I have been working on this project for about 1 week and 2 days now.


Do you think it will work?

Your controller looks very neat, nice job on that. I'm not convinced that using the rack and pinion z drive is going to work though. There will be an awful lot of backlash.

Some nice work Chuck, I like the Z axis setup, but like Rat, I think you'll have some problems unless you've done something to get rid of the backlash.

Thanks guys

I think I will have more y-axis problems then the z-axis with the counter balance detached there is no backlash in the z-axes as long as I don’t do any fast hard plungers into the material. – I hope any way -

p.s. this is the first time I ever touched a mill so I have a lot to learn.

Interesting point Chuck, as the biggest problem I have with the Z is it getting pulled into the work as the bit bites, with all the weight on the rack it might not do that, hmmm.

let us know how well it works

do u have a cooling fan or vents in that electronics enclosure? might get a bit toasty in there. very clean though

do u have a cooling fan or vents in that electronics enclosure? might get a bit toasty in there. very clean though

Yes I have 2 fans in there the stock fan that was in the box I replaced and the other is at the bottom right in the picture.

She’s all done – I hope

Works very well

Now all I have to do is figure out how to get my project drawings in there.

Looks really good Chuck, could you take a couple more picture of your new Y setup?

Have you cut any metal yet? Does the Z axis work as you'd hoped?

what size stepper (oz wise) are you using on the Z since you don't have any counter balance?

a very clean design

chuck,

where did you get your box for the electronics? The wiring job looks absolutely awsome. Very clean. Can you give as much detail on what you used for wiring in terms of kind of wire, where to get it, what are you using for hold downs for the wire, etc...

Once again great job on the wiring.

I cut some metal with the jog only in mach3 and everything works better then I thought it would.

I used this kit with the 4 axis and 425 oz motors http://www.kelinginc.net/ThreeXCNCPackage.html


A friend of mine had the box lying around and gave to me, it is 12” x 12” x 4”

I used 4-16ga wire for the motors and 4-22ga wire for the home and limit switches the wire ties are held down with those tape blocks and I got all at the local electronics store.

Cool, thanks for the info and pictures Chuck.

Keep us up dated as you start running it harder :)

Chuck whats the part number on the large timing pulley you used on your Z-axis?
I'm assuming the other pulleys are the ones used by Blade in his build?
Same belt on Z and X ?

Sorry for all the questions, but it looks like I'll be able to start my conversion sooner than I thought.

I plan on basing it around what you and Blades have done.

Thanks,
-Doug

https://sdp-si.com/eStore/Default.asp

Here is the z part #
A 6R 3-067037
A 6A 3-22DF03708
A 6A 3-45NF03710

Here is the y part #
A 6R 3-079037
A 6A 3-22H3708
A 6A 3-22DF03708

I used a longer belt for the y-axis then Blades used so I could move the motor out and down so it would not hit the x-axis motor.

cool thanks Chuck

Though the y looked like it was angled down a bit :)

Hey Chuck, looks really good, man!! Looks like that Z axis idea worked out pretty well.
I haven't been on here much in awhile, as work has been keeping me really burried for awhile now, plus it's been too cold in the garage to hang out there much.

I have been designing a custom extrusion for the Y axis that mounts the same as my original prototype, but it incorporates a belt guard. Only issue with this design (as you pointed out) is that with the motor straight out from the Y axis, the X axis motor will hit it. I only lost a small amount of Y axis travel with my setup, but a larger motor would not work, unless the bracket was flipped over to place the motor on the other side. Anyway, a company in India can produce this custom aluminum extrusion, fully machined and anodized for around $50. Problem is, I'd have to buy 10 of them. :eek:. I found another source for the pulleys, where I could get them for around $1.50 each, with the 20mm hole bored. Problem there is, they also wanted nearly $200 for shipping 40 pulleys. :confused:
I'm not so sure there would be enough demand for this 2 axis kit to make it worth my while.

Other than that, I'm playing around with another controller board I got from the same place I got the original one. This one has more features, is 3 axis, and has limit switch inputs and relays on-board. This setup will run around $150, and come with slightly more powerful motors than I got with my kit.

Here's a pic of the extrusion design:

http://i142.photobucket.com/albums/r89/autocadder/extrusion-1.jpg

Hi Chuckie,
Nice work on the X2. Looking really good.

Blades. I'd love to get the details on the extruder in Indian and the pulleys aswell?
Might be worth looking into.

Rod

Hey Chuck,

You been able to cut some parts and run your setup hard yet?

was wondering how the Z-axis setup/accuracy was doing?

Yes I have been making aluminum and steel parts with no issues with the z-axis and the whole thing works great for me.
I do not know what you mean when you say running it hard because this is the first time I ever laid my hands on a mill of any type.
I will make a video soon and let you decide.

Sounds like you've been working it, looking forward to the video

Stuff I added since last post

4th axis out of an X2 spindle head – shown with R-8 4” chuck.
Z touch probe.
XY cross laser – drilled hole in bottom of the front control box to stay out of the way.
Cool Mist – used a truck 12v air horn solenoid for on/off CNC control .
Spindle CNC on/off control.
Made drawer organizers so I would not have to open all those boxes ever time I go to do something.
Made a lathe tool mount
Added spindle drive timing belt

Looks real good chukkie.
Hows the 425 oz Steppers working out for ya?

Looks real good chukkie.
Hows the 425 oz Steppers working out for ya?

thx
They work ok for me.

Here is some of the junk I made with it.

With the knife I only made the button and wood handles.

Very nice--that turner's cube looks real good. This is with the stock leadscrews, correct? Fun to see what this machine will do with only basic upgrades. Something for anyone doing their first conversion to consider. Seems to me this would be a "nothing wasted" project which could be upgraded to fancy screws or what have you while retaining all the stuff used for this conversion.

Yes it has stock leadscrews

The main point of this conversion to me was to be able to use it manually as well and not have any problems doing it.

I don’t see any point in upgrading to fancy screws. After all this is a small mill and certainly not a production mill.

Very nice--that turner's cube looks real good. This is with the stock leadscrews, correct? Fun to see what this machine will do with only basic upgrades. Something for anyone doing their first conversion to consider. Seems to me this would be a "nothing wasted" project which could be upgraded to fancy screws or what have you while retaining all the stuff used for this conversion.

chukkie
With better screws you get less backlash.
But with the cost of good Ball screws? One has to ask if you realy need them?
Another thing is you get better holding power from Acme screws than a free turning ball screw. Something to consider?
Since im not in to home production just one offs or Rich. And I want the holding power of the acem type screw. Im just doing a mod with a larger Dia. acme. Someday I will have my complete Mod X2 done. Waiting for colder weather. It will be something like Hoss2006 has with more travel table & Base. Well a few other mods.
Say chukkie I like the idea of keeping your X2 manual best way to get a feel for your Mill as your starting out.
Keep up the good work making chips.

Now my backlash is only .0008 with my mod and the backlash can be adjusted easily with an allen wrench without any disassembly

Surprising there aren't more examples of acme and split nut X2 conversions. Works well enough for other small mills. Maybe we have become fascinated with speed increases available with ballscrews ?

I have a spare R8 head and looking at this item for a chuck.
http://www.cnczone.com/forums/showpost.php?p=487013&postcount=3

here is the one i have
http://cgi.ebay.com/BRIDGEPORT-R8-SHANK-4-SELF-CENTERING-3-JAW-CHUCK-NEW_W0QQitemZ350086692263QQihZ022QQcategoryZ25292QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Surprising there aren't more examples of acme and split nut X2 conversions. Works well enough for other small mills. Maybe we have become fascinated with speed increases available with ballscrews ?


I have the split-nut approach on my X1 and no matter how much I adjusted it it never made much difference. Spent a lot of time messing with bearing supports, etc, same story. When I started the X2 I asked "why bother with ball screws" and one guy said "because you'll never have to fiddle with them" and that sold me. The X1 could do nice stuff but you had to spend most of the time nursing it and I wanted something that involved less of that. Time will tell if it works out.

I have the split-nut approach on my X1 and no matter how much I adjusted it it never made much difference.
In theory it should have reduced whatever amount of backlash that was due to play in the nut. The anti-backlash nut in a Taig is more sophisticated but this design fits into the 'use what you got' approach. The results so far look impressive and adjustment is convenient. How long the nuts last run that tight remains to be seen. Worst case you're looking at new nuts at $10 a pop, new screws are cheap too. Cheap replacement parts are one of the beauties of an X2, allowing us to get pretty fearless when modifying. :)

When I started the X2 I asked "why bother with ball screws" and one guy said "because you'll never have to fiddle with them" and that sold me.

And that's the reason I went to ballscrews also. That plus more efficient use of of my low power drive system from a speed perspective. However I won't pretend it was cheap. With all the fittings the cost of the ballscrews on this mill equal the mills original value.

Nice thread with good info.


-Jason

After turning down the rest of the Y screw to 10MM and boring out both ends of the Y-Axis Screw Retainer to 18MM x 5.5 deep and installing thrust bairings then seating and adjustng the split nuts after 800+ full cycles of the X and Y axis I now have a constant .0003 backlash.

http://www.vxb.com/page/bearings/PROD/Kit7156

Hey Chukkie,

Very nice work, your Z Axis conversion is EXACTLY what I have planned. I reckon this would work fine for me as I am not doind any real heavy duty work, light cuts in alloy.

Have you been able to do a vid of the machine in action yet, would love to see how it goes?

It scares me how accurate this $1,200.00 machine is.

Here is a Industrial looking watch I made last week.

Guts out of a $15.00 watch off ebay.
I cut the crystal out of a peace of window glass.
The band is an old belt.
6 refrigerator magnets for the buckle.

The magnet thing works out good so when I want to take it off while working on stuff I can hang it on any thing metal and still tell the time.

Very cool indeed. is this your own design?

Very cool indeed. is this your own design?

Yes, just thought it up in my head and started making it.

Chuckie, I am just starting my X2 conversion and I am planning to keep the stock screws. I am interested your split nut modification. I think the photo you showed earlier in this thread was the X axis nut. Do you have a photo of the Y axis nut? As you know, these mount to the bed differently. My question is, do you use a shim in the spit to keep it from pinching completely closed when mounted in the machine? It seems that the way the mounting system works (1 setscrew on Y and 2 on X) - pressing the nut against the back of the slot - would close the slot and potentially bind the screw.

Cheers,
Michael

Hi Michael! I would cut the slot on the round side of the nut, and move the adjusting screws up. Then the slot CANNOT be pinched when tightening the mill setscrew.

CR.

Chuckie, I am just starting my X2 conversion and I am planning to keep the stock screws. I am interested your split nut modification. I think the photo you showed earlier in this thread was the X axis nut. Do you have a photo of the Y axis nut? As you know, these mount to the bed differently. My question is, do you use a shim in the spit to keep it from pinching completely closed when mounted in the machine? It seems that the way the mounting system works (1 setscrew on Y and 2 on X) - pressing the nut against the back of the slot - would close the slot and potentially bind the screw.

Cheers,
Michael

Check out how LMS splits theirs in this kit.
CNC X and Y-Axis Motor Mounts and Screws for Mini Mill (http://www.littlemachineshop.com/products/product_view.php?ProductID=3198&category=)
Hoss

Thanks guys, that is exactly what I was thinking.

Cheers,
Michael

If you look at the picture real good you can see I drilled and tap an extra hole for the x-axis and drilled, tap and recessed 2 holes for the y-axis. I did all this so I could adjust it without taking things apart. Also the split nuts have 2 pass holes in them on the split side so the mounting bolts will pass thru the first part of the split nuts and the center bolts are the adjusters.

http://www.cnczone.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=64715&d=1218500086