Opinions: Software No longer supported

[Al_The_Man]

Some time ago I purchased a very usefull software package that consists of an AutoCad add on.
I recently went to the web site to check for upgrades and it's blank except for one sentence 'No Longer In Business'
No contact link or anything.
There is no dongle or registration number issued at the time of purchase.
I wonder what the legal ramifications are about distributing it to others?
There would be obviously no loss of sales by the original seller.
Food for thought.
Al.

[lakeside]

that a real issue about any software here today gone tomorrow or sorry we do not support the new iges format or well the salesman was wrong or you need to spend 2k more for that or that will be in the next upgrade and so on

[fyffe555]

I've been through this with commercial software in a different industry; Software is protected only by use licence by the rights holder and/or by formal copyright / trademark / patent ownership. The latter three have to be actively protected by the holder in any public contravention of the holders rights or the rights can be shown to be abandoned.

If the software is no longer for sale but the legal entity issuing the licence for use still exists then you cannot do anything with the SW other than what the licence permits for the duration of the licence. That is, if 'no longer in business' means the licence issuer and rights holder still exist, the legal trading entity, dba or corp is still registered but is simply no longer trading, or no longer trading just the SW, the SW licence still holds.

If the original rights owner has sold the rights to a third party and the original rights owner ceases business and no longer trades, the existing licence still stands for the duration of the licence. On expiry or change of use the licence needs to be renewed with the new rights holder. The new rights holder is responsible for informing the current licencees of the change.

If the entity issuing the licence is no longer trading AND the legal trading entity is also defunct and shown as such by the registering State, and reasonable efforts cannot locate or obtain a response from the licencer or copyright/patent holder or locate a new rights owner the the SW may be regarded as abandoned. If its abandoned after a 'reasonable' period of time it may be regarded as public domain, but there's no clear statement of what reasonable is nor what happens if the distribution by a third party after abandonment is made for the profit of the third party.

Abandoned or public domain SW can reasonably be distributed.

Don't think that helps much does it......

EDIT: should have added; Specific licence terms and conditions may make explicit provision in case of abandonment by the rights holder and prevent the licencee using it in any way after the licence term expires but its not usual. SW without 'reasonable' protection such as keys, dongles, compulsory user registration and activation may be considered less likely to be found to be abandoned. SW without any inbuilt protection other than a use licence can be found to be abandoned more readily.

Andrew

[fizzissist]

Canada probably has different laws than the US covering your question, but here there is also the 'first sale doctrine'. Depending on the "license", or EULA you agreed to by clicking the "I Agree" button under the license agreement that nobody ever reads, you may well be entitled to sell your software.

In almost any case, If you have made reasonable attempts to contact the license holder for permission and are unable, then it is reasonable to consider the license abandoned.

Modern software is 'perishable', so unlike other intellectual properties, it is incumbent upon the developer to maintain control of licensing to demonstrate their equitable interest in the product.

Here's a case to consider....You've purchased a $15,000 seat of ViagraCAM which is ideal for hard machining. A year later your dongle broke and the vendor has disappeared. The developer has disappeared. You've exhausted all reasonable means of contacting the license owner to make your dongle functional. What do you do?

Would you be breaking the law by contacting DonglesRus.com to get your program hacked and working?

Me? I'd do it in a heartbeat. Then when they sued me, I'd counter sue them for the cost of the crack, punitive damages for loss of income, and demand a new dongle.

Judge Judy would rule in my favor. I just know she would.

[sdantonio]

Actually I'll go you one better, though this touches on the borderland of legality.

In the US there is something called the digital copyright act which allows you to make a copy of any piece of software you own for backup purposes (in the event that the original gets damaged).

I once knew a guy who went into business under the following pretences (and remained in business for quite a few years). The idea is as follows:

pretense 1: Since you don't have a cd burner I will make a backup of your software for a small fee (usually $25 per disk).

pretense 2: What, you can't find your original disk to make a copy from? Never mind, I'll use my original disk to make a copy for you. Just as long as you really do own the software or promise to buy it shortly after trying it out.

Suprisingly there was only one company who gave him any trouble at all (who I won't name, but without then we would not be able to post our files in PDF format).

It is actually this model and logic that allows products like clondCD or easy DVD creator to stay in business.

[fizzissist]

I'm almost hoping that someday someone gives me you-know-what about my MP3 collection at work. I own every single piece of music...

Speaking of 'puters....

We had a problem of people stealing hard drives, and had a pretty good idea who the perpetrators were.

A simple rewire internally of the connector leads and "baiting" the problem location resulted in a big poof of smoke, some rather unscholarly language, and a resultant purchase of a new motherboard and new power supple.

Never had the problem again.

....Which reminds me of another story.....

[fizzissist]

I worked for a record company that did their own R&D. We built our own amps, crossovers, and microphones. Doug, the boss had (still has) a nasty habit of tinkering with projects in process when no one's around.

He'd come in way early, or after everyone had left and turn stuff on and diddle with the knobs and switches. He knew just enough to be dangerous.

So one night before going home, the head engineer wired a nice fat resistor across the 120VAC power terminals inside the amplifier, and put the cover back on.

Next morning when he came in, the lab smelled awful. Like burning resistors.
Doug never said a word, but he didn't touch anything for at least 3 months after that.

[NC Cams]

Copyrights are not a pretty picture when you have to get involved in the legal system with them. However, this much is clear:

IF the copyrights were properly registered, they remain the property of the registered intellectual property owner or his assignee for a long, LONG time.

Although you may obtain a liscense, you do NOT gain ownership of the copy righted material. It IS permissible to "hack" into software to check the compatibiity of the s/w with your computer system, firewall, etc BUT it is NOT permissable to do so for the purpose of reverse engineering the intellectual properties. see 17USC512.

Rather than take my or any other ramblings posted on a message board, I"d suggest that you do a google for Article 17 of the United States Code (USC) aka the "copyright law". We did and learned a lot. Why?

We're currently in federal court concerning a copyright issue and even our lawyer was amazed at what we came up with, strategy wise, after READING the copyright statute.

BTW 17USC512 protects the ISP and it does NOT grant a person copyright protection for an unregistered copyright.

Moreover, there is no provision in 17USC that we could find for "abandonment" of the rights as these are granted to the spouse and perhaps family (as I recall) as well at the time the copyright is granted. Protection lasts the lifetime PLUS for the copyright holder.

Granted, if you own them YOU have to protect them but once you create and REGISTER them with the copyright office, you have pretty firm legal ground to stand on.

You can choose to license, give copies, whatever, to whomever as you see fit. What you do for Joe you DON'T have to do for BILL. The rights are yours and you can do with them as you see fit as long as you live. Fairness is NOT part of the federal code.

Don't think for a minute that if you "have it, you own it".

You may have been granted a "unspecified term useage license" but that doesn't mean that you were granted "title" to the software, music, video image, whatever. Read the 17USC - it isn't that hard to understand/figure out.

The lobbyists who formed the law did a pretty good job of protecting the artists PROVIDING they follow the letter of the law and dot the I and cross the T.

Now, if the software was created and compiled and NOT registered/copyrighted, you get into the area of "trade secret" protection which is a whole different story.

If done properly, this is a MUCH more secure way of protecting the intellectual property from being copied/worked around. Reason: you DON'T have to do the "show n tell" registration with the copyright office.

Coke Cola syrup formulae isn't copyrighted BUT it is trade secreted. IT is fairly easy to figure out what's in it BUT it ain't easy to figure out the exact formulation and THAT'S the key - you need the words and the music to make some things work properly.

Regarding unregistered copies: you can make the copies as provided for in the license agreement BUT if it slips out, gets reinstalled, etc you can get into trouble. The local computer shop had a visit from the M/S legal staff and got nailed for unlicensed installations of software on the PC's they had. Recall the M/S lawyers are well paid by someone who has the fund$ to protect their intellectual properties.

Lots of people had misconceptions about the music they "shared" via the early Napster. Sadly, their perception of the law as it pertains to "sharing" cost some people DEARLY when the record companies came knocking.

Consequently, don't think for a minute that you "own" the music on your MP3. You're listening to it under a non-exclusive liscense granted by the owner of the copyright.

We learned that caveat early in our journey thru the trails and tribulations of our copyright licensing journey.