simultaneous 4th and 5th axis work

[jess fuqua]

Is anyone using mastercam for simultaneous 4th and 5th axis work.
If so i need your input on this subject.
Does it work is it easy etc. ?

[cad01]

Originally Posted by jess fuqua Is anyone using mastercam for simultaneous 4th and 5th axis work. If so i need your input on this subject. Does it work is it easy etc. ?

Yes, mastercam is very powerful when it comes to 4 and 5 axis programming. Is it easy? Sure, if you have several years experiance. Anything is easy with the right amount of practice and knowledge. What exactly are you trying to accomplish? Do you know anything about mastercam or are you expecting to jump right into advanced toolpaths? There are several questions one could ask. There are other cam programs that are very basic and much easier to learn, but in the end if you want user control mastercam is great. You also need to make sure you have a post processor for correct g-code. It comes with several generic posts that can be modified or contact your reseller for a customized post tailered to your machine and your user preferance.

[jess fuqua]

Originally Posted by cad01 Yes, mastercam is very powerful when it comes to 4 and 5 axis programming. Is it easy? Sure, if you have several years experiance. Anything is easy with the right amount of practice and knowledge. What exactly are you trying to accomplish? Do you know anything about mastercam or are you expecting to jump right into advanced toolpaths? There are several questions one could ask. There are other cam programs that are very basic and much easier to learn, but in the end if you want user control mastercam is great. You also need to make sure you have a post processor for correct g-code. It comes with several generic posts that can be modified or contact your reseller for a customized post tailered to your machine and your user preferance.

yes, i know mastercam very well, Ive done lots of 3d work at my last job.
now I'm working with another company and they only have bobcad.
I have a job coming soon and the parts are turbines.
I use my 4th and 5th for positioning and letter raping.
Now we are ready to buy new software, so I'm looking for insight from people before i make a decision. I also know solidcam, but am much better with mastercam. I just here a lot of negative thing sometimes about mastercam.
what type of parts do you make with your 4th and 5th, are you using them simultaneously?

[TheBigJW]

You don't want to Be the one who said buy Mastercam at a new job. You will have mud on your face soon enough. They will treat you like you signed up on a new cell phone plan. Not much ever in the way of updates but big bills. And the prices will change based on nothing. I was just told my dongle was old and needed to be upgraded. Sent me a bill for a new dongle and a bill for 150.00. The new dongle only had 2 weeks of service on it. I called and asked for the permenent codes for my dongle. I was told pay your bill and we will give you the new codes. Really for 150.00. We have been on board since version 8 what like 10 years now and they send me a dongle trap. I think they are on thier way out.


John

[jess fuqua]

Originally Posted by TheBigJW You don't want to Be the one who said buy Mastercam at a new job. You will have mud on your face soon enough. They will treat you like you signed up on a new cell phone plan. Not much ever in the way of updates but big bills. And the prices will change based on nothing. I was just told my dongle was old and needed to be upgraded. Sent me a bill for a new dongle and a bill for 150.00. The new dongle only had 2 weeks of service on it. I called and asked for the permenent codes for my dongle. I was told pay your bill and we will give you the new codes. Really for 150.00. We have been on board since version 8 what like 10 years now and they send me a dongle trap. I think they are on thier way out. John

This is the stuff i need to hear, I'm starting to lean more toward solidcam.

Thanks,

[cad01]

Originally Posted by TheBigJW You don't want to Be the one who said buy Mastercam at a new job. You will have mud on your face soon enough. They will treat you like you signed up on a new cell phone plan. Not much ever in the way of updates but big bills. And the prices will change based on nothing. I was just told my dongle was old and needed to be upgraded. Sent me a bill for a new dongle and a bill for 150.00. The new dongle only had 2 weeks of service on it. I called and asked for the permenent codes for my dongle. I was told pay your bill and we will give you the new codes. Really for 150.00. We have been on board since version 8 what like 10 years now and they send me a dongle trap. I think they are on thier way out. John

Yes, mastercam is expensive, as with solidcam or any other high end cad/cam system. And they ALL have maintenace fees. It sounds like John has issues with his reseller, NOT mastercam. The old dongles were parallel port, the new ones are USB. You can still use the older ones, but most new pc's dont have parallel ports any more. We have upgraded two of our pc's and had to upgrade. The fee was $50 to exchange dongles (someone has to progam the dongle to each hasp number to know what products you have). If you cant afford the $50 you are looking at the wrong level of software. Maybe bobcad-cam is more suited. When they send you your new hasp they give you a temp key until you send the old hasp back and pay. You have 30 days, as standard with most invoices. This is not unreasonable. Once you pay and return old hasp (so they know your not still using it for the duration of your maintenance contract, or worse, sell it!) they issue you your permanent hasp key. These are all standard safe business practices. Yes $150 per hasp is steep, but my reseller only charged us $50 each. If you are a new customer you will not have to worry, you will recieve a USB hasp anyways.
Since you already have experiance with mastercam, learning 4th and 5th axis should be fairly painless. I all depends on what you want to put into it. I strongly suggest books and/or training with any new system. It will help you get up to speed quicker and have referances for the future.
I have done nearly everything with mastercam. the only thing I have not done in mastercam is art and router. I even went to Tolland, CT last november to attend one of there post classes (THANKS PAUL!). I will try to get some images put together soon of some parts we have programmed.

[TheBigJW]

Originally Posted by cad01 Yes, mastercam is expensive, as with solidcam or any other high end cad/cam system. And they ALL have maintenace fees. It sounds like John has issues with his reseller, NOT mastercam. The old dongles were parallel port, the new ones are USB. You can still use the older ones, but most new pc's dont have parallel ports any more. We have upgraded two of our pc's and had to upgrade. The fee was $50 to exchange dongles (someone has to progam the dongle to each hasp number to know what products you have). If you cant afford the $50 you are looking at the wrong level of software. Maybe bobcad-cam is more suited. When they send you your new hasp they give you a temp key until you send the old hasp back and pay. You have 30 days, as standard with most invoices. This is not unreasonable. Once you pay and return old hasp (so they know your not still using it for the duration of your maintenance contract, or worse, sell it!) they issue you your permanent hasp key. These are all standard safe business practices. Yes $150 per hasp is steep, but my reseller only charged us $50 each. If you are a new customer you will not have to worry, you will recieve a USB hasp anyways. Since you already have experiance with mastercam, learning 4th and 5th axis should be fairly painless. I all depends on what you want to put into it. I strongly suggest books and/or training with any new system. It will help you get up to speed quicker and have referances for the future. I have done nearly everything with mastercam. the only thing I have not done in mastercam is art and router. I even went to Tolland, CT last november to attend one of there post classes (THANKS PAUL!). I will try to get some images put together soon of some parts we have programmed.

This last post is a very good testiment to how the dealers and cnc software work. The price is the most they can get from you on any given day. You may pay more than your neighbor if they need some more cash. You may find they will change by as much as 30% if you consider the exchange rate on the US dollar. So expect to be nickel and dimed when you need something. Or even charged three times as much. Really I paid three times more than you for a dongle? That makes me even more mad. Well maybe your dongle is three times better than mine. Less crashing? Better graphics? So that is my point exactly. Dealers charge what they feel like.

You will regret dealing with this company. And the software is not really that great. Just think. You may get to pay three times more than your neighbor. Just go to. www.emastercam.com and ask how much the software is....


John

[cad01]

Price is always negotiable. If your negotiating skills are not up to par you can and will get screwed. Maybe the territory boundries affect the princing as well. When you buy a car do you pay full MSRP? When you buy a gallon of milk from store A is it the same price at store B? you get my point here? SHOP AROUND!!!! COMPARE!!! NEGOTIATE!!! Nothing is ever priced the same. You may only have one reseller in you area, but it doesn't mean you can't negotiate. Some resellers hold fast to there pricing structure. It all depends. I don't see how they nickel and dime you? There are different modules for you to choose from. If you don't need Lathe, you don't have to pay for it, and so on. You only pay for the options you need.
Your satisfaction all comes down to what you are willing to learn. If you are a power user you will love mastercam. If you are unsure of what you are doing and hacking programs together you can easily get frustrated as there are more parameter options than most cam software's. This applies to nearly all software of any kind.

[smokey125]

Simple answer yes mastercam will cope with 4 and 5 axis simulations toolpaths. How good it will be at your required parts will be down to your post and your reseller.

The posts by cad01 and TheBigJW for highlight the extremes you seem to get with mastercam.

On this forum there seems to be massive differences of opinion. Personally I think that is entirely down to the reseller you end up with!
If you want to go the mastercam route I would ask on this forum for recommendations of a good reseller in your area. Then you might end up being one of the happy ones!

From my personal perspective I think mastercam is fairly capable software but without the support it's useless. We're in the UK and only have the choice of 1 reseller. Not wanting to be too critical of them but we stopped paying for maintenance a long time ago (we're still on V9) due to the lack of support we got.
Most of the time we answered question ourselves through trial and error as they took so long (if at all) to get back to us.
We have never had a 5 axis post that has worked the way we want, although I have modified most of them to make them better I have reached the limit of my abilities and I have rewritten all of the 3 axis post we have.

We are now in the process of getting another 5 axis mill and I have been looking into costs of upgrading/changing CAM system. To be honest the cost of upgrading mastercam is not a lot less than buying a new system and with the history we have had with mastercam I am strongly recommending that we change system.

Don't be put off mastercam there are many on here who have nothing but good words for it, but you must find a good reseller or you will forever regret getting it!

[jess fuqua]

Originally Posted by smokey125 Simple answer yes mastercam will cope with 4 and 5 axis simulations toolpaths. How good it will be at your required parts will be down to your post and your reseller. The posts by cad01 and TheBigJW for highlight the extremes you seem to get with mastercam. On this forum there seems to be massive differences of opinion. Personally I think that is entirely down to the reseller you end up with! If you want to go the mastercam route I would ask on this forum for recommendations of a good reseller in your area. Then you might end up being one of the happy ones! From my personal perspective I think mastercam is fairly capable software but without the support it's useless. We're in the UK and only have the choice of 1 reseller. Not wanting to be too critical of them but we stopped paying for maintenance a long time ago (we're still on V9) due to the lack of support we got. Most of the time we answered question ourselves through trial and error as they took so long (if at all) to get back to us. We have never had a 5 axis post that has worked the way we want, although I have modified most of them to make them better I have reached the limit of my abilities and I have rewritten all of the 3 axis post we have. We are now in the process of getting another 5 axis mill and I have been looking into costs of upgrading/changing CAM system. To be honest the cost of upgrading mastercam is not a lot less than buying a new system and with the history we have had with mastercam I am strongly recommending that we change system. Don't be put off mastercam there are many on here who have nothing but good words for it, but you must find a good reseller or you will forever regret getting it!

What is a reseller and how do they effect the software?

[TheBigJW]

Originally Posted by cad01 Price is always negotiable. If your negotiating skills are not up to par you can and will get screwed.

Sounds like a nice way to do business. Where can I sign up?
This is exactly what you can expect. Just don't go there.



John

[smokey125]

You don't buy the software direct from mastercam, you buy it from one of there network of resellers. In the UK the network is only one company. In the States there are a lot more to choose from.

The reseller doesn't change the software, they may configure it if you only want mill, or mill and lathe.
What they do is provide your training, your support, your post if you need ones writing for your machine. When you were at your old company who did you contact for technical support if you had a problem with mastercam?

This is where we have problems. Our reseller didn't actually write our 5 axis posts, they got another company in mainland Europe to write them. So if we had a problem we went to our reseller, who went to the company they used, who then might have to go mastercam and then all the way back to us. The usual outcome was by the time it got back to us they had fixed something that wasn't wrong and not fixed what was wrong.
Add to that the problem that no one at our reseller actually had an direct CNC experience and they often didn't even understand the problem you had or what you wanted it changing.

Try this to see who yours would be. https://secure.mastercam.com/findareseller/Default.aspx