I am evaluating Excalibur and OneCNC software to purchase.
I was wondering if anyone had any input on technical support, or recomendations as to which is more user friendly. I use Cimatron currently and want to put one of these on the shop floor to aliviate G-Code programming at the machine control.

John,
I have used AusCAD which was what it was called before OneCNC. In fairness to it, I didn't use it much, but I really prefer Excalibur to it. I'm in Brisbane Australia(so is OneCNC by the way to the best of my knowledge) and I find it easier to speak with Don and get help from him than I would normally recieve from someone right here in Brissy.
Personally I believe this to be the biggest factor for Excalibur.
Aside from that, the post processor is very easy to configure to suit your particular machine.
I honestly believe you would be very happy with Excalibur if you decided on it over another package.
So in answer to your question, Technical support is excellent.....Even across the other side of the world, very easy to talk to and actually wants to help you with your concern.
I also find it user friendly, but I guess it is what you become used to.
I hope this helps..........Greig

We had Xcad which is Excalibur we tried to use it but the the 3d roughing which dosent work properly ruined a few jobs and cost us so much that we got rid of it and purchased Mastercam. We needed an extra seat of cam have since bought Onecnc also and you cant even compare it to Excalibur as far as 3d is concerned especially. We believe Onecnc is better than Mastercam. Our main use for cam is machining solids from Solidworks so I would check with other users that have actually used both before in a full on 3d situation because I assure you we have and thats our view.
Another view which I hope helps.

I had problems with the 3D machining before the last update as well. But that is fixed now.
Here is a link to a 3d job we just did for a customers Harley drag bike.
http://www.stripbike.com/ubb/Forum10/HTML/000052.html

I used plunge roughing on this job and then machined with a 16mm ball cutter.

Came out just like the 3D drawing........

Greig

They look great but they won't fit on my Jeep. LOL

Actually we will be using the software for 2d machining only. I am the only one that does 3d programming and I use Cimatron. Excalibur or OneCNC is for the others that do not know how to program w/ cimatron. Right now they program pockets and holes at the controller. The software should save us hours each week.

John,

One big difference between Excalibur and OneCNC is in the associative machining. Excalibur has always been able to update the toolpath whenever the model geometry changes or the operation parameters change. This is available in both the Shop Floor product and the full product. Since you are looking at the 2D machining only, the Shop Floor product is the way to go and is much much less expensive! BTW...Cruncher's comments are well taken but the XCAD/XCAM product was obsoleted a few years ago for Excalibur. and there have been many changes made since then. Good Luck in your search for the right product.

I used to think in terms of buying the cheapest to get 2d, as though 2d were a less complex thing to handle. However, this is typical of me being stuck in the paradigm of "geometry-based CADCAM", as if the only concern is the accuracy of the code output, and ability to handle 3d roughing and finishing in various ways.

However, since I have been exposed to and use the OnecncXP series, I see the fallacy of thinking in terms of buying a program that focuses on the bare output of nc code, heck Bobcad will do that!

Onecnc's NC manager is a far greater tool than I realized. It is a superior asset for controlling multiple processes in 2d work, which can become very complicated, and make plain old 3d look like child's play.

Make sure that whatever you buy has something comparable to Onecnc's NC manager. This function is available in the cheapest version Mill Production XP, which is the entry level 2.5d package.

Thank you for your advice and input.

I believe Excalibur and One CNC can do the job. They are very simillar in interface and can produce the quality of tool path. We have to chose between the two and take everything into account.
Ease of use (I have to train 5 people) Flexibility ie being able to manipulate the software to do what I want. And technical support. Obviously I do not know thier full potential and what may work better for us but I need to weigh everything in my descision. And ultimatley the descision is not mine. I can make very strrong recomendations but I don't cut and sign the check.

I just believe that nearly any software will be an improvement over programming at the controller yes even BobCAD. That is what we are looking to eliminate. Cimatron has nearly every funtion that any software I have evaluated and probabbly has more options inside each function. Plus with over 15 seats company wide we will not be changing 3d programming software any time soon. It is difficult to use but I can get it to do almost anything I want. Hopefully I will be getting exposed to Five axis programming late this year. That will be the greatest challenge.

Sorry Got off on a tangent.

This site has been helpful in making my descisions

Merlin,
If I understand your previous post, are you saying that there is a difference in the way Onecnc & Excalibur handle associative machining? I don't have a good grasp on the associative machining definition. I would like to know better what this encompasses, and also what is the difference in the way the 2 mentioned softwares address this process.
Thank you.

Post script to above message:
"Anyone" who can answer either of the above 2 questions that I asked Merlin, please feel free to jump in here with your thoughts!
Thanks

SRT

Associative machining it where the actual machining task is linked to the geometry in the drawing. Therefore, when for example a circle that was previously used in a drilling operation is moved to a new location, all machining tasks that used that circle are updated as well. This means you don't have to redo any machining operations when you change the model. This feature is new to OneCNC...just made available in the XP product. The lower end OneCNC products do not have this feature that I am aware.

Since the Excalibur Shop Floor product is the same as the Full product except without 3D surface machining, you get all of the power and machining optimization found in the full product...including associative machining.

Merlin,
I'm wondering, as you describe the one circle feature being moved to a new location, with all the tasks following along, would the same apply if the whole model were moved to a new location would the associative machining be able to handle all of those feature moves as a group.
Does Excalibur have the capability to make working with rotary tombstone programming easier, such as if parts were origionally placed at one location but then were relocated to a different position later, would that be possible with a little programming or would it be an involved process to accomplish.
Thank you.

As far as I can tell, OnecncXP does not have the kind of associative properties that Merlin speaks of. I tried a simple translate of a bunch of holes, and then reposted the code, and the positions given in the code are still the old positions.

The association that I see is between the tool (machining) parameters and a given surface or object that was chosen previously. If I create a process to face a surface with a given stepover, and then decide later to change the stepover, I do not have to reselect the surface again, I just redo the tool parameters, and the paths are updated after that.

I am not sure if both types of associations are possible within one software, to have fixed parameters, and movable entities, versus a fixed set of entities and variable tool (machining) parameters??

HFD,
I'm not sure if understand that Excalibur will do it either, what I am hoping is that it, or onecnc can accomplish it . I thought that I would present the question to Merlin to see If I could get more of an understanding of the capabilities of associative machining as available in Excalibur. Stay Tuned In, until Merlin gets back on line and maybe we'll get an answer. Thanks for looking into it, as to how Onecnc can possibly handle this moving around!

HFD,
I looked up ExcaliburCNC's site, an unless I'm missing something in the pricing, it looks like it adds up to 3400 vs. 6500 for the other one previously mentioned.

If you select entities for an operation, and then move them around, when you re-post it, the new position will show up in the code. It's real simple.
I was doing a job where I had several bars that required drilling and slotting on the one drawing, and to post the drilling I was moving the drawing around to position the current bar on the o,o,o point.
I forgot to move one of the bars and when I did the code it wasn't in the correct place. I then moved the drawing so the desired bar was at 0,0,0 and re-posted. It was fine.
The same with tool properties.
I was doing a job with a 1mm diameter cutter. I took the cut too deep, so I went into modify parameters for that operation, changed the depth of cut, and then reposted...it is very easy.
I think this is what you are referring to isn't it.
Tools are the same. If you find the feed isn't correct for example, you can go into modify tools, and change it to the correct amount. Re-post and it will update it correctly.
I'm led to believe that the only time it becomes a problem is when you move the entities and you havge specified a start point. My understanding is the start point stays the same, but the entry point will move to the new position. I de-select start point most of the time anyway.
Greig
MPE

Originally posted by SRT
HFD,
I looked up ExcaliburCNC's site, an unless I'm missing something in the pricing, it looks like it adds up to 3400 vs. 6500 for the other one previously mentioned.

Price is only one factor, make sure you look deeper than that. Onecnc Mill Professional XP is comparable dollars and might be comparable featurewise, too. The difference in execution of the two programs is phenomenal, and you should not assume that "one is chocolate, and the other is vanilla" ;)

Actually I was hoping to get a banna split with all the toppings, for the price of a cone with a dip of chocolate and a dip of vanilla. I don't know very much about either yet (thus the investigation), but I did just see today when I looked at the Excalibur sight that it looks like it supports DWG which is 1 of the reasons I started looking beyond BC18. Another thing I just noticed today was that the Excalibur mentions mold splitting capabilities (I don't know if that is the same as 1CNC's process or not) but don't you have to get the Expert (6500) to have that ability? I don't believe the Mill Prof XP will take you there, will it? I would have thought by now (with all my questions) that it was obvious I was looking deeper than just the price. The difference in the execution of the 2 programs that you mention, are you comparing "Excalibur Demo" to your full blown 1CNC Expert?

MPE Racing,
Thanks for the reply. If I understand, it sounds like Excalibur will move an entire part, if necessary, without much of a program rewrite. That sounds good. Would you be able to give me a little understanding as to how any simulation, and or rendering, would work. I'm trying to find solid software that will make things a little easier for indexing parts on a rotary table with multiple angles etc. (just simple indexing for now). Thank you.

MPE Racing,
I just went to the Excalibur site again as I didn't have much time to look today. I believe I have found some of the answers that I was looking for. When I looked in the Mill and Verification I saw what I have been asking about. "4 Axis Positioning", "model rotation planes", rotations and "fixture offsets", can be defined in any axis, simulation cutviewer, animated shows a tool in the model (is that a "moving tool" during the model simulation?). Is this for real, or did I just imagine it!

I've only used the cut viewer in demo. But yes it had the tool machining the part.
I would normally just look at the toolpaths in the standard animation to see what is happening. There is a animation speed you can change to make it faster or slower.
As far as changing the drawing position. When you move it, if you are happy with things like depth of cut and tools etc, all you have to do is move it and repost it....It takes literally seconds.....
It really IS that easy.......

SRT

Excalibur has not released their shopfloor software yet. The price quoted to me is 750. Though as mentioned in previous posts, it has NO CAD capabilities. If you down load their demo I believe there is am example of assoc. machining. A pocket with an island is programmed then the island is moved which inturn the toolpath is also moved. That is all I have seen I don't know what else it can do as far as rotary tombstones or moving the entire model.

John F,

Excalibur Shop Floor will have 2D CAD creation and modification commands. You can even import 3D CAD but you can't modify it or machine past the 2D commands such as Profiling, Pocketing etc...

Shop Floor is only $750.00 US and it will start shipping this week. You should be able to download an eval later this week.

It sounds like MPE has answered most or SRT's questions...YES Excalibur can modify entities, operation parameter and tool parameters.

Originally posted by SRT
Actually I was hoping to get a banna split with all the toppings, for the price of a cone with a dip of chocolate and a dip of vanilla. I don't know very much about either yet (thus the investigation), but I did just see today when I looked at the Excalibur sight that it looks like it supports DWG which is 1 of the reasons I started looking beyond BC18. Another thing I just noticed today was that the Excalibur mentions mold splitting capabilities (I don't know if that is the same as 1CNC's process or not) but don't you have to get the Expert (6500) to have that ability? I don't believe the Mill Prof XP will take you there, will it? I would have thought by now (with all my questions) that it was obvious I was looking deeper than just the price. The difference in the execution of the 2 programs that you mention, are you comparing "Excalibur Demo" to your full blown 1CNC Expert?

SRT, AFAIK, the Excalibur demo is not crippled, and I think you are correct about the some of the extra cost in Onecnc Mill Expert being due to mold shelling and splitting, and extra toolpathing options. However, the layout of all the XP series are similar. Sorry there is no way to demo the Onecnc software except through the 30 day money-back guarantee, because watching the video is nothing like using it.

Anyways, good luck in whatever you choose. Since you can already download and use Excalibur for 30 days, that should tell you whether it will serve your needs, but it looks too complex for my liking. That is just my opinion in a brief comparison of the two, of course. At least I made the effort to take a look :)

HFD,
Thank you, I've got an Excalibur CD on the way.
The Excalibur download didn't say 7.0, but rather XCAD/XCAM, so I don't know if the download is "the real deal" or if it is like the 1 CNC Mill Demo was (without the XP series update). Question, what does AFAIK stand for?

AFAIK = geek talk for "as far as I know"
:D

Can Shop Floor be upgraded to handle 3D machining like the full Excalibur?

HomeCNC

AFAIK
(did I do that right?)
But if you know you need 3d machining why not purchase it up front?

Because I'm very close to winning the contest for Shop Floor :D

Originally posted by HomeCNC
Because I'm very close to winning the contest for Shop Floor :D

You got that right! Are you going to do a review on it for us?

Did you get the Excalibur Demo. How are you going with it?

When I first used it I was a bit stumped as I was used to AutoCAD. But now I love it.

One thing to watch. If the Angle button is on which is like an ortho button, it can do some funny things. just make sure it is is off unless you want to draw lines at defined angles.

One thing I do like is the Transform button, which drops down to sub-menus of move and copy. Then you select the one you want. I like this feature. Just a small thing but good.

Another good button is in the tools drop down. The second from the top is entity properties. With this, you can select an entity, and change the things like start and finish points, length, diameter etc. I know all packages have this, it's just nice to know what they are called and where it is.

There is a flyout button which has all the best mdify tools on it. It has things like offset, trim, stretch, break etc.
Because I use these buttons all the time, I've taken each button and added it to the main menu so they are all on my screen all the time. This way I don't need to wait for the flyout and move to the one I want. This is handy I find.

Keep us up to speed on how you are going

Greig
MPE

MPE,
I'll be loading it, to take a look tomorrow morning.

I reckon we'll see HFD running Excalibur soon too.....!!!!....LOL

Greig

Originally posted by MPE racing
I reckon we'll see HFD running Excalibur soon too.....!!!!....LOL

Greig

Not likely very soon, Greig. Maybe if I hadn't already spent my money, I would work the demo harder :) I just want to get a glimpse of what is going on in some of the other camps.

I'm still really enthused about OnecncXP. I actually think that OnecncXP has lifted a fog of confusion from my mind over how CADCAM software ought to work.

That is not saying that Excalibur is bad, because I don't actually know, but it looks harder to learn.

I'll be interested to hear the upcoming testimonials from the new users of Excalibur.

I did put LOL at the end though.....

I'm like you are with OneCNC.....I think Excalibur is the easy to use and just great. Don is very helpful and that is a real selling point to me. Plus I have my mate in Canada I can bounce ideas off and exchange drawings with now.

Greig

Greig, I was not at all offended by your comment, and yes, I did see your "lol".
All is well :)