Turck proximity sensors

[hacker7]

Can anyone please help me with these sensors as far as wiring them to a cnc4pc C10 B.B. I got 8 of them. Any info or wiring diagram to the C10 would be great!!! Thank you for your valuable time. Richard

Similar Threads:

• Turck Proximity Sensors
• proximity sensors
• Inductive Proximity Sensors
• proximity sensors

[ssutton]

Hi Richard,
I could not find a datasheet for your sensors but;

1. They are NPN sensors which mean that they will supply a negative signal
when they are active (sensing material). They will be "Floating" when non-active.

2. I do not see any cables in your photo, if you do not have cables then you will need these or equivalent. CD12L-0B-020-A0 Products

3. Once you have your cables connected to the sensor then, Blue = ground or common, Brown = + volts DC, and black = the output to you port pin.

4. I do not have your input card but I looked at it on the net, connect the common pin on the card to your +volts dc source and then black wire from each prox sensor to each input.

-Scott

[wildwestpat]

The information you require is in the C10 handbook which you can download from the CNC4PC web site. In the version 8 BOB C10 info it is fig 7 on page 9. Just check that they are the same switches as on your packet label. I can not find them in the Turck catalogue but they are large OEM suppliers and do loads of specials.

Regards Pat

[Al_The_Man]

I have them listed in the Turk cat. I have.
The Uprox range have the ability to detect ferrous and non-ferrous metal, Much greater sensing distance and are also have a faster frequency response times than the regular prox.
If you need any other spec's I can look them up.
Al.

[hacker7]

Ok, first THANKS for your quick response. I do have 4 cables that match the sensors if I can get them to work I'll get more. Here's what I did, on the bag it say's 10-65vdc . I hooked up a 24vdc power supply to the brown,black went to pin 15 on the C10, and blue went to Grd on the C10 and the power supply. They have a small LED on the side, which light's up when I get close to with a piece of steel. But in MACH 3 it won't see the signal. I have mechanical home/limits now and they work fine,just was able to buy these turck's locally for $20.00 for all 8. Store was closing. Richard

[Al_The_Man]

You will need a BOB or interface that sources at least 10v, and depending on whether there is an internal pull-up, you may need a pull up resistor from output to supply +ve.
How are you interfacing to Mach?
Al.

[wildwestpat]

Good that the LED shows that the switch is working.

1. Check that the zero volts of the auxiliary 24 volt dc supply is connected to the C10 boards '0' volt terminal.

2. If you have a volt meter check that the output from the switch is pulled down when the meter is connected between the pus terminal of the 24 volt supply and the output wire. This will verify that the output transistor (npn type) is ok.

3. If checks 1&2 are ok then connect the output of the switch to the input of the C10 axis. Unfortunately the instruction in the C10 manual are a bit confusing.

The 24 volt supply negative is connected to the zero volts of the five volt supply powering the C10 BOB - connect at the C10 pins not the power source to avoid earth loops.

Since the diagram on the pack indicates the switch is open collector npn type the output needs a pull up resistor for each switch connected between the input of the C10 to the positive side of the 24 volt supply. The value suggested in the C10 manual is 25K ohms standard values are 2.4K or 2.7 K and either should be OK. The CNC4PC diagrams are shown for common connections for switches and for single switch applications. For the common switch i.e. a switch at each end of the table using a single C10 BOB input just connect the second switch to the input of the C10 with no extra resistor.

If the sensors have an internal pull up resistor the method for determining the value of the external resistor is given in diagram that follows below figure 6 but from the packet in your illustration these look to be open collector switches.

These switches which use the change in inductance due to the change in permittivity at the sensitive end are highly suited to limit and home switches and will when correctly set out perform the simple micro-switch. The only down side is the upper temperature limit typically 60 degrees C and the need for a power supply.

Regards - Pat

[hacker7]

Ok here's what happened. I hooked it up per the info I had got from here, and I can get the homing to work somewhat. When home'd once or twice
in a row it will go to different spot's on the sensor. Like go to the front of the sensor then back off, then the next time I hit home it goes to the back of the sensor and then back's off. As far as limit's when I change it in Mach 3 for limit's, I jog to the sensor it stop's, then when I try to reset, to jog off of the sensor, "nothing" won't let me reset and move unless I move the sensor away from the target. I do have the auto limit override on. I've tried it both on and off and "nothing" same issues. Ok as far as limit's and homing on one switch ,"nothing" won't work at all.

The Blk wire is going to pin 15 which is pulled up on the C10 board via a jumper. Also when I put the RED multimeter probe on BLU and the BLK on the sensor out BLK I get -3.2vdc when the target is over the sensor.Anyway
I'm Lost. Thanks Again Richard

[restless1]

slow down the speed it goes to home and see how it works..
also you may need to add some debounce on the switches in the software..

[Al_The_Man]

Also when I put the RED multimeter probe on BLU and the BLK on the sensor out BLK I get -3.2vdc when the target is over the sensor.Anyway
I'm Lost. Thanks Again Richard

You get a -ve voltage because you have the meter leads crossed, not that it matters much.
The 3.2v you are measuring is the voltage across the transistor when it is turned on, I would have expected somewhat lower than that.
But it appears to be switching OK.
Al.

[wildwestpat]

Take this one step at a time. What do you mean by front and back of the sensor? Is that 3.2 volts measured with the BOB C10 connected - and what is the voltage when the switch is in the other state? Is your multimeter a moving coil or a digital electronic one? Need these simple questions answered as you are getting very near to having the switch set properly.

(I suspect the 3.2 volts is with the switch turned off i.e. is due to the current via the pull up resistor through the resistors in the BOB and the light emitting diode in the opto isolator to the zero volt point on the BOB C10 - if this is what is happening switch ing to the other state should pull that voltage down to around 0.8 volts (NPN hard on) which is not enough to light the opto coupler's LED. If you answer the questions we will all know if this is what you are describing.)

I ask this as the sensor threaded part should be capable of being screwed in and out in the direction of the axis.

It sounds to me as if you are expecting the sensing to be as movement across the face of the sensor.

These sensors have a tuned circuit which excites the area in front of the plastic window. Bringing a bit of metal steel - iron - brass or alli near the window alters the frequency and it is the alteration in frequency that is detected. The switch action is by bringing the sensing surface up to the window and parallel to the window face for maximum sensitivity. The reason for the long screw thread on the body is to alow the operating point to be finely adjusted.

The leads should be screened and earthed at the C10 BOB and the 24 volt supply negative should also be connected to this point and no other.

Hope this helps - Regards - Pat

PS Test the switch by bringing a dime (or any other coin) up to the front face to trigger the switch - then slowly take the dime away from the end window in the direction in which you would screw the threaded body in and out. The detection sensitivity will differ for different types of metal but should be consistent and sharp in its action. Mach3 auto reverses (backs off) to compensate for inertia so the dead space on these switches should have no effect on the eventual precision achieved.

I have the setting up instructions for a similar range of switches if you need to see the typical sort of performance you can expect. Ask and I will scan it in as every switch I have purchased came with a paper copy of the instructions which do not appear in that manufacturer's catalogue.

[Al_The_Man]

Hacker mentions 3.2v when the sensor is covered, I would take this as the volt drop across the transistor when on.
The spec shows that the expected volt drop across the emitter/collector to be 1.8v @ 200ma, the BOB pull up is most likely not low enough to pass this current, which could be accounting for the higher voltage.
The other spec for this sensor is the '8' represents 8mm max. distance when a minimum target of 24mmx24mm is used approaching axially.
Most 3 wire prox. do not use the O.C. transistor to light the LED, the LED usually will indicate even if the output is not connected.
This may shed a bit more light on the subject.
Al.

,

[hacker7]

Ok I'm with you wildwestpat one step at a time. let's start as using them for limit switch'es. The meter I'm using is a digital multimeter. The 3.2 volt's I get is with the C10 BOB on,with the RED multimeter probe on the blue side of the sensor and BLACK multimeter probe on the black wire from the sensor.
I've tried moving the jumper to pulldown as stated in the rev.10 manual on cnc4pc website,if I do that it does'nt even see the signal at all. Now I read somewhere in the zone to put a 1K 1/2watt resistor between the 12Vdc power and the blk output wire of the sensor. I'll head to the radio shack in the morning and try it . The problem I actually have with them being limit's is I can't do a reset and jog off the sensor. This screen pop's up that say's reset error. Now if I move the sensor it will reset. Thanks again Richard

[wildwestpat]

Hi I have removed this posting as I got the part number wrong - should have put on my reading glasses.


Regards - Pat

[Al_The_Man]

I don't see the 8U-M12-AN4X in the link list?
The hard copy of the Turk catalogue I have shows the exact same number as the one shown in post #1.
And describes it as Uprox N.O. NPN 3 wire, there is no bridge shown in my cat.?
It could be a discontinued model.
Al.

[wildwestpat]

Hi Al

Thanks for pointing out that I had got the part number wrong. I have removed the post as it could be misleading.

The problem I am having difficulty with is that 3.3 volts across the switch when it is supposed to be switched low. All the open collector types I have used have produced a voltage drop of less than one volt and go virtually open circuit when in the other state.

The C10 BOB has pull up / pull down resistors selectable with a link to be one or the other and is looking to receive voltage levels of 5 volts or less than 1.2 volts for the open / closed conditions respectively. There is a method of determining the resistor values to achieve these voltages given in the manual which if followed should make any open collector NPN switch work reliably.

The connections with Brown to the axillary supply (+24 volts) - Black to the C10 BOB input and Blue to the '0' volt pin of the BOB and the negative of the auxiliary 24 volt supply. a further pull up resistor is required from the Black wire to the positive of the auxiliary 24 volt supply as the voltage is too high for the C10 BOB input. A method of determining the value of that resistor is also given IF the sensor is not open collector.

What I have been trying to establish is what are the two voltages representing switch 'on' and switch 'off' as unless these are a nominal 1 volt and 5 volts then either the values of the resistors is wrong (follow the instructions given by CNC4PC in the manual) or the switch is duff. There is a third possibility and that is that the switch is a special and is not open collector but has a protective resistor to limit the output current or a diode resistor snubber. It was at this point I tried to find the data on the internet and got the wrong switch.

Thanks for the correction Al.

Hacker 7 connections should be + side of the 24 volts to the switch Brown and via a 24K resistor to the input pin on the C10 BOB where it joins the Black wire from the switch the Blue wire and the negative of the 24 volt supply go to the C10 BOB input zero adjacent to the input pin. As far as I can see the pull down link is set to pull down. This reduces the off voltage as well as the on and you should check these two voltages which on the C10's I have used are a little less than one volt and 5 volts. IMO the 3.2 volts you have measured is almost in the could be either zone which if you have any noise on these lines would cause Mach3 to react. But one switch wired as described with no other connections to the 24 volts should be OK otherwise try 1000pF capacitor with short leads across the input pins.

Regards - Pat

[Al_The_Man]

I can scan the couple of pages in, the wiring diagram of the switch shows simple N.O. switching from output (blk) to common (Blu).
I have never liked the idea of two source voltage pull ups to the same collector.
As I mentioned earlier, the volt drop across sensor when conducting the max 200ma is = or< 1.8v.
IMO the best way to find out what is going on is to set up a simple test at 24vdc with selected load/pull/ups before connecting to the BOB.
Al.

[Al_The_Man]

PDF attached.
Maybe the short circuit protection may have an influence on what voltage drop will be seen?
Al.

[wildwestpat]

Now it is beginning to make sense! The hard on voltage of the switch could be as high as 1.8 volts. The specification for the C10 BOB by CNV4PC is less than 0.8 volt. That means the BOB is in the indeterminate zone where the out put could be a logic zero or one or dancing between them. No wonder Mach3 says error!

This requires adjustment to get the logic zero to less than 0.8 volt. With the input selector set to pull down to zero volts the input resistance the input resistance will be 4.7K in parallel with the buffers input resistance which is unknown. Adding a 5.1K resistor in the black lead from the sensor switch will reduce the input to well below the required 0.8 volt. Now looking at the switch turned off the input needs to be 4 volts and adding a resistor between the blue wire and the brown of 20K will achieve this. This condition is given in the C10 BOB manual as being 25k TOTAL for the series input resistor summed with the pull up for the sensor.

Thus the required connections for a 24 volt auxiliary supply are - black to brown 20K 1/8 watt resistor - Black to C10 input 5.1k 1/8 watt - AND - set C10 to pull these inputs low.

Keep wires well screened with the resistors mounted close to the C10 input pins. Make sure the auxiliary power supply (- ve) is only earthed via the C10 zero volts terminal for the inputs being used. Use 1Kpf disc ceramic capacitors directly across the inputs to the C10 if there is interference which is highly unlikely with this sort of switch assuming the lead and connector are good.

Hope this helps get these switches up and running reliably. Regards - Pat

PS This is now fail safe in that if the sensor is unplugged the C10 sees logic zero the hit end stop condition and the machine will stop or fail to start. If this is not what you require say so and I will work out the required interface.

[hacker7]

Well since I couldn't sleep worth a crap last night, at 3:00am I was back in the Shop scratching my head. Cause I've read all over the place that these kind of switches work with the C10 board. I'm no electronic's guru, just know enough to get in trouble. Well I believe your right about the dancing thing cause when I checked the diagnostics page in Mach 3 the limit I had set to work that sensor was going off/on at a steady pace so was the light to the pin on the parllel port . I tried the other resistor I had talked about before it did not work either. Anyway I will try what you had said and get back to you.
I just hope to be able to do a "Reset" and be able to jog off the sensor. Oh and by the way I thought it might be default sensors. So I went back and bought what they had left, only this time I got 10 for $10.00 model#Bi1-EG05-AP6x.they are alot smaller. Anyway I can't THANK YOU guy's enough
for the help. I'll let you know A.S.A.P. Richard

PS The guy told me the first sensors I bought were old stock.