My Newest Desktop machine

[dertsap]

i wonder how gator guard bed liner would be on mdf , the stuff is tough and would probably protect the mdf from most of the crap that someone could throw at it

[microcarve]

A4's cutting area is approx 12 x 9 x 3.5"

It's called "A4" because that's about the size of a common sheet of printer
paper and it's easy to judge what the cutting area available is.

I've been upgrading details along on the A4 machines so they're at $489
right now. I sell them less if someone wants to do the painting. Painting
gets a few dings when the machines are being repeatedly test fitted with
all the parts, so if I don't have to sand and paint them, I'll sell them for $429.

I haven't had them powder coated, but I'd sure love to and have mentioned
it several times. Problem is, I need to have a big order to make it worthwhile
to have that done. I'd surely like to see someone do it....

Steppers from about 150 oz to 300 oz work great and have been tested.
Anything more is overkill that doesn't add anything.

Don't worry about dumb questions....those are the most useful kind to most
people most times....


John

[vtx1029]

Do you have a standard shopping list of other items needed to to complete one?

[microcarve]

i wonder how gator guard bed liner would be on mdf , the stuff is tough and would probably protect the mdf from most of the crap that someone could throw at it

That's another thing I've wanted to try. Just haven't gotten around to
it yet. I imagined it being a slight PITA, but one day, I'll see for sure...


John

[microcarve]

Do you have a standard shopping list of other items needed to to complete one?

The tool holder from k2cnc for a Bosch Colt....and the Bosch Colt
itself...

I'd recommend driver kits form a few places...

Hobbycnc if someone is comfortable soldering to save some $$.

Probotix sells a few driver kits

The Gecko G540 is very popular and is being used on several machines
I've sent out.

I'd suggest getting the motors from the same place as the driver
kits. Those guys match motors very well to what they sell.

I like Vectric software...

I use Mach3 myself. EMC2 is free, but you'll need a linux machine
for it.

That's about all you'd need, besides some cutting bits.


John

[vtx1029]

so your kits come with lead screws and couplers?

[microcarve]

so your kits come with lead screws and couplers?

Sure thing...

It's a complete mechanical machine except for the tool holder.
It's drilled and tapped for any that Probotix sells. The one from
k2cnc is the most popular, so I mention it first.

[atwooddon]

End plates in place....

Getting shinier by the minute...


John

EWWW, pretty!!!

Don

[microcarve]

Finished....

(There will be a 3/8" thick aluminum plate on the Z axis
to bolt tool holders to. That material will be here tomorrow.)

It came out really nicely. It's a bit heavier than it looks too.
19 x 21 x 17H without motors attached. Should be an excellent
PCB machine as smooth and tight as it is.

The urethane reinforced MDF support bars for the table rails
could be painted, but I didn't do those because of the time
it'll take for paint to dry well enough for shipping. I figured if
someone wanted this one, it could go out before the weekend
if I didn't need to wait on such a small bit of paint to dry.

Price is lowered to $350 + shipping. I'd rather sell it than hold out for an
extra buck. I have *plenty* of cnc machines already...



John

[Getter-Done]

That is Awesome.

[microcarve]

That is Awesome.

Thanks Very Much!


John

[microcarve]

.

Good, and it is better to fix it on the firm place to ensure the accuracy.

If no firm place can be found....rope will work fine...

(Same design)


John

[RedskinsJBS]

.








If no firm place can be found....rope will work fine...

(Same design)


John

This photo always makes me laugh.

But, it does give me an idea on where to put my CNC in my dorm room. Hang the thing from the ceiling! Psh, screw my 187 ft of floor space, I also have 187 ft of ceiling space!

[microcarve]

Also works Great bolted to walls....

(I had a picture, but I can't find it)


John

[ma1]

John,

I am up to page 37 in this thread, and congratulations for the excellent design, and excellent storytelling with your pictures and detailed posts.

If you don't mind, I might duplicate some support parts of your design for my
first mini-CNC machine. I also own a rf45 clone so i can machine the metal
and the mdf in my mill. I don't have a lathe though, and have to do without
one. I am cooking up a design that will use drawer slides instead of the
linear rails for cost and smoother movement. The end goal is precision PCBs and plastic/thin aluminum milling. I already got 3/8-12 acme screws and 3/8 ball bearings along with brass nuts and some delrin (in case).

I wanted to ask before I forgot:
1- why is the z axis screw not supported on two ends? Wouldn't this
be stronger against the pull on the router?
2- Can one put an overall 3/4 MDF bottom baseplate for improved
stability of the rectangular base structure? Or something
like a horizontal cross-brace?
3- Similar to your aluminum joint supports, I was planning
to use steel corner braces from home depot. i really don't
want to drill the sides of mdf to avoid weakness, i would
rather drill the faces and put tee-nuts. what do you think?


sincerely

ma

[microcarve]

John,

I am up to page 37 in this thread, and congratulations for the excellent design, and excellent storytelling with your pictures and detailed posts.

If you don't mind, I might duplicate some support parts of your design for my
first mini-CNC machine. I also own a rf45 clone so i can machine the metal
and the mdf in my mill. I don't have a lathe though, and have to do without
one. I am cooking up a design that will use drawer slides instead of the
linear rails for cost and smoother movement. The end goal is precision PCBs and plastic/thin aluminum milling. I already got 3/8-12 acme screws and 3/8 ball bearings along with brass nuts and some delrin (in case).

I wanted to ask before I forgot:
1- why is the z axis screw not supported on two ends? Wouldn't this
be stronger against the pull on the router?
2- Can one put an overall 3/4 MDF bottom baseplate for improved
stability of the rectangular base structure? Or something
like a horizontal cross-brace?
3- Similar to your aluminum joint supports, I was planning
to use steel corner braces from home depot. i really don't
want to drill the sides of mdf to avoid weakness, i would
rather drill the faces and put tee-nuts. what do you think?


sincerely

ma

Thanks Very Much!



I must say, I'd avoid using drawer slides. Of course there do
exist better drawer slides than the ones I've seen...and tried...
but the ones that most people are likely to end up with aren't
going to be any improvement over simple round shafting.

They'll probably work fine for light milling of softer materials, but
I doubt it'll be good when you decide to try something like
metals. It's best to go ahead and make it as good as you can
while you're at it and round shafts at these sort of relatively
short length are long time proven to work fine. They're inexpensive,
reliable, maintenance free, easy to get, among other benefits.

Honestly, the only way I know of to improve on these short
round shafts is to use true linear bearings and blocks. Other
than that, anything else is of lesser reliability.


The Z axis has a double bore at the top for 2 bearings that
aligns them. They're stacked in the thick 1" aluminum block
so they lock the screw in place with a single collar, allowing
the Z to travel to the full bottom of the axis.

Those are done both ways sometimes, but I'm beginning to
do them more often like the latest one. It's more of a case
of making the bores while the mill is already set up and
flipping the part, but the size and function of the Z does
allow it to be done either way. It's just a bit harder sometimes
to make 3 exactly placed holes that match perfectly enough
for error free travel in 2 separate aluminum blocks. It does work
just as well either way though....


Base plate...sure you could just make a few slots in the sides
for a base/bottom "pan" in the machine. But as you can see, it's
rigid enough to actually hang from the rafters and still run while
doing some highly detailed work, so the "pan" only adds to shipping
costs for me, and isn't really necessary. It won't hurt anything, but
it isn't needed with the rigidity it already has with tensioning rods.

It's very easy to lift up and vacuum out/clean without that pan it place.
Which is a plus at times...


I tried the steel corner braces before. Seems like a good idea until
you find out they're just stamped out by the millions and there's
little/no QC involved with them. Those may or may not work depending
on who made them. Tensioning rods are the way to go, but that's
limited to relatively short pieces of a material like MDF, or it will just bow
and little is gained. A good design with T-Nuts can work very well.

I've been through every section of every hardware store within many
miles of me looking for the right parts that are easy to just run out
and buy. The right parts just don't exist. It seems we're stuck making
many parts from scratch.

A good machine can be built with drawer slides and corner braces, though.
It just takes a good bit of care and attention to detail...as well as
some good tools that can get the needed holes in the right places.

I'd guess a guy who can make the Z axis I showed won't have much
problem. That's the only real "hard part" in the whole thing.
A mini lathe would be a nice thing to have. It's still plenty strong and
large enough to do things like bushing and turning leadscrew ends.

It's as simple as a design can get...which is great for reliability and
highly detailed work as well as cost, but getting every part the exact
right size and in the exact right place can take a lot of work...and
in my case...a lot of special tools. It all adds up quick...


John

[atwooddon]

Also works Great bolted to walls....

(I had a picture, but I can't find it)


John

Damn John, just when I thought I had the Feng Shui of my shop floor space working in harmony, you come along and mention 'wall space'. Sheesh, now I have to start all over with my space layout..... One good thing about hanging it on the wall or from the ceiling, you don't have to vacuum 'under' it.

Don

[microcarve]

Damn John, just when I thought I had the Feng Shui of my shop floor space working in harmony, you come along and mention 'wall space'. Sheesh, now I have to start all over with my space layout..... One good thing about hanging it on the wall or from the ceiling, you don't have to vacuum 'under' it.

Don

LOL!



Odd as it may sound, it's actually practical in some instances.

I just bolted one up with some 2" aluminum angle, but it was easy
to see that with a slight change to the side panels, it's a useful
idea.

The change is to just angle the front to back of the side panels
with a 3-4" difference, then make a bracket for it to hang by.

The main thing cnc is really great at is doing the exact same thing
over and over. So easily dreamed up and made fixtures and jigs
can make bolting up 3-4 of these small machines in a row on a wall a
practical thing to do....in some cases.

One has to use their imagination, but it should be easy to see how
it could be useful for making lots of parts near continuously....

Very cost effectively!


John

[microcarve]

Just to explain a bit about the "practicality" of hanging
them on a wall....

People used to tell me all the time that I should put a logo
on my parts I make. I always wanted to, but tool changes are
a PITA.

I had a row of machines on a workbench...a picture is back in
the thread somewhere...but I really needed that workbench space.

So I have all this extra wall space in my 'router room' and it looked
like a good place to see if a machine could actually work attached to
a wall. It does.

I just never got time to do some wiring in the room, but hope to one
day.

The advantages are that it's easier to keep cleaned. Standing comfortably
while changing parts...(leaning over all day long is tiring). One part can
have a certain fixture for one operation with one bit and the next machine
have a different bit...for the logo, for example. Maybe another machine with
an angled bit to do some chamfering to look nice.

With fixtures in place that always hold a part in a certain position, it could be
productive and a relatively smooth process.

Only reason it ain't already going is all that wiring....


John

[jig123]

John,
How would you compare the Fireball V90 to the A-4?
I know the V90 has a larger work area: 12x18x3 vs about 12x10x4.
Would that larger work area lead to less accuracy/stability?
Or what other differences would you expect?