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Thread: Trouble calculating deflection of a 80x80mm T-Slot

  1. #41
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    Default Re: Trouble calculating deflection of a 80x80mm T-Slot

    Quote Originally Posted by triumph406 View Post
    Why are you fixated on yield? Do you even know why?

    Matweb has 6063-T6 yield at room temp = 31000psi
    Matweb has 6063-T832 yield at room temp = 39000psi
    Matweb has 6063-T83 yield at room temp = 31000psi
    Matweb has 6063-T6 yield at room temp = 40000psi

    I got to ask, even for 6063-T6 do you think any design using that material is going to yield? If the loads are so high that an extrusion yields, the issue isn't the material but the poor design. Changing from 6063 to 6061 isn't going to fix the failings in your design is it?
    It's a whole lot more than just yield, of what ever material is being used, It would depend on how they are using it 6061 can make all the difference, 6063 T5 being like a wet noodle, in comparison, 6061-T6 aluminum properties include its structural strength and toughness. You don't get any of this with 6063 or it's equivalent replacement 6105

    You are not helping anyone by posting like this, I myself I do not use Extrusions because of it's inability to be a good structural member, without the addition of other plates / elements Etc, when used as a beam, as it is used in the many Hobby builds, it is what it is, Hobby users all over the world use extrusion like 8020, because it is easy to bolt things / parts together, some have successful builds using it, some do not, it's all in how they put it together, not many have any mechanical experience, so just bolt parts together, and learn from the experience, and there next build they do it better, or just keep on adding plates to strengthen what they already have

    For your information they do not make 6063 or it's replacement 6105 Extrusion as a T6 Grade, it only comes as a T5 Grade, so just posting numbers off the web that are not even anything to do with the subject, just shows you know nothing about Extrusion or using it to build machines like these hobby guys do

    Mactec54


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    Default Re: Trouble calculating deflection of a 80x80mm T-Slot

    Quote Originally Posted by mactec54 View Post
    It's a whole lot more than just yield, of what ever material is being used, It would depend on how they are using it 6061 can make all the difference, 6063 T5 being like a wet noodle, in comparison, 6061-T6 aluminum properties include its structural strength and toughness. You don't get any of this with 6063 or it's equivalent replacement 6105
    Again you don’t know what your talking about!! 6063-T5 isn’t going to be a “wet noodle” compared to any other aluminum!!

    And if 6063 or 6105 were so poor why is 6105 used by 8020 and Frameworld, surely they know more than you do? Or did they forget to consult you?

    Again, if your designing a machine/assembly correctly you shouldn’t be worrying about material ultimate strength or yield strength. You shouldn't even be close to these limits. And for the 1000x, up until the material yields the deflections of all aluminums will be the same (other than small variations in E)

    Quote Originally Posted by mactec54 View Post
    You are not helping anyone by posting like this, I myself I do not use Extrusions because of it's inability to be a good structural member, without the addition of other plates / elements Etc, when used as a beam, as it is used in the many Hobby builds, it is what it is, Hobby users all over the world use extrusion like 8020, because it is easy to bolt things / parts together, some have successful builds using it, some do not, it's all in how they put it together, not many have any mechanical experience, so just bolt parts together, and learn from the experience, and there next build they do it better, or just keep on adding plates to strengthen what they already have
    Agreed 8020 or similar is convenient.

    On the other hand 8020/Frameworld extrusions are used successfully in many industrial applications, it’s not just a hobbiest product.

    Quote Originally Posted by mactec54 View Post
    For your information they do not make 6063 or it's replacement 6105 Extrusion as a T6 Grade, it only comes as a T5 Grade, so just posting numbers off the web that are not even anything to do with the subject, just shows you know nothing about Extrusion or using it to build machines like these hobby guys do
    6063-T6 isn’t available in T6 temper?

    Well that’s news to Amazon

    https://www.amazon.com/Small-Parts-A.../dp/B003WE9DMC

    Or

    Seamless Aluminum Pipe - Series 6063-T6 Schedule 40|Metal Distributor|Continental Steel & Tube

    Or Ebay

    https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_nkw...&ul_noapp=true

    Or Mcmaster-Carr

    https://www.mcmaster.com/#4490t261/=1a3h7xu

    Quote Originally Posted by mactec54 View Post
    You are not helping anyone by posting like this,[U
    You’re the one who is taking a lack of mechanical understanding of materials and displaying it all to see.

    You would last 1 day in most any engineering position, once you display your lack of basic engineering.

    Last edited by triumph406; 11-03-2017 at 01:05 PM.


  3. #43
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    Default Re: Trouble calculating deflection of a 80x80mm T-Slot

    Quote Originally Posted by triumph406 View Post
    Again you don’t know what your talking about!! 6063-T5 isn’t going to be a “wet noodle” compared to any other aluminum!!

    And if 6063 or 6105 were so poor why is 6105 used by 8020 and Frameworld, surely they know more than you do? Or did they forget to consult you?.
    They have no choice if there extrusion presses don't have the Tonnage to extrude anything else

    Quote Originally Posted by triumph406 View Post
    On the other hand 8020/Frameworld extrusions are used successfully in many industrial applications, it’s not just a hobbiest product. .

    The industry don't build Routers and milling machines with it, enclosures table frames, safety Guarding Etc, that about it


    Quote Originally Posted by triumph406 View Post
    6063-T6 isn’t available in T6 temper?

    Well that’s news to Amazon.
    https://www.amazon.com/Small-Parts-A.../dp/B003WE9DMC

    Or

    Seamless Aluminum Pipe - Series 6063-T6 Schedule 40|Metal Distributor|Continental Steel & Tube

    Or Ebay

    https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_nkw...&ul_noapp=true

    Or Mcmaster-Carr

    https://www.mcmaster.com/#4490t261/=1a3h7xu .[/QUOTE]


    Yes there are lots of choices for 6063 material like this, we are not talking about Bar Stock Round Tubing Etc, we are talking about 8020 extrusions and, you need to focus on the facts instead of you ego, it seems you are not even in the same ball park

    Quote Originally Posted by triumph406 View Post
    You would last 1 day in most any engineering position, once you display your lack of basic engineering.
    How many Patents do you have your name on, what processes have you designed that is still in service for more than 20 years, what commercial buildings use your designed and manufactured product in, what medical and aircraft parts do you design and manufacture

    I actually own more than one company that employs people like you, it's a shame that you have no experience in what we are talking about, you continue to change what this is all about, so lack any focus, you can have the last say, as I'm not going to waste anymore time on this thread, it is obvious that you will say more unrelated BS

    Mactec54


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    Default Re: Trouble calculating deflection of a 80x80mm T-Slot

    Quote Originally Posted by mactec54 View Post

    I actually own more than one company that employs people like you, it's a shame that you have no experience in what we are talking about, you continue to change what this is all about, so lack any focus, you can have the last say, as I'm not going to waste anymore time on this thread, it is obvious that you will say more unrelated BS
    Myabe you should talk to one of your engineers, you might learn something



  5. #45
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    Default Re: Trouble calculating deflection of a 80x80mm T-Slot

    Quote Originally Posted by mactec54 View Post
    How many Patents do you have your name on, what processes have you designed that is still in service for more than 20 years, what commercial buildings use your designed and manufactured product in, what medical and aircraft parts do you design and manufacture

    I actually own more than one company that employs people like you, it's a shame that you have no experience in what we are talking about, you continue to change what this is all about, so lack any focus, you can have the last say, as I'm not going to waste anymore time on this thread, it is obvious that you will say more unrelated BS
    Now your sounding desperate, if any of this is true you haven't learnt much over the years, and any success you may have had is on the backs of others



  6. #46
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    Default Re: Trouble calculating deflection of a 80x80mm T-Slot

    Wow,

    I can't believe I missed this thread all this time.

    Not sure if I should run like hell or make a comment!

    triumph406, your statements are correct. Yes, everyone who reads this and has a basic understanding will see the obvious truth of it, I, for one, appreciate your contributions, but I will say there's no real point to fight it out further because based on based my experiences here, I can only see it degrading into more name calling from this point forward. After a similar experience, I almost up and quit this forum.

    Ivan-Ivanov, is this for your new build that we talked about in your other thread that you want to cut steel with? I just don't see straight aluminum T slot being a good choice for this. How about 3/4" inch thick top and bottom pieces with 3/8" plate on front and back with 1/2" plate ribs throughout and filled with epoxy granite, bolted together? I'm basing this on linux_fan's build and his comments and success. It's one of only a couple DIY machines I've seen that can cut steel well. IMO, for what you want to do, I'd ditch a T-Slot gantry. The other option would be to use steel. I see this thread was started a while back, so perhaps it was concurrent with the other thread I participated in earlier.

    As for the equations,

    It looks like the equation for a beam simply supported at both ends was used. My guess is that the actual value will be in between what you would get for the simply supported at both ends and the fixed at both ends as it's not really simply supported or fixed. Of course, the simply supported is more conservative and might be closest to the truth.

    For my build, I did calculate the angle of twist of the gantry beam using an exaggerated cutting force at the tool tip with maximum Z extension. Basic deflection calculations are a good place to start, but I found this calculation to be more relevant. Still more relevant would have been to calculate the moment induced on the gantry due to accelerations. This would require me to know where the center of mass of my spindle and Z axis assembly was at maximum extension. And then calculate the corresponding angle of twist when accelerating. This hind sight is too late. Of course, I just did the basic calculations, and didn't account for the ribs I welded in and a few other things. I do wish I had some FEA software. Oh well, I can get by well enough with some simple calculations.

    I have decided that this shall be my only post in this thread. It doesn't matter what retribution may follow for my post. I just don't have the time or energy to respond, and I have said my opinion, and that is enough for me.

    Also, I am making some T-Shirts that say "Any highschool kid could do that!" on them. So if you're a member of this elite club and you'd like your very own, send me a PM.



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