CNCzone.com-The Largest Machinist Community on the net!



Home Page Mark Forums Read Today's Posts My Replies Classifieds Reviews Photo Gallery Web Links Share Files Advertise With Us Ad List
Go Back   CNCzone.com-The Largest Machinist Community on the net! > Mechanical Engineering > Mechanical Calculations/Engineering Design


Mechanical Calculations/Engineering Design Discuss general mechanical design and mechanical calculations.


This forum is sponsored by:

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #1   Ban this user!
Old 07-27-2007, 10:06 AM
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: usa
Posts: 9
kenbarra is on a distinguished road
Drill Bit Manufacturing

My current design job is a medical grade drill bit for bone.

I am new to drill bits. I did my research on the characteristics of the drill point, the many geometries available and the theory behind the angles and facets. But for Pete's sake, I can't find anything on the actual manufacturing of the bits.

What is the flute profile? I know it's the grinding wheel profile, but what is that? I want to include the correct profile in the solid model.

What is the toolpath? How does the wheel orient to the stock? How does it begin the cut? Radial feed in? Radial with axial advance? Begin the cut at the point or the shank?

I have the material for the bit specified as a 15-5 stainless, 45 HRC (15-5 h900).

Now I need a shop. Most of the big guys won't call me back (Kennametal owns Cleveland and Greenfield). The few I have talked to won't do stainless(Republic/Michigan). I have set up RFQs with some small shops, but no results yet.

Please help. If you know a shop or have some detail about the toolpath.
Tweet this Post!Share on Facebook
Reply With Quote

  #2   Ban this user!
Old 07-27-2007, 10:40 AM
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: USA
Posts: 157
yoopertool is on a distinguished road

Are you looking for a shop to make these drill bits? or are you looking for someone to tell you how to do them? If you are looking for a shop to do them for you I work for a company whose main product group is medical drills and cutting tools. We are located in Michigan. If you wish for us to quote send me a PM and I will give you the email for our sales rep. About 99% of our parts are stainless steel. Our engineering group could even help you with your design if you wish. Here is our website if you wish to take a look.

http://www.precisionedge.com/main.html

Good luck!
Tweet this Post!Share on Facebook
Reply With Quote

  #3  
Old 07-27-2007, 10:49 AM
Switcher's Avatar
Moderator
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Vectorink.com
Posts: 3,659
Blog Entries: 2
Switcher is on a distinguished road

What is the flute profile?
The flute profile is the shape of the flute, hold the drill in your hand (shank side in hand) & look straight at the drill point (see attached image below). In the photo the red line is the flute profile. It is not only the grinding wheel profile, I run a cnc toolgrinder (840D/5-axis) & I can make the radius in the photo with a 90deg. 1A1 wheel.



What is the toolpath?
The toolpath is the g-code. (what path will the wheel follow?)



How does the wheel orient to the stock? How does it begin the cut? Radial feed in? Radial with axial advance? Begin the cut at the point or the shank?
Depends on the wheel & the machine. Most cnc grinder controls (840D, etc..) manufactures have addon software that creates the toolpath, leadin, leadout, etc...

Example, on my machine I can start the flute profile from the point, or the shank side, & as many passes as I want.



.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	1.JPG‎
Views:	73
Size:	22.5 KB
ID:	41332  
Tweet this Post!Share on Facebook
Reply With Quote

  #4  
Old 07-27-2007, 10:53 AM
Switcher's Avatar
Moderator
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Vectorink.com
Posts: 3,659
Blog Entries: 2
Switcher is on a distinguished road

(This is not meant to be a smart a$$ remark, )


If all your doing is the design of the drill, really it shouldn't matter to you how it's made.


Give the manufacture a print, that's all they should need.


.
Tweet this Post!Share on Facebook
Reply With Quote

  #5   Ban this user!
Old 07-28-2007, 02:15 AM
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: usa
Posts: 9
kenbarra is on a distinguished road

Sorry, What I should have asked is:What path will the tool follow? Will the material turn about the "A" axis and the tool move along X? (thinking in a 4-Axis mill scenario here) I imagine the grinding wheel would maintain a constant relation to the axis of the material. This relation would be governed by the helical pitch of the flute. One "A-axis" revolution would coincide with one helical pitch.

And I know where the flute profile is. What is the wheel profile that matches? You can use a 1/4" endmill to do a lot of passes and create some complex geometries, but a .250 inside radius between the wall and floor of a pocket is a lot easier with a 1/2" ballnose endmill. So, I suspect, the same applies to drill flutes. There is probably a given size that coresponds to each drill diameter, and a depth of cut that creates a standard web thickness.

As I am creating the solid model, it helps to know the path. I treat solid modeling like machining(virtual machining?). My sketch profiles are like tool silhouettes and the extrusion path is like a tool path.

I want to understand the process. If I just randomly send out drawings, somebody may waste a lot of their time and my (company's) money following a drawing that should have been done differently. We see it at our shop when we take on contract jobs. Unspecified dimensions and unrealistic tolerances waste a lot of our time. I don't want to be the guy that causes those problems. If I can take some time to learn the limitations and advantages of the process, I can design to compliment the process.

So, that's why.

Oh, I understand what G-code is. I have some experience with NC mills. I took a few extra shop and NC classes as part of my ME degree.

Last edited by kenbarra; 07-28-2007 at 02:16 AM. Reason: old signature
Tweet this Post!Share on Facebook
Reply With Quote

Sponsored Links
  #6  
Old 07-28-2007, 09:26 AM
Switcher's Avatar
Moderator
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Vectorink.com
Posts: 3,659
Blog Entries: 2
Switcher is on a distinguished road

The cnc I run is a 5-axis (X,Y,Z,A,C) Schutte W305 840D, I use all 5 axis to grind the flute.

This is how I grind a blank, with & without coolant holes (2 flute). The drill program I use is a proprietary software from Schutte, I enter all my wheel info before I start working on the drill flute, then I work from a print for the drill info.

1) Probe the face of the blank with a Renishaw probe (set the X=0.000, & any coolant holes)

2) Select the wheel from the wheel magazine, I use a 1A1 wheel with a 90deg. corner that is wider than the drill flute, need to be wider so it cleans everything up. I could use a 11V9 cup wheel, it's my choice I run the machine, end result is the same.

3) Rapid (G90) all 5-axis to zero, set (G91) for the actual grinding, the Z-axis is set to whatever depth I need the flute to be, the Y-axis is offset to the drill center, the C-axis is set to whatever lead I need, & stays fixed in that position.

4) The actual grinding starts, Infeed is in the X-axis, most times starting from the point side working my way towards the shank. The A-axis is also rotating.

5) Rapid out of the 1st flute, send all axis to 0.000 (G91), index the A-axis 180deg., & repeat just like the first flute.

6) Send all axis home (G90)




.
Tweet this Post!Share on Facebook
Reply With Quote

  #7   Ban this user!
Old 07-28-2007, 10:45 AM
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: USA
Posts: 157
yoopertool is on a distinguished road

Almost all high end cnc fluting machines have proprietary software which acts somewhat like a conversational control. to get different grooves you can just put a profile on your wheel with a cnc wheel dresser. At my company we have about 10 or these:

http://www.rollomatic.ch/prod620main.php?mach=620

and some other smaller fluters that do simpler parts.
Tweet this Post!Share on Facebook
Reply With Quote

  #8  
Old 07-28-2007, 05:35 PM
Switcher's Avatar
Moderator
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Vectorink.com
Posts: 3,659
Blog Entries: 2
Switcher is on a distinguished road

Originally Posted by yoopertool View Post
Almost all high end cnc fluting machines have proprietary software which acts somewhat like a conversational control. to get different grooves you can just put a profile on your wheel with a cnc wheel dresser. At my company we have about 10 or these:

http://www.rollomatic.ch/prod620main.php?mach=620

and some other smaller fluters that do simpler parts.
I just use a 90deg.1A1 wheel straight out of the box, then program the profile.


.
Tweet this Post!Share on Facebook
Reply With Quote

  #9   Ban this user!
Old 07-28-2007, 06:00 PM
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: the Netherlands
Posts: 277
ironDigit is on a distinguished road

Though i can't specify wich keywords to use ,i'ld say try youtube and alikes.
I've seen quite some vids of manufacturing processes including mills and drills.
I don't hink you'll ever get a clearer picture then a vid.

Good luck.
__________________
Finally CHIPS you can have as much as you can without the doc. complainting about your cholesterol.
Tweet this Post!Share on Facebook
Reply With Quote

  #10  
Old 07-29-2007, 08:12 AM
Switcher's Avatar
Moderator
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Vectorink.com
Posts: 3,659
Blog Entries: 2
Switcher is on a distinguished road

Originally Posted by ironDigit View Post
Though i can't specify wich keywords to use ,i'ld say try youtube and alikes.
I've seen quite some vids of manufacturing processes including mills and drills.
I don't hink you'll ever get a clearer picture then a vid.
Good luck.
I agree.


.
Tweet this Post!Share on Facebook
Reply With Quote

Sponsored Links
  #11   Ban this user!
Old 07-30-2007, 12:12 AM
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: usa
Posts: 9
kenbarra is on a distinguished road

Thanks all, Especially Switcher.

So Switcher, can you describe the transition from full z depth to no wheel contact?

Is it a z-axis feed[G91] as the x-axis continues at the original [g91] feed?
What is the relataion/ratio? (2ipm along x-axis to 1imp along the y-axis)

Is there any y-axis movement during the operation?

Does the c-axis change during one part. I can see that the c-value would be different depending on the lead angle (helical pitch). But that should be constant for my application. I have seen the variable angle endmills for cutting aluminum.

Thanks for your time. I really appreciate you sharing your expertise.
__________________
Ken Barra, Manufacturing/Design Engineer
SpinalDevices, LLC
Tweet this Post!Share on Facebook
Reply With Quote

  #12  
Old 07-31-2007, 12:27 AM
Switcher's Avatar
Moderator
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Vectorink.com
Posts: 3,659
Blog Entries: 2
Switcher is on a distinguished road

can you describe the transition from full z depth to no wheel contact?
If your asking about when the flute is finished, & the wheel exits the flute, I program a small amount of over travel (approx. 1.0mm) I would still be in G91, I also do the same before the wheel touches the drill (pre travel, approx. 1.0mm (G91)), so that the wheel isn't slamming into the drill, when it rapids up to the drill (G90).



What is the relataion/ratio? (2ipm along x-axis to 1imp along the y-axis)
I might have mislead you, when I said "I use all 5 axis to grind the flute", actually for a basic 2-flute drill the "Y,Z, & C-axis" are only used to Rapid (G90) up to the drill & then stay fixed in that position, the actual infeed (G91) is in only "X & A-axis"

I work in metric so the 2ipm converts to "50.80" that sounds correct for the "X & A-axis" feeds (G91).



Is there any y-axis movement during the operation?
No, after the "Y-axis" Rapids to the drill it stays fixed in that position, during the entire grinding process.


Does the c-axis change during one part.
No, just like the "Y, Z-axis" the "C-axis" Rapids to the drill and stays fixed in that position, during the entire grinding process.





NOTE:
Just like any other program everything depends on how the machine is setup, how many axis, etc...


.
Tweet this Post!Share on Facebook
Reply With Quote

Reply




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Spade Drill Does Work in Aluminum; Big Hole Boring on Drill Press. Geof General Metalwork Discussion 47 02-01-2008 02:32 PM
fanuc drill mate / robo drill post for enroute? goodplastics Post Processor Files 0 07-19-2007 06:49 PM
Can I drill AISI 1020 plate steel with a drill bit? Apples General Metalwork Discussion 2 02-01-2006 12:15 PM
manufacturing and the USA MBG CNCzone Club House 90 10-16-2005 04:48 PM
Where is Pro Manufacturing? utengineer04 PTC Pro/Manufacture 3 08-30-2005 11:11 AM




All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:53 AM.





Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2012, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO
Template-Modifications by TMS

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 63 64 65 66 67 68 69 70 71 72 73 74 75 76 77 78 79 80 81 82 83 84 85 86 87 88 89 90 91 92 93 94 95 96 97 98 99 100 101 102 103 104 105 106 107 108 109 110 111 112 113 114 115 116 117 118 119 120 121 122 123 124 125 126 127 128 129 130 131 132 133 134 135 136 137 138 139 140 141 142 143 144 145 146 147 148 149 150 151 152 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160 161 162 163 164 165 166 167 168 169 170 171 172 173 174 175 176 177 178 179 180 181 182 183 184 185 186 187 188 189 190 191 192 193 194 195 196 197 198 199 200 201 202 203 204 205 206 207 208 209 210 211 212 213 214 215 216 217 218 219 220 221 222 223 224 225 226 227 228 229 230 231 232 233 234 235 236 237 238 239 240 241 242 243 244 245 246 247 248 249 250 251 252 253 254 255 256 257 258 259 260 261 262 263 264 265 266 267 268 269 270 271 272 273 274 275 276 277 278 279 280 281 282 283 284 285 286 287 288 289 290 291 292 293 294 295 296 297 298 299 300 301 302 303 304 305 306 307 308 309 310 311 312 313 314 315 316 317 318 319 320 321 322 323 324 325 326 327 328 329 330 331 332 333 334 335 336 337 338 339 340 341 342 343 344 345 346 347 348 349 350 351 352 353