I love to build new things, but .....

[widgitmaster]

For many months now, I have been getting emails, eBay comments, and private messages here on CNCzone requesting larger and stronger routers! Now I don't have any problem with building them, but from the beginning I have tried to make the most precision and rigid unit while keeping the cost down. The Mini-Router and Midi-Routers are the final products of this endeavor.
After a little research and cost analysis, I have concluded that a precision, CNC router with an X-Axis travel of 24.685", Y-Axis travel of 24.685", Z-Axis travel of 10.512", along with Preloaded Ball Screws would have an initial cost of over $2800 just for the THK Linear rails and the NOOK ball screws & nuts. The raw aluminum material needed to support all the linear rails, would cost and additional $550.
So that now totals $3350 for materials alone! Now add all the labor needed to manufacture all the aluminum parts, machine the ends of the hardened ball screws, and another $50 for screws & dowel pins.
I would hate to invest all that money and time to build one unit that would need to sell for close to $5000, and have no one in this current economy that can afford it!
Building a machine of this size using the THK rails, could also be made from Low Carbon steel with a zinc plating, and have a slightly lower material cost, but steel is much harder to work with, and consumes more cutters!

What is your opinion on such an expensive CNC Router?

Eric
WidgitMaster

[Switcher]

Why not do a setup with R&P , like ez-router?

That would slash material cost big time.


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[widgitmaster]

MSC #00373126 $185.87 ea., 2 required equals: $ 371.74 plus S&H
MSC #00373134 $414.32 ea., 4 required equals: $1657.28 plus S&H

[widgitmaster]

Originally Posted by Switcher Why not do a setup with R&P , like ez-router? That would slash material cost big time. .

What is R&P?

[Switcher]

Sorry, rack & pinion.

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[Switcher]

Something I think a lot of folks would like to see would be a 24*24" tabletop router/dremel machine in a kit form, that would also cut down on cost.

You could also outsource the main table have it built with steel (welded), keep it local to you, then you build only the odd & ends to finish the kit.

That would give you more time, & allow you to ship larger number of machines out the door,


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[ger21]

The K2 25x25 is about $4500, with 5" of Z travel. They use ABBA instead of THK, which probably saves on costs. You might want to check out pricing on HiWin rails, from www.automation4less.com. Also, what about going with Nook's precision acme screws. Should be just as accurate as ballscrews, and a bit cheaper.

[widgitmaster]

Originally Posted by Switcher Something I think a lot of folks would like to see would be a 24*24" tabletop router/dremel machine in a kit form, that would also cut down on cost. You could also outsource the main table have it built with steel (welded), keep it local to you, then you build only the odd & ends to finish the kit. That would give you more time, & allow you to ship larger number of machines out the door, .

Even if I build a 12x12 router, it is best to ship it in pieces, as UPS has a tendency to drop everything just to hear it crack on the ground!

The word KIT is rather ambiguous, as that is easily perceived as having all the electronics included! And that is totally outside my capacity!

Also, to build a 24x24 out of steel, would need to be able to support a 1/2" dia tool Milwaukee Router motor.

[lovebugjunkie]

Not sure my opinion is worth much as I have no experience with a cnc router, but that is about to change in the next two weeks.

From my point of view as a new user just getting into CNC as a hobby.

When I think of cnc routing as a hobby the first thing that comes to mind is cutting wood. After spending some time reading the CNCZone I realized I don’t need the machine I though I needed (wanted). As a new user buying my first cnc machine I would have a hard time justifying $5000 + with the cutting area you listed knowing I was going to use a router or other low end cutting tool on itand still have to add motors/drivers and interface card.. Not that I would not jump on a bigger machine that you made. I would love to be able to afford a Rolex but on my Timex budget this is not going to happen.

I am finally getting a cnc router and going to use it as a hobby tool, but if the CNC god slaps me on the side of the head and the unexpected event happens that I could end up making a few nickels with it, my plans would most likely change.

[PowerNaudio]

widgitmaster i love your machines, don't take this in the wrong way, its more of a compliment. i see your cnc machines more as a work of art, a show of craftsman ship, kind of like a Ferrari, it does everything you need or want it to, but i wouldn't want to put a scratch on it. now a cnc machine doesn't need to have every single component hand crafted from a block of aluminum or steel in order to be high quality and an accurate machine. you can build a much simpler machines that function just like your previews ones, without the high cost of making costume made parts, for the machine to be cost effective you can use off the shelf square tubing and flat stock for the frame, with the right dimensions where all you have to do is cut them to length and either weld them in or bolt them down, to keep the labor and cost down. mass purchasing components in the new but old stock of linear rails and blocks, or round precision shaft and pillow bearings as well as the electronics, till your machines start to sell enough to be able to buy, to the current year components. there are ways to make it cheap, but great. specially with your skills, and a bit of engineering and the keep it simple principle, im confident you'll be able to come up with a large, simple, accurate unit, on the cheap side.
good luck, so very looking forward to one of your larger machines.

[widgitmaster]

Originally Posted by PowerNaudio widgitmaster i love your machines, don't take this in the wrong way, its more of a compliment. i see your cnc machines more as a work of art, a show of craftsman ship, kind of like a Ferrari, it does everything you need or want it to, but i wouldn't want to put a scratch on it. now a cnc machine doesn't need to have every single component hand crafted from a block of aluminum or steel in order to be high quality and an accurate machine. you can build a much simpler machines that function just like your previews ones, without the high cost of making costume made parts, for the machine to be cost effective you can use off the shelf square tubing and flat stock for the frame, with the right dimensions where all you have to do is cut them to length and either weld them in or bolt them down, to keep the labor and cost down. mass purchasing components in the new but old stock of linear rails and blocks, or round precision shaft and pillow bearings as well as the electronics, till your machines start to sell enough to be able to buy, to the current year components. there are ways to make it cheap, but great. specially with your skills, and a bit of engineering and the keep it simple principle, im confident you'll be able to come up with a large, simple, accurate unit, on the cheap side. good luck, so very looking forward to one of your larger machines.

Thanks for your input PowerNaudio!
Funny you should say that, as off-the-shelf items were the motivating reason behind my learning to make things for myself! They have always fallen short of my expectations, and seem to lack the precision I like or need!

Now, for the Keep it simple principle. That was exactly how I approached the Mini-Routers, and they are very accurate and rigid for their price. But any router with a travel over 12" needs to have a stronger, more supported slide mechanism. Thus the need to use a THK (or equivalent) Linear Slide Block system.
Widgit

[turmite]

Widgit as far as I know I have never posted on one of your build threads but I do have a suggestion for you now. I use an old Digital Tool router, which to my knowledge is the first kit machine offered in the US or maybe the world.

It uses rack and pinion for the drive motion and dual vee wheels and v-rail for the rail system. I have run this machine thousands of hrs and the only problems I ever had was a design flaw. I have never had a problem with the r&p nor the dual vee wheels. TEA is a company that advertises here on the Zone, take a look at the vee wheels. I don't think you will be dissappointed.

I hoping to build a machine between now and the first of the year and it will in all likelyhood have dual vees and a belt drive......just because I want to try it!

Mike