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    Default Re: 30"+ work space low cost diy CNC router parts kits?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goemon View Post
    I had had a look at that MadVac site. That guy has a large budget for a diy build. You could probably buy what he made ready to play for $16,000 these days but I have to say, what he built looks amazing. He has every right to be proud of what he made and show off a little.
    A lot of his budget was due to the size, the HiWin precision ground ballscrews (including precision, matched angular contact bearings) and profile rail, and a then top-of-the-line FlashCutCNC. You probably couldn't get the ballscrews and bearings and rails and electronics for $16000 new today (and he bought them new then.) The point is, look how he leveled and flattened the bearing areas for the linear rails. Using self-leveling epoxy, and finishing off by hand, measuring with piano wire. You don't need a metalworking shop to do what he did (he builds wooden kayak kits) is the point I was after. And he did this over 15 years ago, when information was not like the way it is today.



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    Default Re: 30"+ work space low cost diy CNC router parts kits?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goemon View Post
    I pulled my first carbon fiber plate out the mold (the optical mirrors) and I am satisfied that they will be rigid enough for the gantry side plate. I can stand on them with the edges held up by two chairs without any visible bending. They will be a lot strong than many of those over-priced aluminum gantry plates people sell on eBay for $200.

    I don't want to offend anyone who makes and sells those things (ok maybe I do a little.... I can't help it) but when I look at what you get for $200, I can't help thinking "is that it?" and "are you serious?" and "is everyone else just seeing two small thin aluminum plates with some red paint?".

    Take a $10 aluminum plate, change the name to "CNC aluminum plate" and now it's worth $200. Good scam. No.... wait a sec... you have to cut off one of the corners first, then you can increase the price 20x...
    It may help to know that waterjet services charge by the inch, so regardless of the cost of the aluminum, the machining is a bargain. Most of these plates (they're actually full sets for the entire frame) are for OpenBuilds OX routers, which are inexpensive, light duty routers. Even at 1/4" it's likely fine for what it is. And most kits are under $200. For someone with no access to cut the somewhat complicated parts, and wants to get their machine built and running, instead of theorizing on material strength, it's a good way to go. Ever price out a waterjet? The whole point of the open-source design is to make the technology accessible. I also wouldn't tell them to tool up with optically flat mirrors, gallons of resin, and bolts of CF fabric, when clearly, the goal of people buying those waterjet aluminum parts is not to make aluminum molds. You have the luxury of having the ability to create such technical material. Don't knock on others who don't. Consider how much you'd have to charge to create the same kits out of CF, in the same thickness and shape. You'd have about $10 in materials, and about $450 in labor...



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    Default Re: 30"+ work space low cost diy CNC router parts kits?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goemon View Post
    I have a lot of epoxy bar top here so I can make anything level. Whatever I use, it's going to have to be fairly flat to start with or the epoxy bar top will become a point of weakness (if too much has to be used).
    To deal with the limited compression capacity of epoxy guys have laminated cold rolled steel on top of the leveled epoxy. This effectively spreads out the load of the linear rails upon the epoxy.
    The tube I have here are round. with solid bar clamps, they could probably be made into a fairly strong and rigid frame that is quick to construct. It would be ugly though.
    When talking about gantry beams we generally want to think in terms of box beams. Often square box sections are used and the size is somewhat variable depending upon what you want to accomplish. A 6" square beam is a good start for most machine builds.
    I pulled my first carbon fiber plate out the mold (the optical mirrors) and I am satisfied that they will be rigid enough for the gantry side plate. I can stand on them with the edges held up by two chairs without any visible bending. They will be a lot strong than many of those over-priced aluminum gantry plates people sell on eBay for $200.
    pictures pictures pictures.

    Seriously many of us are interested in your progress here. However I'm not sure how you determined that there was no visible bending or for that matter bending you didn't see.
    I don't want to offend anyone who makes and sells those things (ok maybe I do a little.... I can't help it) but when I look at what you get for $200, I can't help thinking "is that it?" and "are you serious?" and "is everyone else just seeing two small thin aluminum plates with some red paint?".
    Generally you don't want to use plates anyway in your structure accept possibly for gussets. I do have to agree though many of the DIY builds with aluminum plates use plates that are way too thin. The issues here is the same for the gantry beam, a box section is the most economical way to a stiff structure.
    Take a $10 aluminum plate, change the name to "CNC aluminum plate" and now it's worth $200. Good scam. No.... wait a sec... you have to cut off one of the corners first, then you can increase the price 20x...
    Actually that is the reality of trying to run a business. It is also why DIY router builds still make sense, the volumes aren't there to justify mass production. When you do low volume parts, often cut one at a time on a CNC machine the costs go up considerably. It isn't a scam and the reality is many of the businesses supplying to this niche are struggling. That $10 worth of aluminum could easily end upcasting the company $150 in labor not to mention machine time. That is if the shop rate is a measly $75 an hour. It goes like this, someone has to take the order or process it, it then has to be scheduled, then the CNC must be setup and the job ran, after that any finishing (probably none) and packaging has to be done and finally someone has to charge your account for the work done. This can easily cost a small company at least two hours of employee time. Frankly this isn't any different than going to a plasma cutting service to have something burned out of sheet material, the material is relatively cheap compared to the time to run the job.

    To put it another way CNC routers aren't mass produced like table saws and drill presses. This is why this forum is so active because a DIY build is cost effective and can work very well. By the way the cost effective nature of a DIY build could change in the future if one of the machine tool peddlers started to move CNC routers in volume. Right now demand isn't there. Understand here that I'm not trying to make excuses, I'm just pointing out the reality of manufacturing parts for extremely low volume products.



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    Default Re: 30"+ work space low cost diy CNC router parts kits?

    Whatever I use, it's going to have to be fairly flat to start with or the epoxy bar top will become a point of weakness (if too much has to be used).
    There's a UK forum where everyone builds this way, and I've never heard of a problem. I wouldn't use table top epoxy, though. Most use West System or similar. As long as you let it cure, it's not an issue. I think most use about 3/16-1/4" of thickness.

    Gerry

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    Default Re: 30"+ work space low cost diy CNC router parts kits?

    Quote Originally Posted by ger21 View Post
    There's a UK forum where everyone builds this way, and I've never heard of a problem. I wouldn't use table top epoxy, though. Most use West System or similar. As long as you let it cure, it's not an issue. I think most use about 3/16-1/4" of thickness.
    There is a company that sells an epoxy for work floor leveling, used by race car shops, that I cannot remember the name off the top of my head. I believe a couple people have used it for CNC applications...



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    Default Re: 30"+ work space low cost diy CNC router parts kits?

    Quote Originally Posted by ger21 View Post
    There's a UK forum where everyone builds this way, and I've never heard of a problem. I wouldn't use table top epoxy, though. Most use West System or similar. As long as you let it cure, it's not an issue. I think most use about 3/16-1/4" of thickness.
    There is nothing special about West sytem's resins. I have a bunch of them on my shelf along with tons of others. The important part with leveling resins is the viscosity. If they are too thick they won't level evenly and they become difficult to avoid trapped air bubbles. Bar top epoxy is designed for the purpose. Another type that would work well is infusion resin - the type used carbon fiber infusion processes. It also has particularly low viscosity so it can flow evenly.

    Whatever resin is used, it won't have the strength of steel for holding screw threads. I am going to want most of the screw thread embedded in the metal. I'm going to want as little resin as possible if I go that route.



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    Default Re: 30"+ work space low cost diy CNC router parts kits?

    Quote Originally Posted by wizard View Post
    To deal with the limited compression capacity of epoxy guys have laminated cold rolled steel on top of the leveled epoxy. This effectively spreads out the load of the linear rails upon the epoxy.

    When talking about gantry beams we generally want to think in terms of box beams. Often square box sections are used and the size is somewhat variable depending upon what you want to accomplish. A 6" square beam is a good start for most machine builds.

    pictures pictures pictures.

    Seriously many of us are interested in your progress here. However I'm not sure how you determined that there was no visible bending or for that matter bending you didn't see.


    Generally you don't want to use plates anyway in your structure accept possibly for gussets. I do have to agree though many of the DIY builds with aluminum plates use plates that are way too thin. The issues here is the same for the gantry beam, a box section is the most economical way to a stiff structure.


    Actually that is the reality of trying to run a business. It is also why DIY router builds still make sense, the volumes aren't there to justify mass production. When you do low volume parts, often cut one at a time on a CNC machine the costs go up considerably. It isn't a scam and the reality is many of the businesses supplying to this niche are struggling. That $10 worth of aluminum could easily end upcasting the company $150 in labor not to mention machine time. That is if the shop rate is a measly $75 an hour. It goes like this, someone has to take the order or process it, it then has to be scheduled, then the CNC must be setup and the job ran, after that any finishing (probably none) and packaging has to be done and finally someone has to charge your account for the work done. This can easily cost a small company at least two hours of employee time. Frankly this isn't any different than going to a plasma cutting service to have something burned out of sheet material, the material is relatively cheap compared to the time to run the job.

    To put it another way CNC routers aren't mass produced like table saws and drill presses. This is why this forum is so active because a DIY build is cost effective and can work very well. By the way the cost effective nature of a DIY build could change in the future if one of the machine tool peddlers started to move CNC routers in volume. Right now demand isn't there. Understand here that I'm not trying to make excuses, I'm just pointing out the reality of manufacturing parts for extremely low volume products.

    Visible bending is the bending I can see. That part is easy to determine. If you can see bending, there is visible bending. If you can't, there isn't. I have done nothing to determine if there is any bending that is not visible to the naked eye. As others have said, every material will have some flex. My point is that there would be visible bending if I stood on some of those thin aluminum plates bridged between two chairs and that I think these cf plates will be rigid enough.



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    Default Re: 30"+ work space low cost diy CNC router parts kits?

    Just in case it help anyone else, here is my list of what I have bought so far:

    THK rails with 4 bearing blocks on each 1000mm x 600mm x 310mm used (from ebay) $315

    4 x 1/2" two-start lead screws with associated mounts, couplings, blocks $140 (eBay)

    4x Nema 23 motor mount $60 (eBay)

    4x Nema 23 381oz low inductance motors $160 (automation technologies)

    1x Gecko g540 $265 (automation technologies)

    1 x 48v 12.5a power supply $55 (eyeboot)

    4 x ready made db9 shielded motor cables $48 (automation technologies)

    Various extrusions, screws, joining plates / connectors $100 (Open Builds)

    Temporary router mount for Ridgid 2hp router $12 (2 x 3 5/8" steel pipe mounts off eBay)

    Carbon fiber and resin for gantry plates $50

    1 x Gecko g540 cooling system (tbd)

    Total so far $1205



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    Quote Originally Posted by Goemon View Post
    Just in case it help anyone else, here is my list of what I have bought so far:

    THK rails with 4 bearing blocks on each 1000mm x 600mm x 310mm used (from ebay) $315

    4 x 1/2" two-start lead screws with associated mounts, couplings, blocks $140 (eBay)

    4x Nema 23 motor mount $60 (eBay)

    4x Nema 23 381oz low inductance motors $160 (automation technologies)

    1x Gecko g540 $265 (automation technologies)

    1 x 48v 12.5a power supply $55 (eyeboot)

    4 x ready made db9 shielded motor cables $48 (automation technologies)

    Various extrusions, screws, joining plates / connectors $100 (Open Builds)

    Temporary router mount for Ridgid 2hp router $12 (2 x 3 5/8" steel pipe mounts off eBay)

    Carbon fiber and resin for gantry plates $50

    1 x Gecko g540 cooling system (tbd)

    Total so far $1205
    looks good so far



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    Default Re: 30"+ work space low cost diy CNC router parts kits?

    Just to update on the cost of steel, my last trip to Klein Steel Direct had me paying at the rate of $65 per hundred pounds. That was actually cheaper than previous trips. In this case i paid 49.50 for a 4x6 beam, plus about 10 pounds of plate, that woild have been suitable for a gantry on a small machine. The cost vary with the market but it is really hard to beat that price considering the strength you are getting. In fact if you bought a 4x8 sheet of plywood you would be paying more and would need to put a lot of work into fabricating a gantry beam that even came close to the stiffness of a steel beam.

    Now Klein Steel Direct is an operation of Klein Steel that is focused on moving drops and surpluses (a few processing booboos too) from Klein Steels mainstream operations. This means that a suitsble bit of material isnt always on hand, you do have to be flexible and willing to visit frequently to score the ideal steel for your project.

    In any event any steel supplier moving lits of steel will have drops piling up like dead flies caught between window panes. Such steel pretty much has to be sold at discount to move quickly. Other wise it turns into a complete loss and gets recycled.

    Now the question is do you live in an area where there is a major steel supplier working in bolumes that generate enough drops to justify selling yhose drops retail like this. I dont know obviously as im not sure of your location. A sizable near by city though willl have a steel supplier to industry.



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    Default Re: 30"+ work space low cost diy CNC router parts kits?

    Quote Originally Posted by wizard View Post
    Just to update on the cost of steel, my last trip to Klein Steel Direct had me paying at the rate of $65 per hundred pounds. That was actually cheaper than previous trips. In this case i paid 49.50 for a 4x6 beam, plus about 10 pounds of plate, that woild have been suitable for a gantry on a small machine. The cost vary with the market but it is really hard to beat that price considering the strength you are getting. In fact if you bought a 4x8 sheet of plywood you would be paying more and would need to put a lot of work into fabricating a gantry beam that even came close to the stiffness of a steel beam.

    Now Klein Steel Direct is an operation of Klein Steel that is focused on moving drops and surpluses (a few processing booboos too) from Klein Steels mainstream operations. This means that a suitsble bit of material isnt always on hand, you do have to be flexible and willing to visit frequently to score the ideal steel for your project.

    In any event any steel supplier moving lits of steel will have drops piling up like dead flies caught between window panes. Such steel pretty much has to be sold at discount to move quickly. Other wise it turns into a complete loss and gets recycled.

    Now the question is do you live in an area where there is a major steel supplier working in bolumes that generate enough drops to justify selling yhose drops retail like this. I dont know obviously as im not sure of your location. A sizable near by city though willl have a steel supplier to industry.
    I live in Westchester NY. I don't know of any stores near where I live that sell low cost steel but that doesn't mean there aren't any. I had a look for scrap metal suppliers a few days ago and from what I saw, it was all as you described I.e. They don't let you order what they have online. You have to go there in person to see what they have on the day.

    All of the NY based regular metal dealers I found were all super expensive - far more than everywhere else. I guess I don't live in the best place for bargains on steel...

    I ran into another problem last night. All of the parts I ordered from the OpenBuilds part store are garbage. I thought I would be ok with their L brackets and corner connectors etc but the quality is among the worst I have ever seen on any product in the history of the world.

    I can literally bend their L brackets with my fingers. There is no way I can use any of their stuff. It's going in the trash where it belongs. I am happy I listened to the people here and didn't buy one of their kits.

    Where is a good place to buy small connecting parts like that if I want stuff that will keep my frame rigid? I have no welding ability so it has to something I can use to connect the frame components using screws.

    I am thinking of using some steel shelf brackets unless anyone has a better idea?



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    Default Re: 30"+ work space low cost diy CNC router parts kits?

    Look through the build logs and see what others have done. Without any ideas of what your machine will look like, it's hard to say.

    Gerry

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    Default Re: 30"+ work space low cost diy CNC router parts kits?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goemon View Post
    I live in Westchester NY. I don't know of any stores near where I live that sell low cost steel but that doesn't mean there aren't any. I had a look for scrap metal suppliers a few days ago and from what I saw, it was all as you described I.e. They don't let you order what they have online. You have to go there in person to see what they have on the day.

    All of the NY based regular metal dealers I found were all super expensive - far more than everywhere else. I guess I don't live in the best place for bargains on steel...

    I ran into another problem last night. All of the parts I ordered from the OpenBuilds part store are garbage. I thought I would be ok with their L brackets and corner connectors etc but the quality is among the worst I have ever seen on any product in the history of the world.

    I can literally bend their L brackets with my fingers. There is no way I can use any of their stuff. It's going in the trash where it belongs. I am happy I listened to the people here and didn't buy one of their kits.

    Where is a good place to buy small connecting parts like that if I want stuff that will keep my frame rigid? I have no welding ability so it has to something I can use to connect the frame components using screws.

    I am thinking of using some steel shelf brackets unless anyone has a better idea?
    I live in Westchester also! If you need some of the smaller parts machined I may be able to help.

    As far as steel or aluminum; there is a guy in Westchester I believe named Fred Eisner that advertises in some machining magazines; a quick Google search would produce his e-mail. Another source, if you're near Thornwood, is Ortiz Welders. I was able to buy some 6061 aluminum plate from them a while back. Another idea is to peruse the scrap metal yards in the area. They don't do e-commerce, but you'd be able to bargain with them if you have cash-in-hand.

    You can buy aluminum frame connectors from a place like Misumi (us.misumi-ec.com). They do have high rigidity versions of their connecting extrusions, as well as other automation components. OK, if you go to their site, you'll wish you had an AmEx Black card....Really, they have some pretty reasonably priced stuff for the quality. For corner brackets, the least expensive, most rigid way, I can think of is to buy steel or cast iron angle, that's ground square. Simple enough to drill and/or tap for use as corner brackets.

    From Shars: Angle Plate 2x2x2" $9 for a precision ground angle... Larger ones for slightly more. It would copst you a lot more than $9 to have an angle plate gorund, let alone the cost of the cast iron...

    A great source of metal pate is Shapiro Supply, in St. Louis, MO. They may have drop-offs in sizes you need, at a good price.



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    Default Re: 30"+ work space low cost diy CNC router parts kits?

    Quote Originally Posted by louieatienza View Post
    I live in Westchester also! If you need some of the smaller parts machined I may be able to help.

    As far as steel or aluminum; there is a guy in Westchester I believe named Fred Eisner that advertises in some machining magazines; a quick Google search would produce his e-mail. Another source, if you're near Thornwood, is Ortiz Welders. I was able to buy some 6061 aluminum plate from them a while back. Another idea is to peruse the scrap metal yards in the area. They don't do e-commerce, but you'd be able to bargain with them if you have cash-in-hand.

    You can buy aluminum frame connectors from a place like Misumi (us.misumi-ec.com). They do have high rigidity versions of their connecting extrusions, as well as other automation components. OK, if you go to their site, you'll wish you had an AmEx Black card....Really, they have some pretty reasonably priced stuff for the quality. For corner brackets, the least expensive, most rigid way, I can think of is to buy steel or cast iron angle, that's ground square. Simple enough to drill and/or tap for use as corner brackets.

    From Shars: Angle Plate 2x2x2" $9 for a precision ground angle... Larger ones for slightly more. It would copst you a lot more than $9 to have an angle plate gorund, let alone the cost of the cast iron...

    A great source of metal pate is Shapiro Supply, in St. Louis, MO. They may have drop-offs in sizes you need, at a good price.
    Thanks for the tips. I'll check them out.

    I could use a break from trying to get answers from Automation Technologies. Dealing with them is so frustrating... whenever I ask a question about something they sell, their answer has nothing to do with what I asked. I can't stand it. I'm tempted to pay more to buy my components from somewhere else just to avoid dealing with them. They seem to know nothing about what they sell and speak very poor English. The experience is no different to ordering direct from China.



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    Default Re: 30"+ work space low cost diy CNC router parts kits?

    The experience is no different to ordering direct from China.
    Except it's cheaper to order direct.

    If you know what you want, they are great to deal with.

    Gerry

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    Quote Originally Posted by Goemon View Post
    Thanks for the tips. I'll check them out.

    I could use a break from trying to get answers from Automation Technologies. Dealing with them is so frustrating... whenever I ask a question about something they sell, their answer has nothing to do with what I asked. I can't stand it. I'm tempted to pay more to buy my components from somewhere else just to avoid dealing with them. They seem to know nothing about what they sell and speak very poor English. The experience is no different to ordering direct from China.
    The DIY CNC business is still a cottage industry. It's better to fund out what you can first, then purchase, as Gerry mentioned. That said, a lot of their drives look to be unbranded Leadshine drives. Which you can buy (branded) from a company like American Motion Tech for not much more (they have DM542E for under $40 and it's a great drive.)



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    Default Re: 30"+ work space low cost diy CNC router parts kits?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goemon View Post
    I live in Westchester NY.
    That sucks for a location but on the other hand there should be plenty of businesses in that area. I'm in the Rochester NY area, thus the mention above of the local steel supplier, one of several in fact.
    I don't know of any stores near where I live that sell low cost steel but that doesn't mean there aren't any.
    Google is your friend. A bunch showed up just searching for steel suppliers Westchester county. None of them advertised selling drops and surplus but it is hard to imagine a full service steel supplier not having drops. The key here is full service.
    I had a look for scrap metal suppliers a few days ago and from what I saw, it was all as you described I.e. They don't let you order what they have online. You have to go there in person to see what they have on the day.
    Yes getting out of the cellar is important.. Trying to sell such stuff on the web increases costs significantly. Getting a good deal on non prime stock means taking advantage of opportunities as they crop up.
    All of the NY based regular metal dealers I found were all super expensive - far more than everywhere else. I guess I don't live in the best place for bargains on steel...
    That could be an issue; there is a lot of corruption in the NYC area, living expenses are high and I would imagine dead is high. If a vendor is charging his prices for non prime stock then there is something wrong.
    I ran into another problem last night. All of the parts I ordered from the OpenBuilds part store are garbage. I thought I would be ok with their L brackets and corner connectors etc but the quality is among the worst I have ever seen on any product in the history of the world.
    I've never seen any of their hardware so frankly can't offer an opinion, but the web site screams stay away to me. How all of your components end up bolted together, welded together or whatever is very important in a machine build.
    I can literally bend their L brackets with my fingers. There is no way I can use any of their stuff. It's going in the trash where it belongs. I am happy I listened to the people here and didn't buy one of their kits.
    Well I'd have a hard time trashing something I paid for, but I understand the frustration.

    There are a number of vendors that supply to the tool & die and machine tool building industries but I have to warn you sometimes the prices seem high. Some examples off the top of my head:
    Misumi,
    Travers,
    MSC,
    Champion Die-Tool,
    PunchTools,
    anchor-danly,
    cnc-specialty-store,
    Southern Tool,
    Grainger,
    KBC Tools,
    Production Tool Supply,
    Harbor Freight (sometimes referred to as horrible freight),
    Wholesale Tool,
    Share Tool Company,
    Little Machine Shop,
    Victor Machinery,
    80/20,
    Carr Lane,
    https://www.boschrexroth.com/en/us/p...-framing/index,
    Faztek,
    T-Slots,
    alufabinc,
    Nifty Bar,
    Brunner Enterprises
    Where is a good place to buy small connecting parts like that if I want stuff that will keep my frame rigid? I have no welding ability so it has to something I can use to connect the frame components using screws.
    There are all sorts of options. For example you can buy 1-2-3 blocks ( and larger variants) pretty cheap the days as imports, mostly available from machinist supply houses. You can buy cast-iron angle plates also pretty cheap. The aluminum extrusion suppliers have all sorts of predrilled or punched connector plates, gusset plates angle and such. If you can pick up some angle iron drops and a good hack saw you can have fairly decent but not completely square 90 degree brackets.
    I am thinking of using some steel shelf brackets unless anyone has a better idea?
    Most of the shelf bracket I've see wouldn't cut it for machine tool usage.

    Some other ideas:

    If you have nothing against wood and have a router you can glue. up sheet stock (plywood) into rather robust 90 degree corner brackets. Here you use a factor edge as a pattern for the router to create one good corner on the laminated stock. While this is wood you can get a rather robust block if you laminate enough material, use a good glue and maybe a few screws. The idea here is to exploit the factory edge which is generally pretty square.

    Get a welding shop / fabrication shop to weld up what you need. Just make sure they have the machining capability to square up the bracket. Frankly this gets to be expensive but is a good solution for critical locations in your machine.

    Buy a good cut off saw or table saw and a high quality square and DIY the materials you need. The saw is an additional expense but might be justified if you need to do material prep once the router is built. Note that aluminum can easily be cut on wood working class machines. However doing steel on these machines is a much tougher nut to crack. Only you know what your long term needs are so this might not fit into your plans.

    Look for structural framing brackets. These can be for aluminum extrusions and in more general designs made of steel. Make sure they are robust with diagonal support. For example: Display Part P2484W. Unistrut or equivalent is available at electrical and plumbing supply houses. This is industrial quality stuff so the prices are a bit stiff compared to your run of the mill home center crap. Also 90 degrees might not be that precise however they are generally made with substantial materials and paired up might be suitable for your needs. Angle brackets of these types though are not the most robust solution used alone. The Aluminum extrusion brackets might actually be a better choice if they have the gusset and are suitably wide.

    At the moment I'm drawing a blank as to other off the shelf robust 90 degree connector methods. Maybe some other ideas are out there.



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    Default Re: 30"+ work space low cost diy CNC router parts kits?

    Quote Originally Posted by louieatienza View Post
    The DIY CNC business is still a cottage industry.
    This is key to realize. The volume isn't there for mass production so you need to borrow parts from other industries to have any hope of controlling costs. Otherwise you need to DIY the parts yourself.
    It's better to fund out what you can first, then purchase, as Gerry mentioned. That said, a lot of their drives look to be unbranded Leadshine drives. Which you can buy (branded) from a company like American Motion Tech for not much more (they have DM542E for under $40 and it's a great drive.)
    Thankfully motion control and the usage of such hardware is very wide spread which is what has made these machines affordable. The wide selection of such hardware though can be overwhelming for a DIY'er new to machine tools.



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    Default Re: 30"+ work space low cost diy CNC router parts kits?

    Quote Originally Posted by ger21 View Post
    Except it's cheaper to order direct.

    If you know what you want, they are great to deal with.

    Fair enough.

    My most direct comparison has been with CNCrouterparts.com and the experience in terms of the quality of interaction was night and day.

    The problem I have been having is that I can't tell is some products are what I want or not without asking a question. For example, "do your premade Gecko G540 motor cables include the resisters built in or do you still need to order the molds separately?". That simple "yes" or "no" question took 5 emails back and forth.

    CNCrouterparts.com is noticeably more expensive but I can see why some people would pay more for the same thing. You need patience for AutomationTechnologies.

    Still, if a person is going to take on a diy project like this, a little patience is essential. I'm just grateful that I have help from you guys.



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    Default Re: 30"+ work space low cost diy CNC router parts kits?

    Quote Originally Posted by wizard View Post
    That sucks for a location but on the other hand there should be plenty of businesses in that area. I'm in the Rochester NY area, thus the mention above of the local steel supplier, one of several in fact.

    Google is your friend. A bunch showed up just searching for steel suppliers Westchester county. None of them advertised selling drops and surplus but it is hard to imagine a full service steel supplier not having drops. The key here is full service.

    Yes getting out of the cellar is important.. Trying to sell such stuff on the web increases costs significantly. Getting a good deal on non prime stock means taking advantage of opportunities as they crop up.

    That could be an issue; there is a lot of corruption in the NYC area, living expenses are high and I would imagine dead is high. If a vendor is charging his prices for non prime stock then there is something wrong.

    I've never seen any of their hardware so frankly can't offer an opinion, but the web site screams stay away to me. How all of your components end up bolted together, welded together or whatever is very important in a machine build.

    Well I'd have a hard time trashing something I paid for, but I understand the frustration.

    There are a number of vendors that supply to the tool & die and machine tool building industries but I have to warn you sometimes the prices seem high. Some examples off the top of my head:
    Misumi,
    Travers,
    MSC,
    Champion Die-Tool,
    PunchTools,
    anchor-danly,
    cnc-specialty-store,
    Southern Tool,
    Grainger,
    KBC Tools,
    Production Tool Supply,
    Harbor Freight (sometimes referred to as horrible freight),
    Wholesale Tool,
    Share Tool Company,
    Little Machine Shop,
    Victor Machinery,
    80/20,
    Carr Lane,
    https://www.boschrexroth.com/en/us/p...-framing/index,
    Faztek,
    T-Slots,
    alufabinc,
    Nifty Bar,
    Brunner Enterprises

    There are all sorts of options. For example you can buy 1-2-3 blocks ( and larger variants) pretty cheap the days as imports, mostly available from machinist supply houses. You can buy cast-iron angle plates also pretty cheap. The aluminum extrusion suppliers have all sorts of predrilled or punched connector plates, gusset plates angle and such. If you can pick up some angle iron drops and a good hack saw you can have fairly decent but not completely square 90 degree brackets.


    Most of the shelf bracket I've see wouldn't cut it for machine tool usage.

    Some other ideas:

    If you have nothing against wood and have a router you can glue. up sheet stock (plywood) into rather robust 90 degree corner brackets. Here you use a factor edge as a pattern for the router to create one good corner on the laminated stock. While this is wood you can get a rather robust block if you laminate enough material, use a good glue and maybe a few screws. The idea here is to exploit the factory edge which is generally pretty square.

    Get a welding shop / fabrication shop to weld up what you need. Just make sure they have the machining capability to square up the bracket. Frankly this gets to be expensive but is a good solution for critical locations in your machine.

    Buy a good cut off saw or table saw and a high quality square and DIY the materials you need. The saw is an additional expense but might be justified if you need to do material prep once the router is built. Note that aluminum can easily be cut on wood working class machines. However doing steel on these machines is a much tougher nut to crack. Only you know what your long term needs are so this might not fit into your plans.

    Look for structural framing brackets. These can be for aluminum extrusions and in more general designs made of steel. Make sure they are robust with diagonal support. For example: Display Part P2484W. Unistrut or equivalent is available at electrical and plumbing supply houses. This is industrial quality stuff so the prices are a bit stiff compared to your run of the mill home center crap. Also 90 degrees might not be that precise however they are generally made with substantial materials and paired up might be suitable for your needs. Angle brackets of these types though are not the most robust solution used alone. The Aluminum extrusion brackets might actually be a better choice if they have the gusset and are suitably wide.

    At the moment I'm drawing a blank as to other off the shelf robust 90 degree connector methods. Maybe some other ideas are out there.

    You've given me some ideas to work with. You also reminded me that there is a bunch of contractors supply stores near where I live. I haven't been into any of them before because they are more for commercial use but now would be a good time to see if they have anything good for this purpose.

    I wish I had your instinct to stay away from the open builds store. Believe me, I also have a hard time trashing stuff I paid for but there is no way I can rely on their parts to keep my frame rigid. They can't even keep themselves rigid. I need L brackets with no visible flex. Their stuff bends like paper clips and that is not one word of exaggeration. They are quite literally and precisely that bad.

    The Open Builds stuff has overtaken my Betamax video player and Wild Wild West DVD as my worst purchase of all time and I have a solar power flashlight!



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30"+ work space low cost diy CNC router parts kits?

30"+ work space low cost diy CNC router parts kits?