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    Default Router repair questions...

    Hi Everyone,

    I've got a microcarve MV3 that I use for small stuff and I've been using a cheap HF trim router on it. It has been working very well for a couple of years, but today I went to cut an oak tray and it seemed to be struggling more than expected. The RPM's were bogging down from 29K down to 27/26K sometimes which seemed a bit lower than normal. I was luckily that I could finish the piece, but it was pretty warm at the end and I saw little bit of smoke come out from the vents on it. Could it be just a bit old and its lube dried up? I don't usually use it at 29K, but rather 8K to cut plastics most of the time. Any tips on what I can do to repair it? Add lube or something? I know it is cheap and weak and maybe it is at the end of its life, but I figured why not try to fix it if there is a chance/idea.

    Thanks,

    Alan

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    Default Re: Router repair questions...

    The brushes may be worn out?
    But at $30 for a new one, I'd just replace it.

    Gerry

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    Default Re: Router repair questions...

    I pulled the brushes - they have plenty of life left. I've modified this one to work with a superPID - which is one reason I'd like to repair it if it can be done.



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    Default Re: Router repair questions...

    I've burnt out a couple routers. I found that particles got ingested inside the router through the cooling holes. They particularly don't like when you cut aluminum.

    Sounds like you got a couple of years out of yours. That's pretty good. The cost to try and fix it may be more than a new one. Perhaps it's time for an upgrade. They wear out. Just like angle grinders. The average home owner who buys one of those wouldn't run it for hours at a time on a CNC.

    My guess is that it's done. If the brushes were worn down perhaps you could replace them, but the burning smell, I don't know. Take it apart and have a look at the brushes. They should be spring loaded. No idea where you could get replacement brushes from.

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    Default Re: Router repair questions...

    It actually came with replacement brushes, which I've never used. I was thinking of reducing the depth of cut to make it easier on it, but I used gwizard to figure out the speed and rate with the lowly 1/4 HP. It has cut about 6 or 7 of these before without seeming this bogged down so maybe it is just at the end of its life.



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    Default Re: Router repair questions...

    Quote Originally Posted by alank2 View Post
    I pulled the brushes - they have plenty of life left. I've modified this one to work with a superPID - which is one reason I'd like to repair it if it can be done.
    That may be so but if the unit has intact burned up, you really should buy a new one. That being said if the router still starts up you might get a bit more life out of it.

    Things to look for:

    1. an excessively dull bit can significantly load the router down. This will lead to over heating if you run at the same rates as previous runs.
    2. harder than normal wood can impact the required power. This is especially a problem with trim routers as it is far easier to fully load the router.
    3. ball bearing gone south. I'm not even sure this model has replaceable bearings but the reality here is that HF stuff is so cheap it doesn't pay to buy bearings, especially if the router has already smoked the windings.
    4. running such a router at low speeds impacts cooling, this can lead to premature heat damage in the windings. As above damaged windings simply aren't worth repairing when the replacement can be had for $24 on sale.

    In any event was others have mentioned you got 2 years out of possibly the cheapest router out there, you should be happy. Your choice now is to buy an exact replacement or go with something a bit more powerful. It does sound like you could use a more powerful spindle.



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    Default Re: Router repair questions...

    Quote Originally Posted by alank2 View Post
    It actually came with replacement brushes, which I've never used. I was thinking of reducing the depth of cut to make it easier on it, but I used gwizard to figure out the speed and rate with the lowly 1/4 HP. It has cut about 6 or 7 of these before without seeming this bogged down so maybe it is just at the end of its life.

    One of the problems with running a CNC is to understand when you are overloading a motor. It is actually hard to tell unless you have some good feedback on RPM and current draw. It isn't at all like manual usage of a machine where you get instant feed back on overloads. You say you have a speed controller but it might pay to put an ammeter in circuit to have another parameter to judge spindle loading by.

    Also back to your original post, you ask: "why not fix it knowing that it is cheap and weak"? The best reason I can give is that it is time to move forward. You are obviously getting value out of the machine by using it. Even a most improvement would let you get even more value out of the machine. Note I'm still talking a trim or midi router here, just something that isn't total bargain basement. If nothing else a new spindle will help you find the next weak spot in the machine.



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    Default Re: Router repair questions...

    This is a stupid question probably, but how can I tell if the bit is worn down? See if it has a dull edge vs. a sharp one?



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    Default Re: Router repair questions...

    Drag the cutting edge across the back of your fingernail. A sharp bit should scrape the nail. A dull bit will just slide across.

    Since you spent $170 on a speed control for a $30 router, I'd suggest buying a higher quality trimmer, and putting the SuperPID on that. Something like this:
    https://www.amazon.com/Makita-3709-4.../dp/B001JEOW7S

    Gerry

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    Default Re: Router repair questions...

    Router repair questions...-img_0491-jpg
    Router repair questions...-img_0489-jpg



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    Default Re: Router repair questions...

    That bit is garbage, replace it.
    You can't actually see the cutting edge on a sharp bit, because it's infinitely small. You're is rounded over, leaving a shiny, smooth cutting edge.
    You might also want to try spiral bits, which cut with less force.

    Gerry

    UCCNC 2017 Screenset
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    Mach3 2010 Screenset
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    JointCAM - CNC Dovetails & Box Joints
    [URL]http://www.g-forcecnc.com/jointcam.html[/URL]

    (Note: The opinions expressed in this post are my own and are not necessarily those of CNCzone and its management)


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    Default Re: Router repair questions...

    Thanks Gerry - have you or others used that Makita - is it known to work with the superpid or a speed control?



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    Default Re: Router repair questions...

    Haven't used it in a CNC application, but I have used one for hand routing.

    Gerry

    UCCNC 2017 Screenset
    [URL]http://www.thecncwoodworker.com/2017.html[/URL]

    Mach3 2010 Screenset
    [URL]http://www.thecncwoodworker.com/2010.html[/URL]

    JointCAM - CNC Dovetails & Box Joints
    [URL]http://www.g-forcecnc.com/jointcam.html[/URL]

    (Note: The opinions expressed in this post are my own and are not necessarily those of CNCzone and its management)


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    Default Re: Router repair questions...

    Do you have a variac or speed control - would you be able to test it to see if its speed goes up/down...



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    Default Re: Router repair questions...

    Quote Originally Posted by alank2 View Post
    Router repair questions...-img_0491-jpg
    Router repair questions...-img_0489-jpg
    That bit is most certainly worn out. A such it could have slowly driven your router into an overload condition (as the cutting edge wore down) eventually drawing so much current that the motor started to smoke. I'm actually surprised that you got any cutting action out of that bit, there had to be some plowing going on.

    The only really questions is how far gone is the router right now. If the windings didn't short you may get some life out of it yet just understand its days are numbered.

    As for the router bit it isn't impossible to sharpen them or dress up the cutting edge if they aren't to far gone. The straight cutting edges means you can use small diamond honing tools to bring the edge back to sharpness. In the case of this specific bit it might be too late unless you spend a lot of time on it. It is not that hard to get yourself out of a bind with hand sharpening, I've even done so on end mills at work to finish a project in aluminum. It isn't a replacement for sharpening on a machine but if you aren't so blessed or the local sharpening services charge too much it can help extend life a bit. A lot of people won't bother just as the won't sharpen drill bits, I just find it to be a challenge.



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    Default Re: Router repair questions...

    I found another bit that looks considerably better. I'm not sure if it is a quality one or not, I'm not sure its origin, but it looks new and sharp. I'm going to try to power up the router in a little bit here and see how it does unloaded at various speeds... we'll see how it does...



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    Default Re: Router repair questions...

    As luck would have it I had another HF router sitting in a drawer that wasn't used much. The good thing is that I was able to transplant the top of the bad one which I custom cut for the superpid sensor to read the RPM off of the top of the shaft. Painted half of it white so I'll hopefully be back to cutting soon with it. If/when this one dies I'll get something nicer finally.



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