Hawke 150 spindel problems

[greg b]

Hi all got some problems with a cincinatti hawke 150 turning centre with a2100 control.The machine has been running fine untill some days ago day when I started it up and it configured fine with no failures,untill I went to axis alignment which went through normal procedures untill the spindel c axis tried to align and there was a growling noise followed by a spindel alignment error.So I shut the machine down and restarted a few miniutes later and this time every thing configered fine and machine run perfect for several more days with no issues,untill today when I started up again with no errors untill the spindel axis aligned and this time the spindel was jerking as it moved back and forth.The machine starts and runs good but if I start at anything above 500 rpm it starts with a real horrible noise like a loose pully or motor mount,so I pulled all the covers off to inspect and everything is in good condition including drive belts,all bearings feel silky smooth with no end float.When running the machine is very quite with no noise,I have a feeling the motor and or spindel are out of step with one another.Anyone out there had this problem or can help many thanks in advance.regards Greg

[cncatj]

Greg_
i would suggest that you remove spindle belts , and start spindle motor to a certain
desirable speed , so you can determine if the noise is in the spindle motor or not !

good luck
p.d you may want to put a mark on both pulleys before removing belts

[greg b]

Thanks for your reply mate,I have already done that,the motor runs silky smooth and in fact its quite hard to even here it running even at its highest speed.Thats what is really weird about this,it basicly did this overnight and at first I thought it was as simple as a loose motor mount or pulley,I have experimented with tightening the tooth belts at different tentions and there is a definent change for the better when I tighten them right up,but this appears to be masking something of another problem.The belts appear to fit the pulleys neat enough and the spindel is also nice and quite,as stated before it appears to me that the spindel motor is out of sink because it only makes the noise on start up at speeds above 500rpm and when you use the speed dial to up and down the rpm,but only between 500rpm and 2000rpm.The thing that also makes me think this is a motor out of sink problem is when the spindel aligns in the start up process it is really jerky and not smooth like it used to be and when I run a tapping program it is also very jerky and not smooth.The question I am asking is there a way of checking if the spindel is accelerating correctly and that c axis is in sink.Many thanks in advance,regards Greg.

[greg b]

Just updating diognosis on hawke 150 spindel.No luck! Has anybody worked on the VFS Spindel drive units and spindel motors of these machines before.The only thing I have found out of wack so far is the supply wires from the spindel motor were all loose to the extent of being able to lift them out of the connector bar easily,1 at least looked like it was never tightened up at all,as the wire was not even crushed.Thinking you little beauty this is it! Bugger the motor still acts the same,the errors I have been getting are C Axis Tpa/Home Failure,I have checked the little sensor above the spindel and all checks out.The machine runs great when up to speed and there are no failures on the BDS and VFS units when starting up the only thing thats a problem is the rumble on start up when spindel takes of and on spindel config and tapping cycles especially with pecking the spindel looks out of sink.Does anybody no if Dick Mallen/Mallardfizz is still about as he seems to no these things well.Any help would be great regards Greg.

[mallardfizz]

hello Greg
yes i'm here
yes i received your e-mail
yes i have followed your posts.
i havent replied because at the moment i dont have anything constructive to add.
i havent come across anything like you describe. the only thing close was a motor pulley that had crept forward and was rubbing.
if i can go back it seems that the problem occurs when the machine is aligning. this is when it sounds rough?
it also gives a problem when tapping? DO YOU HERE THE 'ROUGH' NOISE WHEN TAPPING?
To summarise you have a problem when aligning and tapping ( g84.1 solid tap or g84 )
if this is correct i need to find what is common for these two instances.
once i have your answer i will contact my american gods to see what they can suggest. at the moment they are off work and i dont know when they are back
as soon as i have something more positive i will respond
regards
Mallardfizz

[greg b]

Thanks for your reply Dick,I understand you guys are real busy, I really appreciate your time,Im almost certain its something to do with the contol because the machine only has a prob when it accelerates from zero to 800 + Rpm and its as if its a loose belt or pulley ,the noise is a real deep wipping noise,but when up to speed its as quite as a mouse.But that all being said the main thing is, when the spindel aligns for the first time on start up in C Axis it used to turn nice and smooth from side to side as it looked for its position, but now it has a real jerking motion and quite often it will go into a C Axis Tpa fail error and you have to clear it and start again in the aligning process to get it running.Its like the motor is not sure where it is in C Axis,and I guess that appears to be extending to the tapping cycles as I said before.Have you ever set up Kolmorgan motion link to trouble shoot the spindel control,Im told it will show you any faults that may appear,cause I think I have a copy of this program.Would you have a manual that may give me the translation for the 2 faults that the control posts ( C Axis Tpa Fail Error and C Axis Servo Fail,as this may help me get to the bottom of this problem.Many thanks in advance regards Greg.

[mike_Kilroy]

up our alley! We stock replacements & repair these and sell replacement ones. We have sent small laptop to customers that they hook upto internet and we then go in and run the VFS5 or axis drives thru our motionlink to help diagnose the problems. Let me know how we can help.

[mike_Kilroy]

noise during accel only might be spindel drive tuning parameter too.

[greg b]

Hi Mike your reply is much appreciated,its a real bugger when these things give you some grief, after checking almost everything I can and scanning the manual,Im pretty sure it could be a tuning issue,I already have the Kolmorgen Motionlink program on my laptop but I just cannot get it to interface with the VFS5 ,I have tried everything in the manual that they recommend to set up communications with the VFS5 but to no avail.The only problem I can think of is,the laptop I have doesn't have a D9s port so I have to use a Usb to serial converter which works fine when uploading and downloading programs into the acramatic 2100 control,but i'm not so sure about communications with the VFS5.When scanning for drives it comes up with no drive found,do I need to have the complete machine running or just turn the VFS5 on,which I have done both but still nothing.Could you please give me the setup procedures you use when trouble shooting the VFS5 and the laptop configuration I should be using, would be most appreciated Mike.Best regards Greg.

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[mike_Kilroy]

No problem! You can do it!

I suspect you simply don't have the right serial cable!

Make a cable to talk to the VFS5 (and same cable will work to talk to the Servostar axis drives too): 3 wires only:

2<->3
3<->2
5<->5

That's it! Just plug THIS cable into your USB<->RS2323 adapter and it will let you talk. MotionLink Plus takes care of baud rate (wether it is 9600 or 19200baud) when it scans for drives; if it doesnt find drive on setting you have picked it goes around again and looks at the other rate.

When you get into the drive, the tunning parameters that most likely cause the buzzing are KV and KVI. You can change them (say drop one at a time and try it - drop like 20% each time). If you solve it this way them they need to be saved to the drive program or they are overwritten on next power up. We can help you with this if you want.....

[greg b]

Thanks Mike for your help with that,I will give those wires a try,we tried to day with another serial to usb adaptor and tried several goes at configuring the com ports with no luck (very frustrating ) .Almost tempted to buy and old laptop with D9 and Rs232 ports already on them,but I will give your method a go tomorrow with some luck she will be right,I will keep you posted thanks mate.Greg.