Salvaging Shop Fox Cam Clamps for T-tracks

[DonFrambach]

Found that the Shop Fox Cam clamps can be very useful for securing work pieces to my router. http://www.cnczone.com/forums/985097-post171.html

However, due to Chinese quality control procedures, none of the 4 clamps that I received were usable as delivered. The problem was that I could not fit any of the clamps to my t-track table because the screws that secured the nut were either too long (1 case) or too short (3 cases) and the nut itself was so rough that it would not fit in the track (4 cases) and, in one case, the threaded hole in the nut was so off center that it would accept the screw when in a t-track.

Although the screws were all 3/4" long, the counter-bores for the screws varied from .23" (too shallow) to .37" (too deep). Three of the clamps had shallow counter bores so that the screw did not engage the nut when the nut was in the t-track. This problem was solved by using 7/8" 1/4 x 20 SHCS that I happened to have. The screw from the unit with the deep counter bore struck the bottom of the t-track before the clamp could be fully tightened down. I suppose this could have been solved by using a 5/8" SHCS but I simply ground down the supplied 3/4" screw until it was the appropriate length.

The supplied nuts were very rough and didn't fit into the t-tracks. One had the hole very off center. I made one nut work by grinding it smooth but decided it was easier to just use some 1/4 x 20 oval nuts that I got from Woodcraft. http://www.woodcraft.com/Product/200...ut-10Pack.aspx

Bottom line: If you purchase a Shop Fox cam clamp, be prepared to either shorten the screw or replace it with a 7/8" SHCS. In addition be prepared to either smooth and reshape the supplied nuts or replace them with oval nuts.

Some photos:

[joesz]

Not surprising to hear of the quality issues, it is very common to get garbage from China. The thing is they know full well it is not worth the money it would cost to ship the stuff back so they ship junk all the time. It is also not uncommon for them to switch materials or change tolerances on blueprints so beware to anyone considering outsourcing anything to China, yea you will get the stuff for cheap they use slaves to make it but you can be 100% sure you will get garbage 95% of the time. It was illegal for anyone in the USA to have anything to do with Communist China a few years back but now that the large corporations found out there is cheap labor to exploit those laws don't seem to matter anymore. The human rights violations taking place in the sweat shops over there would never be allowed to take place here yet it seems it is ok for the large corporations to just look the other way it makes me sick.

[cornbinder23]

Originally Posted by joesz Not surprising to hear of the quality issues, it is very common to get garbage from China. The thing is they know full well it is not worth the money it would cost to ship the stuff back so they ship junk all the time. It is also not uncommon for them to switch materials or change tolerances on blueprints so beware to anyone considering outsourcing anything to China, yea you will get the stuff for cheap they use slaves to make it but you can be 100% sure you will get garbage 95% of the time. It was illegal for anyone in the USA to have anything to do with Communist China a few years back but now that the large corporations found out there is cheap labor to exploit those laws don't seem to matter anymore. The human rights violations taking place in the sweat shops over there would never be allowed to take place here yet it seems it is ok for the large corporations to just look the other way it makes me sick.

AMEN!!!!!!!!

JTCUSTOMS

[louieatienza]

Originally Posted by joesz Not surprising to hear of the quality issues, it is very common to get garbage from China. The thing is they know full well it is not worth the money it would cost to ship the stuff back so they ship junk all the time. It is also not uncommon for them to switch materials or change tolerances on blueprints so beware to anyone considering outsourcing anything to China, yea you will get the stuff for cheap they use slaves to make it but you can be 100% sure you will get garbage 95% of the time. It was illegal for anyone in the USA to have anything to do with Communist China a few years back but now that the large corporations found out there is cheap labor to exploit those laws don't seem to matter anymore. The human rights violations taking place in the sweat shops over there would never be allowed to take place here yet it seems it is ok for the large corporations to just look the other way it makes me sick.

If the large corporations thought it'd be more profitable to make stuff here, they would. If they didn't get taxed up the wazoo, have to deal with union workers who make 50% more than their non-union counterparts, be chained down by every BS regulation and beaurocracies, maybe we wouldn't need to import.

We buy China stuff all the time, and there's many here who'd rather buy some cheap junk, and spend the time to fix it and make it something like we should have bought in the first place! There have been a few posts of late concerning porblems with Chinese bearing blocks. I have a few sets from our "favorite" seller, and while serviceable, leave a bit to be desired. Then I have a few sets from another Chinese manufacturer (resold by Marchant Dice) which blow Chai's away in terms of quality, but they cost more than 3 times as much. Finally I have some NOS THK bearing blocks, which at first glance look only marginally better than the Marchant Dice units, and the differences are only noticeable under very close inspection; and they would cost more than twice that of the Marchant Dice units if bought new. Many here buy the TB6560 or whatever driver boards for their machines, and use them successfully. But if something ever went wrong with it, you'll have to wait for another one to get here by boat and through customs; not hte best thing if we're in the middle of a job.

Now we're getting wood products from China. The plywood at Home Cheapo has more voids than my checkbook. I don't know if they're getting MDF from China yet; but if we were concerned with UF glue dust, I can't imagine what crap they'd be using - imagine, getting mad cow disease from Chinese MDF hehehe...

Then again, nobody seems to care that Apple is the second most valuable company in the world, and their products are made by the aforementioned sweatshops, of which there are suicides every MONTH. But we buy up iPhones and iWhatevers like crack cocaine.

I'm not saying that it's wrong to buy Chinese stuff. Maybe a lot of the stuff is junk, but hey it works and it's cheap. I want to save a buck just like anyone else. But I know when I want or need to spend more and buy a better product. I don't want to knock anyone who wants to save; I do it too. But to me it's hypocritical to judge large corporations, who are in essence doing the same thing we are doing by buying Chinese.

[acondit]

If we succeed in driving the prices down far enough, nobody will have jobs, and nobody will be able to afford to buy anything.

[louieatienza]

Originally Posted by acondit If we succeed in driving the prices down far enough, nobody will have jobs, and nobody will be able to afford to buy anything.

I respectfully disagree. Our country has succeeded in the past from the innovative minds of entrepeneurs who refused to believe that something was impossible to do. It's not merely a matter of matching the prices of Chinese products, it's educating the consumer that spending a little more for American quality is better spent money than buying cheap Chinese stuff, and spending hours on hours fixing it and making it what it was supposed to be.

Companies do not tax people, and add surcharges for emmissions, workers' comp, etc... It is the government, and the corporations merely pass teh expense on to the consumers. If the Chinese don't give a crap about the uality or lack thereof of their product, then neither do we, since we buy it by the freight load. If you buy more American stuff, then you'll create more American jobs.

edit: I aplogize for the rant. I realize that this is not a forum for politics,; just had to get a load off my chest. I'm stepping off the pulpit....

[cornbinder23]

Originally Posted by louieatienza Companies do not tax people, and add surcharges for emmissions, workers' comp, etc... It is the government, and the corporations merely pass teh expense on to the consumers. If the Chinese don't give a crap about the uality or lack thereof of their product, then neither do we, since we buy it by the freight load. If you buy more American stuff, then you'll create more American jobs.

I agree the government plays a role in what type of costs are passed to the consumer, but dont you think those expenses should be twice the amount for china and especially corporations that remove their north american presence, they blatantly are removing jobs from our economy, and I am not just talking about consumer electronics (apple) I can understand why Us consumers dont want to spend 400 on an ipod, but I for one am VERY willing to pay a little more for something made in the US as I will be supporting jobs here. You used to have a choice on where you spent your money now you dont really have the choices you used to have. And I know first hand that its not just consumer goods that companies make in China, I have lost a job to a company looking for more profit, not a better quality product.
It used to be you payed less for an inferior product, now the costs for the inferior products are getting higher and higher, I am looking forward to the days when the inferior product costs enough for the US consumer to say enough!!
Just to list a few products that DEFINITELY have issues that most dont hear about in the US
Dog food- killing your pets
Milk additives- killing their own children
Passenger car tires- massive failures resulting in death and injury
Tire valve stems- same as above
Pharmaceuticals- dialysis meds killed some and made many sick
Electronics- corporate espionage?
Children's toys- coated in toxic paints and made with toxic substances
It all boils down to greed, greed within government and corporations and also greed from the average consumer.

Sorry Don couldnt help myself!!

JTCUSTOMS

[acondit]

Originally Posted by louieatienza I respectfully disagree. --snip-- It's not merely a matter of matching the prices of Chinese products, it's educating the consumer that spending a little more for American quality is better spent money than buying cheap Chinese stuff, and spending hours on hours fixing it and making it what it was supposed to be. --snip--

I think that is what I was saying.

[louieatienza]

Originally Posted by cornbinder23 I agree the government plays a role in what type of costs are passed to the consumer, but dont you think those expenses should be twice the amount for china and especially corporations that remove their north american presence, they blatantly are removing jobs from our economy, and I am not just talking about consumer electronics (apple) I can understand why Us consumers dont want to spend 400 on an ipod, but I for one am VERY willing to pay a little more for something made in the US as I will be supporting jobs here. You used to have a choice on where you spent your money now you dont really have the choices you used to have. And I know first hand that its not just consumer goods that companies make in China, I have lost a job to a company looking for more profit, not a better quality product. It used to be you payed less for an inferior product, now the costs for the inferior products are getting higher and higher, I am looking forward to the days when the inferior product costs enough for the US consumer to say enough!! Just to list a few products that DEFINITELY have issues that most dont hear about in the US Dog food- killing your pets Milk additives- killing their own children Passenger car tires- massive failures resulting in death and injury Tire valve stems- same as above Pharmaceuticals- dialysis meds killed some and made many sick Electronics- corporate espionage? Children's toys- coated in toxic paints and made with toxic substances It all boils down to greed, greed within government and corporations and also greed from the average consumer. Sorry Don couldnt help myself!! JTCUSTOMS

My mother died last year from complications due to heart failure, but she was a diabetic of 30 years, and had to go on dialysis because her kidneys failed. Now I could go on and on that the dialysis killer her, but maybe, just maybe, it gave her 5 more months of life; 5 months that I will cherish forever.

The stupid World Health Organization put a ban on the use of DDT on crops; and maybe that prevented a couple thousand people in Africa from complications arising from it, but the ban itsel has killed millions because crops can't be grown because of insect infestation. Now, in California, we're kiiling the livevlihoods of farmers because irrigating their land might kill off a dozen or so stupid frogs; in a state over a trillion dollars in the hole?

As for these toys - there was a time when part of parenting meant watching your kids, and taking toys out of their mouths. When I was a kid, my mom or dad would grab the toy out of my mouth, and give me a small rap on the hand. Lesson learned. How many toys must a kid put in his or her mouth to ingest enough lead to cause brain damage or kill them?

Corporations make profits, yes; but these profits also raise the value of their stocks, which are in the invevstment protfolios of many. Corporations also hire people. And regardless of place of origin, someone has to ship it, warehouse and inventory it, wholesale it to a distributor, where it is either purchased at a store or showroom, or shipped. These big wig CEOs also have private planes, large mansions, and yachts. These things are not produced out of thin air. They're made; ergo jobs are made.

If corporations today knew what taxes they'll be facing in the future, or penalties for privatized health care, or carbon emissions surcharges, then they'd more likely reinvest their cash in growing their workforce instead of holding onto it. If those who fought their way to the top weren't penalized for their successes, maybe more people would strive for it instead of being jealous and calling those at the top "greedy." If the top 1% pay 40% of all income taxes collected and are called greedy, what of the bottom 40% who pay absolutly no income tax?

[acondit]

Originally Posted by louieatienza --snip-- The stupid World Health Organization put a ban on the use of DDT on crops; and maybe that prevented a couple thousand people in Africa from complications arising from it, but the ban itself has killed millions because crops can't be grown because of insect infestation.--snip--

My Grandfather who died of cancer used to use DDT before it was banned. Now maybe it was not the cause of his cancer (we'll never know for sure) but I remember all the deformed animals around that were exposed to DDT. So, your "stupid World Health Organization" is someone else's "about time". It is easy to complain when it is not your ox being gored.

Alan

[cornbinder23]

Originally Posted by louieatienza If corporations today knew what taxes they'll be facing in the future, or penalties for privatized health care, or carbon emissions surcharges, then they'd more likely reinvest their cash in growing their workforce instead of holding onto it. If those who fought their way to the top weren't penalized for their successes, maybe more people would strive for it instead of being jealous and calling those at the top "greedy." If the top 1% pay 40% of all income taxes collected and are called greedy, what of the bottom 40% who pay absolutly no income tax?

They ARE greedy! I have seen it first hand, I am not against world trade, I am against the US trading jobs and LOCAL economy for 5$ off the widget your kid wants for christmas.
Businesses need money to operate and pay their taxes (obvious)
but its kinda hard for the 40% to pay income taxes without the jobs (again obvious)

JTCUSTOMS

[louieatienza]

Originally Posted by acondit My Grandfather who died of cancer used to use DDT before it was banned. Now maybe it was not the cause of his cancer (we'll never know for sure) but I remember all the deformed animals around that were exposed to DDT. So, your "stupid World Health Organization" is someone else's "about time". It is easy to complain when it is not your ox being gored. Alan

Tell that to the millions that die each yearin third world countries of starvation, because their crops are being destryed by insect infestation. My condolensces to your family; I don't mean this to be a heartless rant. There was a time when we didn't understand the risks, but knowing what we do now, there has to be ways of safely using pesticides. especially where it's needed most.

They ARE greedy! I have seen it first hand, I am not against world trade, I am against the US trading jobs and LOCAL economy for 5$ off the widget your kid wants for christmas. Businesses need money to operate and pay their taxes (obvious) but its kinda hard for the 40% to pay income taxes without the jobs (again obvious) JTCUSTOMS

I've been a victim of large corporations a few times; when my cabinetmaking shop died after Home Depot came to town, being laid off as part of a merger, working for a contractor that shut down when a larger builder came in and outbid us...

Don't get me wrong here. I'm in the same boat as you as far as supporting our local and national economy. But aside from emplying their own personnel, and creating emplyment down the supply chain, corporations also need to make profits for shareholders, R&D, and reserve cash. If there were no corporations, regardless of size, there'd be no jobs.