Need Help! Looking for a machine....

[arkfisher]

I'm looking for a small benchtop machine to mill plastic sheet into guitar picks. I'm looking to make a few different style picks. This is the only application that I am looking to use it for. Any help will be greatly appreciated.

Thanks,

Richard

[hoss2006]

A little router is all you need then, you can get little turnkeys on ebay just for example, not endorsement.
CNC 3020 ROUTER ENGRAVER MACHINE DRILLING / MILLING b | eBay
Hoss

[cameraguy]

A small gantry style router is all you need. If you do want an endorsement, Try the Microcarve MV3. Made in the US, tough little thing, inexpensive, and well supported. Then get a small high speed spindle for it and the right 1/8" bits for that material and go nuts.

[wizard]

I'm looking for a small benchtop machine to mill plastic sheet into guitar picks. I'm looking to make a few different style picks. This is the only application that I am looking to use it for. Any help will be greatly appreciated.

Thanks,

Richard

I think the first question that comes to mind is how do you get the raw material, is it via sheet, rod, or something else? Small router type machines work good for sheet goods, however if these picks have 3d features machining them out of sheet goods might not be optimal.

Thus you may also want to look at small mills like the Sherline or TIag. A small milling machine would be a bit more versatile when it comes to raw stock. Both of these mills come with fairly high speed spindles which will be useful in this application.

Your third option is a DIY router mill. This may be more work than you are interested in but it does give you a few advantages. One is being able to size the mill to your needs. Plus a DIY machine can be easier to maintain as you know it inside out. The biggest problem here is the need to have access to machining equipment to do a decent job of it.

[waltpermenter]

I'm looking for a small benchtop machine to mill plastic sheet into guitar picks. I'm looking to make a few different style picks. This is the only application that I am looking to use it for. Any help will be greatly appreciated.

Thanks,

Richard

I'll second hoss2006's recommendation. You say you are wanting to cut the picks out of plastic sheet and a router would be the logical choice here. there are many routers on ebay that are ready to go just needing a computer. This would be far easier to get making parts quickly versus a diy or partially built machine and much cheaper than a little mill cnced that would have half the work area.
walt

[hive8]

I second a router too, get them on ebay, all you need is a high rpm spindle and some bits which are easy to find and not to expensive, if you go down the mill road you will spend a lot more money then with a router on tooling and other things...

Also what dimensions are you talking about in terms of work cube (part size with stock)

[arkfisher]

Thanks for the reply's.

I will be the first to admit that I'm a dummy when it comes to this stuff. lol

My material will be sheets roughly 8 x 12 inches and 3-4mm in thickness. I would like to maximize the number of picks that I can cut out from this material because it's not cheap. Also, I need to thin the material down to anywhere from 1.2-2.5mm in thickness. I'd like to be able to bevel the edges as well, but I can sand that if I have to.

I'll be spending roughly 100$ a sheet for my material and with the pick style that I want to make I can get roughly 18 picks out of a sheet. I also need a way to bevel the edges consistently. What I want to make is similar to these picks here: CT55 - BlueChip Picks

As with anyone, I'd like to spend as little as possible and get the best results possible as well. I'd like to stay under $1000 total, and even less if I can. 1000$ may be my budget, but if I can do it for $100 I'm all for it.

I'd like to buy American made, but I know it's not always possible anymore....

Thanks again!

Richard

[cameraguy]

You can thin them out to very exact thickness with a fly cutter, and can mill them out with very fine bits. I use cutters down to .007" (seven one-thousandths of an inch) wide for material like that. You could also profile your logo or name on the pick with the same cutters. Once you get a machine going, it should run those picks out consistently and like clockwork, with few if any rejects.

If you are looking into other general machining and playing, there is a fun world of machining out there. However, the learning curve for the machine mechanically, electrically, electronically, and learning both the computer driver software, understanding the GCode of the programs it runs, and the design software to draft the programs in the first place, are all one hell of a learning curve. After you get all that, then you need to use it to learn machining itself.
If it sounds like fun for you, and it is, obviously jump right in and learn it like most of us did. The info is out there. Just be warned that it will take some time to get profitable - none of us started this cold and got manufacturing new products out the door in any short period of time.

Not to scare you off, quite to the contrary. I think its a great idea. I just need to understand where you are coming from, and to figure out what you need. You didn't mention wanting to learn to be a machinist, only to produce guitar picks. As such, I have a feeling you would prefer a machine that magically produced your product more like an appliance, than a desire to unlock the wonders of becoming a machinist.

It sounds like a pure business decision. If all the learning curve is just a means to a specific end, it may make more business sense to have a person or firm design a package solution for you. Its done all the time - A small company just wants an appliance that does 'A' when you stick in 'B' shaped raw stock in and push the shiny red button, it makes noise then and out comes 'C' finished parts, so they get a consultant to do it for them. I know, its what I used to do.
If that sounds attractive to you, the parts for a machine already preconfigured for optimal performance cutting luthier materials could be sourced, a fixture made for clamping that specific sized material, program(s) written to cut picks to your specs, and tooling and other consumables supplied to you. At that point, your learning consists of simply understanding basic maintenance of the machine, and after you unpack it, it starts making money for you day one.
At that point, you lose the understanding of what is going on, but you start producing product. Otherwise you will have some months or year or so of messing with finding the right everything and getting it all working together. That trial and error can be expensive too. It might save some money if all the stuff you got, day one, was working for you, even if you had to pay someone else to do it.
Between getting producing faster, and the cost of trial and error with your hardware, it may make more business sense to just hire a consultant. If you have more time than money jump in and learn! Either way we are here to help. I can advise, PM me if you need some private recommendations.

[waltpermenter]

Thanks for the reply's.

I will be the first to admit that I'm a dummy when it comes to this stuff. lol

My material will be sheets roughly 8 x 12 inches and 3-4mm in thickness. I would like to maximize the number of picks that I can cut out from this material because it's not cheap. Also, I need to thin the material down to anywhere from 1.2-2.5mm in thickness. I'd like to be able to bevel the edges as well, but I can sand that if I have to.

I'll be spending roughly 100$ a sheet for my material and with the pick style that I want to make I can get roughly 18 picks out of a sheet. I also need a way to bevel the edges consistently. What I want to make is similar to these picks here: CT55 - BlueChip Picks

As with anyone, I'd like to spend as little as possible and get the best results possible as well. I'd like to stay under $1000 total, and even less if I can. 1000$ may be my budget, but if I can do it for $100 I'm all for it.

I'd like to buy American made, but I know it's not always possible anymore....

Thanks again!

Richard

K2CNC, K2 USA CNC Router, Cabinet CNC Router, Small to Large CNC Router Machines, Desktop CNC router. and EZ router, CNC Router & CNC Plasma Machines for Business or Hobby - ez Router are a couple US made companies that have small routers. you'll have to request prices but don't expect it to be very cheap. If you want to get a complete system that you don't have to spend time building and come under your budget, a chinese router is going to be your best bet like it or not. find one in your budget, read thru their feedback, search google for reviews and be happy with your purchase. then you just need to learn the software to make your parts,. there's a router forum here Commercial CNC Wood Routers - CNCzone.com-The Largest Machinist Community on the net! you'll find better info.
walt

[wizard]

Thanks for the reply's.

I will be the first to admit that I'm a dummy when it comes to this stuff. lol

That is ok, up to a minute ago I didn't think anybody would pay more than $2 for a guitar pick!

My material will be sheets roughly 8 x 12 inches and 3-4mm in thickness. I would like to maximize the number of picks that I can cut out from this material because it's not cheap. Also, I need to thin the material down to anywhere from 1.2-2.5mm in thickness. I'd like to be able to bevel the edges as well, but I can sand that if I have to.

I missed the sheet material in the last post. However I have to ask what is the material?

Also I would resist the desire to jump on the cheap CNC router bandwagon. It is not that a CNC router is a bad idea just that it should be big enough to hold all your fixturing needs. That means big enought to hold the blank sheet plus one or more fixtures to hold the semi finished picks. There is a strong likely hood that one or more of these fixtures will need a vacuum source. There is almost zero likely hood that you can do this for less that $1000 with ready to go hardware.

I'll be spending roughly 100$ a sheet for my material and with the pick style that I want to make I can get roughly 18 picks out of a sheet.

$100 that is highway robbery for a sheet of plastic.

I also need a way to bevel the edges consistently. What I want to make is similar to these picks here: CT55 - BlueChip Picks

This is why I mentioned fixturing above. To do this well you will need to work out some fixturing arrangements. It may be possible with a 3 axis machine but most likely will require a part flip or special tooling. The big problem is that this is a very cosmetic product so precision will be paramount.

In the end I'm really thinking a general purpose machine is not the way to go here. It might workout much better to have the parts clamped between centers and profiled there.

As with anyone, I'd like to spend as little as possible and get the best results possible as well. I'd like to stay under $1000 total, and even less if I can.

This isn't impossible for a DIY solution with scrounged up parts, I think it is next to impossible with off the shelf hardware.

1000$ may be my budget, but if I can do it for $100 I'm all for it.

I'd like to buy American made, but I know it's not always possible anymore....

The big problem is that there really isn't a machine out there that is optimal for your needs and fits your budget. Even if you come up with a cheap router you still need to solve all of your fixturing and tooling needs.

Thanks again!

Richard

If it was me I'd design a die to mold various thickness blanks out of Utem or some other super plastic and then focus on a compact machine to machine them to final dimensions. At $100 a sheet you are already to the point where molding might be economical. With the blanks you can then have almost infinite profiling capability.

There are of course other approaches but I'd start by eliminating the sheet material.

By the way your expenses are just starting. I highly doubt that those picks have the surface finish you see in the pictures right out of a mill. This mean some sort of secondary operation that could be mechanical or chemical finishing of the parts. It is the polished appearance that is bothersome and likely important for the prices being charged.

[hive8]

Other option would be a high rez 3d printer, if the material is right, these things can print to 100micron, then a little polishing and your good to go... no need for tooling...

Or an other way too, an hand injection molding machine, and have someone make a model for you...

[arkfisher]

Thanks again for the replies. I am definitely learning a lot already.

Wizard,

The material is considered a "plastic", but it's a polymerized animal protein. It is not possible to mold this material due to the curing process which takes months.

The whole idea is to mimic the texture and sound that is achieved from using natural tortoise shell (which has been illegal to have since I think the 60's)

I can make the polymer myself, but after it is made, it has to cure in a formaldehyde bath for up to 6 months in order to achieve the desired hardness. Hence, the high cost for the material.

I will have roughly $4 each in the pick, just in material.

The blue chip picks are made from a type of plastic that is extremely expensive (they say 1000's of dollars per sheet), and I don't think they are as good as this material will be.

Thanks again guys!


I know that the pick wouldn't be finished until it is buffed or sanded with a 1000 grit+ sandpaper, which in and of itself would require a setup to "finish" the pick.

Honestly, if it cost's more... I could still do it. I'm working on a prototype right now to make sure it's what I want to do.

Just looking to get all the help I can here...like I said, I'm kinda a dummy at this stuff ;-)