The G-Code challenge

[IMK1230]

So here we have the G-code challenge laid before any manufacture of CAD/CAM software.

The challenge is to take any computer literate person off the street and to sit them down in front of your CAD/CAM software and get them to draw, generate the tool path and produce the G-code to make the simple shape in the attached photographs.

In thirty minutes.

Oh and by the way they have NO assistance at all from any CAD/CAM literate person they have to figure out the mysteries of your software by themselves!

I say thirty minutes as it took me thirty minutes from opening the door of my workshop to make this item while enjoying a cup of tea. Hoover up the mess and clean up the mill, turn off the light and close the door.


I lay this challenge down because I am computer literate of some forty year software development experience and in my time I have developed numerous applications using 2d and 3d graphics. And I have spent the last week downloading 3D CAD/CAM packages and in not a single one of them can I meet this challenge. In fact there is not a single one of them where I have been able to do it in a days before I just simply gave up with frustration.

Brgds IMK

PS Think ill just give up, anyone want to buy a new X2 CNC mill?

[TOTALLYRC]

Originally Posted by IMK1230 So here we have the G-code challenge laid before any manufacture of CAD/CAM software. The challenge is to take any computer literate person off the street and to sit them down in front of your CAD/CAM software and get them to draw, generate the tool path and produce the G-code to make the simple shape in the attached photographs. In thirty minutes. Oh and by the way they have NO assistance at all from any CAD/CAM literate person they have to figure out the mysteries of your software by themselves! I say thirty minutes as it took me thirty minutes from opening the door of my workshop to make this item while enjoying a cup of tea. Hoover up the mess and clean up the mill, turn off the light and close the door. I lay this challenge down because I am computer literate of some forty year software development experience and in my time I have developed numerous applications using 2d and 3d graphics. And I have spent the last week downloading 3D CAD/CAM packages and in not a single one of them can I meet this challenge. In fact there is not a single one of them where I have been able to do it in a days before I just simply gave up with frustration. Brgds IMK PS Think ill just give up, anyone want to buy a new X2 CNC mill?

If it was easy, then everybody would do it.

My test for a good cad program is how fast can you draw an exact 2 inch line.
does it take 5 pull down menu's? or are you forced to try to move a mouse that perfectly.
How about a line on a forty five degree angle. Same thing.
Graphite is real good at this but the cost is way beyond me.

When you have to say I am proficent in brand x cad and it took me 3 years to learn it. I think it is not what I would call user friendly.

I of course need to start trying more programs but I havn't found one yet.
Desk cnc is a great program for generating gcode but it did take a while to learn and I am computer literate. I can even type with all 10 fingers from time to time.

I think 30 minutes is a bit short, but if the first timer could do it in an 8 hr session, I would be impressed. Espicially if they know nothing about g-code.

[g-codeguy]

Originally Posted by IMK1230 So here we have the G-code challenge laid before any manufacture of CAD/CAM software. The challenge is to take any computer literate person off the street and to sit them down in front of your CAD/CAM software and get them to draw, generate the tool path and produce the G-code to make the simple shape in the attached photographs. In thirty minutes. Oh and by the way they have NO assistance at all from any CAD/CAM literate person they have to figure out the mysteries of your software by themselves! I say thirty minutes as it took me thirty minutes from opening the door of my workshop to make this item while enjoying a cup of tea. Hoover up the mess and clean up the mill, turn off the light and close the door. I lay this challenge down because I am computer literate of some forty year software development experience and in my time I have developed numerous applications using 2d and 3d graphics. And I have spent the last week downloading 3D CAD/CAM packages and in not a single one of them can I meet this challenge. In fact there is not a single one of them where I have been able to do it in a days before I just simply gave up with frustration. Brgds IMK PS Think ill just give up, anyone want to buy a new X2 CNC mill?

If I understand you correctly, you did it in 30 minutes using G-code? I agree. We use Mastercam. If that had been the first part I did on version X, I probably couldn't have done it in 30 minutes, and I have been using Mastercam since at least version 6. v9 would have taken just a few minutes.

[IMK1230]

Originally Posted by g-codeguy If I understand you correctly, you did it in 30 minutes using G-code? I agree. We use Mastercam. If that had been the first part I did on version X, I probably couldn't have done it in 30 minutes, and I have been using Mastercam since at least version 6. v9 would have taken just a few minutes.

Sorry misunderstanding, No I milled it by hand as I am struggling to find any CAD/CAM software where I can learn how draw and produce th G-code to make the object in 30min. I have over the past week download I can’t remember how many CAD/CAM packages that are simply rubbish. Inasmuch as they have two hundred menu/push buttons on the display and perhaps only 10% are applicable to your current context and the rest just mislead and or popup messages saying YOU CAN DO THAT… Well if I cant do it why show me the menu/bush button… Why because they are CRAP and have not been thought trough.

Hence I have laid down for them this 30 minute challenge.. Meet this requirement and I may buy your software.

This looks really sexy and maybe a winner I shall see tomorrow when I can talk to them, as for the rest monkeys so far.

http://www.easymill.com/videos.php


IMK

[magic]

Hi all,

I did this in 10 minutes with DesignCAD 3D MAX and ContourCAM, but since I don't have a mill in the house you will have to make do with a simulation.









It's a kind of magic.

www.magicsystems.com

[IMK1230]

Originally Posted by magic Hi all, I did this in 10 minutes with DesignCAD 3D MAX and ContourCAM, but since I don't have a mill in the house you will have to make do with a simulation. It's a kind of magic. www.magicsystems.com

But how long did it take you to learn the software... Was it more than 30 mins? Challange failed.... Yes or No...
Ctrl+Home, Ctrl+End, Ctrl+Shift+Home,and Ctrl+Shift+End tut,tut,tut...

[BlueChip]

First off ... and this is an essential element ... why would you have to even create a drawing?

Our conversational software .... KipwareM and KipwareT ... were designed to quickly and easily create G code programs for the simple "widgets" made in 90% of shops every day. They were designed so more people ... not CAD/CAM literate ... could get involved with more programming ... leave the complex "stuff" for the CAD/CAm guy, let everyone else program the everyday "stuff" ... this means more productivity.

In this example, conversational software means :

(1) Pull up a chair
(1) Select a menu ... pocket, boss, hole pattern, etc.
(2) Answer the plain-English-questions ... length, width, depth, corner radius, tool size, etc.
(3) Software creates the G code automatically.

No drawing ... no toolpath definition as the software should know what to do ... no 3D options for simple parts ... no CAD/CAM experience required.

If you want to explore it further, please visit our website ... www.KentechInc.com.

Thanks for letting me express my thoughts.

[magic]

Hi IMK1230,

If you are the Ian, who has been writing our support, I suggest that you are more than computer literate.

And it took me a day to learn the software completely.

I don't know what you mean by Ctrl+Home, Ctrl+End, Ctrl+Shift+Home, and Ctrl+Shift+End tut,tut,tut...

Is it a comment on the help, we gave you in our hot line?

It's a kind of magic.

[Switcher]

Vcarve Pro, = 10min.

You can download a free trial from the link above.

.

[Kevin Taylor]

IKM The time required would be contingent to how many of the cam program salesmen call during the 30min. you try to work I'v self taught my self to run a Gcode only mill over the past four year's and it was much easer than learning the cad/cam software I'v bought " Now on the third version and was presured last week to buy the news't because the two step's back I have will not any longer be suported Ie not sold I can get tec suport but the snot nosed punk that was presuring me Thought that since they were not selling it any more that it ment that it was not suported , When I bought the last upgrade I was ashured that the next greatested verson was a long ways out and before my 90 day's of tec suport was up I was reading about the new one on this sight I think with a pocket calculator and pencil and the rough diminsions with note pad I could wright the code in 30 min. and I'm Etarded


Good luck Kevin

[HuFlungDung]

I think its kind of a bull**** challenge. Its like asking a 5 year old to write a novel by giving him a pencil and a copy of the alphabet.

Computer literate doesn't mean much. People only know what they've been exposed to, and that means that they have practiced whatever it is that they know.

Computer literate does not mean the the person understands the words 'perpendicular, fillet, diameter' or a host of other industry jargon that is assumed to be in the working vocabulary of the average person sitting in front of a cadcam screen.

I had a customer in my shop the other day, looking at my Haas VF3 in action, doing some 4th axis milling. He asked "What does this machine do?" He didn't even know what a cutter was, or where it was. He was totally clueless because he had absolutely no background to understand it.

This is where intuitive (aka common sense) has a restricted meaning that applies to 'those acquainted with the field of expertise', although maybe not familiar with the menus of a particular piece of software.

Windows itself has 'become intuitive' only in the sense that it is everywhere, and a lot of programs copy a similar theme. But it sure has heck isn't intuitive to a total greenhorn.

So you're never going to fly with a program if you don't tackle a tutorial first. The question is, can you complete the tutorial in less than 30 minutes? Then you've got some kind of a basis on which to build your own knowledge, because there is nothing natural about cad nor cam.

[BobWarfield]

If you couldn't learn to mill that shape manually in 30 minutes without any prior machine tool training or assistance from a manual machinist, why would you expect to do better with CNC?

The reality is most of these CAM programs will take you a lot less time to learn than it would take to learn to do what you've done manually.

Cheers,

BW