Vertical mounted router table?

[307startup]

Does anyone have any thoughts about designing, building and setting up a router table like a panel saw? In other words, almost vertical, with a slight angle, so that it doesn't take up as much space. Loading and unloading sheets of material would be easier and I was planning on using a ledge at the bottom edge as a register for material. Either a stop or using angle stock as a vise to hold the bottom edge...with another stop or angle-stock vice at the non-mobile end of the table...constant location of all sheets, +/- .010".

[Madclicker]

I've been pondering this for a while. The one place to start in the design is a vacuum table. While a panel saw cuts straight through and the quality of the cut is not affected much by whether the sheet goods lie truly flat or not, the opposite is true for a cnc router table. The problem is compounded by the lack of helpful gravity in a vertical design.

[307startup]

...not to mention if you need to get at any of the manifold or fittings, or even installing new vacuum "modules" it would be pretty easy to get to. I myself like the idea of a mostly vertical design because I can have a double head gantry...one side for a router, the other side for a plasma cutter...that's why I didn't suggest a vacuum table to begin with. I'm not a big fan of "uni-tasker" machine tools.

[Madclicker]

I don't consider a vacuum table an option for a machine like this. Heck, now that I have started using them, I don't consider vacuum tables optional for even smaller machines.

Funny, I just happened across an epay ad for a vertical router:

dynacnc

[Jason Marsha]

Here is a homebuilt one

http://www.otocoup.com/index_e.htm

Jason

[PowerCNC4u]

DynaCNC has been building one for a long time now. www.dynacnc.com. I want one someday, but the plasma table I own is working for me now. Hopefully soon.

[307startup]

So this obviously is not a crazy idea. Plus with the slant it allows swarf/slag to drop away from the cut area and the path of the cutting tool. My only real concern was with gravity helping the part to move out of position before the cut was finished, but by cutting bottom to top, this takes the worry out of the part falling into the tool...if it does fall, it would fall away from the router/plasma torch.

[wizard]

I would suspect that by cutting bottom to top you would loose any hope of accuracy unless there was substantial use of vacuum chucking and other holding mechanisms.

In general though I don't think the idea is bad for a router. There are issues to overcome not the least of which is getting enough stiffness in the arm to maintain squareness under stress. This is not impossible of course. But dealing with the work holding issue and this issue up front should lead to a usable design.

As to getting the machine to do double duty I don't think it is impossible but then I don't think it will be cost effective either. Beyond the work holding issue, where on a Plasma machine gravity is even more important, you have the issue of conflict of interests. That is what works well for a plasma table likely will be a negative for sheet goods that get routed. I could see two different sub tables that get rolled into place depending on the machines usage, but by the time you go to all that trouble you could have built two complete machines.

So in summation I'd certainly try for a router design. There is little doubt in my mind that it can be done. A plasma machine is another issue though. With Plasma you can't really clamp the sheet so I'm not sure how you would get the required hold down.

I don't want to discourage you as I agree with the advantages if it could be made to work. The manner of holding even modest tolerances on parts as they are being cut escapes me.

Dave

So this obviously is not a crazy idea. Plus with the slant it allows swarf/slag to drop away from the cut area and the path of the cutting tool. My only real concern was with gravity helping the part to move out of position before the cut was finished, but by cutting bottom to top, this takes the worry out of the part falling into the tool...if it does fall, it would fall away from the router/plasma torch.

[307startup]

I fail to see how accuracy would be lost by cutting bottom to top...the cutting action would be inducing any movement, not gravity, because until it is cut free, gravity is acting on it in exactly the same manner as it was prior to being cut free. My concern was with cutting top to bottom or side to side and having the cutting forces move the piece out of alignment. By cutting all inside movements first, and then cutting the exterior from bottom to top, you leave a margin of safety of the finished workpiece if gravity were to pull the piece out of position, due to shifting or cutter-induced momentum. Or rather I should say, initial cutter position for outside movements would start top center and move down, around bottom, back to top center so if/when the workpiece shifts it will fall below (in relation to floor) the spindle and cutter.

As for gantry arm stiffness...take a pole and hold it straight out...now take that same pole and lean it...which takes more effort? A vertical gantry beam should be facing far less stress and abuse in a vertical arrangement than moving parallel to the horizon.

I fail to see, once again how gravity comes into play even more in plasma cutting...is there some field of physics that I am unaware of governing plasma cutting? Because this won't be a true vertical design, but rather at 10*-30* angle, gravity will still be pulling slag straight down...where there will still be floor space for it to occupy once it is clear of the material being cut. The plasma torch will still be running parallel to the plane of the material...so the cut will still be straight and not angled...and the slag would then fall towards the floor.

How different in function (not tooling) is a router and a plasma table? They aren't any different. Cutting shapes out of flat sheet material...they wouldn't be working to different goals...the goals are one and the same.

Once again...to explain how this would work...the bottom edge and the farthest edge from loading would have angle stock that would act as a register. Top edge and loading end would have angle stock on piano hinge (or something similar) that would act as a vise to hold the material square and flat. I'm not seeing how exactly the hold down would be a problem...

The tolerances for cutting parts is built into the machine tool...not in the slant of the table.

Hope this clears up my initial entry.

[ger21]

http://www.camtech.ca/products/route...ceOverview.cfm

[Madclicker]

IMO, a vertical router would be useless without a killer vacuum table. Even on a horizontal table sheet goods need a good vacuum table in addition to gravity to pull them flat and hold them in position. With a vertical table you have not only the cutting forces to contend with, but also have gravity working against you. At least with a horizontal table gravity helps hold the workpiece down.

I don't think the savings of a few sq ft of floor space is worth it.

[ger21]

One downside is that the Y axis will need much more power, because it has to lift the entire Z axis