Looking for a reality check - 48x96 machine build

[detroitlions34]

Hey guys,

I have been hanging around here for a long time and appreciate the wealth of information on this board.

I own a company that does shop drawings and fabrication for commercial window systems i.e.: storefront and curtainwall. We are looking at branching into some new markets with a CNC router, and use the machine for light duty aluminum work. Such as cutting slots and holes in 1/8" thick aluminum doors and headers.

We have some promising leads, but want to stick with a more entry level machine to test the waters. Our budget is 4500 to 6000 for a running machine with software.

The type of wood we will be cutting is from 1/4" luan type to 3/4" MDF, some engraving work, and eventually 3D carving in solid wood.

We have multiple CAD stations already running AutoCAD.

Here is our research, can you please let me know your feedback on the machine, and any input would be appreciated. The only other choice we see for a 4x8 router in this price range is to build a Joes hybrid with R&P and the cast CNC parts.

CNCrouterparts store items:
Hardware only machine kit 48x96
Nema 23 electronics kit
All other items accounted for, i.e.: 80/20, gear track, etc. to complete the kit
3 1/4 hp router (porter cable)
Mach 3 software
(already have computer)
Custom built wood/steel table

Thanks for the input. Any feedback on going to Nema 34 motors at this stage is great too.

[adprinter]

Hello,
Welcome to the forum. The budget you have stated, is doable to build a machine similar to the one I have built. While mine is only currently set up to handle a maximum of about 32"x32" X Y travel 13" Z travel. The design could be scaled up to accomodate the 48"x96" travel you specified. Have a look at what I have done. My system is using NEMA 34 906 oz, motors and I use it to carve solid oak in 3D most of the time. I still have not tried any aluminum machining- (I have a router, but no PID to reduce speed for metal machining). But the design I believe to be sturdy enough to handle it, once I can afford to purchase the Super PID for router speed control. Another member of the forum posted a challenge last month which asked the question if it were possible to build a quality unit for less than $1000. It set me to thinking (and researching) what it would cost at today's prices to duplicate the machine I built. My estimate was in the neighborhood of $3500. Of course, if I were to scale it up to a 4x8 I am sure it would probably add about another $500 to $750 to that price. Anyway, have a look at the MyCNCV1.pdf It may help you in your design.

[jckstrthmghty]

Because this is business duty I would recommend you go with a kit or prebuilt system. Nothing wrong with designing your own but that's more of a hobby oriented approach. Time is money afterall.

CNCRouterparts will definitely work for you and the budget is appropriate. Maybe consider the nema 34 upgrade for the additional power.

[ger21]

CNC Router Parts seems to be the machine of choice these days, and is most definitely the best bang for the buck you'll find.
Go Lions, btw.

[RossMosh]

$6000 is do-able but it will get tight. I wouldn't be surprised if you went over budget.

I think your best bet is to sit down with Excel and make out a budget. Most of the prices you need are available on the internet. You can price extrusion from Automation4less.com. eBay will give you a good idea for the rest. I have a 4x8CNC Machine budgeted using CNCRouterParts stuff and I'm coming up with about $8000 using CRP 4x8 kit, Chinese Spindle, extrusion purchased locally, welded steel frame, dust collection, Mach3, and Vcarve Pro. Running NEMA23 will cut the price by roughly $1000. If everything went to plan for my machine it would be closer to $7000 but I figured in a 15% overage as the little things add up to big numbers.

As for the Joe's machine vs CNCRouterParts machine, it's safe to say they are comparable in many ways. The Joe's machine can definitely be built for less money but once you add in the Cast CNC Parts, I think you're talking about very similar cost structures with the Cast CNC parts probably being a bit more expensive. As for which one is better? That's very hard to say. I like the CRP machine slightly better because I trust angle iron turned on edge less than CRS. I also think the new gantry risers are better than what's done on Joe's machine.

[freecncplans]

CNCRouterParts does have a complete kits set. Couple it with the electronics kits they have and you can have everything up and running in no time.

Sean

[vid1900]

If you need an all steel, heavier duty machine, you can build a 4x8' Mechmate for less than $5000

MechMate CNC Router - Build your own with our detailed plans

At least 300 people have built one (I know of 3 friends in NY alone that have done it).

I've built 2 of them myself. Takes about a month to build, but if you have never built anything CNC before, better give yourself 2 months.

[ger21]

Originally Posted by vid1900 If you need an all steel, heavier duty machine, you can build a 4x8' Mechmate for less than $5000 MechMate CNC Router - Build your own with our detailed plans At least 300 people have built one (I know of 3 friends in NY alone that have done it). I've built 2 of them myself. Takes about a month to build, but if you have never built anything CNC before, better give yourself 2 months.

No offense, but I bet if you read through all the build threads on the Mechmate forum, you'll have a hard time finding 1 or two that were built in a month. Especially for someone doing it for the first time.
Also, there are less than 100 builders that actually have serial numbers. Are there really 300 running Mechmates??

I do agree that the Mechmate may be a better choice than CNC Router Parts, but I think $5000 may be optimistic, and unless someone can devote 40 hours/week to building, I'd say 3-6 months is more realistic.

[detroitlions34]

Thank you guys for all the replies.

I think we are going to be going with the hardware kit for he 4x8 machine, and going with a local supplier we know of the 80/20.

We are fortunate to have some very technically savvy people under one roof. We work with aluminum extrusions every day, and even share space with a stainless steel fabricator that has a CNC bridgeport we can use as well.

I like the idea of the 80/20 material, and with our in house capabilities I think going with the hardware only kit and doing the remainder of the machine ourselves should work out OK. Here is my current cost structure:

$665
NEMA 23 ELECTRONICS KIT (CNC Router Parts Store)
$1,245
HARDWARE ONLY MACHINE KIT (CNC Router Parts Store)
4X8 OPTION

$75 SHIPPING ??? (not sure yet)

$200 for CRS
1 PCS 4" x 15" x 1/4" COLD ROLLED STEEL
2 PCS 108" 2.5" COLD ROLLED STEEL 1/4"
2 PCS 60" 2.5" COLD ROLLED STEEL

$962 quote for 80/20 cut to size
8 PCS 54" 1530 EXTRUSION
1 PC 60" 3060 EXTRUSION
2 PCS 108" 1545 EXTRUSION
1 PC 1530 - 19" LTH

$232 for gear rack from McMaster Carr
1 PC 54" GEAR RACK
2 PCS 102" GEAR RACK 20 PITCH 20* PRESSURE ANGLE

$300 Software
$350 Router
$250 COMPUTER
$250 TABLE

$250 DUST COLLECTOR

$4,779

Obviously this isn't all inclusive, but please let me know if you see anything big missing. I am waiting on my quote back for the CRS so I just threw in $200. We are also just including $250 to upgrade a current computer and get a monitor. Also the table will be built in house using some materials we already have.

[RossMosh]

$250 seems light for the table unless you're having the guy who you share space with make you the table. Do not cheap out on the table. It's the foundation of the machine. Strong and rigid are key.

$300 for software is also light. Mach3 alone is $175. Then you're going to want something to actually do the CAM work that doesn't suck. I'd say V-Carve Pro or the like is what you're looking at. So $800 is probably a more accurate number for that.

I think you're also going to want a Super PID for router speed control. That's another $200.

You also have to worry about e-chain. You can cut some yourself for maybe $50-80. To buy it is about double that.

I also think it would be wise to add a Misc category at around 10%. That will cover things like hardware, spoilboard, t-track for the spoil board, collets, ect ect ect.

Like I said, $6000 is probably enough but you should be prepared to go a bit over.

[osphoto]

NEMA 23 for a 4x8 ft table? Perhaps on the Z axis but not on the X & Y. That just seems weak. And you are gonna really want some fast rapids when setting up work, etc.

$350 for a router? Didn't realized they cost that much these day's. k2cnc.com sales router holders at reasonable prices. In using the router, I'd suggest going to Collets, Nuts and Toolholders and getting a collet that is way better then manufacture.

CAM software, don't forget that really important part of the cost factor.

Happy building however, if you are paying folks by the hour to build this, don't forget that hourly rate.

[detroitlions34]

Thanks for all the replies.

We have several AutoCAD seats for the parts design and plan on Mach 3 or similar to transfer to run the machine. We are researching other software options now.

Jumping to the 34 motors really hikes up the price which is why we are leaning 23, but I don't want to handicap ourselves either. We are thinking that as long as the 23 motors get through the material the same, we arent going to be doing really fast cuts through our material anyway. We always want to hear everyones opinion though.

Also we are budgeting that much for the best router we could find, but honestly the spindle options out there are really cool. I think going with the router to get set up and working though will be the way to start.

Thanks again, I'll keep everyone updated to our progress.