Need some advice

[jonny3777]

Hi all I just joined first post. I am in need of some advice on how to get my CNC up and running. Its a 3 axis USB CNC, the software is terrible I bought it from china (ebay) It has a 240x170x50mm work area on it. I bought it to make flight panels for home flight simulators. Very simple design for each panel I attached a sample pic of one for reference. Anyway my questions are, how do I get the cnc to work within its area, It has no limit switches but I was told its possible to use without them? Also I want to cut the panels out of 4mm perspex, then I want to paint them and engrave text,arcs and lines etc but if I take the panel off the bed how will I know the machine will know to start engraving? which leads me to my next question, changing the tool How do I know when to change the tool in the program? I just about managed to render an stl file in autodesk artcam 2017 but the toolpath came out leaving a great big dirty layer under the panel because I can only import 3D models using the relief tab Its so annoying I have had it a week and I havent even scratched anything with it. I can't read G code and I only bought the cnc to serve one purpose make so simple panels, why is it so hard?? I have tried so many programs mach3 which needs a parallel port, gsimple, freemill. none worked for me I tried meshcam but ran out of trail dont wanna buy anything else cause I cant even use what I got. Sorry guys I know I'm a complete noob but if there is someone out there that could explain this to me I'd be so greatful. and I mean explain it as if you where teaching a child to use it because I am useless with software like this but I am willing to learn. There are no tutorials on how to separate text engraving from cutting on the same piece, and very few tutorials on the latest version of artcam just artcam pro. I have not used any other versions of artcam. Anyway guys if you can help I really appreciate it as I am pulling my hair out at this point thanks.

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[Jim Dawson]

I think you need to step back and take a deep breath. You have a lot of different problems to solve and you need to take them one at a time. You have a lot to learn so you are going to have to take a systematic approach.

Limit switches. The machine will run without limit switches. Just set the machine 0,0,0 at the corner of the table, and then set your part on the table at that corner. Or set the part on the table anywhere, and set 0,0,0 to a corner of the part. It is only important the the CAM 0 and the part 0 agree. Make sure that your CAM Z zero and the machine Z zero agree, normally would be the top of the part.

I would start out with a simple 100mm square, and just engrave the profile. Set the Z 0 above the part so you can air cut rather than actually cut. This will give you a chance to get the machine under control before you actually try cutting anything.

It sounds like you can't even get the machine running. Does the software that came with the machine actually run G-code? And do you have a method of getting G-code into the machine controller? If you can get the machine running at all, then that is a good start. You can do an upgrade later. Normally a G-code file has a tap, nc, or cnc extension. The controller proabaly won't like a stl file.

The easy way to do a tool change is to do all of the machining operations as separate programs. That way Z goes to a safe position and you can jog the machine to a good position to do a tool change. If you don't move the part then the machine still knows where everything is, but you will have to zero the Z again. There are better ways to do this, but let's start simple.

To separate text and engraving from machining operations, you should be able to put them on different layers, or at the very least generate the code as separate operations by selecting only the items that you want to machine in a given operation.

This should get you pointed in the right direction.

[jonny3777]

Hi Jim, thanks for the info. The cnc came with a GRBL controller not great, The control board is laseraxe so it uses their controller, Just a couple of questions though. When you say jogging do you mean manually moving the tool around the bed? If I where to take the piece in artcam and say set the x,y,z axis to the bottom left corner of the piece, does that mean that I would then jog the tool over to the bottom left corner for the cnc to start? Also if I need to get the Z height with a 4mm piece of perspex say, would I jog the tool to said position and lower the tool head until it was almost touching the surface, is that how you set the z axis? The thing is I will need to remove the panel from the bed after it has been cut to paint it, how do I engrave it if I zero the axis for a tool change?

[Jim Dawson]

Hi Jim, thanks for the info. The cnc came with a GRBL controller not great, The control board is laseraxe so it uses their controller, Just a couple of questions though. When you say jogging do you mean manually moving the tool around the bed?

Yes. Just use the jog buttons on the keypad.

If I where to take the piece in artcam and say set the x,y,z axis to the bottom left corner of the piece, does that mean that I would then jog the tool over to the bottom left corner for the cnc to start?

Yes, jog over to the bottom left corner of the part, and set X and Y to 0

Also if I need to get the Z height with a 4mm piece of perspex say, would I jog the tool to said position and lower the tool head until it was almost touching the surface, is that how you set the z axis?

Yes. I normally use a piece of paper (about 0.08mm) as a feeler gauge. Just bring the Z down until the tool just touches the paper, then set Z to the thickness of the paper.

The thing is I will need to remove the panel from the bed after it has been cut to paint it, how do I engrave it if I zero the axis for a tool change?

Just repeat the above operation to re-zero Z for the engraving operation. You should not have to re-zero the X & Y if you have a method of locating the work on the table.

[ger21]

You don't want to create an .stl and use 3D machining on a part like that. It's best done with a 2D drawing and 2d toolpaths.

[jonny3777]

You don't want to create an .stl and use 3D machining on a part like that. It's best done with a 2D drawing and 2d toolpaths.

Thanks or the replies guys, I had mach3 but it needs a parallel port and I only have a laptop for usb. I ran into a new problem today I was using GRBL controller 0.9 and imported a simple piece of text from a little program called desk engrave. I jogged to the corner of the piece then lowered the Z axis above the piece. I hit begin on GRBL and it started the engraving or be it started 5mm above jogging in the air. It wouldn't lower to the piece and to make matters worse the spindle will only spin when it feels like it :/ it starts spinning then stops and slows down again. Is there any control software I can use that's for usb and easy to navigate?

[ger21]

UCCNC with a UC100 motion controller.

[jonny3777]

Thank you I'll look into it.

[handlewanker]

Hi....this scenario is like asking a Neanderthal caveman to get in and pilot a helicopter........it ain't gonna happen unless you first get basic tuition on how to operate a CNC machine.

I would suggest also that you browse UTUBE for some tutorials on setting up a CNC.... whatever..... BEFORE you even think about trying to make a part.

I'm a complete noob when it comes to CNC, but after doing the UTUBE trip and getting lots of info on the forum I was able to set up my CNC mill and after genning up on G code was also able to write a simple G code sequence to move the spindle around with a dummy cutter without unexplained events happening.

Provided of course that you have the right equipment to actually work a CNC you can quickly get to first base and start making sense of the correct procedure........learning G code is the same as learning your ABC before you can write a book.

It's a long journey, but it starts with the first step.
Ian..

[jonny3777]

You don't want to create an .stl and use 3D machining on a part like that. It's best done with a 2D drawing and 2d toolpaths.

I included so pics of my rig so that you guys can see what I have to work with. I tried UCNC but my board isn't listed on the supported platforms I have a program called ccnc.exe it came with the mill. It's a laseraxe USB board and spindle but the software is more suited to laser I think because the spindle pulses as it spins, I may be a noob to this but I'm pretty sure I should be getting consistent speed, i checked the spindle speed but noting was there for it just burn time which is for lasers I would think :/ So GRBL seems to be the only thing that half jogs the mill but doesn't run the spindle when I command it to or even when I run a gcode file I've loaded. It just jogs around in the air without spinning the bit I know this takes time to learn but I've spent a week on this thing and I feel I have made no progress I searched youtube for setting up my mill but nowhere had my mill or software so not a good start. I have been receiving orders for flight panels and I have had to turn people away until I figure this out I really would appreciate it if someone could lend their experience if they ever came across this software or cnc mill before thanks.

[Army56]

Hi Jonny,

I was just wondering if you found a solution to this problem. The reason I ask is because just I bought the exact same machine from EBay two months ago.

I figured out that the LaserAxe main board only uses GRBL v0.8 and all the newer software generates the newer versions of G-code. I have been dealing with the sellers for over a month now and they were promising that they will compensate me for my troubles. I was asking for a different main board so I could upgrade the GRBL to a version used by most of the newer software like ArtCam and Inkscape. But they keep doing a song and dance with me and I've had enough of it. Shortly they are going to find a very bad review attached to their product. I have had the machine since late January 2018 and have not yet made any headway with the CNC router, not even the simplest of engravings. Does your cooling fan stop turning when the laser power or burn time are set to less than 100% like mine does?

Anyway, I've been thinking of booting out the LaserAxe board and replacing it with something else but I haven't a clue as to which board to use instead. Any ideas or solutions?

[handlewanker]

Hi, some time back I was going to indulge my self with one of these thingos just for the fun of it to do a bit of engraving and micro carving on wood items etc.

At $200 how can you lose...........but when i read further and noted that it runs with something called GRBL and very limited at that, I went off the boil.....just too much messing about........a Gecko controller retrofit would cost more than double the price of the whole machine.

I even thought about getting one of those cheap 6600 controllers on EBAY for $20 or so and running it with Mach 3.........didn't do that and now if I did indulge I'd bin the GRBL stuff and work with the EBAY controller etc.

It's not the machine that's the problem it's the controller and upgrading to a different controller that is reliable and used by many is a big cost jump.

A 3020 CNC router will get better results right out of the box......it's assembled already........ and it runs on Mach 3.....all of this is just my opinion.
Ian..

[Army56]

Thank you for the information. The 3020 is about the same price I paid for mine but I also have a 2500 mW laser. The laser head works good. But I did buy it mostly for the router though, the laser was a bonus. There must be a main board out there that is compatible with these requirements.

[handlewanker]

Hi....I think the GRBL controller is the lowest tech item for these micro CNC routers.........price dictates the controller......... but I see there are also controllers on EBAY that go for around $25 to $50 3 and 4 axis control etc.....you get what you pay for etc......and these appear to be ones that the 3020 has and they work with Mach 3.....a break out board cost about the same too.

James Newton sells stepper driver kits using the THB 6964AH chip that have improved electronics and quite reasonably priced too....DIY build of course.

The CNC router you mentioned goes for A$200 on OZ EBAY, and that is just the router with a piddly tool holder, it's more expensive with an ER 11 collet chuck..........by the time you replace all the electronic items you would pay almost double the starting price with GRBL.
Ian.

[Army56]

Hi....I think the GRBL controller is the lowest tech item for these micro CNC routers.........price dictates the controller......... but I see there are also controllers on EBAY that go for around $25 to $50 3 and 4 axis control etc.....you get what you pay for etc......and these appear to be ones that the 3020 has and they work with Mach 3.....a break out board cost about the same too.

James Newton sells stepper driver kits using the THB 6964AH chip that have improved electronics and quite reasonably priced too....DIY build of course.

The CNC router you mentioned goes for A$200 on OZ EBAY, and that is just the router with a piddly tool holder, it's more expensive with an ER 11 collet chuck..........by the time you replace all the electronic items you would pay almost double the starting price with GRBL.
Ian.

Its easy enough to find a new GRBL controller - I guess what my concern is finding one that will drive both my laser and router. With my luck I would buy one and find out it doesn't drive one of them. But if I buy one for the CNC router and it makes it work good, there's lots of room on the frame I could mount another board on there for just the CNC and keep the original for the laser. Just thought of that now.

I found a nice little free course on Arduino electronics with about 15 or so lessons. I think I will go through that first before I make up my mind.

Anyway thanks for the information.

[handlewanker]

Hi, they sell the GRBL boards for that CNC router quite cheaply on EBAY.....don't know much about the specifics as I'm not at all interested in GRBL etc.

You could build a micro CNC router/laser engraver quite cheaply but when it comes to the electronics to control it, that's where the problem starts.

I doubt that these machines have an anticipated life expectancy that would be good after 12 months of use......just having some backlash in the axes nuts would make it unreliable......that doesn't mean they can't be DIY upgraded to make them more robust.

On UTUBE there is a guy called MYFORDBOY who completely rebuilt one of these machines to make it a super model.......can't think why he didn't build one from scratch they're so basic.
Ian.

[Army56]

Hi, they sell the GRBL boards for that CNC router quite cheaply on EBAY.....don't know much about the specifics as I'm not at all interested in GRBL etc.

You could build a micro CNC router/laser engraver quite cheaply but when it comes to the electronics to control it, that's where the problem starts.

I doubt that these machines have an anticipated life expectancy that would be good after 12 months of use......just having some backlash in the axes nuts would make it unreliable......that doesn't mean they can't be DIY upgraded to make them more robust.

On UTUBE there is a guy called MYFORDBOY who completely rebuilt one of these machines to make it a super model.......can't think why he didn't build one from scratch they're so basic.
Ian.

Thanks - I'll check it out.

[handlewanker]

BTW, the GRBL board has everything on it....if something goes wrong the whole board needs to get changed......my preference is......a separate controller board for Mach 3, separate breakout board, separate drivers and an adequate separate power supply, all in a box off the machine......cost a bit more but more reliable I think.
Ian.

[Army56]

BTW, the GRBL board has everything on it....if something goes wrong the whole board needs to get changed......my preference is......a separate controller board for Mach 3, separate breakout board, separate drivers and an adequate separate power supply, all in a box off the machine......cost a bit more but more reliable I think.
Ian.

Yes that makes perfect sense. I'm currently watching the UTUBE Arduino course for beginners.
Thanks again.

[Army56]

BTW, the GRBL board has everything on it....if something goes wrong the whole board needs to get changed......my preference is......a separate controller board for Mach 3, separate breakout board, separate drivers and an adequate separate power supply, all in a box off the machine......cost a bit more but more reliable I think.
Ian.

Is this kinda the thing you would get .... Not including the Mach 3 of course. I'm not even sure what the deal is with that.

https://www.amazon.ca/Longruner-Expa...+motor+drivers