What it will really take to stop global warming???

[Geof]

At least one columnist understands how impossible it is to stop Global Warming. The full article is here;

http://www.macleans.ca/science/techn...080326_994_994

Here is a small excerpt:

Late last year, the Paris-based International Energy Agency compiled a list, which it presented at the United Nations Climate Change Conference in Bali, outlining what's required in order to meet emissions reductions of 50 per cent by 2050. The list, described by the Los Angeles Times, included: 30 new nuclear power plants, 17,000 wind turbines, 400 biomass power plants, two hydroelectric dams the size of China's massive Three Gorges project, and 42 coal or natural gas plants using carbon-capture technology to store CO2 emissions underground. But that's not all. It concluded that all of that would have to be built and up and running by 2013 — and the process repeated every year until 2030.

[fizzissist]

That's just the financially impractical side of it....and that's still based on the presumption that AGW is a function of CO2 output....and that those efforts would in fact impact it.

If man's CO2 output is truly causing global warming, our only solution is to get Algore on a nuclear powered aircraft. But there's a case of which do you worry about more...the nuke going critical or Algore???

..Slightly off topic...Don't know if I posted this somewhere, but I found this article pretty interesting...

"...The World Investment Report last year highlighted the transformation of world oil and gas supply from a private investor-controlled — and market driven — business to a state-controlled business. The top 10 oil firms in the world are all state owned, accounting for 77% of the total, with Russian firms controlling another 6%. Only about 10% of world oil reserves are in the hands of investor-owned firms such as Exxon Mobil...."

http://network.nationalpost.com/np/b...-corcoran.aspx

[cauhape]

Why is global warming being discussed on a CNC forum?

[Geof]

Originally Posted by cauhape Why is global warming being discussed on a CNC forum?

For entertainment?

Because CNC machines need energy and the primary source of energy in our civilization are fossil fuels.

Why not?

[fizzissist]

I've got a novel answer....maybe because CNC machines might be useful in manufacturing the solutions that WE come up with??? Like compound airfoil shapes for wind turbines?

Maybe cauhape is already saving the planet by generating his CNC's power with solar panels so doesn't have to worry about energy prices.

[307startup]

Originally Posted by fizzissist I've got a novel answer....maybe because CNC machines might be useful in manufacturing the solutions that WE come up with??? Like compound airfoil shapes for wind turbines? Maybe cauhape is already saving the planet by generating his CNC's power with solar panels so doesn't have to worry about energy prices.

I prefer to run mine with a stationary-bike powered generator. That way if my machine makes any funky noises, I just stop pedaling...instant E-stop

(my cheek hurts)

[Geof]

Even if the Nuclear Plants could be built maybe they are not the solution anyway.

http://network.nationalpost.com/np/b...-disaster.aspx

[john0489]

Why did the U.N. Climate Change Conference take place in Bali? Is it not time that "World conferences" particularly this one, should set up e-conference facilities using large screens such as those used in sports stadiums. Along with automatic translation facilities international travel would be negated. Thus, all delegates could remain in their home contries (or even at home), and chat to each other to their hearts content.Thus huge financial costs and further CO2 damage to the planet would be minimised. A common time zone could be agreed to best suit delegates. Travel time/costs and hotel costs would be almost eliminated. In truth an enforced time zone would exist anyway if every one had to travel a place like Bali! Such savings could go into a World Global Warming fund.

Am I in cloud cuckoo land, by thinking that most of these international conferences are mainly placed were they are, so that delegates can have a really good time at someone else's expense.

I have to say that long before global warming was an issue, I very regularly travelled for business reasons by air all over the world. As a retired scientist I am now ashamed of the CO2 footprints I left all over the planet. My only wish is that with todays' technology, and the few governments that genuinely want to save the planet,we might just be able to "stop the clock" but it is doubtful that there is any chance of reversing existing damage. Sadly my children and grandchildren, will not forget my generations' lack of knowledge, and certainly will not forgive the current generation of governments that still have their heads in the sand whilst at the same time being fully aware of the consequences of doing too little to late.
John Stafford

[fizzissist]

John,
I'm puzzled about your statement concerning "CO2 damage". That implies a) CO2 is damaging and is therefore a pollutant, and b) you subscribe to the AGW notion that CO2 is a causitive.

I appreciate your being sorry for your old carbon footprint, but a far greater crime is committed today where we have some people leaving an enormous carbon footprint in the process of trying to tell the rest of us that we're guilty and need to change the way we live.

Algore sits at the cookie jar, eating all the cookies, and tells us he's doing it to convince us to stop eating so many cookies because it's bad for all of us. Maybe that's a lousy analogy, but you get the idea. Algore's a hypocrite, and that's the difference.

You may be retired, but once a scientist, always a scientist.

[Geof]

I will second everything fizzizzist writes. I think he only got there before because he is in a different time zone. Why did the Bali Conference take place in Bali? Because it was a big boondoggle; you are not in cloud cuckoo land, anyone who thinks these conferences are serious is. Although they do have a serious side; a potential for serious harm. They create the idea that a problem exists, it may it may not, and they create the idea that humans can do something about, indeed must do something about it. And I think my thread starting post shows the futility in that. We have to adapt.

[dynosor]

Originally Posted by john0489 Why did the U.N. Climate Change Conference take place in Bali?

Because it is warm there. As with most vacation spots, warm is good.

Why didn't they go to Siberia? Because cold is not so good.

If the UN actually believed that global warming is a real problem, that human CO2 emissions cause global warming, and that reducing fossil fuel consumption will make a difference, they would have used telecommunications instead of flying all their delegates to Bali. Regardless of the published agenda, that conference was not about stopping global warming. It was about how the UN can develop a mechanism to control all human activity by regulating the use of fossil fuels.

[Bobbyr70]

If everyone always thinks it is someone elses problem then nobody will ever do anything about it. How about we all start by eating the elephant one bite at a time. It's never too big a problem if we approach it that way. Start with reducing the energy you consume.
The simple baby steps. Like not wasting time driving around when you don't really have to. Turning off litte things that add up to a lot of money back in my pocket. I am looking into building an electric vehicle that will get me back and forth to work and even adding a wind mill to generate power for charging it. Who knows! Remember it starts with little things. Rome was not built in a day.....It was brick by brick and taking action not finding ways we cant do it. There are way to many people in this world that expect everyone else to solve it for them. Why not get involved rather than just telling everyone else it can't be done.....