I've got a question for the probe gurus out there

I've been using the probe on my machine for about 7 months now, and until recently it worked perfectly.

The last week or so I've had issues with it being EXTREMELY picky about where I position it, and what dimensions I give it.

For example, I am probing the center of a 2.5"x1.5" block. The appropriate use of the macro would be to position the probe anywhere within 0.4" of the Z surface, roughly centered (within 0.4") on the block in X and Y.

I started out with the probe about 0.25" off the part, centered to within 1/8" in X and Y. I input my part dimensions (X2.5 Y1.5) and my Z distance (-0.250). It then errors out at a random point from here on out, when trying to measure X and Y.

Eventually I seemed to trace the problem to it having to move too far to reach the part surface (though this shouldn't matter, as I was within 0.4" of center, and inputted the exact dimensions of my part).

I was finally able to make it work by dropping the X dimension down to 2.0 and the Y dimension to 1.25". It scares me a little though, as it comes *awfully* close to the edge of the part, when it plunges in Z. I also don't understand why I should need to lie to it and tell it my part is smaller than it is.

The other issue I have is I need to get down to <0.1" above the face of the part in Z, and I need my Z depth to be under 0.200".

I never had these issues before, so I'm not sure what's going on. Maybe I don't fully understand the probing macro, but I think I have a pretty good handle on what it wants to know, and where I should be positioning the probe. I've tried hundreds of combinations of Z positions and X,Y,Z dimensions, and none seem to reliably work everytime.

The other issue I have is sometimes the probe will error out, and then I will run the *exact* same cycle again, and it will work just fine. I thought maybe somehow the coolant lines might be blocking the line of sight from the probe to the receiver on the back of the enclosure, but moving them seems to have no effect on this particular instance.

I'm quite confused here, as I'm spending WAY too much time on something that shouldn't be a problem. If anyone has any advice, I'd greatly appreciate it.

How old is this machine? Haas has had a few problems with the probe programs on new machines. If your machine is new call your local dealer and have them send you the latest probe programs.

Hmmm...I'll be interested to see what you learn. I recently had the same exact experience with my VF-2. It used to work perfectly, then it gave me fits setting work offsets (probe error). I tried the same exact cycle over again, from the same position (just hit Cycle Start again) and it worked perfectly. Odd. :confused:

How old is this machine? Haas has had a few problems with the probe programs on new machines. If your machine is new call your local dealer and have them send you the latest probe programs.

The machine was delivered May of 2007.

Just for giggles have you recalibrated your probe recently?

Cory,

I was talking to my HAAS Service Technician during the installation of my HAAS TM-1P with the Renishaw (WIPS) Wireless Probe and Wireless Tool Setter and I "think" he mentioned something about the batteries in one of the probe systems he serviced recently only lasted about 6 months. This particular one was a wireless probe and wireless tool setter. One battery set of batteries checked o.k and the other one was marginal. He replaced the marginal battery and it still didn't work properly. He finally had to replace the batteries in both the probe and tool setter to cure the issue.

Just something that you may want to look at. Oh, by the way, those batteries are expensive. I think he mentioned they cost something around $20.00 each at Radio Shack and it takes 2 each in the probe and 2 each in the tool setter. $80.00 Ouch!

John

Cory,

I was talking to my HAAS Service Technician during the installation of my HAAS TM-1P with the Renishaw (WIPS) Wireless Probe and Wireless Tool Setter and I "think" he mentioned something about the batteries in one of the probe systems he serviced recently only lasted about 6 months. This particular one was a wireless probe and wireless tool setter. One battery set of batteries checked o.k and the other one was marginal. He replaced the marginal battery and it still didn't work properly. He finally had to replace the batteries in both the probe and tool setter to cure the issue.

Just something that you may want to look at. Oh, by the way, those batteries are expensive. I think he mentioned they cost something around $20.00 each at Radio Shack and it takes 2 each in the probe and 2 each in the tool setter. $80.00 Ouch!

John

Hmm. I'll check into the batteries. My TS27R is wired, so at least I only have to shell out $40 for batteries.

Oh, by the way, those batteries are expensive. I think he mentioned they cost something around $20.00 each at Radio Shack and it takes 2 each in the probe and 2 each in the tool setter. $80.00 Ouch!
Yup, that's exactly why you shouldn't bother patronizing Radio Shack. They've turned into phone store that sells RC toys.

I found out that the MSRP on those batteries is only $16.99. And we know that MSRP is usually higher than what you find them for. Not at Radio Shack.:confused:

But I ended up buying a pair of them from a battery reseller on eBay for (drum roll please): $8.75 and 2.95 shipping. That's for both batteries. The same exact brand, model and everything. And yes: they were brand new, current manufacture date batteries.

Don't let yourself get caught without them. I ordered two pairs so I'd have a spare set (my probe is the wireless, the presetter is wired). Nothing like paying Radio Shack a 400% premium. Crooks.

Hi Greg,

Thanks for the tip on the batteries. If you have the e-bay seller I.D. of the person you bought them from I would really appreciate it. You could post it here or just send me a personal message.

John

Just do an eBay search for (linky-->>): ls 14250 (http://search.ebay.com/search/search.dll?from=R40&_trksid=m37&satitle=ls+14250)

There are so many resellers on there it will make your head spin. I think I chose the guy I did because he had the lowest combination of price and shipping. And you can find them bundled in different quantities (1, 2, 3, 4) or find other Buy it Now options.

This is who I bought mine from. He has a pair 'on sale' right now for $7.55. Or check his other items for larger quantities:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=280191552998

The thing that gets me about Radio Shack is this: If you buy 25 batteries from the guy listed above (TWENTY FIVE!!!), it's $95.40, shipped to your door. Buy only four of them at Radio Shack and pay $79.96. So if you mail order, you are buying five and getting twenty more for free!

I don't think the local hardware store has that much markup on bolts. :confused:

Hi Greg,

Many thanks for the link on the batteries.

Guess we are in the wrong business. Don't you wish you could get that kind of markup with basically no labor involved.

John

Guess we are in the wrong business. Don't you wish you could get that kind of markup with basically no labor involved.
Well, they aren't in the right business either (or at least their original business).

Walk into Radio Shack and tell them you need a SPST toggle switch and they'll give you a blank stare. Don't even bother inquiring about 1/2 watt resistors. They'll point you to 'that' corner of the store: the one they know nothing about and seems to shrink every year.

When I bought those batteries at $20 each, I went home and the first thing I checked was the online price. I returned them to Radio Shack the next day.

The kid asked me what was wrong with them. I told him that it was the price. He offered me a 10% discount. Woo-hoo! I can get them for $18 each which is still a buck more than MSRP! :wee:

I told him that it wasn't personal and I understood that he just worked there, but that Radio Shack was going to die with price gouging like that. I'd have paid $10 each. It would have stung but not enough to bother waiting for mail order. But $20 each was just a punch in the face.

I've since discovered the same thing with the batteries in my digital calipers. This has all been in the past few months. I buy them all online now.

Getting back to Cory's original topic: did anything come of the probe errors? Mine was doing the exact same thing. It had a clear line of sight. It failed once, then worked after that.

I wonder: had it been awhile since you used the probe when you got the error? Could the internal switches have been a little sticky and started working again after bumping into a part once or twice?

Reading all your fun and games I have to make the (nasty :)) comment that the little bit of paper between the work and the tool for tool offsets and between a 1/2" diameter piece of stock in the spindle and the side of the work for work offsets is a lot simpler. And it doesn't batteries!!!!!

Now having stirred I will wander off and get dinner.

Getting back to Cory's original topic: did anything come of the probe errors? Mine was doing the exact same thing. It had a clear line of sight. It failed once, then worked after that.

I wonder: had it been awhile since you used the probe when you got the error? Could the internal switches have been a little sticky and started working again after bumping into a part once or twice?

I think I have it narrowed down to two potential culprits:

1) The batteries. I plan to order at least 4 extra so Im not caught with no replacements on hand

2) Line of sight. I'm probing parts that barely come out of the top of my vises. I think the receiver for the probe is mounted far too high on the back of the enclosure. When I visualize a straight line between the receiver, and the probe, I can definitely see that the coolant lines, or even the spindle housing itself could be blocking the LOS.

I don't think it's a programming issue, as I can run the exact same probing cycle 5 times, and have it work 5 times, or fail 5 times, or fail 2/3 of the time, etc.

Reading all your fun and games I have to make the (nasty :)) comment that the little bit of paper between the work and the tool...

A friend of mine says that about my digital calipers too. Then again, he still makes things with a file and a hacksaw. :D

Actually, we really did have that conversation and as we talked, I realized that I don't even own a hacksaw anymore. :)