Need lots of help! CNC Controlled Quilting.

[Khalid]

Hi All,
I want to share the picture of embroidery artwork RENE has done on his ordinary sewing machine using my Software... He did a great job on it...
Rene.. You have to do following things to get positive results...

1- Tighten the clothe very well on the Hoop.
2- The white thread on the bobbin emerging in picture shows that Bobbin thread needs more tention...
3- You should apply some embroider paper behind the cloth..This will give drastic improvement in embroidery..

I am adding RENE work here... I hope you all will like what we can do..


Further details can be seen in following thread...
http://www.cnczone.com/forums/showth...=57404&page=23

[lmlamb]

Originally Posted by supertechster Hey Deviant, Larry... Sorry for not corresponding sooner, but I have been really busy, 10hr days and no time for me. I ordered 5 Axis controller, have Mach3 and 5 good stepper motors, nema23 size but not too sure how strong yet, and plan to use 1 for the x, 1 for the y and mount another to top of the machine, using belt on the rear handwheel to drive it. This will control sewing speed and keep track of needle up/dn position. I'll add a pair of Hall-Effect or Reed switches w/magnets mounted at 10 and 12-o'clock to detect needle FULL Up and use the motor to put it in FULL Dn position as needed. The other 2 motors will be used for roller control - 1 on each end. I had the idea to zero the machine, load a converted, repeating pattern and then stitch it out Right to Left, from one side of the 10' bed to the other, nonstop. Then, machine would put needle down and both roller and y axis would activate to simultaneously advance the quilt, and retract (pull back) the sewing machine to expose new, un-quilted area. Then the rollers would lock up, the needle would retract (Up) and the stitching would start again, using the last-known-needle down and x/y positions as start, but this time from Left back to the Right... and repeat. Do you think this would 'fly'? I, like deviant, will also need to get a 20' of aircraft wire or 'open-end' 1/2in wide timing belt and with that several motor-shaft and idler rollers to mount. These will pull the table back and forth, and another smaller aircraft wire or belt mounted to anothe motor to drive the y axis front to rear. The rollers are tricky, but I think a strong spring tension and a 3/4 in wide belt wrapped around the wooden 'gears' will work OK and also allow a bit of slip - just in case. I drew pictures, re-engineering the carriage to lower it so that the rear roller is able to wind as much Top, Batting and Backing as possible before it gets too 'fat' and the whole quilt has to be unwound and reversed in the frame. A good solution for this would be nice to hear, but one I thought of is simply lock the x-axis 1" beyond the last pattern-row and simply baste-stitch a reference line all the way across using 1-2" stitches that can be easily removed, and a small '+' at either end of that line for needle-down remounting reference. ;-) ... Another cool add-on would be one to raise the rear roller and it filled up and got fatter - still contemplating that one. Anyway, I bought a bunch of 'L', 'T' angle brackets and various metal bits and strapping and intend to mount the motors later this week when the belts and pulleys arrive (or wire and spools) - and I'll do so allowing her to remove all tension or unhook the CNC to do any manual stuff- and with minimal permanent damage to the wood frame. Final goal is to add X/Y encoders to detect when , what direction and how fast the carriage is moving (manual mode) and speed up the stitching motor accordingly. Comment? Tips, tricks, ideas? Looks like we three are all doing the same thing - or at least trying to ;-)

Hey Supertechster,

I saw something like what you are describing at a quilting show one time, it was called MAX-THROAT. It worked with the PCQ system (stands for PC Quilter) It worked quite well. I want to do the same thing with my CNC Quilter, I just haven't had the time to sit down and draw up the plans yet. I am thinking that the scale of the Y axis will have to be the same as the scale for the rollers, so that it moves the quilt the same amount of distance as it would in the quilting phase. it would be pretty easy to program the roller commands into Gcode as A-axis, B-axis, etc. and insert them into a spot in the code that will make the movement at the right time. It's all in the timing! I was also considering using a belt wrapped around the rollers, but I can see difficulties in the future with that design. I am thinking of using some 1 1/4 inch belt pulleys on each of the rollers, with a milled shaft into the roller to hold it in place. I just need to find someone that can mill the shafts for me. I need to make a drawing of the shafts and pulleys to cement the idea.

Do you have any paper plans on your project? if so, I would love to see them.

Larry

[lmlamb]

Originally Posted by Rene Nuñez Paz Hello Larry Thanks for your answer. In Khalid project all is ok, A axis is controlling needle movement using stepper, but Am not able to set up A axis to move at high RPM. Only that I think that Y axis in GCODE generator is inverses (+ x -), like if you embroider a cap. Until I be able to do that, made some changes editing G CODE and substitute A for Z. Configuring steppers in this way. Step x unit----200 x 1/4 microstep = 800 / 2.54 (like if I use a acme bar 10TPI) = 314.96 step/mm velocity = 1270mm/min then 1270/2.54 = 500 rpm= 500 SPM in theory CODE i put in Z= 2.54 x needle movement In this way in each Z movement of 2.54 , stepper turns 1rpm at high speed of 500rpm and needle operate one time only . After i put G92= Z00 to reset Z axis without stepper movement (recommendation received in Mach forum) GCODE G90 G21 G64 F 4000 (NEEDLE UP RAPID MOVE- Light bulb Off if On) M09 (START STITCHING- Light Bulb Off if On) M09 G01 X0 Y-9.7 G00 Z2.54 G92 Z0 G01 X2.2 Y-19.7 G00 Z2.54 G92 Z0 I don’t know if this works when I test in sewing machine, but in mach 3 works pretty. Now I need first built a frame to support fabric, My first trial will be putting sewing machine over cnc table router, and fabric support bolted to router mounting in z axis, I have one stepper free, and will use it in to move needle. Tell me what do you think of this, and what’s wrong.. Two questions more SRS ---what meanings? POT---what meanings? Thanks in advance and sorry my bad English Rene

Hi Rene,

How is your project coming along, did you get the issue with the speed taken care of. Haven't heard from you in a while, so I thought i would ask.

[Rene Nuñez Paz]

Hi Larry

Sorry my late answer .. Iam very busy in work.
I paused embroidery machine building, but
I get some progress in A axis work at high speed

Look my xml file, and test...

Later I will make a more long message...

Regards

Rene

[Rene Nuñez Paz]

sORRY
fORGET UPLOAD A FILE to test XML file

Please tell me what do you think

Regards

Rene

[lmlamb]

Originally Posted by Deviant Hey guys, This request is for my wife. I hope I can drum up alot of help, cause it will make my purchases easier if I can make her happy. So please help!! *grins* I realise that this isn't a routing question, but I think the machine would operate very close to the way an engraving/router would. I don't need to or have anyway to control a z-axis, so I will only being moving x and y. I'll need to sew and generate continous pattern. I have the ability to monitor and control the stitch length. So I only need to control the side to side and back and forth movement. I plan on mounting a timing belt onto the table and connect that to the carraiges for both of the axis. Is there any concern with slicing a timing belt into a long track and mounting each end? Then I would connect the pull with some retaining idlers to keep it in contact with the belt. Would I increase my wear? I wouldn't think so, but I've never tried to use a drive belt/timing belt. Now. I don't have the ability to stop sewing and guarantee that the needle is retracted from the quilt. So.... What I need to do is beable to create and generate a continous pattern. I.e. you start sewing on grid 1x1 and then make a bunch of wave patterns til the end of the quilt, then it would turn and draw a bunch of seagulls on the way back. Without ever stopping the line. If the pattern breaks or jumps too far, it would run the risk of pulling the needle while it's still embed in the quilt. Which, best case would break the thread or needle. Worst case it could tear a big hole in some customers quilt. Now the questions are. Do you think that mach3 would be handle this. ((I think so, I just specify my x/y, speed, and table diminsions etc...)) What can I use to create the pattern. Would I need to draw it in as a bmp in paint or another graphic program? ((corel draw, photoshop etc)) How do I take that pattern/picture and turn it into a machine path that mach can understand. If each small pattern is drawn, how can I connect them as a continous pattern. I.e. I outline a dove, now I want to repeat that dove 15 times. Are there any other concerns that I should have? Thanks alot guys. I hope someone can answer my questions.

Hey Deviant,

I have an answer for you! First, buy open ended toothed belt and a pulley gear for the motor shaft that you have. Second, use coreldraw x4 and get a copy of DXFtool for the Corel. DXFtool is a macro that will convert your drawings to a DXF file. Once you have a dxf file, run it though lazyCAM or your favorite CAM program and convert it to a gCode program file. Then use Mach3 to run the system (motors, controller, etc) and it will run. Chances are that you may have to adjust the scale by clicking on the axis scale in Mach3, and setting it at maybe .05 or so to get the right size. You may even have to set it smaller. It all depends on the size of the file that you convert.

Let me know if you have anymore questions.

[angelababy]

Thanks so much for the wonderful information you provided us

[Rene Nuñez Paz]

Hi,
Sorry my ignorance, I don't know nothing about quilting
I was looking some machines an videos, and reading here
I think that is possible to do quilting like if we are doing
embroidery, without use a cruise controller or stitch
regulator.

I we have a desing for quilt, and we can make a Tajima
(dst) file using this design, then we can generate a Gcode using Khalid
Embroidery G code generator.
Wilcom can import graphic files and conver it in embroidery file
for example. using Sophiesew(free) or Willcom.

In this case, G code will contains the properties of the stitches
and isn't needed the use a stitch regulator or a cruise controller.
Software will do all job.

X and Y axis will be for move the carriage and sewing machine
using belts or rack and pinion in X axis
and a multiple start acme threated bar 1/2" 5TPI
for move sewing machine

Needle operacion can be done using A axis, some regulation
of needle speed operacion can be done using Rotation Diameters
in Settings Page, in this way needle speed could be regulated
in long stitches.

I have tested system and some g code and seems to be good.
Stitches per minute is about 480-500 , I don't know if this
is fast or slow for quilting.

I have some idea of build a machine similar a quilter, but
not for quilt, only for embroider work in fabrics
for curtains, etc. I think to use this proccess.

Thanks for your comments

Rene

PD-Sorry my bad english

[lmlamb]

Originally Posted by supertechster Hey Deviant, Larry... Sorry for not corresponding sooner, but I have been really busy, 10hr days and no time for me. I ordered 5 Axis controller, have Mach3 and 5 good stepper motors, nema23 size but not too sure how strong yet, and plan to use 1 for the x, 1 for the y and mount another to top of the machine, using belt on the rear handwheel to drive it. This will control sewing speed and keep track of needle up/dn position. I'll add a pair of Hall-Effect or Reed switches w/magnets mounted at 10 and 12-o'clock to detect needle FULL Up and use the motor to put it in FULL Dn position as needed. The other 2 motors will be used for roller control - 1 on each end. I had the idea to zero the machine, load a converted, repeating pattern and then stitch it out Right to Left, from one side of the 10' bed to the other, nonstop. Then, machine would put needle down and both roller and y axis would activate to simultaneously advance the quilt, and retract (pull back) the sewing machine to expose new, un-quilted area. Then the rollers would lock up, the needle would retract (Up) and the stitching would start again, using the last-known-needle down and x/y positions as start, but this time from Left back to the Right... and repeat. Do you think this would 'fly'? I, like deviant, will also need to get a 20' of aircraft wire or 'open-end' 1/2in wide timing belt and with that several motor-shaft and idler rollers to mount. These will pull the table back and forth, and another smaller aircraft wire or belt mounted to anothe motor to drive the y axis front to rear. The rollers are tricky, but I think a strong spring tension and a 3/4 in wide belt wrapped around the wooden 'gears' will work OK and also allow a bit of slip - just in case. I drew pictures, re-engineering the carriage to lower it so that the rear roller is able to wind as much Top, Batting and Backing as possible before it gets too 'fat' and the whole quilt has to be unwound and reversed in the frame. A good solution for this would be nice to hear, but one I thought of is simply lock the x-axis 1" beyond the last pattern-row and simply baste-stitch a reference line all the way across using 1-2" stitches that can be easily removed, and a small '+' at either end of that line for needle-down remounting reference. ;-) ... Another cool add-on would be one to raise the rear roller and it filled up and got fatter - still contemplating that one. Anyway, I bought a bunch of 'L', 'T' angle brackets and various metal bits and strapping and intend to mount the motors later this week when the belts and pulleys arrive (or wire and spools) - and I'll do so allowing her to remove all tension or unhook the CNC to do any manual stuff- and with minimal permanent damage to the wood frame. Final goal is to add X/Y encoders to detect when , what direction and how fast the carriage is moving (manual mode) and speed up the stitching motor accordingly. Comment? Tips, tricks, ideas? Looks like we three are all doing the same thing - or at least trying to ;-)

Hey Techster,

How's it coming on the takeup roller automation? I am working on my design now, I plan to mount it on clear acrylic plexiglas cut to fit both ends of the table with a linear rail and carriage on each end with two gears to guide the rail ends true and square. My only issue at this time is controlling the motor which is to be mounted on one end with a spool that will contain 50 lb test stainless steel wire to act as the pulley. Now, I was thinking of using a small spring motor to keep tension on the roller/fabric, and also back up the roller when the motor releases tension. I was thinking about using one of the extra motor ports on my Rockcliff controller card to feed command to the motors, but I would also like to have control to manually release tension or tighten it from the keyboard. That's the easy part, just a matter of assigning the proper keystrokes. I would love to see what you have done, do you have any photos, diagrams etc?

[XYZADave]

Hi Deviant You have a PM
Thanks Dave