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My 40W Hobby Deluxe was sent directly to me from the Chineese manufacturer with all the FSE boards in place and -supposedly- quality controlled.
I'm not sure the point of your thread. FSE is an US based company. They sell Chinese goods, not unlike a company like Walmart.
What services FSE offers vs buying directly from China is something they'll have to convince you of. Everything has it's pros and cons.
My 40W Hobby Deluxe was sent directly to me from the Chineese manufacturer with all the FSE boards in place and -supposedly- quality controlled.
The base machine is a G Weike, and that's a Chinese machine. You're paying a premium, vs buying directly from G Weike, for their support and their controller/software.
That said, I own a 100% US based company, too. I get materials domestically (whenever possible) and also imported. It doesn't mean we aren't employing and supporting the US economy.
*Edit:* Direct from their website: "Our machines are opened, quality inspected then repackaged in Las Vegas, NV." There's value to the piece of mind that someone in the US has checked this, is handling the import process, and is there for support. The purchaser has to decide it that's worth the premium.
I guess my problem with it is at the time I bought it, I was lead to believe, by the wording on their site and the way they flaunt 100% US Based, that it was an american made machine. Maybe that was my mistake in misreading, or assuming based on all the "100% US Based". I can say, the website is different now. I actually found them on ebay, and their current ebay ad says:
Specifications:
40W FS-LSMINI40 CO2 Laser (4th gen):
designed by USA Engineering Team that understands lasers, not fly by night importers/exporters
That lead ME to believe it was a US made product. Read it. The laser is designed by a USA engineering team. That INFERS to me that it's a US made laser.
All I'm saying is everything I've seen from them lead me to believe it wasnt a cheap chinese model.
Now, I'll say, their retina card and software really is great. I like how they update the software, how they incorporate requested features. I just feel like their website is somewhat misleading - lead me to believe it was NOT a chinese made laser.
As per the shipping label on my first 40W Deluxe Hobby Laser, it was shipped directly from China and not the USA, which was probably why my first one was no good, as it hadn't been checked by the FSE team.
I'm not in The USA, so it coming from China directly is probably a smart move, but it did lead to troubles with the machine, as it hadn't been checked by the FSE team.
The machine that was sent to me to replace the first one, was sent from Las Vegas (that is what the tracking info and the packing slip said) and I was assured by Henry that he had personally checked the machine.
He must have done, as this one has (almost) worked perfectly - the wrong bolt being used to mount the mirror bracket would be pretty hard to detect without dismantling the machine.
I'm in Eastern Australia too and my 40W Deluxe was also drop-shipped directly from China, with the same basic experience Bec has had (US plugs and all).
I bought a 48x36 from FSL recently. I will say that many things are out of square and the workmanship is kind of lacking but I knew going into the deal that I was buying a Chinese machine, made and assembled in China. I wasn't expecting perfect but I will say what I got was better than I expected. My honeycomb is really out of square, but it doesn't effect it's use.
I will say that the laser could not have possibly been tested by FSL. If it was it never test cut anything. One mirror mount was so far out of alignment that I figured I would have to make a new mounting plate. After I took it apart I found some huuuge burrs, cleaning those up let the beam stay parallel to the axes after a good bit of fiddling. It would not cut as it shipped, or if it would it was only over a very small portion of travel. I don't think it was bumped out of place because as I said those burrs kept the mirror way too far out, it never would have aligned right with it there. There was no attempt made at all to align the red dot to the CO2. I didn't get any manuals with the laser, no CD's either. Just a piece of paper with a link for drivers/software. That pissed me off a lot (Seriously FSL, you send a Gweike USB drive. How hard would it be to copy the manuals/drivers to it??) But a phone call or three later and I had everything I needed.
I guess what I'm getting at is that I doubt they test the lasers. If they do it's just to see if it turns on and not much more.
The reason I decided to buy from FSL instead of China is security. If FSL decided to try to shaft me I have a lot more legal recourse than against some china company. I might have to drive to Vegas to do it, but it could be done. It's something to think about. What recourse do you think you have directly wiring money to China? You should consider that when your choosing a machine, research the options you know?
Also, if you couldn't tell that FSL gets there lasers from China you must not have done much research before you bought it. There are hundreds of China sellers selling identical lasers, same paint scheme and all. The whole play on words "USA Based" pretty much pushes that from an educated guess to a hard fact. The cost VS real US companies seals the deal. If it walks like a duck...
I never saw this "US engineered" stuff, but it is very possibly referring to the retina card. It's hard to say, seeing as how you only copied one line from wherever you found that. I looked on ebay and didn't even find a FSL.
I purchased a 40w Hobby laser from FSL and am quite happy with it. I had previously purchased a 40w laser directly from China that ran Newly Draw. Yep, it is the same box but different electronics controlling the machine. The FSL electronic and software are great! I still have the piece of junk from China and am still considering the electronic upgrade that FSL offers just so I can have a 2nd laser.
BTW, I did have a piece on the cable carrier broken when it arrived. I contacted FSL and they promptly shipped me a new piece. Fortunately it was the end piece that is open so I did not have to unplug anything to install the new piece.
The reason they want 5 star ratings is the same reason eBay sellers need the 5 star rating. Anything less cost them MONEY in their sales. Google has the ability to even knock them down in the priority list when you are doing a search for lasers if their rating slips. (If their rating is good, they will probably show up on the first page of a search, if it is really bad, they may be several pages deep before you find them. If you don't see them on first page of a Google search you will probably go with someone on the first search page. IE it cost them MONEY not to have the 5 star rating.) It encourages them to work with the buyer to resolve issues to make the customer happy.
An extra note about FSE lenses. On their website they list prices for other focal length lenses. Including the standard 2". All are about $300 if memory serves.
You might, like I did, make the assumption that they use high quality lenses in their lasers.
I had an issue with my original lens cracking from the heat build up. During a phone call or email with FSE, they let out that despite the fact they sell a $300 2" lens, that is NOT the lens that ships with the laser. It's a cheap chinese lens.
Needless to say my replacement lens was $42 on ebay, and not $300 from FSE.
Just a little more transparency I think needs to be stated.
thanks for confirming that about the lenses
i got one off ebay the other day, a 2.5' lens for $32 and it looks identical to the lens that it came with.
just thought i'd add my 2cents worth,
what we have really paid for is the electronics, the laser is just an off the shelf chinese laser that FSE say they have full input into.
When my laser arrived in australia it had no retina card.
i had to wait another week for the retina card to arrive from the states.
I was pretty pissed off that it looked from all accounts the laser would be coming from the states, then the Fedex tracking showing it was coming from Gauzhan in China.
But when i got it and got the issues with it sorted out i was happy
these issues include a power supply that ended up blowing up, this was after it took out 3 retina cards and 2 motor driver boards and allot of downtime
i've had the laser for 17 months now and am still learning
I talked with Jason yesterday on the phone, for a good hour almost.
He answered to the best of his ability, questions I had.
While I consider myself decently knowledgeable with machines, I am not a maintenance tech. But I do maintain and upgrade my machines the best I can.
With all the china machines I have purchased, I have noticed good and bad in them.
The biggest thing I look for is support. If I have a problem I want support. You can see my link below on J-Cut. I came to the conclusion that after numerous emails back and forth about problems with a brand new $8000 machine, having to invest almost another $2500 or so ( I can't even remember, and don't really want to remember ) of my own money to get the machine to even operate, was disgusting.
The disappointing thing.... no support. I needed a schematic for the machine. Simple request I think. But after several emails, I was told they didn't have one they could give me.
Which my point of this is......
FSE is atleast a phone call away at US time standards. I can call someone and get them on the phone. Jason was helpful yesterday, but I haven't bought a machine yet. How much help would someone be after I bought the machine? I can't answer that , but look at the above posts to answers.
100% based US ..... here lies a problem with those that are tinkering and those that are real businesses.
I am a real business. Do I wish I could purchase German and American machines. Heck yes. But the bottom line is I can't all the time. Hence the China machines. Do the China machines do the job. Yes with a lot of aggravation usually. But for me, spending $250,000 on a machine, or spending $50,000 for a machine.... I think no more explanation needed there. When the time comes and funds are available for the $250,000 machine, yes I will have a good German or American CNC.
BUT I WILL SAY.... right up front I asked Jason about China etc. He didn't beat around the bush, didn't try and hide it one bit. He told me components and assembly is done in China. I don't care where the machine is built IF its quality controlled and works as it should out of the box.
Obviously its a hard concept for many tinkering people to grasp. Your buying cheap equipment ( play toys ) and with that cheap equipment, you aren't going to get support. If you want to pay $250 an hour and get HAAS support, then buy a HAAS. It will work right ( 99% of the time ) after they service it for you. It will cost you an arm and leg, but it will be running again.
The bottom line, I am going to research FSE a little more. The price seems fair, the software seems good and easy and support seems good/decent.
Can you buy the same china laser for $650 on Ebay. Probably. But your not going to get the software or support. That is what your paying for. That costs money.
Big companies make big money and charge big money. Little companies make little money and charge little money and hence usually can't give the support like a bigger company can.
If we all wanted awesome machines, we would be spending $10-12,000 on an Epilog wouldn't we?
I could ramble more and I probably will after others post. But I think most people can probably get my drift of what I am saying.
Todd
http://www.cnczone.com/forums/chinese_machines/128856-my_j-cut_nightmare_machine_one.html#post944750
I've learned a lot over the last 1+ year owning this machine, leaning about CNC, and now being in the process of building my own CNC mill.
First, FSE's primary product: RetinaEngrave and the USB card. That is, without a doubt, an absolutely amazing piece of software/equipment. It truly turns a POS china laser into a great machine. It's funny... I feel like with the 40watt FSE hobby laser, it's like you're buying a ford pinto and putting a ferrarri engine into it. The machine itself is a piece of crap. Nothing is aligned, nothing STAYS aligned, the tolerances on many things are off (my Z-table took WEEKS just to get flat, and stay there), FSE claims they factor test every machine before it goes out, but I cant tell you the number of stories I hear about machines arriving misaligned, with missing parts, things broken, etc.
But the engine in it, RetinaEngrave, is freaking amazing. It truly is a cheap piece of crap car with a turbopowered engine in it.
I've been looking at upgrading my laser for a while now. I've learned the limitations of 40watts and a glass tube, and my 9x14" max working area, and I want more. And I saw some Epilog's and others at a local show and they blew me away.
But honestly? They don't run Retina. I've been considering a FSE 80watt (metal tube) laser. Mainly because I know it runs retina, and what a great product it is.
I started this thread pissed at that company, and while I still have a bad taste in my mouth regarding treatment, their own, in house, american made product is awesome.
The laser is hit or miss, and you'll absolutely need to put a lot of tiime into it to get it to work the way you want.
The Retina controller is unparalleled, however.
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