Plasmacam, Torchmate, Tracker? any feedback?

[duraflap]

I've been looking at the PlasmaCam, TorchMate and the Tracker Plasma machines.
Anyone own and or use one of these. I'd like to hear your feedback on cutting quality and factory support of these machines.
I'm needing to cut #8 finish Stainless Steel parts.

Tell me what you think
Dennis
dennis@duraflap.com

[jimcolt]

I have an early version (around 8 years old) PlasmaCam...it is used sporadically for all materials from gauge to 1-1/4" thick...it has a Hypertherm Powermax1000. I have been very happy with the performance of this machine....the software is particularly easy to learn....and importing .dxf files are a breeze. My machine has their old technology torch height control...basically a controlled drag type height control.....the newest PlasmaCam machines have arc voltage height control with an advanced initial height sensor. A few years back I had a control box fail....it was replaced with a rebuilt one with a trade in price...other than that just a few drive belts have failed.....easy to replace.

I would not hesitate to buy from them again.

Jim Colt

[duraflap]

Thank you Jim for your thoughts. Have you ever cut #8 finish Stainless Steel?
That will be the majority of my needs.
Dennis

[jimcolt]

I'm not sure exactly what #8 finish ss is....is the 8 a finish spec or a thickness?

The Hyperthem air plasma systems cut gauge to about 3/16 stainless very well using the FineCut consumables...there is a bit of discoloration...just on the cut edge due to oxides from the oxygen content in the cutting and ambient air....but quite good cuts with minimal warpage as long as you can keep the cutting speed as high as possible. Above 3/16" thick...the cut quality on stainless still is fairly good....but the edge gets darker...and generally would need a secondary operation (grinding or wire brushing) to get rid of the oxidation.

When stainless is cut with plasma it is strictly a thermal (melting) process as compared to cutting steel....which combines exothermic effects of oxygen (air is approx. 20% oxygen) with the thermal effects of plasma. Because of this...edge squareness will be better on steel as compared to stainless. Expect more bevel on stainless edges as the arc trails approx. 15 to 30 degrees...

There are idustrial (expensive) plasmas that cut stainless using other gas combinations...with better results. I would suggest getting cut samples from the plasma manufacturers to see if the cut quality meeds your needs.

Jim

[duraflap]

Hi Jim
#8 finish is the grade of SS that is Mirror quality. It really is a mirror, brighter than chrome and of course rust proof as it is SS. I cut thousands of pieces of this material via an outside vendor for my mudflap weights with laser each year and I'm hoping to bring this service into my shop on a smaller budget than the cost of a waterjet or laser.
You can see examples of our products on our website at
www.duraflap.com if you are interested.

But you are happy with the Plasma Cam? What about their support? Are they easy to reach and do they give you satisfaction?
Dennis

[jimcolt]

As far as what I call hobby class machines...machines in the under $15K price range...I think the PlasmaCam is as good as any. In the earlier years they were known for their minimalistic warranty...those that were technically savvy and could maintain the machines...and also understood the whole cnc / plasma process were very happy. Those that bought the machine and expected no smoke, perfect cuts and no problems were not happy. In recent years...PlasmaCam seems to have stepped up to the plate by improving their warranty and technical support...and also has added arc voltage torch eigt control with ohmic plate sensing for initial height sensing...which is key to longer consumable life and better cut quality. I like the looks of their new 5 x 10 Samson machine. I believe that they have the easiest complete CAD/CAM software package for beginners.....and it very easily imports .dxf files form just about any drawing package....then you use the PlasmaCam software to post process your drawings with lead ins, kerf compensation and manual or geometric nesting of the parts. Tha machine uses their own proprietary control box...that plugs into a serial output from your PC....x and y axis are dc servos.....I'm not sure what they currently use to control the z axis....mu older machine has a small ac "pancake" motor.

When I call these machines "hobby class"...it is mostly due to the fact that they have relatively lightweight construction...relativelysmall drive motors...are only designed to carry 1 tool (torch) at a time....where an "Industrial class" machine would be constructed more like a machine tool....with much more power (acceleration, heavier payload capacity). Industrial class machines are designed to carry industrial torches...such as Hypertherm's HPR130 or HPR260....which provide dramatically faster cut speeds with better part accuracy and up to 10x longer consumable life. A 5 x 10 Industrial machine with an HPR130 can cost $100,000. If you run machine like this very heavily, 2 shifts a day the $100,000 machine will be more cost effective than the $10,000 machine in less than a year...due to lower operating cost and higher productivity/accuracy.

I have been working with virtually all manufacturers of CNC plasma machines for about 25 years....each machine design has it's advantages. I'm sure this post will raise some questions/objections!

Best regards, Jim Colt

[duraflap]

Thank you Jim
You certainly have a lot more experience than I do about these Plasma machines. I want to look at all the options in the lower cost and probably the Hobbist type of Plasma as I don't have the need for the more industrial types you describe. It would not have the work to pay for itself at this time.
All in all, you have enlightened me and I thank you for your feedback.
I'll probably be contacting you to pick your brain a bit more when I get closer to deciding on which way to go.
Many thanks for now.
Dennis

[duraflap]

How easy is it to convert the Plasma machine to a cnc Router if I wanted a dual purpose machine?
Dennis

[stirling]

I'd doubt if most small plasma machines are rigid/strong enough for routing.

re: choice of machine: I took a long look at some of the vids on youtube (searched simply on cnc plasma). Is it me or is there one machine that just seems to stand head and shoulders way above all the others?

[Torchhead]

How easy is it to convert the Plasma machine to a cnc Router if I wanted a dual purpose machine?
Dennis

It's easier to convert a router to a plasma than vice versa. The reason is that plasma is a non-contact cutting process and the cutting forces are relatively light. Plasma tables typically have light weight gantrys and smaller motors because they don't need to shove a bit through material. Mounting a router to a gantry and slinging it around calls for more torque and less speed. Any gantry flexing results in inaccuracies.

A lot of the plasma tables do not have a full Z axis under control from the PC so are poor candidates for routing even with a dremel tool!

If you think you might need to do something besides plasma cutting make sure the control electronics and control software will support either process. In a machine with MACH changing over to cut with router is just loading another "Profile". Since the THC in MACH is just the Z axis the electronics will use any type of tool on the Z.

The mechanical part of using both is another subject entirely. Change over can be anything from minutes to hours. I saw one table that was longer and setup with a plasma bed on one end and router on the other. They had home s at both ends and just switched cutting heads and moved tot he other end of the table. They could make the table 100% either type with some bed changes.

Tom Caudle
www.CandCNC.com

[duraflap]

Thanks Tom
I called Plasma Cam today and found out what you say is very true.
Their software doesn't control a true Z axis but simply will give you one depth move per program. Being propertiety software, I 'll scratch them off my list.
If I build a table, is it possible to build in the speed a plasma needs to cut thinner material and conversly operate at router feed speeds as well when I wish to use the machine for a router in my shop?
Thanks
Dennis

[curlyweld]

DENNIS , THIS IS MY FIRST REPLY BUT FOLLOW THE SITE NOW FOR ABOUT 2 MONTHS. TOMMORROW I SHOULD RECIEVE MY NEW EZ ROUTER PLASMA SET UP. I ORDERED THE 5 BY 5 SETUP FOR PLASMA. THESE TABLES WERE ORIGINALY SET UP FOR ROUTER AND ARE BUILT VERY STOUT. I EVEN ORDERED MINE WITH A NEW ROUTER AND THE EXTRA Z AXIS TO RAISE AND LOWER IT. I DON'T KNOW HOW MUCH I WILL USE THE ROUTER ,BUT IT WASN'T THAT MUCH MORE TO HAVE IT ALSO SET UP FOR ROUTING.I BOUGHT EVERYTHING FROM THEM EXCEPT THE TABLE . THEY GIVE ME THE DRAWINGS FOR THE TABLE AND I BUILT MY OWN.SO FAR THEY SEEM TO BE A VERY GOOD CO. WITH NO COMPLAINTS THAT I CAN FIND. TAKE A LOOK AT THEIR WEB SITE AND SEE WHAT YOU THINK--EZ-ROUTER.COM-- GIVE BRANDON A CALL OR EMAIL ,HE IS REAL QUICK WITH RESPONSES AND GIVES NO BUYING PRESSURE WHAT SO EVER.THERE'S MY TWO CENTS,,,GOOD LUCK---CURLY