Embroidery machines

[Karl_T]

My January landlord is in the custom embroidery business. She's buying a new four head unit to the tune of $30K because the DOS software the old unit uses is no longer supported.

I can see the machine is very similar to a stepper table mill with toolchanger. I have no idea what sort of code today's embroidery software puts out for machines to read.

So, is it feasable to refit these machines with camsoft, or any other, controls?

Karl

[wwendorf]

I do computerized embroidery as well as machining. I guess i'm addicted to motion control!?!?!?

Unfortunately, you cannot retrofit it with standard CNC controls. The reason is because in addition to X and Y movements, there are lots of other controls that get involved.

There is computerized tension, needle up down positions, thread cutter operation, thread movement sensors and many other things. Even though there are similarities, the differences are big enough that CNC and computerized embroidery are definitely in different spectrums.

Hope this helps,
Wade

[Karl_T]

Originally Posted by wwendorf I do computerized embroidery as well as machining. I guess i'm addicted to motion control!?!?!?

Exactly my problem. Must be a new disease

Modern controls could handle all the issues you mention. But, I wonder about the machine command files. Are they similar to G and M codes?

Karl

[Switcher]

Most machines (brands) have their own format as far as the code to run the machine.

Here is a little info on just 1 of many file extensions
http://www.fileinfo.net/extension/pes

The guys that build the machines are very smart, that they write their own software that only runs on their machines, keeps the customer buying more & more.




.

[Switcher]

I've read about this program a while back (havn't tried it).

Converts a bunch of file types.

http://www.threadsmith.com/nav.srf?page=software

[Switcher]

I found this link for "Running a DOS application and capture its output in VB .NET 2005"

http://www.vb-helper.com/howto_net_run_dos.html

Maybe you could write something?


.

[wwendorf]

The biggest problem is that yes, modern controls "could" work, but the problem lies in that you would HAVE to have a lot of experience with sewing and understand how tensions work, etc... In my mind, an embroidery machine has aspect of 4 axis cnc. The computer controls X and Y movement, then it controls the needle up and down as well as the frequency of the needle up/down (as in speed of sewing motor), then you have the other issue of the machine controlling (sometimes) the tension and the automatic trimmer.

So, while it would be difficult if you didn't understand how sewing machines work (lots more complicated than milling) it is possible.

As far as different embroidery formats, that's not really any different than us having lots of different post processors. No machines GCode is completely identical. Same with embroidery formats. None of them are identical, but they all work pretty much the same.

Wade

[Switcher]

Originally Posted by wwendorf The biggest problem is that yes, modern controls "could" work, but the problem lies in that you would HAVE to have a lot of experience with sewing and understand how tensions work, etc... In my mind, an embroidery machine has aspect of 4 axis cnc. The computer controls X and Y movement, then it controls the needle up and down as well as the frequency of the needle up/down (as in speed of sewing motor), then you have the other issue of the machine controlling (sometimes) the tension and the automatic trimmer. So, while it would be difficult if you didn't understand how sewing machines work (lots more complicated than milling) it is possible. As far as different embroidery formats, that's not really any different than us having lots of different post processors. No machines GCode is completely identical. Same with embroidery formats. None of them are identical, but they all work pretty much the same. Wade

G-code is an industry standard.

Several embroidery formats isn't the same, not much of a standard. If a control can't read the file, it's useless.

I'm not saying it can't be done, when in fact it could be, it all depends on how much you want it, & how much time you have to invest in the project.

A stepper motor is a stepper motor regardless of how it's setup.



.

[wwendorf]

Yup, GCode is an industry standard. There are a few embroidery formats that are considered industry standards as well. Pretty much all embroidery machines read a format called DST. It's a format that all machines use. Additonally, all machines typically have their own formats which give features not commonly covered in the "generic" features.

There are also conversion programs out there that translate one format to another in about 2 seconds flat without modifying the design in any way or changing how it sews.

And, i'm not arguing with ya, I'm just saying that converting it to use GCode would be very counter-productive because you wouldn't be able to digitize or purchase designs in a format the machine could use. You would have to write a design converter to even attempt to create a design in GCode. Or your own digitizing program. Lots of custom software to write as well.

Additionally, another thing about embroidery machines and their formats is that they also typically automatically change threads. Some machine can have up to 15 threads pre-loaded in them. I guess that is kind of like an automatic tool changer in a way?

Wade

[Khalid]

Yes everything is possible.. Now we can convert the embroidery format to our Gcode format..
http://www.cnczone.com/forums/showth...=57404&page=24

[wwendorf]

Originally Posted by Khalid Yes everything is possible.. Now we can convert the embroidery format to our Gcode format.. http://www.cnczone.com/forums/showth...=57404&page=24

Yes, I've been monitoring your posts on your build thread. Nice job on that! I definitely didn't have the patience to reverse engineer the software, or the desire to build a machine from the ground up. Of course, that's likely because I have several top end embroidery machines already. <grin>

Wade

[Al_The_Man]

Originally Posted by Karl_T So, is it feasable to refit these machines with camsoft, or any other, controls? Karl

Did you see the example of embroidery machine in the Galil animated examples with code, I know it does not go into detail as to code input, but evidentially there was someone that originally put a version together based around the legacy DMC-1000 and used the old Galil Opint software , I believe they have since upgraded to a later version card and software. I don't have a link anymore.
This was the patent, http://www.patentstorm.us/patents/5458075/fulltext.html
( just noticed it is a post from 2007!)
Al.