Need Help! Ballscrew End Supports - Opinions Needed - TMT (SYK) vs PVP vs China Generic


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Thread: Ballscrew End Supports - Opinions Needed - TMT (SYK) vs PVP vs China Generic

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    Default Ballscrew End Supports - Opinions Needed - TMT (SYK) vs PVP vs China Generic

    Hi All,

    I need to buy some ballscrew end support bearings. I plan on buying four FK15's and four BF15's to use on my build to use with 2510 ballscrews (x and y) and a 2505 ballscrew (z).

    The last machine I built was rack and pinion, with a Z axis I bought, so this is my first experience with actually implementing ballscrews into a build.

    I have seen videos on youtube of people buying generic Chinese end supports and having to shim them to try and get the slop out of the fixed side bearings. If you've bough some generic Chinese supports, please tell me your experiences, however right now I am leaning towards one of two brands made in Taiwan.

    The two Taiwan Brands are:

    PVP Brand "Produce Value Precision"

    TMT (SYK) Brand

    Anyone have any experience with the quality of either of these brands? Which one would you buy? I should mention that this is going on a 4' by 6' steel frame build using Bosch Rexroth size 25 linear rails, a powerful 30 taper ATC spindle, and double nuts on the ballscrews. A 2000 lb build made to cut aluminum well.

    Thanks in advance for your help.

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    Default Re: Ballscrew End Supports - Opinions Needed - TMT (SYK) vs PVP vs China Generic

    Are Fk15 and BF15 bearings single race or double race?
    If they are single race you will have backlash.
    If you have double bearings at one end which can be pre-loaded, then you can get rid of (most of) the backlash.
    Economy here may be very wasteful.

    cheers
    Roger



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    Default Re: Ballscrew End Supports - Opinions Needed - TMT (SYK) vs PVP vs China Generic

    Do you have any links?

    You might also want to look at Misumi.

    Gerry

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    Default Re: Ballscrew End Supports - Opinions Needed - TMT (SYK) vs PVP vs China Generic

    I purchased SYK fixed and free end bearing supports, AC bearings, for C3 ballscrews, and was impressed with the fit and finish. Bought them from WorldOfCnc's website (Marchant Dice) a while back.



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    Default Re: Ballscrew End Supports - Opinions Needed - TMT (SYK) vs PVP vs China Generic

    Quote Originally Posted by RCaffin View Post
    Are Fk15 and BF15 bearings single race or double race?
    If they are single race you will have backlash.
    If you have double bearings at one end which can be pre-loaded, then you can get rid of (most of) the backlash.
    Economy here may be very wasteful.

    cheers
    Roger
    FK refers to the bearing housing, which is F for flanged, and K for fixed end. Which means (usually) two AC bearings preloaded either front-to-front or back-to-back. FF would be flanged, free end bearing (for the non-driven side of the screw, to allow for thermal expansion.) BF and BK are for block style supports. They have other shape supports but these are the most common.

    They do make economy fixed end bearings with two deep groove ball bearings lightly preloaded, for light duty applications.



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    Default Re: Ballscrew End Supports - Opinions Needed - TMT (SYK) vs PVP vs China Generic

    Quote Originally Posted by RCaffin View Post
    Are Fk15 and BF15 bearings single race or double race?
    The FK is the fixed end and it is double race. I've heard that some of the generic Chinese ones have slop between the two bearings at the fixed end and need to be shimmed. That is why I am avoiding the generic Chinese ones. I could be wrong. Perhaps they are easy to shim? Perhaps there is a trusted supplier? I don't know. Kind of hard to return something to China, so I want to get it right.

    Quote Originally Posted by ger21 View Post
    Do you have any links?

    You might also want to look at Misumi.
    ball screw end support bearing FK15, View BALL SCREW END NEARING, pvp Product Details from Tianjin NaBoRui Mechanical Equipment Sales Co., Ltd. on Alibaba.com

    https://www.aliexpress.com/item/SYK-...000793017.html

    Where would I buy Misumi from? I'm on a strict budget but if there is a comparable product.....worth having a look.

    Quote Originally Posted by louieatienza View Post
    I purchased SYK fixed and free end bearing supports, AC bearings, for C3 ballscrews, and was impressed with the fit and finish. Bought them from WorldOfCnc's website (Marchant Dice) a while back.
    That is good to know. The PVP is made in Taiwan also and is less expensive. I'm curious if the quality is comparible. I will most likely get the C7 rated. I will be using the C7 rolled ballscrews but with double nuts. I looked for ones on ebay but they are all an arm and a leg for a used screw, and I definitely won't be buying new ground C3 screws. LOL!



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    Default Re: Ballscrew End Supports - Opinions Needed - TMT (SYK) vs PVP vs China Generic

    Quote Originally Posted by NIC 77 View Post
    Where would I buy Misumi from? I'm on a strict budget but if there is a comparable product.....worth having a look.

    That is good to know. The PVP is made in Taiwan also and is less expensive. I'm curious if the quality is comparible. I will most likely get the C7 rated. I will be using the C7 rolled ballscrews but with double nuts. I looked for ones on ebay but they are all an arm and a leg for a used screw, and I definitely won't be buying new ground C3 screws. LOL!
    us.misumi-ec.com

    My ballscrews are rated C5 (precision ground) though I also had a set of C3 ballscrews, this way I could use them for either... When I get a chance I'll post some pics of the SYK ones...

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by RCaffin View Post
    Are Fk15 and BF15 bearings single race or double race?
    If they are single race you will have backlash.
    If you have double bearings at one end which can be pre-loaded, then you can get rid of (most of) the backlash.
    Economy here may be very wasteful.

    cheers
    Roger
    R O G E R! Good to still see you here...



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    Default Re: Ballscrew End Supports - Opinions Needed - TMT (SYK) vs PVP vs China Generic

    I ended up doing something a bit differently. I have ordered a set of C5 bearings from a company in China. I asked the sales person point blank about my concerns with preload between the two bearings on the fixed end and he was able to satisfy me with his answers. I bought them direct from the manufacturer. He says they are true C5 quality and better than the SYK C7 and PVP C7 I was looking at. He said they were closer to misumi in quality than those, and the pictures on the website looked great, so I purchased 4 FK15, and BF15's, and 4 extra nuts (I've heard it's better to use double nuts, what do you guys think?). I'll have the ends of my ballscrews machined accordingly, I will need custom lengths regardless, and the end machining is included in the cost of the ballscrews. Here is the pic he sent before shipping:

    Ballscrew End Supports - Opinions Needed - TMT (SYK) vs PVP vs China Generic-bun-4-jpg


    I hope I made the correct choice. I will let you guys know what they are like when they arrive. I expect shipping to take a month.

    I'm also ordering a set of 4 SYK MBA 15-F motor brackets from a different supplier. I'll let you know how that turns out as well.



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    Default Re: Ballscrew End Supports - Opinions Needed - TMT (SYK) vs PVP vs China Generic

    Quote Originally Posted by NIC 77 View Post
    I ended up doing something a bit differently. I have ordered a set of C5 bearings from a company in China. I asked the sales person point blank about my concerns with preload between the two bearings on the fixed end and he was able to satisfy me with his answers. I bought them direct from the manufacturer. He says they are true C5 quality and better than the SYK C7 and PVP C7 I was looking at. He said they were closer to misumi in quality than those, and the pictures on the website looked great, so I purchased 4 FK15, and BF15's, and 4 extra nuts (I've heard it's better to use double nuts, what do you guys think?). I'll have the ends of my ballscrews machined accordingly, I will need custom lengths regardless, and the end machining is included in the cost of the ballscrews. Here is the pic he sent before shipping:

    Ballscrew End Supports - Opinions Needed - TMT (SYK) vs PVP vs China Generic-bun-4-jpg

    I hope I made the correct choice. I will let you guys know what they are like when they arrive. I expect shipping to take a month.

    I'm also ordering a set of 4 SYK MBA 15-F motor brackets from a different supplier. I'll let you know how that turns out as well.
    They're usually two angular contact bearings, either arranged back-to-back, or front-to-front. In the case of these ballscrew supports I believe they are front-to-front, since the bearing retainer pushes against the outer race, and if shims are necessary they would be between the inner races.. A link to their site would be nice!



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    Default Re: Ballscrew End Supports - Opinions Needed - TMT (SYK) vs PVP vs China Generic

    Quote Originally Posted by louieatienza View Post
    A link to their site would be nice!
    https://dghddz.en.alibaba.com/

    https://wholesaler.alibaba.com/produ...605413003.html



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    Default Re: Ballscrew End Supports - Opinions Needed - TMT (SYK) vs PVP vs China Generic

    Guess what showed up at my door today! I have purchased stuff on E Bay, a few small things like drill bits and taps that haven't shown up yet that I ordered from China almost 2 months ago, but this took about 3 days. Holy Cow!

    Ballscrew End Supports - Opinions Needed - TMT (SYK) vs PVP vs China Generic-01-bearings-jpg
    Ballscrew End Supports - Opinions Needed - TMT (SYK) vs PVP vs China Generic-02-bearings-jpg

    I have built a CNC machine before. It was rack and pinion. So take with a grain of salt my experiences and review. I have never had the opportunity to handle the popular American or Japanese or European counterparts to these products. And once I actually use them, my opinion could change.

    For the FK15's, I will say this. They are machined from steel. There is absolutely no slop or play in them at all. The bearings spin nicely, no gritty feel, nothing that concerns me. And absolutely no axial or radial movement. They look and feel solid, I have zero complaints at this point.

    Something interesting about the nuts:

    Ballscrew End Supports - Opinions Needed - TMT (SYK) vs PVP vs China Generic-03-bearings-jpg
    Ballscrew End Supports - Opinions Needed - TMT (SYK) vs PVP vs China Generic-04-bearings-jpg

    I apologize for the quality of the second picture, but my flash kept reflecting off the shiny steel. You can see that there is no hole for the set screw, but there is a gold discoloration where the hole is. So they made a set screw that when tightened can't damage the threads on the ballscrew. Well done!

    For the BF15's. I admit my ignorance with these products. I thought the bearings should be a light press fit. I was surprised when I saw that I could slide the bearings freely in an axial direction. It makes sense now that I think about it, that if you have a ballscrew that is 1mm longer than you planned that you could slide the bearing on the free side inside the housing to accommodate. Nevertheless, you can slide them axially. There is very very little play radially, and if you try to twist them, they only move very slightly. The piece of paper in the photo is .003" thick and you would literally have to tap the bearing with a rubber mallet to get in to move more. By hand that's as far as it goes. The bearings are marked "Germany Bun Z2009"

    Ballscrew End Supports - Opinions Needed - TMT (SYK) vs PVP vs China Generic-05-bearings-jpg

    So what do you all think?

    I'll let you know when my SYK MBA15-F's arrive.



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    Default Re: Ballscrew End Supports - Opinions Needed - TMT (SYK) vs PVP vs China Generic

    There is no problem with the bearing at the free end of the ball screw 'floating'. That is normal. The bearing at the free end MUST float so as to handle any effects of thermal expansion.
    For that matter, many shorter ball screws don't even get a bearing at the free end.

    Cheers
    Roger



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    Default Re: Ballscrew End Supports - Opinions Needed - TMT (SYK) vs PVP vs China Generic

    Quote Originally Posted by RCaffin View Post
    There is no problem with the bearing at the free end of the ball screw 'floating'. That is normal. The bearing at the free end MUST float so as to handle any effects of thermal expansion.
    For that matter, many shorter ball screws don't even get a bearing at the free end.

    Cheers
    Roger
    That is good to know. Thanks for your input! I assumed it was a light press fit and you'd machine the ballscrew a mm or so more than was necessary on the free side. My assumption was wrong. I have to say that the fit is very close.

    Overall, I must say that I'm quite happy with the purchase. And the customer service from these guys is excellent. I just got another message today saying they are happy to work with me if I have any problems.



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    Default Re: Ballscrew End Supports - Opinions Needed - TMT (SYK) vs PVP vs China Generic

    Quote Originally Posted by NIC 77 View Post

    The bearings are marked "Germany Bun Z2009"
    What about FK unit bearings? Can you show their marking?



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    Default Re: Ballscrew End Supports - Opinions Needed - TMT (SYK) vs PVP vs China Generic

    Quote Originally Posted by kikabidze_liq View Post
    What about FK unit bearings? Can you show their marking?
    The FK15's are assembled with two bearings preloaded together. You can't see the markings on them because they come as an assembled unit. They have two rubber seals instead of the metal shield where the markings are stamped at the free end. You're not supposed to take them apart because the preload is set at the factory during assembly, at least that is my understanding, so I will not be disassembling them to look for markings. They feel like good quality bearings when you spin them, and I am happy with them.

    I've provided a link to the manufacturer in a previous post. Send them a message and ask if you want to know about their bearings. They have been helpful at answering my questions, I'm sure they will tell you what you want to know.

    My SYK motor mounts have been shipped, I'll update you guys when they arrive.



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    Default Re: Ballscrew End Supports - Opinions Needed - TMT (SYK) vs PVP vs China Generic

    The SYK MBA 15F mounts have arrived. The Bun brand FK15s slid in nicely. It was like putting a piston into a piston liner. Perfect fit!



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