New Machine Build MountainCrafts Router/Plasma Build Thread - Page 2


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Thread: MountainCrafts Router/Plasma Build Thread

  1. #13
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    There is a significant performance between a typical router "speed control" and the Super PID. Following is a brief explanation from the CNC zone forum thread. To put it even more briefly: A typical router "speed control", which has no feedback control, does just that, it decreases current to the motor and the motor turns slower, and as there is less current, there is less torque for the router to be able to cut steadily. The Super PID, which has a closed loop feedback capability, senses load and add power to maintain a given RPM on the router.

    For the visual among you: First watch this video: [nomedia="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qJdOAj0hei0&feature=mfu_in_order&list=UL"]YouTube - Super-PID CNC open-loop spindle test[/nomedia]

    Then watch this video [toward the end]:[nomedia="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=85L050QcsYI&feature=autoplay&list=ULf5hQXdzXgF0&index=4&playnext=1"]YouTube - Super-PID CNC 5000 to 30000 RPM PID[/nomedia]

    Fixed speed router; Generally 25000 RPM to 30000 RPM, (like Khalid said), very noisy, lots of heat, tool wear and bearing wear and will melt plastic when cutting etc and can burn woods too depending on speeds and feeds.

    Variable speed router OR any typical "speed control"; When you turn them "down" these just send less power to the router. So speeds are about 16000-30000 RPM range, and at lower speeds like 16000 there is very little torque. So if you are trying to use the lower speeds it will droop speed badly and have very little cutting power, or just stall, or speed will vary all over the place depending on cut depth etc. And under 16000 RPM you can pretty much forget about it, so you still get bad issues with melting plastic and aluminium melting onto the tool because you are forced to use too much RPM if you want to get any useful cutting power.

    Super-PID closed loop speed control; This has a infra-red speed sensor pointed at the router shaft, so it measures the exact RPM of the router at all times. Then it uses a high-speed math algorithm called P.I.D. to adjust the power sent to the router, to keep the router spinning at the RPM you wanted. And it has an accurate tacho so you can set a chosen RPM based on speeds/feeds tables as people need for professional production.

    So speed range is now 5000-30000 RPM, and you can get excellent power down to 9000-10000 RPM (used for most plastic and aluminum cutting etc) and even get significant amounts of usable power at the very low RPM range like 5000-9000 (where your router is almost silent!) that can be used to cut fussy materials like low-melt point plastics, fussy woods, and light cuts in materials for the purpose of getting good surface finish etc.

    The idea of the Super-PID was to offer some (most?) of the performance benefits of a VFD spindle setup, but at a lower cost and an simple task of just connecting it to your existing router setup.



  2. #14
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    I read through the first several pages of the super PID thread early this morning, and am totally sold on the product.. It's a no brainer IMO, and a must have....

    It's now on the list...

    [URL="http://www.cnczone.com/forums/cnc_wood_router_project_log/124543-mountaincrafts_router_plasma_build_thread.html"][U]4' x 8' CNC Wood Router Project[/U][/URL]
    [U][URL="http://www.cnczone.com/forums/woodworking/135576-home_made_drum_sander.html"]Home Made Drum Sander Project[/URL][/U]


  3. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zygoat View Post
    many people there run dual use machines. (that is what i am building). if you use dust collection while using the router. then you should be ok. it takes a little bit of clever design on the table working surface but nothing too hard. also you can mount the router and the plasma to the z axis permanently. (together at the same time) this way to change between the two you just have to tell the computer what you want to do. (which you have to do anyway) basically zero effort.
    Do you have a link to a thread on your machine?

    I think for me, the most intimidating issue of a dual use machine, is the switching back and forth between a material bed for wood working, and a slat bed for plasma.. But over the last couple weeks, I think I have come up with a some what elegant solution to that problem...

    [URL="http://www.cnczone.com/forums/cnc_wood_router_project_log/124543-mountaincrafts_router_plasma_build_thread.html"][U]4' x 8' CNC Wood Router Project[/U][/URL]
    [U][URL="http://www.cnczone.com/forums/woodworking/135576-home_made_drum_sander.html"]Home Made Drum Sander Project[/URL][/U]


  4. #16
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    Just slide a bed on top of the slats.

    My build

    http://www.cnczone.com/forums/diy-cn...ter_build.html



  5. #17
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    Got a bunch of goodies last night.. will probably be ordering a NEMA 34 mount to use instead of that NEMA 23 one...







    Also picked up a couple sheets of 3/4" T&G plywood to use as a material bed and bracing... Looking like there's a little break in the weather for a few hours, and I'm hoping I can cut it up and screw it down today...

    My plow broke yesterday, and I'm stuck at home for a few days, while I wait for the parts to arrive... so if the weather will cooperate a little, maybe I can move forward some...

    [URL="http://www.cnczone.com/forums/cnc_wood_router_project_log/124543-mountaincrafts_router_plasma_build_thread.html"][U]4' x 8' CNC Wood Router Project[/U][/URL]
    [U][URL="http://www.cnczone.com/forums/woodworking/135576-home_made_drum_sander.html"]Home Made Drum Sander Project[/URL][/U]


  6. #18
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    So this afternoon was fairly productive.. Got a couple things out of the way.. one of them I thought was a major hurdle to pass, but turned out to be easy... drilling the rails..

    I cut and installed the 3/4" T&G, squaring the table base as I went.. Then I dug out an old HF bench top drill press and made a drilling fence from a scrap of gal uni-strut on it to center the holes, and drilled out all the holes on the X Axis rails... I thought that was gonna be a total PITA, but the bits dug through the CRS like butter.. first 1/4", then 3/8"...

    Was gonna drill out the X rails too, but realized that since I've got a full 12' stick of 4" CRS flat bar on order for the Z axis, I should just wait for that, and use that along with one of the 3" pieces I already have cut and marked, and then I wouldn't need to make an adjusting jig to hold the two rails apart by exactly 1" like I would need if I used the two 3" rails I already cut.. as now, with a 4" and a 3", I have 7".. and will only need the same 1/2" bar adjusters I will make to adjust the rails on the other two axis...

    Besides, I poured a beer, and deep down I knew that the day was over when I did that..

    Anyways, I'm well on my way to being done with 'drilling holes'.. and so far, they've all come out 'perfect'...

    After aligning the rails with a tape measure and about every third bolt, the bearing carriages move like butter... Only one small imperfection on one rail I'll have to file down....

    Gonna build mock-up gantry end mounts out of plywood tomorrow or the next day, and then I can start on the Y axis and Z axis...

    Still gotta cut up and install some shear panels to stiffen up the table base in the Y direction too.... the table is less than 1/16" out of square measured diagonally, and the rails are less than 1/16" out of parallel.. pretty good considering I haven't even really atarted dialing it all in yet...

    Starting to feel like something now!







    Last edited by Mountaincraft; 03-23-2011 at 08:41 AM.
    [URL="http://www.cnczone.com/forums/cnc_wood_router_project_log/124543-mountaincrafts_router_plasma_build_thread.html"][U]4' x 8' CNC Wood Router Project[/U][/URL]
    [U][URL="http://www.cnczone.com/forums/woodworking/135576-home_made_drum_sander.html"]Home Made Drum Sander Project[/URL][/U]


  7. #19
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    I like that computer table. Did you weld it up yourself or buy it?

    CarveOne

    CarveOne
    http://www.carveonecncwoodcraft.com


  8. #20
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    I got it at IKEA in LA a long time ago... (20 yrs?)..

    Would be pretty easy to make though.. I can take more pics if you want...

    [URL="http://www.cnczone.com/forums/cnc_wood_router_project_log/124543-mountaincrafts_router_plasma_build_thread.html"][U]4' x 8' CNC Wood Router Project[/U][/URL]
    [U][URL="http://www.cnczone.com/forums/woodworking/135576-home_made_drum_sander.html"]Home Made Drum Sander Project[/URL][/U]


  9. #21
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    Wanted to post the 3D renderings of the gantry mounts I intend to make... I posted them else where, but figured they belonged with the thread about the machine they are gonna be used on too..

    In reality, they will be an inch and a half wider (in the Y direction) than those shown, as the gantry beam is currently extending that far past the rails on each side...







    [URL="http://www.cnczone.com/forums/cnc_wood_router_project_log/124543-mountaincrafts_router_plasma_build_thread.html"][U]4' x 8' CNC Wood Router Project[/U][/URL]
    [U][URL="http://www.cnczone.com/forums/woodworking/135576-home_made_drum_sander.html"]Home Made Drum Sander Project[/URL][/U]


  10. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mountaincraft View Post
    I got it at IKEA in LA a long time ago... (20 yrs?)..

    Would be pretty easy to make though.. I can take more pics if you want...
    Thanks,

    The reason for asking is that I had been considering using some left over 1x2 box tubing for the main vertical structure to build something similar to what you showed. There is nothing more than just the thought so far. I wouldn't be copying that one, so no other photos are really needed. I have some steel angle and some shorter pieces of 1x2 box tube that may be useful.

    CarveOne

    CarveOne
    http://www.carveonecncwoodcraft.com


  11. #23
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    So I'm trial fitting my Z axis together, and notice that when the screw is in the bearing blocks and I turn it, it 'wobbles'.. Probably about a 16th inch run out...

    Is this normal.. Seems to me that they should be straight as an arrow.. Are McMaster Carr ACME screws normally 'true' or is it typical to have some bend and has to be field straightened?

    Should I attempt to straighten it by hand? Should I call them and demand a replacement?

    It's a 1/2" x 36" long 5 start screw.. I'll be using about 22-24" of it...

    Seems to me that this would cause problems.. vibration, bearing wear, etc...

    But I've never ordered one of these before.. so I don't know if it's status quo for these things to arrive 'out of true'...

    [URL="http://www.cnczone.com/forums/cnc_wood_router_project_log/124543-mountaincrafts_router_plasma_build_thread.html"][U]4' x 8' CNC Wood Router Project[/U][/URL]
    [U][URL="http://www.cnczone.com/forums/woodworking/135576-home_made_drum_sander.html"]Home Made Drum Sander Project[/URL][/U]


  12. #24
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    Can anyone advise me about the acme screw? I'm not sure what is 'typical' with these things...

    [URL="http://www.cnczone.com/forums/cnc_wood_router_project_log/124543-mountaincrafts_router_plasma_build_thread.html"][U]4' x 8' CNC Wood Router Project[/U][/URL]
    [U][URL="http://www.cnczone.com/forums/woodworking/135576-home_made_drum_sander.html"]Home Made Drum Sander Project[/URL][/U]


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MountainCrafts Router/Plasma Build Thread
MountainCrafts Router/Plasma Build Thread