Re-man Fadals?

[Scott_bob]

Coolant thru the Tool is the best...

One option:
http://www1.mscdirect.com/CGI/NNSRIT...00264&PMT4NO=0
(If you don't have the Coolant thru option)

We just Plumbed in a Coolant Fitting on the top of the cabinette.
When we wanted Coolant thru, we attached a short hose to this Tool Holder, and M08 turned on this Fitting...

Works ok, even with the low pressure, low volume stock Fadal pump...
Way better than try to just flood from the outside.

[hardrocker]

Excellent! I didn't even realize MSC stocked these. A while back Kendco quoted me about something like $1,000 [for a collet style though IIRC, didn't see that one on MSC], and they said that it wouldn't last very long; even if that was the case, to get some prototyping done, I think it would have been fine.

We maybe should order one of those adaptors for the toolroom anyway, so the Fadal doesn't get loaded with more and more prototype stuff. Of course, with the particular product slated for the Fadal, ThruCoolant was pretty much necessary - not just very, very nice.

[hardrocker]

Scott_bob,

After my verbose reply to your earlier questions, I'm curious of what someone outside of this plant thinks of the course this project played out [I was told to spec out the equiment way back in February!]. I've seen both extremes at other places, but it sure seems like we cut our options on this project too many times [not that I think the budget would have expanded outside of Haas or Fadal anyway].

Actually, on the maintenance note though, every shop I know of in 100mi any direction of here is using exclusively or has at least one Fadal [the same rep handles Kitamura and services everything, but not many around here putting out the cash for high end machines]. So, not speaking for or against the Fadals reliability, I suspect this area should have good service representation for a long time.

[Scott_bob]

hardrocker,

Well as you might guess I am not very optimistic about Fadal Engineering survival. Not with the way they run their buisness. But I have thought that same thing about Microsoft. Actually these two companies have similar faults. Both rely on their popularity rather than on quality or performance.
Low cost at the expense of performance.
Service availability at the expense of durability.
Too many American companies settle for designed obsolecense. You know that widget that was actually designed to break, so you'd come back and buy some service that you're so happy about getting so quickly. And for years Fadal has offered a control that only increased the frequency of breakdowns...

I would not be happy with a Fadal CNC with one of their controls on it. In my opinion you'll be paying for service on your CNC that will be much higher than the additional cost of a better machine that is more accurate and reliable. It's the same idea with race cars. Buy a cheaply made car (you pick) or a quality made car (you pick). At the finish line who is going to win. 2nd place is the 1st loser...

[hardrocker]

Originally Posted by Scott_bob Buy a cheaply made car (you pick) or a quality made car (you pick). At the finish line who is going to win. 2nd place is the 1st loser...

Pretty good analogy! It's a good thing we're not in a race here; however, repairs, not to mention downtime, sure can eat up inital savings real quick. Even the best names in anything still make an occasional lemon, but sometimes it doesn't hurt to pay for better odds. To make that analogy complete, I drive a Chevy, and my wife a Ford; no Lexus in my yard, so I perhaps can't be expecting the company to consider value in intial investment.

I'm not as pessimistic about Fadal disappearing, but I am curious how long they'll play out the old control. I actually asked the dealer, and it sounded like they were burned bad enough by the 104 fiasco that Fadal will likely just keep offering Fanac etc. along with the old MP.

BTW, my previous post addressed Scott_bob, but I actually meant for anyone to find humor at our expense i.e. analysis paralysis leading to grabbing the first available machine. Of course, I'd loved a "heavy duty" machine, but the Fadal may well be the right tool for the job. However, the fact I could have had one running 3 weeks earlier with more HP, onboard CAM, and a preshipping cutting tests [I wonder if they'd let me try some parts in the Kitamura at the same time for the fun of it?!] still perplexes me.

[DareBee]

The race car analogy reminds me of a guy I know.
He always says (CHEAP, FAST, RELIABLE - Pick two)

[ltmquik]

I do not think that Microsoft is a good comparison. There are not many options other than Linux or MAC for OS. I don't think Linux has any performance or reliability over MS.

Fadals problems started occuring when they were bought out by G&L and then again by MAG Corp. Each time, each of the parties bring their own management into the picture. Each time there is total chaos because they all want to change to suit themselves. Fadal has a long way to go to get to where they were before G&L.

[Scott_bob]

Itmquik,

From talking with virtually all the software programmers I talk to...
"If you" were a software programmer, you might have a different opinion.

Microsoft does not care to address the significant problems with their product, they just patch it up, add another layer of complexity to the OS, call it something new and sell it to the poor gullible bums (like me) who want the latest OS to stay competative in the job market.
That is why Microsoft OS is known as bloatware...
Intel and AMD and others, have down a great job with hardware. Do you think the OS has kept up with hardware? I don't think so. By the way MAC or Linux both are supperior OS to Microsoft. And you are wrong about Linux, it is more reliable and faster than Microsoft.

2ndly, both Fadal's legacy controls were developed before any ownership changes. How exactly is that G&L or Mag Corp's fault?

[Scott_bob]

Originally Posted by DareBee The race car analogy reminds me of a guy I know. He always says (CHEAP, FAST, RELIABLE - Pick two)

I say: "Pick one"

[ltmquik]

Originally Posted by Scott_bob Itmquik, From talking with virtually all the software programmers I talk to... "If you" were a software programmer, you might have a different opinion. Microsoft does not care to address the significant problems with their product, they just patch it up, add another layer of complexity to the OS, call it something new and sell it to the poor gullible bums (like me) who want the latest OS to stay competative in the job market. That is why Microsoft OS is known as bloatware... Intel and AMD and others, have down a great job with hardware. Do you think the OS has kept up with hardware? I don't think so. By the way MAC or Linux both are supperior OS to Microsoft. And you are wrong about Linux, it is more reliable and faster than Microsoft. 2ndly, both Fadal's legacy controls were developed before any ownership changes. How exactly is that G&L or Mag Corp's fault?

First, I could not get SolidWorks or my CAM package to work with Linux. There also is no support for Linux from them. Does MS have a monopoly on the market? YES. Is it the best? I don't know. I do know that its (MS) OS works well while trying to satisfy everyone. My opinion only.

Second, I do not think that G&L or MAG Corp are at fault for anything. I was basically stating what I think some of the problems are and when they started to occur.