Epoxy-Granite machine bases (was Polymer concrete frame?)

[alex_ku]

Hi Jacob,

Thanks for comment. I'll try one more size(marble flour) in my next part (the column).
About vibrator - its my mistake. At begin i'v set it to minimal vibration level and found int quite enough. But it's not. So i'v change the setup to 50% of maximum vibration on both sides of vibrator, connect it to triangle. Now i feel the changes

We will see.

Best regards,
Alex

[pecamuzicar]

Hi to all!

Do you anyone know about using Thixotropic epoxide resin for Epoxy-Granite?

Some of characteristics of my resin:

- bending resistance 16,5MPa,
- pressure resistance 70Mpa,
- adhesion to the substrate 4MPa .

I would use mixture of iron (steel) aggregates (0,3mm about 60-70%, 5-6mm about 25-30%) + glass wool (10-15%). Agregates-Epoxy about 10-11/1.

Then I would fulfill space between two steel square tube one in the second (120x120mm and 60x60mm) to make 1m long metal lathe bed. Please give me also your opinions about such design.

Thanks in advance! :-)

Peter

[veteq]

@Terry,

May i ask you when this mill was made..?
Is the Horzizontal part that holds the spindle made of full EG? No steel inserts for reinforcement?
I was wondering how long this mill was used, where there no creep or fatique issues in the horizontal head part.

Been searching the web for cree and fatique data on EG, but thats very hard to find if it even is there..


Kind regards,

Roy

[danielpublic]

Originally Posted by the4thseal where do you get thins stuff.I am in the USA

Apparently on eBay e. g, I guess its "same same" (?).

Anyhow, this plasticizer & superplasticizer-stuff seems really interesting even if it doesn't suite any application/half-god-holygrail-performance-machine in any random basement/commandcentral. However in the beginning of the last century concrete-lathes was pretty common. If one does not exclude the other, it might bring down costs if nothing else.

I guess one can mix that to/with any concrete?
I mean... look at that flow.

[johnohara]

Slashdot posted an interesting story today about a breakthrough in nanoscale 3D printing at the Vienna University of Technology.

In addition to the impressive results, the last picture on the page shows the device they used.

Here's a link to it.

~John

[lgalla]

Originally Posted by pecamuzicar Hi to all! Do you anyone know about using Thixotropic epoxide resin for Epoxy-Granite? Some of characteristics of my resin: - bending resistance 16,5MPa, - pressure resistance 70Mpa, - adhesion to the substrate 4MPa . I would use mixture of iron (steel) aggregates (0,3mm about 60-70%, 5-6mm about 25-30%) + glass wool (10-15%). Agregates-Epoxy about 10-11/1. Then I would fulfill space between two steel square tube one in the second (120x120mm and 60x60mm) to make 1m long metal lathe bed. Please give me also your opinions about such design. Thanks in advance! :-) Peter

Peter you can not use a thixotropic Epoxy as it will not be able to wetout the fillers.You need a very thin epoxy similar to laminating epoxy at 600CPS
Thick epoxy is 20,000Cps
Larry

[cjtoombs]

Hi Lgalla From your post: "water absorption in weight 1 - 2 [Mass %]" I can only assume it expands. It is a pity they do not quote a figure. Without an accurate number it is a No Go zone. Cheers John

The assumption is not neccecarily valid. Mass conserves, volume does not. If the water molecules fit in between the other molecules there would be no exansion. The easy way to solve any volume effects would be to condition the parts at high humidity and saturate them prior to final machining/assembly. I live in the desert and relative humitity here rarely drops below 20%, so in all likelyhood the water once absorbed will stay in the part for life, allowing for the dimensional stability desired.

[pecamuzicar]

Thanks lgalla,

Originally Posted by lgalla Peter you can not use a thixotropic Epoxy as it will not be able to wetout the fillers.You need a very thin epoxy similar to laminating epoxy at 600CPS Thick epoxy is 20,000Cps Larry

Yes, it was logical and expected, but still somehow I got ordinary epoxy from same producer with same characteristics, looks nice. What is CPS?

But I like to build shorter lathe bed with it, about 1m or something longer with steel tubes like I mentioned, or maybe better without like on the sketch. I would apply there ways with simple square edges, but for this size I have not idea for shape and thickness of EG bed to get also other adequate properties like strength, or there are need some reinforcement ...

All of you are machinists and some of you are EG experts like you, so give me some opinions and advices here. Otherwise, this idea with superplastics is not bad for building Romig style lathe http://www.vintageprojects.com/machi...urretLathe.pdf

Cheers,

Peter

[lgalla]

Peter CPS is viskoznost.The glass fiber would also cause very high viscosity
I am no machinist but if I built a machine I would build a steel structure and fill in the tubes and spaces with E/G.The steel frame work would be the strength.The E/G the damping of vibration and will add to the overall strength and stiffness.
laku noc

[pecamuzicar]

Oh, dobar dan Mr lgalla, :-))

It is nice to met you and speak something on domestic language. If you are not machinist, how you are longer interested in such "new" EG technology? From the beginning I had idea to using EG fulfilled steel tubes and i would agree with you 100%. But recently, after few private messages with John McNamara where he expressed doubt about damping characteristic of this construction because of big stiffness of cold or hot rolled steel tubes, I changed my mind something (something).

For good dampening he recommended me rather to use Bamberg's design construction "Concrete Core Cast with Reinforcement" if I would like to use steel tubes. Do you maybe know it is already discussed here, and it is not problem to speak about that here? It looks pretty reliable and affordable. But however, only thin (0,4mm) damping sheets ISODAMP C 1002 looks hard available and expensive even more than epoxy. I would substitute it, but ... ? I did not see that before and I will maybe ask Aearo Company to send me some small sample, or ... Romig bed style is checked. But just I am not sure, but I would.

But at least for headstock and other parts I have some ideas to apply EG, and I would to use my epoxy I bought. So, you and other EG machinists guys, please stay with me here to discuss and conclude something about that.

Pozdrav (Cheers),

Peter

[lgalla]

TAMO METEP XENO
please excuse my Serbian,I do not speak the language.To make new members feel at home I just look up a few words.
E/G is not new to me after 25 years of use.It was used to backup fiberglass molds subject to high pressures And used to dampen vibrations.When you take different materials to gether they tend to cancel each others natural resonate frequency.E/G works as it contains many different materials and sizes which all resonate tending to cancel vibrations.
Again I say I do not agree with a total fabrication of E/G as it would require a precision mold which would cost more than the part.If big production fine.My english spelling is getting bad.Too many UNBO
NappN
http://www.cnccookbook.com/CCMillEpoxyFill.htm

[pecamuzicar]

Thanks Larry,

In that my first idea I though mostly about strength. EG mixture I found here with iron aggregates was described like machinable, but very strong because of glass fiber (and some additives not so much available). It seems because of very stiff steel tubes, there I not need to care so much about strength like about dampening.

For pure EG construction mold I would not care - it is wooden - simple and no problem I think (?), because still I am interested how it should be for such narrow and long lathe structural base. On e. - it can be in some standard lathe bed shape (?), probably with some reinforcements (?).

Cheers,

Peter