Useing cam for a Haas

[leggetmachine]

Ok i am new to this so help if you could help me out. I have worked as a machinist for about 10 years mainly with Mazaks and Hurcos. All programing was done right at the machine on the control. I now work for a small job shop a 2 man operation the owner and me. and we are looking in to getting a mill. We are wanting to get a Haas. i have been looking at some older used Haas and noticed that they just program in standard g code. my question is do you all program at your machines in g-code or do you use a cam system of some kind for your programs. just wondering what every one is useing any help would be great thanks

[lakeside]

all machine tools will read eia format which is stander g code it when you get into can cycle,program command lines and macros that some codes are assigned by the machine builder

[gar]

060627-0714 EST USA

leggetmachine:

For complex surfaces we use Mastercam. Note: Mastercam or other CAM programs generate G-code.

For simple jobs G-code directly on the machine, created on a computer with a text editor, taking an old program and modifying it, building from some standard macros, or any combination of these.

For more complex, but not surfaces we have our own program to translate a drawing file to G-code.

If your are doing volume production you want to use G-code that you optimize for productive efficiency. You could generate this G-code from a CAM program or other ways.

.

[Ken_Shea]

Everyone I know uses some form of CAM, with your g-code only experience you should be able to get the most out of any CAM software. After the learning curve you might think you died and went to heaven

Haas now has theri own CAM called HaasCam, OneCNC is the brains underneath the HaasCam label.

Here is a link with some discussion that may be of interest.
http://www.cnczone.com/cg...7;t=000163;p=0

Ken

[leggetmachine]

thanks, i think that mainly answered my question. the large company i work for also and i mean large 30,000 employies in several countries but anyway we mainly use mazatrol to do our programs and on the hurco we use their conversational programing. we had a machine that we programed in just g code and it just took so long thats why i was asking if you all program at your machine or use cam. so yes i work 2 jobs the little 2 man shop i am in the works to buy it from the owner so he can retire. i was just wondering if i was going to have to spend the money for a cam system with the machine

thanks ken hit the nail on the head i have heard about the HaasCam and i was wondering what it was like thanks again

so anyway thanks all i love these forums and all the great info keep up the good work

[Geof]

Everyone I know uses some form of CAM.....Ken

If having addressed someone on the zone qualifies as 'knowing' them then the above statement is unintentionally inaccurate; I have never used CAM. I do use a very simple 2D CAD program for plotting tangent points and intersections but I code everything by hand. If the shape can be described as a combination of simple curves and straight lines and if you can extract intersection points from a CAD drawing then whether you choose to hand code or use CAD/CAM in my opinion should be a decision based on how many pieces you are making. A CAM generated program will almost certainly have a longer cycle time than a hand coded one and for any part there is going to be a break point where the combined Program + Setup/Prove + Machine Time is less by going the hand coding route. And this is the important time; it is pretty hopeless if you save a couple of hours programming time and then lose a minute per piece on 300 pieces.

Notice I say if you can extract intersection points from a drawing; I can calculate them but I never do because that is much slower than plotting them.

If you are doing moulds or idiotic convoluted shapes dreamed up by some pointy headed designer you have no choice you have to use CAM.

[rickyt]

I use Mastercam for all my programming on my Haas. I could program at the controller
but why? With Mastercam it is easy to modify programs and I can backplot and verify my part. I also have files for every customerI do work for with there part programs in. Even on most of todays machines you only have so much memory(Iknow you could upgrade) but you still dont have the filing that a computer has. the more you use your cam system thebetter you get at it, you setup your tool and operations libraries and in no time you can fly when programming.

[Ken_Shea]

Geof,
I was speaking of personal acquaintances. If you or anyone else finds hand coding only, quicker, better, more profitable. then more power to you, I envy your experience, you then would of course, not qualify as one of the "Everyone I know"

If you have never used CAM software then you are about as qualified to speak of the drawbacks as I am to speak of the benefits of hand coding, which I have never done.

As for me, I will stick with the CAM software.

Ken

[Geof]

.... If you have never used CAM software then you are about as qualified to speak of the drawbacks as I am to speak of the benefits of hand coding, which I have never done....

Interesting implication in this sentence; that I do not know enough about CAM software for my opinion to hold weight. I have not used it personally but I do have employees who have used CAM software and who have generated programs for some of our parts so I do know that CAM programs run slower than hand coded programs; many times several minutes slower.

[HuFlungDung]

Geof,

You have surprised me! I'm gonna have to ask my mommy if we can still be friends

I cannot imagine doing much without a cadcam program, if for no other reason than to avoid typing the values into an editor or into the control. Typing programs in can be bad for your machine's health Do you like to agonize over each and every line when you prove it out the first time?

You must also be very skilled and know exactly what you want and how you are going to do the job the first time around! If there is any degree of complexity to the program at all, I usually am not happy with one phase or another of what I have created, not because the CADCAM is lacking, but because I did not maximize the use of a particular tool, fed too fast, too deep or tens of other reasons. Then I go back to the computer, generate a new and improved program in about 2 minutes and am back up and running with very little lost time, and not running a second-rate program because it is too tedious to hand edit the thing.

Simple 2d profiles, and such, I don't think I could create anything more succinct than OneCNC (as an example) creates the first time around. You should, when you have a half a day sometime, take a OneCNC demo to see what I am talking about. Maybe you'll be impressed, maybe not.

[rickyt]

+1000

It is so easy to change the tool path to gain the max performance for the tool.
If I see a better way of machining some thing (ie, entry point, step down, feeds)
like hu said 2 minutes, repost and off and cutting.

[gar]

060627-1925 EST USA

Some examples:

See my web site www.beta-a2.com then MISCELLANEOUS PHOTOS.

Most of the turning operations are hand coded using HAAS canned cycles, and modifying prior programs. The mill operations were done with Mastercam, except for photo P8 which was done with our own conversion program.

The space space station which is really a shifter lever and knob and similar units are made in the hundreds and therefore optimized for cycle time. The fuel injector components are special and about 16 were made. The license plate had 3 or 4 made.

Also see www.ltekindustries.com PART PHOTOS page. These were mostly done with Mastercam. Other than for the camera housing these were generally only made in quantities of 1 to 3.

(edit 060717-1032) correct spelling of ltek (end edit)

.