Moving to Oz, just how much of the shop to bring....

[janders57]

G'day all, I'm a native Californian (meaning I was here before things got anywhere near as bad as they are) and just married to a gal in Cootamundra, NSW. It's my intention to relocate permanently to Coota, but timing is something very much up in the air right now.

I work from home as a small machine shop. I have a manual Bridgeport, a NMTB40 taper CNC knee mill running Ahha (with intent to switch to Mach3), Hardinge w/Omniturn CNC, a 50's vintage Hardinge Chucker, Roll-In saw, and a whole mess of tooling and misc hand power tools for machining and light fabricating. I have a TON of questions regarding what, if anything, I should bring with me that requires power.

My Bridgeport is rated 50/60hz, but nothing else is. Cheap and easy out is run the other three big machines via inverter and set output to 60hz. I can readily convert the drill press and saw to 50hz motors there. For the not inconsiderable number of power hand tools, I'm looking for a small generator here that I will drive with a 50hz motor there. That's something of a pain, but I have a sizable investment in these tools.

Among my many questions:

Aus Customs folks advised that bringing in used machines requires special permits. Anyone know anything about this?

Are there any electrical code issues with my plan to have a basic sub-panel supplying 110v/60Hz from the generator? If so, would not hardwiring anything and just using extension cords work?

Availability of NMTB 40 taper holders in metric, see a few on eBay here now and then, would be nice to add metric holders there if they can be had reasonably.

Is anything in the way of cutters, drills, taps, available there in inch sizes?
I plan to bring a mess of such items to support my own stuff (repairs and such). Yes, I will of course be adopting metric as fast as possible, I work with it now and have some metric tooling. Just wondering if I needed any inch stuff if it could be found there or if I'd have to import it. When I was there a couple months ago, I noticed screws in a hardware store labeled as "1/4 x 30mm", leading me to believe there might be a fair bit of inch hardware and tooling floating around still.

Coota is a ways from anything, where would the nearest suppliers of tooling and materials such as aluminum plate and extrusion, and plastics such as Delrin be located?

As I mentioned right off, I'm not sure when I'd be moving. Economy is a big factor. I have several folks there interested in hiring me, so I'm -not- counting on showing up, setting up shop, and trying to make a living. And not sure if I could find enough work to justify the expense of bringing everything over. Maybe the BP mill and source an engine lathe there...
I'm already looking at approx $10k for a container and getting it delivered there, adding a second container would really add to that. I could get a 40' container here about as cheap as a 20', but given the layout of my driveway, a 40' would be nigh well impossible to set down, let alone winch all the machinery uphill into it....

While I may not bring the big iron, I will be bringing all the tooling and such, and may just set up a small fix-it type shop when I can buy a mill and lathe there. And with that, what are the big names in older quality mills and lathes?
Are Bridgeport and Hardinge common at all? Would be looking for R8 spindle mills, 5C capable engine lathe. What am I likely to pay for a Bridgeport or clone with DRO, and a lathe in 35cm x 100cm capacity?

Hardly gotten started with questions I fear. I know it sounds like I need to figure out what I want to do, but that's the point of all these questions.
Need to figure which way to go. Sorry for the long post, but it's a big move and I want to make sure I consider everything.

Thank you,

Jon Anderson
Grass Valley, Calif.

[Davo J]

Here is a link to one machinery supplier https://www.machineryhouse.com.au/ these are the general prices of new import machines around here.If you want a quality brand second hand mill and lathe in good condition you would be looking at around $4,000 to $10,000 each in that size.So if your lathe and mill are in good condition it might be worth bring them because it may cost less and it is a pain trying to locate good machines and it is expensive shipping them, as you say your miles away from anything.
Davo

[skippy]

The $10k USD sounds expensive for a 20' container. I just got a 40' container from China and it cost me $4,500 including road freight (factory to port, 300km) in China, shipping to Spain, road freight (port to factory, 200km) here in Spain, customs inspection fee and customs agent/broker's fee. Admittedly it was from China but $10k USD sounds like a lot.
Good luck by the way as it is a big step you are taking. I'll more than likely be back living there by the end of this year myself as a result of being shafted by this wonderful economic crisis here.

[janders57]

Originally Posted by Davo J If you want a quality brand second hand mill and lathe in good condition you would be looking at around $4,000 to $10,000 each in that size.

Thank you for the link, good starting point to reference from.
And thanks for the rough values on quality used machines. Looks like maybe I ought to at least consider bringing the whole lot!


Jon

[janders57]

Originally Posted by skippy The $10k USD sounds expensive for a 20' container. I just got a 40' container from China and it cost me $4,500 including road freight (factory to port, 300km) in China, shipping to Spain, road freight (port to factory, 200km) here in Spain, customs inspection fee and customs agent/broker's fee. Admittedly it was from China but $10k USD sounds like a lot. Good luck by the way as it is a big step you are taking. I'll more than likely be back living there by the end of this year myself as a result of being shafted by this wonderful economic crisis here.

40' containers are just about the same as 20' here, but I have an uphill driveway that starts a meter past the garage door. I can put one 20' next to the garage, but a 40' in the driveway would render the entire driveway unusable. I'm looking at $2300 for a clean container certified for international shipping delivered to my driveway, and about $1800 in AUD to haul from the Sydney port and dropped on a lot in Coota. Adding a second container doubles that first figure, but has only a minor impact on the 2nd.

I'm looking into costs to transport 1 or 2 containers to the nearest port, and what it'll cost to float it down to Oz. And figuring a few hundred for customs.
Seems anything I can't find a receipt for, I'm going to have to pay GST, and that includes a fair bit of stuff around here. That could cost me. Then there's wood certified for entry to Oz for pallets and cribbing, and other packaging costs. I'm trying to figure on the high side to make sure I don't get caught short.

Right now, don't have the $$ to move everything. If things go much further south here, won't get there either. Have a complex decision tree as to how much to move vs how much cost vs how much time. I'll have one 20 container here soon, in the worst case I could load it up and store in on a mate's property until I can afford to ship it. I'd have to fire-sale everything else though.

I'm going back in October for another visit, and will be talking to a few folks that are willing to hire me for my welding background, as well as see if anyone would be interested in a space sharing arrangement. Maybe I could work part time while ramping up work for the machine shop... Folks there are very friendly, and I'm betting if I can get everything there, something will work out.

Thanks,

Jon

[skippy]

"Seems anything I can't find a receipt for, I'm going to have to pay GST, and that includes a fair bit of stuff around here"
They're really only interested in stopping commercial imports that seek to avoid paying import taxes so for the stuff that you don't have receipts for, just get several "blanket" receipts from one or more friends in business. Make sure they show the dates as being from some years ago. They sure aint going to carbon date em!

If Handlewanker gets to see this post he'll be sure to mention it saying something like "rats jumping off the sinking ship" over in the AGW thread. Just joking guys, I promise!

[Geof]

I suppose I should make some comment about not wanting to rain on your parade or something like that; let me introduce a negative note into all the plans. Don't run yourself totally bereft of resources making a move like this; it is a huge jump and if for some totally unforeseen reason you cannot make a go of it down there but do not have the finances to return to CA life can turn bitter very fast. I migrated from NZ to Canada four decades ago and things worked out well for me but I used to know Kiwis who couldn't make the switch and returned and I knew Canadians who went down there but returned. Completely turning your life upside down is a huge task and you don't realise how huge until the dust has settled and you cannot go back.

[skippy]

Well written Geof and very valid. I wished him good luck and I wholeheartedly meant it BUT my advice is also to think about it very carefully first. I did the very same thing for love 15 years ago (get your violins out) and here I am at 50 years old forced to go back to my country with my tail between my legs because of (a) a failed business due to the economic crisis (lost most everything) and the wife gets to keep the rest, and (c) as a husband I found out that I’ve been replaced since early this year and so (c) I get to leave my kids here on the other side of the world from me (mixed marriages suck) as this is their country, meanwhile I don’t have enough to even feed myself let alone buy a ticket home. And just to think, I came here with a LOT of money..... How life can change....

[janders57]

Geof and Skippy,

Really appreciate the cautions. I won't get into the details, but she and I have an unusual and very strong relationship. Last marriage lasted 18 years with lots of troubles. I know this one will go the distance.

I've always loved Australia, and came close to moving there in the 70's when the government was looking for skilled welders. I did see a fairly wide cross section of Oz in 2 weeks. Some things suck a bit, like the scarcity of surplus tools and tooling I've grown used to. But people are friendlier, real, down to earth. My kind of people. I've always longed for a simpler country lifestyle. I am confident I have a good grasp of the changes I'll be facing, and my ability to fit in. Heck, everyone in her family says I'm already more Aussie than Yank, just my accent gives me away. That and I keep looking the wrong way when crossing streets...

And the reality is, if I stay here, I risking losing it all. The local county has been unfriendly to manufacturing for years and it shows. California too, has not been business friendly. Have lost a lot of work to China, and some customers have closed doors. Meanwhile cost of living keeps going up. Where to move to here? Nevada maybe, Texas I hear is doing reasonably well. But to move anywhere in the USA puts me all alone in a strange town/state where I don't know anyone. In Coota at least, my wife has lots of connections due to years of working at the hospital, volunteer fire fighter, and 'ninja carrot' as she calls it, emergency rescue services (not sure of the official title down under).

I do have a shot at a job with a defense contractor via a friend that took my resume straight to his boss, and perhaps a recent new customer will ramp up fast enough to make the difference. If either comes to pass, I'll be here for some years to come and we'll visit back and forth as much as we can. If neither comes to pass, I'm more than willing to gamble everything on a new life in a new country. No guts, no glory, or something like that... My ideal timeline is to move in 2-3 years. Economy goes down the crapper here though, and I'll shorten that quite a bit.

There is there, what my wife calls "fair go", and maybe it's an artifact of country life there, but people in the smaller town pull together and help each other out. There are more than a few opportunities for me there in differing fields, all I have to do is want to give them a try, and they'll give me a try. Not like here, where you need at least one degree to get your foot in many doors. I most certainly am not counting on setting up a machine shop in a rural town and making a living right off the bat. Plan is to get a job, then find a place for my shop, then start off part time. If the job goes well, maybe my machine shop can once again become what it started out as, my hobby!
I'd love to get into restoring old motorcycles, antique tractors, and maybe build a small steam locomotive....


Jon

[Geof]

Good luck, if you want to make it work you will make it work; I have proven that to myself. And isn't it a bit sad that California, which was the place people moved to back in the 40's through 60's to get ahead, has turned into a place those same people now move away from.

[tumutbound]

Originally Posted by janders57 Aus Customs folks advised that bringing in used machines requires special permits. Anyone know anything about this?

In general, if you've owned the item for more than 12 months, it's GST exempt. There may be different rules if you're bringing in items that will be used to earn income. Have a look at this customs information sheet.

Are there any electrical code issues with my plan to have a basic sub-panel supplying 110v/60Hz from the generator? If so, would not hardwiring anything and just using extension cords work?

You can't perform any mains wiring without a license, which you can only get after doing an electrical apprenticeship.

Is anything in the way of cutters, drills, taps, available there in inch sizes?

See the link to Hare and Forbes as provided earlier. I've bought all my stuff via eBay. You won't pay GST on eBay sourced items unless the value of the import is over $1000.

Coota is a fair way from anything, where would the nearest suppliers of tooling and materials such as aluminum plate and extrusion, and plastics such as Delrin be located?

Wagga Wagga is the closest big town/city and does have a number fo engineering supply places. Other than that, Sydney and Melbourne are about equal distance from Coota.

[Cootamundra is a nice place. I often pass through on my way to/from my property in Tumut]

[janders57]

Originally Posted by Geof And isn't it a bit sad that California, which was the place people moved to back in the 40's through 60's to get ahead, has turned into a place those same people now move away from.

Indeed. And I have fairly deep roots here. My grandfather came from the Pyrenees in the late 1800's. He was a blacksmith in the Death Valley region and was one such contracted by the Borax company to make wagon wheel hoops and shoes for the mules. Also founded a ranch called Junction Ranch that is now enclosed within a China Lake weapons test range. He also opened a machine shop in Los Angeles for a time.

My step father's family predates the state itself, having obtained a Spanish Land Grant in 1849, when they owned half of Cathay's Valley west of Yosemite.

But it's fast approaching time to head somewhere that still values skilled labor. Sigh, hurts to say that....