ortza Dart 815 any user??

[steve_p]

Originally Posted by battwell any progress? ive just started a biesse 335 conversion. what a monster!

nah, been too busy. Did order some bits for the machine that were damaged (handles on pod rails etc) and replaced the missing servo drive, but I'm still unsure about the Mach/Camsoft decision. I've recently bought a Sheetcam and Mach license (I've been concentrating on getting a cnc plasma table running smoothly for a paying job -so the router has taken a back seat- which I'm probably going to shift over to Mach soon to get an integrated THC solution), so I guess I should really just try Mach on the router first since it'll cost me nothing. I just don't want to spend ages getting it to work, to then change over to Camsoft and start over. There seems to be an equal number of people who love and hate Camsoft!

I've just got a nagging feeling that by using Camsoft I'll end up with something a bit more useable on the cabinet-specific side of things, which could be run from alphacam or similar... but I could be wrong, maybe I'm being suckered by a Stella Artois 'reassuringly expensive' marketing ploy, and all that's needed is the right postprocessor for either system..

You using Mach for the 335?

[battwell]

yes im using mach for the 335 conversion
its about the same as your dart.
3 routers, loads of drills vert and horizontal etc.

i should have the basics done in a week ( would do it in a day but i have 2 rush jobs on)

ive been writing the drilling scripts etc. its not hard! (very?)
what else would you need for a cabinet processor? thats what i do for a living so i need mine to do everything its supposed to.
if i get it all as nice as i want it il offer it as a control retrofit installed on a weekend. (as i can make and test most of it on the bench beforehand)
just puzzling over the safety circuits at the moment. only 1 limit switch per axis. need to work out the best way to handle this.

re thc on plasma. just buy mp3000 kit at about £400 from the states candcnc.com saves a lot of work! i have 1 on mine. its all worked out and already set for differing metal thicknesses etc

[battwell]

by the way.
i wrote a fully working post for my biesse for sheetcam. supports drilling/ sawing etc! so why go for alphacam unless you cant draw a cabinet
its a very esy post to modify. it already does everything you need in mach.
(requires 6 vb scripts written for horzontal drilling, sawing etc. but il have them done by next week if you need them)

sheetcam is superb and the backup support from les is great!

[steve_p]

Originally Posted by battwell by the way. i wrote a fully working post for my biesse for sheetcam. supports drilling/ sawing etc! so why go for alphacam unless you cant draw a cabinet its a very esy post to modify. it already does everything you need in mach. (requires 6 vb scripts written for horzontal drilling, sawing etc. but il have them done by next week if you need them) sheetcam is superb and the backup support from les is great!

I'd pretty much decided on the candcnc plasma solution, I originally thought my servos were running at 160v, which ruled out geckos (but you can get vipers at that voltage), but I've since measured the psu and it's 80v, so it seems the mp3000/gecko route is the best option, keeping the geared motors. Unlike my router though (where I've got another one running alonside the Dart for money jobs), I use the plasma day to day, so it's more of a wrench to remove the working Burny control.. But waiting 15 mins for it to compute the kerf offsets on a nested sheet is boring! I bought Mach and sheetcam from Les with the intention of going down the mp3000 route.

You're rapidly turning me off camsoft. Unlike you, I don't even do cabinet work (well, maybe one job a year- all my stuff is one-off prototyping and models) so I don't know why I'm bothered about it... I guess I'm just thinking about the best way to keep as much of the machine's functionality as possible. The only reason I mentioned alphacam is that I assumed only a cabinet cad/cam program would be able to handle the horizontal boring, but hearing that you do it in sheetcam makes all the difference. Do you draw edge holes or hinge rebates in sheetcam? Or do you cheat it into thinking it's doing something different? And besides, are the Mach macros such that the drills and saws are called up with standard M and T codes, so all I'd need to do is to write a postprocessor for a cabinet cam program even if I wanted one in future?

[steve_p]

By the way, my Dart is rigged differently to your Biesse in that all my I/O comes back to the cabinet, so I don't have to think about serial comms to the sensors. But once inside the cab, they are all wired into I/O boards that seem to be some (2 wire, I think) serial bus variant- it would make the installation really simple if I could use modbus from Mach to read/write to these boards!- all I'd have to do is work out what numbers all the switches were, and just hook up the drive and encoder connections ... Have you used modbus with Mach?

[battwell]

dont let me put you off any program that may cost you thousands and may or may not work...lol
in sheetcam post i used drills as tool numbers 100 plus drill number set for correct size in sheetcam. checked if drill was over 100 if it was subtract 100 (to give drill head number) and call drill cycle g99.
for horizontal drilling draw 0.1 , 0.2. o.3 or 0.4 diameter hole on board edge(which wouldnt exist as real drills on my machine) depending on side to be bored. call relevant drill cycle!
it works brill.

re mach. i have 30 vertical 10 horizontal to program.
i will use the same sort of setup but each tool size will call a different m code.
this will be easier to set sheetcam to do. (i have yet to write a post for vectric vcarve but im sure it wont be too hard)

eg. m1601 will be drill 1 m1602 drill2 etc (that way i can offset the drill from original toolpath etc, set offsets and do correct cycle for that drill (vertical or side 1 2 3 or4 etc. set whatever rpm ie for bigger bits need to go slower?

i should have the 335 moving on sunday . have to go deliver one of my fantastic pool tables in london tomorrow . darn work is getting in the way of fun.

what plasma source does the burny have? i have hypertherm 1000.
ive had to dismantle mine for the moment as the 335 has used up all my space. (not many people with 2 5 tonne cncs in their garage i bet!)
bet theres not many people that use diesel to run all their machinery either! the joys of living on a mountain.

[battwell]

havnt used modbus yet. however may have to for the amount of i/o i want as i can only get 80 out of the galil.(ideally require about 125) i was thinking about strobing the drill head outputs so i could get 64 outputs from 16 galil outputs. but i havnt tried this yet. it works well on pinballs and fruit machines so i dont see why not.

otherwise i will use galil rio units.

the 335 has all the outputs back to the cabinet too so i just have to use 2803a chips to give me half amp drive power for the existing relay output cards

ive spent 2 days working out what everything does! i want the whole conversion to be a "piggy back" conversion leaving everything intact so it can run on original control too (so when i start selling the conversion it all just plugs in but if there are any problems the control can be re run from original in under 15 minutes)
some of the original relay logic has taken a bit of working out. but it works well and is proven so ive decided to keep it in the conversion

and as a bonus i fixed the original control today so it will be up for sale to one of the 3rd world countries. lol

[steve_p]

My plasma table came with a hypertherm max100 (massive Hf start brute) but I recently took a punt on a powermax 800 on eBay that had a machine torch but the torch was cut off- I was expecting it to be scrap, but I rewired the torch and it's been running every day for a couple of weeks no prob- not bad for 200 quid. I got some finecut consumables for it.

Pop in for a cuppa if you're in London anytime, I'll even supply biscuits if I get some Mach info out of you..

G and M codes are over my head at the moment, I've never needed to go there. Guess that'll change soon. I like the holes on the edge idea- how do you program the height of the hole below the sheet surface?

Also, my machine controls (controlled..) the vac pods via software- each one has a solenoid valve- what do you do with yours? Are they all connected to the pump, and use those little ball-valve things in the top surface?

[battwell]

re sheetcam. les has my first biesse post (without horizontal and saw) or i can send it to you if you need to see whats edited.

but if your going mach, il have everything you need within a month as i iron out any problems etc and test.

you need to get the dart moving even if its only off the 1750 with only 16 outputs.

do you have breakout board and cables?

[battwell]

the biesse sets holes at half panel height by default in fixed cycle. (easy to change in code as theres never many horizontal holes. and its only really for dowelling in edge of 18mm board so its always centre anyway!

pm me your address/contact number/email
im off to bed. early start again and ive run out of beer (cnc brain lubricant)

the m codes are quite easy to write. a new info sheet has just been released today.
http://machsupport.com/docs/Mach3_V3...o_Prog_Ref.pdf
if you cant sleep?

[steve_p]

No, i/o for the galil is the next thing- I wasn't sure whether to just get a 1900 terminal board, or the fancy Ethernet modular things. It'd all have to be eBay prices though, so I guess it'll be whatever comes along. I assume you just used the terminal strip, if you then added 2803s. I use them all the time, they're great. And MUCH cheaper than galil modules, I bet..

[battwell]

you will need an icm 1900 or 2900. and also the lead!!! (you wont find the 100 pin plugs anywhere. i searched for over a month here and states)
i sourced a few of these from the states and malasia. annoyingly i could only find 2 leads so if i want more it will be at $125 each plus shipping.
(i have 4 icm1904 with built in amps in stock, these are like rocking horse poop)

i was also lucky enough to find an iom1964 to wire nicely 64 i/o extended to, this took nearly a year to find on ebay...lol although i believe there are opto22 /greyhill interface cards also available but you would still need the lead etc.
the 1964 only has 16 high power outputs 500ma, the rest are 20ma so need boosting with 2803a etc. to give me 500ma relay driver.
if your going to try to make one up use ac input optos!

without the right icm the wiring is going to be a birds nest.
ive made up 15 interface cables to my i/o cards with the right plugs etc so i should be able to wire this lot nice and easy/tidy now! (leaving the original ribbons hanging in case the piggy back needs reversing in future)

the only problem you have at the moment is your controller (1750) doesnt have the extended i/o so you have a max of 16 in 16 out unless you get the daughter board for it (if you find some i want 4 for mine :-)

for the biesse 335 im using galil 2280 8 axis ethernet controller (these are the easiest to set up etc)
2 off icm1900 plus 100 pin leads
1 off iom1964 for extended i/o

nobody could say a good conversion was cheap. lol