DM4400-what size 3 phase motor for rotary converter

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Thread: DM4400-what size 3 phase motor for rotary converter

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    Default DM4400-what size 3 phase motor for rotary converter

    I just bought a couple of DM4400's and setting one up in the garage with only single phase. I want to set up a 3 phase rotary converter and wonder what size 3 phase motor would be a minimum. I can get my hands on a 2HP motor right now for free. Since these machines are so small I wouldn't think it would need much, but I really have no idea what it would take.

    Thanks, Dan

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    Gold Member Jim Dawson's Avatar
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    Default Re: DM4400-what size 3 phase motor for rotary converter

    What is the HP on the spindles? Do the servos require 3 phase?



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    Default Re: DM4400-what size 3 phase motor for rotary converter

    I don't see a HP rating for the spindle motor, it's a DC servo and the only thing on the machine (to my understanding) that requires 3 phase. All the axes are stepper/encoder driven with 48V DC drivers. From the manual:

    "This requires a 30A, 220V three phase 50/60 Hz AC supply. The tap voltages on the transformer are 440,380,330,220 Volts. The transformer is rated at 10KVA."

    That's all I know at this point, I'll try to find out more, but I'm hoping that someone who knows these machines can chime in. I know there is (were) a lot of these units out there.



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    Gold Member Jim Dawson's Avatar
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    Default Re: DM4400-what size 3 phase motor for rotary converter

    The specifications indicate that at least a 15 HP RPC would be required, but that is full load. A 10 HP would be enough for real world use. There doesn't seem to be a lot of information on these machines on the net. From some quick research it seems that the spindle motor is a 4.5 HP (6 HP peak) DC servo driven by a Servo Dynamics 3030 160 VDC drive. The input 3 phase goes to the transformer, then to a 3 phase diode bridge rectifier to supply the spindle motor drive. All of the other components seem to be single phase, but I would have to see the schematics to confirm.

    If it were me, I would convert the machine to single phase by replacing the transformer with a single phase transformer and diode bridge. Doing that would be less expensive and simpler than installing a RPC.



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    Default Re: DM4400-what size 3 phase motor for rotary converter

    Jim, you have the specs exactly right. All but the spindle motor are single phase. I like your idea of just converting to single phase, but that's out of my experience. Can you point me in the right direction to get it done? Some place to read up on how to do it, or something you might be able to explain. I have all the schematics in pdf.



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    Gold Member Jim Dawson's Avatar
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    Default Re: DM4400-what size 3 phase motor for rotary converter

    Again without seeing the schematics, all you need to do is replace the transformer driving the spindle with a single phase transformer, and connect that to a bridge diode.

    This is what you have now:
    DM4400-what size 3 phase motor for rotary converter-03267-png

    This is what you would be converting to:
    DM4400-what size 3 phase motor for rotary converter-diode_fullwave_3a-gif


    This is the diode bridge I would use, this is just an example. There are a lot of vendors.
    https://vetco.net/products/200-volt-...DtkaAilH8P8HAQ


    This is the transformer I would use, again just an example.
    Acme 5 KVA Single Phase Pri 240/480 Volt Sec 120/240V Transformer (TRA3414) | eBay

    If you want to post the power schematics, I'll be happy to review them. It kind of seems that the original equipment was a bit over built.



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    Default Re: DM4400-what size 3 phase motor for rotary converter

    Jim, here's a link to download the service manual with schematics:

    https://www.dropbox.com/s/5dfdh312de...rvice.pdf?dl=0

    If you have the time to help out with this I would greatly appreciate it.



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    Gold Member Jim Dawson's Avatar
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    Default Re: DM4400-what size 3 phase motor for rotary converter

    This may be much easier than I first indicated. I found a manual for a Servo Dynamics 3060 drive, I believe this is what you have in your machine. http://www.warp7.se/forum/download.p...99a9eee686273c

    It seems that the input to the drive is 115VAC, 3 phase. But... I suspect it would work just fine running on 115V single phase at reduced output and have a little more ripple current on the DC bus. This would be roughly equivalent to running a 3 phase VFD on single phase. The max rated out of the SD 3060 is 60 amps @ 160VDC (roughly 12 HP) so I can't imagine a situation that would require that much spindle power for all but heavy industrial use, especially given that the nominal power of the spindle motor is 4HP. I normally don't load my 3HP spindle over 50% under any condition.

    Per the schematic that you supplied for your machine, I would connect your 220V single phase to L2 and L3 (see page 90) on the disconnect with no connection to L1, and see what happens. Pretty sure it will run just fine. I'm not exactly sure how the 3 phase transformer will react to the single phase input, but I think it will be fine. Make sure that terminals 1 and 2, TB201 on the SD-3060 are connected to 115V power, this supplies the onboard +/-15VDC power supply and the cooling fan.



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    Default Re: DM4400-what size 3 phase motor for rotary converter

    That looks like the correct driver manual, nice detective work.

    I already managed to get everything running except the spindle by connecting single phase to two of the inputs, but they were different ones than you suggested. When I looked at the schematic I thought the same as you (L2 and L3), but nothing happened, so I moved the connection around until I brought it to life. Don't remember which ones worked and I'm not at the machine, but I'll post later. Anyway, with that connection I will check the voltage at the driver as you suggested and see what's up.

    I read somewhere else that someone had gotten the spindle to run on single phase, so I believe it's workable. I don't mind if the power is reduced as I don't plan to do real heavy work. Eventually I hope to convert to Mach 3/LinuxCNC to bypass the old controller, but until then I just want to get it doing something useful.



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    Default Re: DM4400-what size 3 phase motor for rotary converter

    Hey Jim-

    I still haven't got this nailed down yet, but I met with Marty (the same Marty in this Dynatect forum) who lives across town from me with a DM4400 that he did a conversion on, and he suggested the same thing as you, putting in a diode bridge (or rectifier, same thing I guess) because that's what he did to make it work. I'm still playing with the machine moving it around with the same single phase hookup as earlier, but no spindle power yet. Hopefully I'll be able to figure that out soon and get it going. Thanks again.



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    Gold Member Jim Dawson's Avatar
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    Default Re: DM4400-what size 3 phase motor for rotary converter

    I guess I would get out the voltmeter and see what the input to the drive actually is when running on single phase, maybe doing a little rewiring would be in order. It is possible the drive has a phase loss circuit built in, and you may have to bypass that. I don't know about that drive, but you can fool some VFDs by connecting one hot leg to L1 and L2, and feed the other hot leg to L3.



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    Default Re: DM4400-what size 3 phase motor for rotary converter

    Jim,if you're going to be hanging around for a while that would be good. I'm looking into the wiring right now and finding something weird that I need to figure out. I was just re-tracing the input to the main breaker on the machine and something isn't making sense. It appears that I'm getting continuity between two of the input wires at the input terminal block, which doesn't make sense to me. I'm checking the whip wires that came with the machine at this moment, I'll report what I find in a few minutes.

    Another thing that caught my eye while I had it all powered up was that the servo amplifier had a red led lit; from the 3060 manual diagram on page 8, this indicates a ground fault (second from the left just right of the reset switch). I tried the reset just for kicks but the led returns after 1 second, so I may have a problem with the amplifier as well.

    Last edited by drhanger; 01-08-2017 at 09:16 AM. Reason: changed 'left' to 'right' of the reset switch


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DM4400-what size 3 phase motor for rotary converter
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