Toner Transfer Failure

[lurch]

Canon Photo Paper Plus Glossy UPC# 013803021172, 92ISO brightness, 270g/m2 paper weight~17.91lb paper english measure, 10.5 mil thickness. Using various times and pressures up to 3.5 minutes, and heavy pressure, the best result I could achieve was around 85% transfer. I attribute alot of this result to thickness and composition of paper. Can anyone give me physical specs on successful papers, processess they have had success with? I've read 5bears, and tom gotees pages on this, and I've been to think and tinker... I'm looking for a more common paper.....

[GaryM]

Lurch,
I use Staples picture paper, high gloss, for Ink jet printers.
It works pretty good for me. The paper is a little hard to get off the traces, but not that bad.

Gary

[davesaudio]

I get better results that that just using glossy magazine pages.
Sand with 1000grit first. I think its all about how you soak and rub the paper off
dont peel. toothbrush is good .
HTH

[HayTay]

Lurch,

Additional info on what GaryM said. Here are the Staples Picture Paper specifications and part numbers:

Product Specifications:
Size of Paper - 8 1/2" x 11
Quantity - 100/Pack
Thickness (mil) - 9 mil
Color - Bright White
Finish - Glossy

Staples Photo Basic Paper, 8 1/2" x 11", Gloss, 9 mil, 30/Pack
Part Number (SKU) - 471861
UPC Bar Code - 7 18103 02238 5
Special Buy! Save 20% on Staples Photo Papers. Valid 04/17/05 – 04/23/05
Reg. Price $9.98 SALE PRICE $7.98

Staples Photo Basic Paper, 8 1/2" x 11", Gloss, 9 mil, 100/Pack
Part Number (SKU) - 471865
UPC Bar Code - 7 18103 02241 5
Special Buy! Save 20% on Staples Photo Papers. Valid 04/17/05 – 04/23/05
Reg. Price $29.98 SALE PRICE $23.98

And it's even on SALE!!! I hope this helps.

Harry

[lurch]

Thanks much, Harry! I was looking for more detailed info on the paper itself, your info helps. I know the magazine glossies are run on a clay coated paper to get the smooth surface for the ink. High clay coating means flat surface, no irregularities to catch the eye when a color changes refraction due to surface irregularities yielding a grainy appearance. The high clay coating should be easy to rub away after a decent soak. Also I was worried that the 10.5 mil canon paper just wasn't transmitting enough heat. Ill be trying the staples paper when I can next make it over to Tallahassee, nearest "big town", nothing like that locally. I was thinking of trying glossy pages from some of the industrial trade magazines I get from work, as an alternative. What should I be looking for on the magazine pages? And, how successful is this method??

[jimini]

I haven't tried it but I hear that old National Geographic magazines work very well.
Mut have a high clay content.

[TinkerDJ]

I have used some magazines, some worked okay but others not so well. Best thing with a mag is they are pretty cheap when you consider it.

I do know one thing do not use Kodak paper, i have a whole package of it. Has a kinda plastic coating on it and its a pain to soak off. I had to leave these ones over night.

I ran across this in the yahoo group for homebrew pcb making. What i have played with and had some really good results has been taking a piece of regular paper, put a very thin and consistent coating of silicone cualking on it. If it has any bumps or is uneven then it will not work right. After its dry it is very sticky. Cut out the piece you need with at least a good inch on the top part and tape the top edge to the paper. Run it through the printer. Use a piece of parchment paper between the iron and the transfer paper, i tried wax paper but for some reason it didn't work as well, maybe the wax. Now when you iron it to the board, which has to be scrubbed absolutely spotless and degreased, press hard for about a minute then take the edge of the iron at a slight angle and run it along the paper making sure to get lots of pressure and cover the entire piece. Let it cool, and then peal off the paper slowly and carefully. No soaking, i've only used one type of silicone and its outdoor rated. The hardest part is to get the silicone as smooth as possible. The smoother the better the transfer.

Also the usaull disclaimer, attempting this you take full responsibility that you can kill you laser printer by having the piece of silicone paper get cuaght up in the fuser or something. I haven't had a problem, but i use wide tape and tape at least an inch to the top of the paper.

Last but not least if your looking for a good cheap printer future sh&p has a minolta 1350w refurb on sale for $99 Cdn plus 2 year warranty is $15 Cdn. I payed this and have been more then happy with the results, printed more then 500 sheets now and still %80 on the toner cartrage. Not an endoursment of future sh&p but it took me awhile to find a cheap laser and i hope this helps somebody else.

[abasir]

Originally Posted by lurch Canon Photo Paper Plus Glossy UPC# 013803021172, 92ISO brightness, 270g/m2 paper weight~17.91lb paper english measure, 10.5 mil thickness. Using various times and pressures up to 3.5 minutes, and heavy pressure, the best result I could achieve was around 85% transfer.

Seems like the paper too thick. I personally used about 120g (to prevent warping). Also try increasing the heat. Results may vary because of toner characteristic as well, some toner melts at higher temperature. The blank PCB needs to be cleaned well, I used stainless steel scouring pad (from the kitchen) to prep the board, dry it and cleaned with acetone prior to ironing.

Hope above helps.
p/s: Have you read my PCB DIY pictorial guide (download section).

[H500]

I found that the most critical step is to make sure the printer deposits a lot of toner on the paper. My laserjet could not do this, I ended up photocopying it on the extra dark setting.

[davesaudio]

agree w H500 , setting toner saver=off and options=dark on my samsung.
architectural digest is my mag of choice so far, pages of ads that are mostly whitespace are nicest.

How fine are the traces you guys have tried? I like to fatten mine out where I have the room -

D

[TinkerDJ]

Smallest i have tried is 1mil spacing didn't work so well. I was trying to get down to 0.8mil so that i could use some of the lqfn chips i have, ended up using some boards that i found had a lqfn chip on just cut out the amout of board i needed and used them with wires. I use the toner saver off, and only increase the toner by about 10% or 20% i found that if i made it to dark that it would bleed a little when transfered. Depends on the printer and what toner you have i guess, some guys swear by hp toner and say that the staples or no name stuff isn't as good, the only other transfers i've done before i got this printer was using an hp laser photocopier, those worked out well, i used the bulk hp inkjet photo paper then.

[eqreservoir]

I'm getting my stuff together to give the toner transfer a go. I have a couple safety questions: Is it safe to use the etchant (ferrous chloride) in the garage or basement, or should it be used outside? What happens if you get the etchant on the concrete? I have some Kirkland (from Costco) photo paper on hand, has anyone tried this paper?
Thanks.
HTj