Newbie- N00b Alert. So confused.

[Gamble]

Hi everyone, I'm new here and have been thinking of building a CNC for a long time now. I do welding as a hobby and figured if I can get a little desktop cnc going I can do some easier fabrication. Which is something I want to get into on the side.
I have never seen a community forum this large and it's very very intimidating. I don't even know where to start. I want to build a simple/basic machine that can do wood or aluminum. Something that fits on a desktop and even 1sq foot or 2'x2' would be enough for me.
Truth is I don't know where to being. This will be my first build so i want i to be as simple as basic as possible. Are there any good kits or designs are that easy to build? I want to be on a budget and "try" to spend $500 or less if possible. Once I get it established I'm sure I will want something more and then go onto something else. However I can't justify spending $800+ on something I'm not 100% sure I can do alone.
I've been searching all day for about a week now and can't find any good free plans. I don't mind paying for them but I would kind of like step by step type/style steps. The ones I found just show it all built in a pdf format.

Can someone steer me in the right direction, my head is overloaded with information at this point in time.
Thanks

[aarongough]

Welcome!
To be honest if you're looking at cutting aluminium then $500 - $800 probably won't be enough of a budget to get into it. What sort of cutting area are you looking for?

If you're happy with a smaller machine then maybe you should have a look at the machines built by Microcarve. He's a forum member, very friendly and helpful and he definitely knows what he's doing. He sells machine kits here: microcarve cnc

I have seen videos of his small machines cutting aluminium, albeit relatively slowly (because they have to take shallow passes). If you want more information about the capabilities of the machine I would recommend contacting him directly.

For the electronics and such I would recommend looking at the 3 Axis kits from CNCRouterParts. They're not the cheapest you could buy, but I highly recommend not going with cheap gear in the electronics. I've had some very bad experiences with cheap drivers.

Here's the link to CNCRouterParts:

CNCRouterParts

Then you will need a spindle. The community seems to largely recommend small trim routers like the Bosch Colt:

Amazon.com: Bosch PR20EVSK Colt Palm Grip 5.6 Amp 1-Horsepower Fixed-Base Variable-Speed Router with Edge Guide: Home Improvement

Amazon.com: Bosch PR20EVSK Colt Palm Grip 5.6 Amp 1-Horsepower Fixed-Base Variable-Speed Router with Edge Guide: Home Improvement

I have also heard good things about the Dewalt DWP611:

Amazon.com: DEWALT DWP611 1.25 HP Max Torque Variable Speed Compact Router with LED's: Home Improvement

Amazon.com: DEWALT DWP611 1.25 HP Max Torque Variable Speed Compact Router with LED's: Home Improvement

So a basic kit overall would be:
Microcarve MV-1: $599
CNCRouterParts 3 Axis electronics Kit: $519
Dewalt DWP611: $100
Basic Tooling: $100
-----------------
Total: $1318 (plus various shipping charges and such)

If you wanted a larger cutting area the you could go instead with a larger machine like the Fireball v90 (FireBall V90 CNC Router -). The other parts I mentioned would still be relevant. It's worth noting though that the V90 will likely be less rigid then the Microcarve machines becaus of it's larger size and moving gantry design.

I'm definitely no expert on this stuff, but I have been researching for a few years and have been running a machine of my own for the last 6 months, so I'll do my best to answer any questions!

[Gamble]

Aside from the router you choose is there anything else that will let you or won't let you cut aluminum or stainless? Thanks for the links, I'll look into them now.
For cutting area 1' x 1' will be plenty for now.

[ger21]

Aside from the router you choose is there anything else that will let you or won't let you cut aluminum or stainless

It's all about how rigid the machine is. And you can forget about cutting stainless steel.

[aarongough]

1' x 1' is actually a pretty large cutting area for a machine that will be cutting a lot of aluminium... The reason is to follow:

The router or spindle motor really doesn't have much to do with whether or not a machine can cut aluminium. It has much more to do with how 'rigid' or stiff a machine is. Machines that are designed to cut metal are generally made out of cast iron which is very rigid. Low cost CNC routers on the other hand are generally made out of timber or aluminium. Aluminium is more rigid than timber but obviously much more expensive.

The smaller the machine, the shorter the spans of material that make up it's frame. A 1" span of wood is obviously a lot stiffer than a 30" span of wood. This is why a smaller machine may be more suited to your needs.

The reason that stiffness is important is because every time the cutting tool bites into the material being cut there is a tendency for the cutter to want to bounce out of the material. You would have felt this when using a dremel or an angle grinder to cut metal. The CNC machine has to be strong enough to withstand this force pushing back without moving or flexing at all. If it were to move or flex at all then cuts would be inaccurate and the machine would get 'chatter' which is where the cutting tool bounces in and out of the cut being made, rather than smoothly cutting.

These forces are a lot lower for materials like plastic and wood than they are for metals, which is why cutting metals generally means a more expensive machine.

This may all seem a little daunting, as there is a *lot* to learn... It is manageable though, just do as much reading as you can before spending any money. Otherwise you will likely end up with a setup that doesn't suit your needs.

[louieatienza]

Originally Posted by Gamble Aside from the router you choose is there anything else that will let you or won't let you cut aluminum or stainless? Thanks for the links, I'll look into them now. For cutting area 1' x 1' will be plenty for now.

You need a pretty ridgid macine to cut aluminum. Also it's a good idea to use a lubricant, or better yet, flood coolant; so the materials you use are important. The good thing is, it's a lot easier to make a small ridgid machine. The bad news is, it might not be within your budget.

If you sift through eBay you should be able to find good deals still on linear components. If you want to cut mainly aluminum you'd want supported linear shafting or profile rails. I would also use the stiffest material I could afford to build my framework. For me, I had a few pieces of 1" phenolic that is both very stiff, has good mass, and maybe even some vibration damping properties. You could also use aluminum extrusion, and there are always deals on eBay. Mic-6 cast aluminum tooling plate is also good material, because it is ground very accurately for flatness and thickness, won't deform from machining, and will give you "built-in" accuracy; and you could find this on eBay as well.

[DonFrambach]

I recently built a 14" x 14" router to cut wood and aluminum. To increase rigidity, I chose to go with a fixed gantry design. Most of the components were purchased from CNCRouterParts.com. If you're interested, there is a build thread on this forum. Here's a link: http://www.cnczone.com/forums/diy-cn...ry_router.html

[Gamble]

This place is local to me, how would these work?
3 Axis Drive Stepper Motor 270 Oz-in CNC Kit, P.Supply | eBay
Does the stepper motors come with any type of software? And how do you go about programming this stuff?
I'm thinking maybe buying some motors and going to home depot and getting some aluminum and weld or bolt together a frame for starters.

It doesn't have to be 1'x1' it was just a idea I had. If I can just cut something up to 8 or 10" tall that would be enough for me. And maybe 6" in the other direction.

I was kind of thinking of using some aluminum L brackets to build the base and bolting them down to my bench. That should make it pretty stiff.

What would you guys say is the hardest part of building a cnc? And is the software hard to learn? I'm not looking to do anything intricate or crazy, just basic stuff. Ideally I want to get some nice straight cuts on (up to 16g) or 1/8" aluminum to build catch cans, over flow tanks and other parts for my car.

Edit:
What do you guys think of the zen toolworks kit?

[jsheerin]

If you want to do more metal than wood, you might take a look at this build for some ideas: http://www.cnczone.com/forums/vertic...ill_build.html

While you can cut aluminum with a router, you might be better off going with a lower speed mini mill head. However the router will be what you need for wood - they are kind of conflicting goals. I have a wood router that I cut aluminum (and even stainless) on sometimes, but it doesn't cut metal very well. It goes really slow and doesn't have the best cut quality. But if you're just cutting things out to weld them, this might not matter that much to you. I cut out some parts for an aluminum radiator tank for my motorcycle using my router and those parts were fine. Then I milled out a threaded filler neck for it, and on that the finish is not very smooth.

No matter what you do, you'll probably want bigger motors. The 380oz*in size that Keling sells are pretty popular for routers. They have a kit with the Gecko G540 that looks like a good deal, but that might blow more of your budget than you want.

I'd say the hardest part is sorting through all the available options, picking one, and making the commitment to get started. Then at the end of the build, ironing out electrical bugs. Those never happen to some people, but when they do they can be a pain to track down. Learning the software is usually not that bad if you have any experience with this kind of stuff already. At worst it just requires time to figure it out, read the tutorials and work through examples, etc.

[louieatienza]

I've had some success milling aluminum with a router. Part of it is machine ridgidity, part of it is work hold-down, part of it is knowing what speeds and feeds, part of it is tool selection, and part of it is knowing what types of aluminum mill best at higher spindle speeds.

I've been using a SuperPID router speed controller and it has helped immensly. There's a huge thread on it here.

[adprinter]

Don't want to add to your confusion, but check out my build at:
http://www.cnczone.com/forums/diy-cn...cnc_build.html
It may help to educate you a little more on what is involved, and to decide which type of machine you want to build. Hope this helps!

[Gamble]

I decided to do less thinking and more building and see where I can go from here.
I found this video today and started to make something similar. However I skipped the wood part which was a mistake because it doesn't sit 100% even it has like a 1/16th of a woobale. I can fix that later on though.
Went and got some angle iron and started to measure and cut.





Thoughts thus far?
No local store I have been to sells square stock of aluminium that isn't hollow.