Installing CandCNC's THC1000

[mlaws1172]

I though for those who wondered just how hard it was to install and setup the THC1000, I would see if I can sho just how easy it is.

The THC1000 is a torch hieght control for a plasma cutter. The basic kit is $695 is shown in the first picture.

The second picture shows the cables, and second parallel port card that you will also need. They have a second kit that sells for $895 and includes these idems plus a lic. copy of Mach 3. I would recommend you buy these ideas from them also. There prices about as cheap as you can get.

For what most torch hieght controls cost (or less) you can have a complete
control system including motors, drivers. control software, etc.

They are also going to offering a complete kit in the near future or maybe even now.

Here goes
picture 1: the basic kit includes the THC1000 controller, table I/O board,axis I/O board, plasma card, current transformer, setup CD and Installation manual

picture 2: the cables, and second parallel board they sell

picture 3: this is some of the other parts it takes but they didn't come from them. They sell most of these parts but they will look a little different.

picture 4: this is the back panel of my cabinet with the wiring started.

picture 5: the cabinet i will be using.

Next post I will start showing the componets going togethor. If some of my info. is wrong please set me straight.

mike

[grinder_gary]

Mike,

this set up looks familiar. Keep up the great work as I am going to follow along.

Can't wait to get set up and run!

Gary

[mlaws1172]

Gary
pretty close to the same aint it.

Getting closer to having the wiring done. Here is some more pictures.

The first picture is of the IO cards. They are the main parts that have to be wired in.

The second picture shows the limits wired up. There is a jumper on A-axis limit as we are not using it. All the limits are in series so any not used have to be jumpered.

You can also see two connections labeled EPO, these need to be jumpered also if you aren't using an external E-stop.

The next two pictures show the wiring done ready for the cabinet to be assembled
mike

[Tool bit]

I have the complete mp1000c .- Tom and marti the folks that run candcnc seam to sale kits for THC WHEN I OPEN MY BOX AND find they didn't send all the cables,board it took 4 weeks to get the all the parts and calling candcnc on the phone is a joke . well I had a computer crash and need the mach3 lic key and after 2 weeks I still have not got a key code from the canccnc people . Well they may be good people but their service sucks . If they will read their email or answer their phone I would not have to write this . read you email and sent the mach3 key code Tom or marti.
I email and still they no answer except marti sending a email saying he sent the mach3 key code . if he did again I would not be writting this
Dealing with candcnc makes me ell.

[jimcolt]

To me.....a "complete THC" kit would include all cables, all components and a z axis slide with initial height sensing capability. It is absolutely imperative in order to get the best quality and best consumable life with plasma to have an accurate method of sensing plate surface before each cut...then then retract to the torch manufacturers suggested pierce height.....fire the torch and then index down to cut height whill still on the lead in kerf. In order to do this.....either the z axis torch lifter/slide should be available as part of the kit...or at least available as an option.

When you look at the expensive industrial torch height control systems....all components are included....and everything is essentially plug and play to install the THC on a cutting machine. It would be nice to have a low cost kit for DIY or entry level machines that was complete.

Jim Colt

[Torchhead]

Originally Posted by Tool bit I have the complete mp1000c .- Tom and marti the folks that run candcnc seam to sale kits for THC WHEN I OPEN MY BOX AND find they didn't send all the cables,board it took 4 weeks to get the all the parts and calling candcnc on the phone is a joke . well I had a computer crash and need the mach3 lic key and after 2 weeks I still have not got a key code from the canccnc people . Well they may be good people but their service sucks . If they will read their email or answer their phone I would not have to write this . read you email and sent the mach3 key code Tom or marti. I email and still they no answer except marti sending a email saying he sent the mach3 key code . if he did again I would not be writting this Dealing with candcnc makes me ell.

Okay. Lets clearify some things:

1. The MP1000C is an OLD product. We have not sold/shipped that unit for almost 2 years. Current shipping product is the MP3000 and up to the "E" series. We not only supply units to individuals but also several OEM table manufactures as private label.

2. The manual specifically advises that you backup both the MACH license key and the MACH profiles. Computers crash, hard drives fail and users do stupid things. We do keep all the serial numbers for licenses we issue but not in a database so finding one that old is a manual process.

3. Marti sent your license several times. The e-mail did not bounce so we have to assume you got it.

4. Not all of our "kits" include cables (clearly stated in the descriptions). The Cables to/from the PC are standard DB25' extension cables and some persons don't want to pay the freight on the cables if they already have them. If you bought and paid for a unit with cables and software (Combo unit) and did not get that, we apologize for the mistake but twisting off two years later and posting a neagative reply is poorly thought out.

We do answer our phones (as hundreds of my customers will vouch for) during business hours, and we have over a thousand THC's in the field working. I spend the better part of my day on the phone with customers or potential buyers giving tech support and answering general CNC questions that often have nothing to do with our specific products (things like: "how should I gear my motors for a table" or what size table can I build with your kits") We also maintain an on-line forum were questions get answered even after hours and weekends.

You might want to avail yourself of the built-in spell checker. I'm not sure what makes you "ell" but it sounds like you are pissed about not getting a copy of your MACH license (of which it's your responsibly to keep and preserve). Call any software vendor and tell them your PC crashed and you don't have the license key and you want a copy for free and wait for their response. If you got a response from us we sent the license THAN WE DID. It would be a small attachment.

This is made more difficult since your CNCZone "handle" does not match any information we have so it's impossible for me to even check the validity of the claim. I think I know who you are (Sid) since you are the one that called and asked us to give you the license key over the phone (can't be done since it's an encrypted file NOT just a number) and the same person that keeps telling us you are not getting the license after multiple e-mails.

We have hundreds of kudo e-mails for our products and services. I spend many hours making sure customers get their systems up and running. I don't censor posts on my CandCNCSupport Yahoo forum unless it's SPAM.

TOM Caudle
CandCNC.com

[Torchhead]

Originally Posted by jimcolt To me.....a "complete THC" kit would include all cables, all components and a z axis slide with initial height sensing capability. It is absolutely imperative in order to get the best quality and best consumable life with plasma to have an accurate method of sensing plate surface before each cut...then then retract to the torch manufacturers suggested pierce height.....fire the torch and then index down to cut height whill still on the lead in kerf. In order to do this.....either the z axis torch lifter/slide should be available as part of the kit...or at least available as an option. When you look at the expensive industrial torch height control systems....all components are included....and everything is essentially plug and play to install the THC on a cutting machine. It would be nice to have a low cost kit for DIY or entry level machines that was complete. Jim Colt

Awww JIM! How long have you been hiding in the bushes waiting to throw that rock? Just because you are dyed Hypertherm Blue does not mean you are obtuse enough to not understand that there are other ways (perhaps better) to do a THC than making it "stand-alone' (not part of the toolpath like most other cutting processes) with enough knobs to do your own Star Trek segment. We have been selling low cost THC solutions for over 4 years based on the embedded logic inherent in MACH3. I know I have gone over this with you before, but perhaps a refresher course might be in order.

MACH3 is a control software (takes G-code and moves the motors and gives screen feedback to the operator). It controls the Z as a full axis and can use it to do all types of cutting including up to 3D routing and milling. All the THC models we have sold since 2005, interface and let MACH continue to move the Z but under direct control of the THC during cutting. The beauty of that is obvious. With MACH controlling the Z it knows what it is doing, and where it is, at all times. That offers you the OPTION of not having to do IHS before every pierce if you don't want to ( thicker material or material where the pierces are close together). It allows a level of response tuning and makes sure the moves for piercing and things like delays, are part of the toolpath and not something an operator has to reset on a knob. In fact with our Cut Profiles feature you can store all the essential parameters for different material, and the operator needs less skill to get optimum cuts. It's a dynamic Cut Chart built into the interface.

Moves like IHS, (using a floating torch holder and mechanical switch) Pierce Height, Plunge Rate, Initial Cut Height, lead-ins (4 types), kerf offset and feedrates are PART OF THE TOOLPATH AND THE CAM PROGRAM. The low cost CAM program we recommend (SheetCAM) has all of that and more built in and we supply a custom POST to make it seamless with MACH.

The advantage of having the machine toolpath control XY and Z movements is that it makes it a better coordinated task and opens up the advantage to save a lot of electronics (and cost) not having to put in the logic twice to control Z movement. It also makes it easy to switch over to other types of cutting with a 30 sec change of the control PROFILE in MACH. We could easily offer a Z with the floating torch holder but we do not sell mechanical CNC components. There are several sellers that do, at very cost effective prices (see http://PrecisionPlasmaLLC.com or www.K2CNC.com). We do NOT offer a stand alone "Torch Lifter" unit. I know that precludes us from offering low cost THC's to tables with proprietary Control and hardware (like PlasmaCAM, and others) but order volume on what we do offer is at a level that trying to get a few more sales for a LOT more engineering does not make economic sense. I get several phone calls a month from PCAM users that have the old drag tip "THC" on their previous model that want to add a THC. I have to explain that it's a complete retro fit and adding a full Z. A stand alone unit is their only option. It's often cheaper if they sell the PlasmaCAM and invest in a bare bones table and snap on our electronics.

When you talk of complete plug and play solutions you might want to study our some of our solutions product. For less that a stand alone THC (actually a LOT less) you can buy a complete CNC 4 axis control box including Motors, Cables, Digital Torch Height Controller and auto installing Drivers, screens and setup for MACH3. You will have enough budget left over to buy a complete Z axis slide and rails (in case your table lacks one) and all of the software to draw and CAM process plasma files and 2.5D routing/milling files.

So for edification our DTHC is not only an advanced Torch Height Control with Dynamic Anti-dive ("Tip Saver") and tunable response and fault parameters, but it's also a full 4 axis motor interface and expanded I/O processor for table essentials like Homes, Safety E-stops, Oxy-Fuel Manual UP/ Down Overrides and up to 6 buffered relay outputs (besides the Torch Relay) for controlling external loads. It has the same base interface electronics as our complete packages but does not include motor drives and motors. It will work with most motor driver packages.

Our new Rotary/Indexer Wizard for MACH lets you add a 5th motor and rotary axis to a plasma cutter and cut pipe and square/rectangular tubing. It does all the math and setup for different sizes of material so all you have to do is do the drawing scaled 1:1 (for the circumference on round) and cut it.

The advantage of any open control system is the support and products you get from third party vendors. There are several options in MACH for not only THC but other solutions like dedicated Hand Controllers (pendants).

I don't know how low cost you want but for less than $400.00 you can add DTHC to ANY of our interface products (that includes the remote THC Sensor Card to pickup Arc Xfr, Arc volts and has the Torch Switch relay). Unfortunately your choice on the front end may prevent taking advantage of a flexible set of options.

I will be happy to debate our products with any vendor for features, functions, price and support. You first have to get out of the 1970's mindset that Plasma has to be done separate from the XY toolpath to be "real".

TOM caudle
www.CandCNC.com
Totally Modular CNC Electronics

[jimcolt]

Tom,

You took me totally wrong. I completely understand how your system works. I am not here trying to sell THC's....you always acuse me of that! On all of these forums I am here for advice, and if someone asks me about a Hypertherm product I'd be happy to tell them about it!

I know a ton of people that would be able to upgrade drives and motors and software and THC equipment on a budget......yet they don't want to have to build mechanical components. Like a z axis lifter....all I'm wondering about is why don't you make one that can wire up to your electronics, work with the C&C software.....and make a complete THC? Calm down!

By the way.....Hypertherm has a couple of standalone THC systems, we designed our first THC for plasma in 1970........and we also offer integrated THC systems that only work with our cnc controls, up to four per machine....all available with industrially hardened mechanical lifters/drives. Our newest industrial CNC/THC/High definition plasma system interface with a single Ethernet cable. For the most part they are rather expensive for hobbyists, DIY'rs, so I don't bring them up. And.....I'm not Hypertherm blue (thats Miller!).....Hypertherm brand colors are grey and black.

Best regards, Jim

[Torchhead]

.....And.....I'm not Hypertherm blue (thats Miller!).....Hypertherm brand colors are grey and black.

. Sorry....I should have gone out in the shop and looked at my 1000 G3.

It's just that the subject of this thread is "Installing CandCNC's THC1000" and it could be construed from your comments that a product that does not include the "lifter" is not a complete THC solution or that we don't know anything about IHS or we don't supply cables and manuals. You probably know our products use an existing Z axis and that there are numerous bolt on low cost sources for that. I have been asked several times to design and build a low cost stand alone lifter/THC but I don't see any advantage of that over the integrated MACH THC and working Z axis approach other than it would work on closed systems. The price. because of the added electronics to do all the moves for touch-off, pierce, pierce delay, plunge, initial cut height, etc now becomes a lot higher. I don't want that market place. I then have to try and support machines running other control packages and in commercial shops. I can support a MACH based system in my sleep.

We are planning a Spring release of a system that runs on EMC2 with all the same features but improved I/O capabilities. Biggest challenge is to make it easy to install and setup.

We don't do mechanical products for two main reasons: 1. We stay 110% busy designing, building and selling CNC electronics. 2. We sell electronics to vendors that do sell mechanical components and I believe in the concept " don't compete with your customers or your vendors".

Jim, you do a fine job supporting your company. I can understand that. They have been a good employer to you for many years. I admire loyalty. I have sold a lot of Hypertherm products for your employer ( I invariably get asked the magic question when the builder guys talk to me). Your perspective is (how shall I say this?) is somewhat skewed. There have been a lot of changes in this whole CNC industry in just a few short years and much like the old Mainframe VS PC arguments of the 80's it pays to keep your periscope up and focus wider.

People make choices for buying equipment sometimes based on the thinnest of facts. I want them to ask the right questions and at least understand that if they make a certain choice it's after knowing there are alternatives.

Gotta go. My Toyota ran screaming off into the night and I have to go look for it.

TOM C
www.CandCNC.com

[Tool bit]

Tom / does It takes two week to get a lic key code ? Yes I have called I need the code and the only email the on my computer is Marti saying he sent it - I have called emailed and knowing you are on the cnczone . I get what -- well the old mp1000c was purchased in 8-2008 -that old mp 1000c is not two years old . Tom do This Send me a cost for my lic key code on a 50 cent cd and shipping . ---- Thanks Sid You have my phone number on my emails..... Its now 5:45pm 2/20/10 .

[Torchhead]

YOU DON"T UNDERSTAND! IT"S NOT A KEY CODE. It is an encrypted small file named Mach1Lic with a DAT extension. It's a unique embedded code (not readable by humans) in the file. You have to copy it (intact) into the MACH directory. The only way I know that is your license is I found the original e-mail we sent you. Otherwise I have to scroll search through over a thousand files.

You have been sent the file again and I copied myself and Scott at MACH3 to confirm the license file was attached. I received my copy at 18:28 hours.

This time when you get it copy it to an external storage device and protect your investment. In fact copy your entire MACH3 folder out so you can recover the other files you need.

TOM caudle

[jimcolt]

Tom,

Not at all insinuating that you don't know about Initial Height Sensing.....and it is clear that your THC's can be had with manuals and all cables. I was just wondering why you don't offer the lifter.....I could help you sell a few more systems if you had one.

Your prices for the THC equipment are great.....and if you had a reasonably priced lifter...it would just make it that much easier to integrate.

It is still my opinion that a THC is not complete without the lifter (z axis)......and that opinion won't change! It is also my opinion that every mecanized plasma system needs a THC with initial height sensing....not everyone agrees with me on that until after they have operated a plasma for a while on a cnc. I agree...that you should be able to offer the electronics without the lifter if that's what the customer wants....Hypertherm does the same.

Best regards, Jim Colt