Lumenlabs V3/M3 micro good model for a DIY build?

[Gonzodada]

Hello

New to DIY CNC so early days for me.

I was interested in buying one of Lumenlab's bots but they're having such trouble actually getting them out the door as unfortunately their head honcho has been gravely ill.



So I'm considering a DIY build and I'm struck by the simplicity of the Lumen bot. The frame is a series of milled HDPE blocks secured to a large metal base.

For small bots (I need X = 19" and Y = 19") the cost of suitable 10 mm aluminium plate seems reasonable (about £75). Would it be flat enough or would it need further machining?

I'm not sure how you'd source HDPE blocks. Could you use a hardwood instead?

All that said, I do wonder where the strength comes from in the Lumen bot as isn't it entirely dependent on how the blocks are secured to the base plate?

Thanks
Jim

[lamesh99]

this looks amazing. lightweight, minimum of moving parts, simple, probably fast... perfect for me. i think i'm gonna start building myself one of these as soon as i get my first one up and running (need something to machine the HDPE
i don't have much experience in all this, but it seems to me it was constructed for light, soft-ish materials. i too would go with, say, MDF (25 or 30mm), heavy enough for base, but not too hard to work with. however, i'd use aluminum blocks instead of HDPE (it's just me, i like aluminum ).

as i said, i don't have much experience (none at all, actually), so it would be best to take some advice from more advanced builders and machinists.
nevertheless, i wish you all the luck with the build, and i hope you'll update the thread often!

[Gonzodada]

Originally Posted by lamesh99 this looks amazing. lightweight, minimum of moving parts, simple, probably fast... perfect for me. i think i'm gonna start building myself one of these as soon as i get my first one up and running (need something to machine the HDPE i don't have much experience in all this, but it seems to me it was constructed for light, soft-ish materials. i too would go with, say, MDF (25 or 30mm), heavy enough for base, but not too hard to work with. however, i'd use aluminum blocks instead of HDPE (it's just me, i like aluminum ). as i said, i don't have much experience (none at all, actually), so it would be best to take some advice from more advanced builders and machinists. nevertheless, i wish you all the luck with the build, and i hope you'll update the thread often!

Looks amazing doesn't it? (micRo personal fabricating center - mill, drill, engrave, 3D print and more | Lumenlab). it's competitively priced too. Their main guy got ill last year (as in might die kind of ill) and they got really behind with orders (months) upset lots of their customers and generally had a horrible time of it! They posted recently to say he's on the mend and they're catching up with orders but who knows when things will be properly Ok.

I've been Googling HDPE and it seems very expensive. Can you give a link to the kind of aluminium blocks you had in mind? I like aluminium too.

Jim

[lamesh99]

Originally Posted by Gonzodada Looks amazing doesn't it? (micRo personal fabricating center - mill, drill, engrave, 3D print and more | Lumenlab). it's competitively priced too. Their main guy got ill last year (as in might die kind of ill) and they got really behind with orders (months) upset lots of their customers and generally had a horrible time of it! They posted recently to say he's on the mend and they're catching up with orders but who knows when things will be properly Ok. I've been Googling HDPE and it seems very expensive. Can you give a link to the kind of aluminium blocks you had in mind? I like aluminium too. Jim

i don't know is it just me, but i feel like i can make 3 machines like this for their price of 1. true, they would be DIY, but who says that it can't be just as good?
never mind my crazy talk, lumenlabs still have an amazing product, as far as i'm concerned.
about the aluminum, i don't think my links would help much, since i'm from croatia, but it shouldn't be a problem finding a serious metals dealer/hardware store in uk. over here, on the other hand, it's a real problem. i was buying some aluminum rods (10mmx3m) the other day, and it took me 2 hours of driving to get there. and don't let me get started on machining...
i was thinking of something close to this:

Al block 3x1.5x8,125in

or this:

Al block 5 7/8" X 3 1/8" X 2

you would, of course, have to machine (fabricate) everything to your specs, but you would have to do the same with the HDPE, and i think aluminum is stronger and more durable.

[acondit]

Part of what you are paying for is the machining accuracy of their parts. Of course, if you have the machining capabilities to machine the parts accurately, you can trade your labor for theirs.

Alan

[lamesh99]

Originally Posted by acondit Part of what you are paying for is the machining accuracy of their parts. Of course, if you have the machining capabilities to machine the parts accurately, you can trade your labor for theirs. Alan

well, of course. but, if one plans on using his/hers machine exclusively for hobby, i don't think the accuracy of a 0.0001mm is a must. i don't want to disrespect or diminish anyone's work, but i think that the "brave new world" we live in is getting greedier and greedier real fast.
sorry for the OT, by the way.

[acondit]

Originally Posted by lamesh99 well, of course. but, if one plans on using his/hers machine exclusively for hobby, i don't think the accuracy of a 0.0001mm is a must. i don't want to disrespect or diminish anyone's work, but i think that the "brave new world" we live in is getting greedier and greedier real fast. sorry for the OT, by the way.

I have no relationship with Lumenlabs, but I have followed the Lumenlab machine development for some time. Given what other kits and finished machines sell for, $699 for a micRo kit and $999 for an m3 kit (including 4 stepper motors), it doesn't seem outrageously high priced. As you move up in their offerings, it gets a little richer, but for people who want assembled and tested, somebody has to pay for the time involved. I am not claiming that they are necessarily better or even as good as other options, I think it depends on what someone wants. I just think that accusing them of excess greed is a little harsh.

I agree with you generally on the issue of accuracy, but someone the other day was trying to do micro-machining with a DIY machine. If that is someone's goal then the accuracy required may well be in the range you mentioned.

Alan

[arizonavideo]

I have also followed the Lumenlabs machine for the last few years.

One thing it does have is the lead screws are turned not rolled that gives low lead error.

As for making it yourself, you need to look at it a bit closer.

All the leadnuts are cut into the moving blocks so you will have to tap them yourself and get it right the first time or you will scrap the block. He has lash adjustments which you can't really see.

Same goes for the rail fit. To get a nice fit takes practice and the right tools and you will have to get each bore tight and straight the first time. Unless you have some experience you just may scrap a few blocks before you get it right. If all you have is a drill press it is going to be hard to get nice fits without just the right ream.

I have seen a generic copy using a flat plate and rails bolted to the plate and the rest like many others.

I do wish hope they get back up and posting soon.

[Ron Dunn]

I think they are honest guys, but I think they are way out of their depth.

I placed an order for an M3, they didn't meet delivery commitments, and I cancelled the order for a refund. No problems, which is why I think they are honest people.

Since then I've seen too many changes in the product, too many complaints of parts that didn't meet specification, too many lost orders, and a generally slack approach to business that makes me pleased I ordered a different machine. I bought a Fireball V90, and I've spent months making stuff instead of waiting for endlessly changing delivery promises.

If they improved the professionalism of their operation I'd consider buying, but right now I think they're teetering on the edge of collapse.

[lamesh99]

@ acondit
i was speaking about the greed in general, not about lumenlab specifically. i mean, if you, arizonavideo, or myself can build a machine for say, 100$ in parts and an extra 50$ in assembly and testing time, why sell it for say, 600$? again, i'm not talking about lumenlab, just speaking generally.
i just realized that i'm way OT now, so i'll quit my whining

@ arizonavideo

i had an idea about getting a tight fit for rails and leadscrews:
drill a hole just a little bit smaller than the diameter of a rail, heat up the HDPE block just enough to fit the rail, then let it cool, and set around the rail. you could even add some grooves on the rail to prevent turning or slipping.
similar thing with the leadscrew, but instead of heating the HDPE, you would heat the rod itself, and "melt" a perfect fit thread in the plastic. of course, the plastic would have to be drilled with a size of the rod without the threads, if you know what i mean.
i'm sure this has already popped somewhere on the forum way before i thought of it, but the fact i came to an idea is making me proud of myself

[acondit]

Originally Posted by lamesh99 @ acondit i was speaking about the greed in general, not about lumenlab specifically. i mean, if you, arizonavideo, or myself can build a machine for say, 100$ in parts and an extra 50$ in assembly and testing time, why sell it for say, 600$? again, i'm not talking about lumenlab, just speaking generally. i just realized that i'm way OT now, so i'll quit my whining

My point was that Joe at Lumenlabs hired some guys to help build the stuff he sells. He has to pay their wages and the ceramic coated rails, 4 steppers, Mic6 ground base plate, screws, and sheets of HDPE probably cost more than $100 without any machining. For guys who don't have any machining experience or proper tools who want to build a small cnc machine, a kit for a first machine may be a better approach than building from scratch.

I have over the years tried to bootstrap machines on the cheap. It usually ended up costing me more than if I had purchased a running machine. Now having a halfway decent home shop, I can do a lot of stuff for cheaper than I could think of buying it, but I have thousands of dollars worth of tools and machines. When I read someone saying that they can't even do basic woodworking (and have no metalworking experience) say they are going to build a CNC machine, I think, "he would be better off with a kit to start". Then once he had a machine running he could use it to produce better stuff and build his dream.

Alan

[Gonzodada]

Originally Posted by acondit I have over the years tried to bootstrap machines on the cheap. It usually ended up costing me more than if I had purchased a running machine. Now having a halfway decent home shop, I can do a lot of stuff for cheaper than I could think of buying it, but I have thousands of dollars worth of tools and machines. When I read someone saying that they can't even do basic woodworking (and have no metalworking experience) say they are going to build a CNC machine, I think, "he would be better off with a kit to start". Then once he had a machine running he could use it to produce better stuff and build his dream.

I think this is probably very good advice. I have some basic wood/metal-working skills and some rudimentary shop tools but the thought of a DIY build is still very daunting.

The workaround I guess is to come up with a design that doesn't demand any complex skills or equipment! Build the frame from bolted T-slot aluminium extrusions rather than welded steel for example. But how far you can take that I'm not sure.