Haas TL2 Collet closers

[tooldude328]

We are about to purchase a new TL2 lathe and was wondering what every one is doing for collet chucks and closers? We have looked at Royal but they just offer 5C collet closers for the TL series. I was wondering if anyone is using something different. Seems a waste to have the 2+ inch throught the spindle and not use the bigger collets used by other lathes like 16C or 3J.

[gizmo_454]

Hello,

I do not have a Tool Room Lathe from Haas, but have looked at them in the past. If memory serves me, they have an A2-6 spindle nose on them. That being the case, get their hydraulic closer option and contact ATS Workholding in Rancho Santa Margarita, California, or Hardinge in Elmira, NY.

They both sell collet setups for "C", "J", and "S" type collets. 3J collets are good to 1.75" round stock. I know that the "S" type goes at least to 2" round stock, maybe larger. For that matter, when you are talking to your Haas sales person, tell them what size stock you want to hold in your collet and they should be able to get the machine setup for you from the factory with the collet, if you buy the machine new.

When we bought our SL-10, we ordered a 16C collet closer for it in addition to the 3 jaw chuck. If you go about it that way, as we did, the chuck manufacturer will make sure you have the correct draw tube to collet adapter you need to make things work.

I hope this information helps a little bit.

Mike

[leggazoid]

ATS-Sjogren Speed Chucks

3J or a 22J

probably need M19 to lock spindle to tighten collet.

[tooldude328]

Thanks for the input guys. I should have stated that this will not be a production type environment so I don't need power clamping. I found what I was looking for with a manual closer from either Bison or Lexair for 16C style collets.

[JohnJW]

I am also looking for a collet chuck but I wondering if I am closing the chuck manually, is there any advantage to using a collet chuck vs a 3 or 4 jaw chuck?

thanks,

John

[Donkey Hotey]

...if I am closing the chuck manually, is there any advantage to using a collet chuck vs a 3 or 4 jaw chuck?

Do you hold a screwdriver better with three fingers, or with your whole hand wrapped around it? It's the same thing with collets: they hold the part around the entire circumference. On hollow parts, this results in less clamping distortion. On solid parts, it means the stock is better supported. I actually had a 2" bar knocked out of a three jaw chuck when used to hold the bar upright for milling. That's an eye-opener.

Three jaws are nice for onesy-twosey work but, if I'm going to run a bunch of something, I'll either take the time to setup the collet closer or make proper soft-jaws for the chuck.

Of course, the limitation then becomes the size of your collets.

[Geof]

..... I'll either take the time to setup the collet closer or make proper soft-jaws for the chuck.....

Or make some soft jaws to grip collets if you don't have a collet closer.

http://www.cnczone.com/forums/attach...4&d=1154994272

[JohnJW]

Do you hold a screwdriver better with three fingers, or with your whole hand wrapped around it? It's the same thing with collets: they hold the part around the entire circumference. On hollow parts, this results in less clamping distortion. On solid parts, it means the stock is better supported. I actually had a 2" bar knocked out of a three jaw chuck when used to hold the bar upright for milling. That's an eye-opener.

Three jaws are nice for onesy-twosey work but, if I'm going to run a bunch of something, I'll either take the time to setup the collet closer or make proper soft-jaws for the chuck.

Of course, the limitation then becomes the size of your collets.

But, these are not my wimpy fingers. . . . I am wondering because I can see the speed advantage of a pneumatic/hydraulic collet chuck, but if I have to open and close manually as with a scroll chuck don't I loose most of the advantage of a collect chuck?

I guess for thin wall tubes a collect chuck is better but how much cutting force must be applied before needing a collet chuck vs a 3 jaw chuck? If I am cutting some 1" diameter aluminum rods on a TL, is there an advantage to using a collet chuck?

Other than gripping force, do collet chucks offer better cocentricity than a typical 3 jaw chuck? especially for smaller diameter parts?

I am wondering because the pneumatic collect chucks are not cheap so should I look at it as a all or nothing decision or should I consider a manual collet chuck as a compromise for parts within the range of 5C collets.

Thanks,

[Donkey Hotey]

Or make some soft jaws to grip collets if you don't have a collet closer.

Show off!
(that really is a good idea)

But, these are not my wimpy fingers

Yeah, actually, they are pretty wimpy when compared to a collet. Yes, collets generally run much more concentric than a chuck (even if the collet closer isn't a set-true style). Even after carefully dialing in my BTC chuck, I've found that it's only true at that diameter (and sometimes at that instant--open and close it again and all bets are off). The scrolls are not that accurate and don't seem to hold concentricity at all sizes.

The jaws mark you parts during second operations (do you want jaw marks on your freshly cut surfaces?). If you're using universal step jaws, they only contact a small portion of the work. The jaws are flinging around in space--just something else to clank into with the toolpost.

You don't need a pneumatic closer. Manual is just fine. Actually, you may not need collets at all. It's just another method of work holding. It's just like soft jaws for your chuck: when you do actually need them, you'll know and it will seem totally obvious to you.

[KenFoulks]

Every kind of work holding has it's advantages. There are many sizes of collet, not just 5C, there are also power collet chucks. Here is an article that describes when a collet should be used:

When To Use A Collet Chuck : Modern Machine Shop

[JohnJW]

Thanks for the article. I guess I will either look for a manual collet chuck larger than 5C or a 5C pneumatic one. There are a few small aluminum diameter parts I want to turn on the TL and like Donkey mentioned, I wouldn't want to leave jaw marks on the finish side when I flip the part around.

thanks again,

[tooldude328]

great article/explanation of when to use collet chucks Donkey.
I found a great assortment of manual and Pneumatic collet chucks at
Collet Chucks and Collets -5C, 16C, 3J, B42, b60, BZI


Thanks for all the input guys.