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Thread: 110 single phase to 220 single phase.

  1. #21
    Nono
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    Here it its. The switch would not come a part to show the connections. Here is a picture of the top wiring diagram.

    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails 110 single phase to 220 single phase.-switch-2-jpg  


  2. #22
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    Simple question....if this is an Industrial Hobbies unit.....why wasn't it wired already? You should only have to make 3 power connections if this is an unmodified machine.

    Just for grins draw a diagram of what you have....yes trace the wires.



  3. #23
    Nono
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    A better question is can I take 2 hot 110v legs and get 220v power without an inverter?
    But putting them together

    Last edited by Nono; 06-04-2005 at 12:20 AM. Reason: not sur


  4. #24
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    Say what....the only way to get 220 is to use the 2 hots from a center tapped transformer.....which is what comes into most homes.....there are 2 bus bars and a common bus bar at breaker box where the power comes in from the street. You need one line from each of the 2 bus bars....

    Sure touch the two 110 together...no sparks then you're on the same bus bar....big sparks....big problem....



  5. #25
    Nono
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    This is a three wire connection and I am trying to use Four.. This machine is native 220v and my house is 110v. Should I call an electician? I have an outlet that was used for a 4 wire arc welder and I am not sure how to hook it to this switch? I have done some 110 wiring so running wire isn't any problem, I am just not sure if I connect 2 to 1 I have enough voltage.



  6. #26
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    A Step up and down transformer might be the easiest (and safest) way to get 220v single phase using your 110v wall supply. This 3000W one should be more than adequate: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...sPageName=WDVW



  7. #27
    Community Moderator Al_The_Man's Avatar
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    Can you ohm out the switch to see what the different sections indicate? I would say the each section is the same and possibly 11 & 12 are are one pole (NO or NC) and 9 & 10 the other and the other sections follow suit. The wires from the motor would also have to be identified.
    If you are confident that you could wire up a 120v socket then the 240 is no stretch,
    Buy a length of 14 gauge 2 wire and ground from Home depot and a 15a or 20a 240v socket, same as the 120v but pins horizontal, and a 15amp double pole breaker for the panel, turn off the main breaker and wire the 14gx2 to the breaker in a blank space in the panel so that it straddles the 240v breaker posn, if you dont straddle the 240, you get the same 120 on both pins so no harm will be done, no neutral, only ground (bare wire).
    Al

    CNC, Mechatronics Integration and Custom Machine Design

    “Logic will get you from A to B. Imagination will take you everywhere.”
    Albert E.


  8. #28
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    Nono,

    Why not contact Arron at Industrial Hobbies?
    I am quite sure he would be more than happy to supply a proper wiring diagram for this unit as you say it is from him!
    Also, based on your comments, I would find somebody that has more electrical knowledge than you seem to indicate. Improperly handled, 220 or even 110 can give you a nasty sometimes fatal shock. If you can find somebody, stay with them as they do the work and then you can learn as well.
    I am not saying this to be offensive, but I would hate to read on this board that you had a serious accident

    Art
    AKA Country Bubba (Older Than Dirt)


  9. #29
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    The newer dryer receptacles have 4 wires, the older ones have only three. All you need is the two 110 volt hots and the neutral. The 4th wire is the safety ground that came about because of mobile homes (trailer homes)...I believe that was the driving force for the electrical code change.

    Also, you don't connect the 110 volt hots together...you'll see sparks.



  10. #30
    Community Moderator Al_The_Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ViperTX
    All you need is the two 110 volt hots and the neutral.
    Except in this case I don't think he should need the neutral?
    Al.

    CNC, Mechatronics Integration and Custom Machine Design

    “Logic will get you from A to B. Imagination will take you everywhere.”
    Albert E.


  11. #31
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    I thought this horse was dead ... it's turning into an azz

    Ignore the doomsayers and re-read my post ... I warned you that their are no standards when it comes to low current 220 single-phase in residential applications.

    I think you think too much and have gotten confused when it came to tying wire colors together. You need both hots AND A GROUND. Your motor came with a 3-wire cord with Black, White, and Green right? Your fancy new 4-wire plug came with Black, Red, White, and Green right? Then you added some cable between the new plug and the machine cord ... somewhere along their you have to ignore the White (Neutral) from the Dryer plug. Clip it off, wire nut it, tape over it, write nasty words on it, then forget it forever because you will never use. Then connect the dryer plug to machine cord like this:
    Dryer => Machine
    Black => Black (This is a hot wire)
    Red => White (This is a hot wire)
    Green => Green (This is GROUND)

    Now you're freaking out because a hot wire is white ... get over it. This happens all the time but by code you should make a wrap of black electrical tape around it to warn that it's actually a hot wire.

    CP



  12. #32
    Community Moderator Al_The_Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cp8071
    Now you're freaking out because a hot wire is white ... get over it. This happens all the time but by code you should make a wrap of black electrical tape around it to warn that it's actually a hot wire.
    I think you may have overlooked the fact it is not just the motor it is the reversing switch he has shown, there is more detail needed on this to complete the picture.
    Al.

    CNC, Mechatronics Integration and Custom Machine Design

    “Logic will get you from A to B. Imagination will take you everywhere.”
    Albert E.


  13. #33
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    Mind if I take a swing at this dead horse ???
    (licensed master electrician for 20+ years)

    Motor is already internally wired to the reversing switch... right? End of discussion there.

    All homes in US are supplied with 220V.... yours included. The welder and dryer outlets are proof of that.

    Remove the existing dryer breaker from your panel (should be a 2-pole/30Amp ...takes up 2 spaces). Take it to Home depot and buy a 2-pole/15 Amp breaker that matches. It is OK if the wire/receptacle/cord is overrated...NOT OK if the breaker is.

    Follow cp8071's instructions, they are absolutely correct... 2 hots, 1 ground, no neutral.

    And I'll repeat don't go touching wires together to test voltage. Most injuries are caused by the flash of molten metal, not electric shock.
    Good Luck!

    PS- by code you should have a fused-disconnect near the machine

    If it ain't broke... fix it 'til it is.


  14. #34
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    Geesch....electrically the safety ground and the neutral are the same...they are tied together at the breaker box.....the problem is that the safety ground is not suppose to be carrying any current....check the code.....so you use the neutral and leave the safety ground alone.



  15. #35
    Community Moderator Al_The_Man's Avatar
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    I think alot of the confusion has arisen due to among the first posts the connection diagram was shown which I assume is the motor connection only, and shows wiring for a permanant connection for either direction, it was not really explained that there was a reversing switch invlolved which you would use to change the conections for either direction.
    If in fact the motor is already connected, it would still be necessary to know how the switch is wired in order to connect the 240 to the switch, the legends used on the switch to indicate NC contacts is not clear, I assume that is a centre-off switch with opposing contacts closed on either left or right.

    Quote Originally Posted by ViperTX
    ....so you use the neutral and leave the safety ground alone.
    You've lost me completly on that logic.
    Al.

    CNC, Mechatronics Integration and Custom Machine Design

    “Logic will get you from A to B. Imagination will take you everywhere.”
    Albert E.


  16. #36
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    I agree Al, we still need more info I had assumed that he didn't have lots of unconnected wires hanging around, but that he only had 3 which were "undeciced" ... if this assumption is wrong then I wish he had been more clear initially.

    The wiring diagram doesn't match the switch or the pictures; The switch terminal numbers don't match up, the wiring doesn't match up. On the schematic you can see 5 white wires ... in the picture there are white, black, red, brown, and green/yellow wires. Also the thermal switch seems to be missing since I don't see the wire nut and the 5th wire isn't present.

    Let's take into account that this was made in China, so they will always use the cheapest parts available. That being said we need to take their diagrams with a grain of salt. Those white wires in the diagram aren't actually white, and that switch is something different than what's shown ... but that doesn't make it wrong or inoperable. We also should assume that many of these have been sold and they didn't all blow up when they were powered up. So the obvious (and ignorant) way to wire it is probably correct.

    Viper: "Safety Ground", "Ground", "Earth", "Bond" whatever you want to call ... it's not the same as Neutral and the two should never been confused. But I'm sure the insurance inspector will explain that to you one day.

    rc-seller: A fused disconnect, sub-panel, or new dedicated circuit would certainly be the best idea. As you pointed out, changing wire gauges (especially to a smaller size) is a very big no-no.

    CP



  17. #37
    Nono
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    Bubba I spoke with Aaron at Industrial hobbies and found out that 3 wires into the switch are black and white are hot and green is ground. So I will need 2 hot legs in and a ground no neutral. cp8071,Rc, Al and all else who had good comments Thank You.

    Electricity is fun but can be a shocking thing to learn.



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110 single phase to 220 single phase.

110 single phase to 220 single phase.