I'm running a brand new VF-1. 10k RPM with gearbox.

It's total runtime is probably under 20-30 hours. No more than 40 tops.

I've been running it almost continually for the last 5 hours. Cutting 6061 aluminum. Mainly 1/2" ball and flat endmills, moderate DOC at 7500-10K rpm, from 60-90 IPM.

Stopping between parts, it felt noticeably hotter inside the machine enclosure than out. I felt the spindle, and it feels like it's around 85-90*F. Definitely hot to the touch.

I can't imagine this is normal, however I figured maybe running it at 10k for the last 5 hours might have something to do with it?

anyone have any input?

Thanks,

Cory

Are you allowing some flow of coolant out the fitting on the bottom of the head, or is it all going through the programmable coolant?

Are you allowing some flow of coolant out the fitting on the bottom of the head, or is it all going through the programmable coolant?

We don't have programmable coolant.

85 to 90 F is not that hot. Are you able to hold your hand against the spindle for a very long time? If you do not have to pull your hand of because it is to hot for comfort then it really qualifies as warm :) . Which might seem a picky point but I have had several spindle feel distinctly warm to the touch after running long cycles at 10,000rpm.

I have also had hot spindles, much to hot to comfortably hold a hand against, and these were caused by running the machine at high speed after it had been sitting for a couple of weeks without being used.

The cure for this is to run the Haas Run In program with the spindle lube air purge turned up to 30 psi to purge accumulated oil out of the lower spindle bearing.

I suggest you simply run the Run In program and when it is cycling through the higher speeds open the door occasionally and feel the spindle. If it is too hot to touch turn the machine off, let it cool down and then restart Run In. This procedure was suggested to me by one of the Haas engineers when I sent an email about a very hot 15000rpm spindle. I had to turn the air pressure up and do the Run In twice before the machine could operate at full speed without getting hot.

We have found that on the 10000 rpm spindles it is a good idea to run the Warm Up program every morning and if the machine is idle run it again just before quitting time.

Ok, so does that mean you have coolant flowing out the bottom fitting on the head casting? I've not seen one without Pcool to know if they have just a big pipe off to the side or what.

Ok, so does that mean you have coolant flowing out the bottom fitting on the head casting? I've not seen one without Pcool to know if they have just a big pipe off to the side or what.

The coolant does not flow onto the head casting.

Thanks Geof, that's what I was looking for.

The machine had been sitting for about a week. I ran the warm up program prior to use. Are you referring to the warmup program, or the run-in program? I run the warm up program quite often.

The spindle is only warm by your definition. I could hold my hand to it for an extended length of time, without experiencing discomfort.

The only real reason I was concerned was because the Haas tech mentioned during the initial setup that the spindle had some excess vibration. It still seems like it makes what I'd qualify as a fairly awful noise at high RPM's, compared to other Haas mills I've heard running. I plan on having them come out to take a look-see, but I wanted to make sure I wasn't going to destroy my machine in the meantime ;)

The coolant does not flow onto the head casting.

Thanks Geof, that's what I was looking for.

The machine had been sitting for about a week. I ran the warm up program prior to use. Are you referring to the warmup program, or the run-in program? I run the warm up program quite often.

The spindle is only warm by your definition. I could hold my hand to it for an extended length of time, without experiencing discomfort.

The only real reason I was concerned was because the Haas tech mentioned during the initial setup that the spindle had some excess vibration. It still seems like it makes what I'd qualify as a fairly awful noise at high RPM's, compared to other Haas mills I've heard running. I plan on having them come out to take a look-see, but I wanted to make sure I wasn't going to destroy my machine in the meantime ;)


Do the Run In program as I suggest while checking the temperature.

Regarding your excessive vibration I have a Super MiniMil which had a horrible vibration at certain speeds. The local Haas tech did a vibration analysis three times, sent the data to Haas and everything checked out okay so I just let it run. Then we started doing a job which needed a lot of material remove so we were pushing the machine hard; it made an atrocious noise. It was well out of warranty so I started pulling covers off to see if I could locate the source. It was the spindle sheet metal vibrating and hitting a ridge on the casting; you could see the shiny polished metal. The ridge seemed like something left over from the casting so I used a grinder to take a bout a sixteenth off...bingo quiet machine.

Incidentally are you using balanced tooling? 10000rpm is borderline for balanced tooling; you can get away with using non-balanced holders but at full speed the machine might make a lot of noise.

Do the Run In program as I suggest while checking the temperature.

Regarding your excessive vibration I have a Super MiniMil which had a horrible vibration at certain speeds. The local Haas tech did a vibration analysis three times, sent the data to Haas and everything checked out okay so I just let it run. Then we started doing a job which needed a lot of material remove so we were pushing the machine hard; it made an atrocious noise. It was well out of warranty so I started pulling covers off to see if I could locate the source. It was the spindle sheet metal vibrating and hitting a ridge on the casting; you could see the shiny polished metal. The ridge seemed like something left over from the casting so I used a grinder to take a bout a sixteenth off...bingo quiet machine.

Incidentally are you using balanced tooling? 10000rpm is borderline for balanced tooling; you can get away with using non-balanced holders but at full speed the machine might make a lot of noise.

I'm using Rego-Fix ER-32 collet holders which are supposedly balanced to 22,000 RPMs.

The machine just doesn't quite sound right at all RPMs. It just becomes more noticeable as you get above 6000 RPM or so. It gets better as it runs longer (or maybe my ears just become more accustomed to it).

if the tech thinks that somthing didnt sound right get on
get it tested
there will be some extra noise with the gearbox but if your not sure ask haas
vibrations will kill you machine and it is not cheap to fix if your out of warrenty

I'm using Rego-Fix ER-32 collet holders which are supposedly balanced to 22,000 RPMs.

The machine just doesn't quite sound right at all RPMs. It just becomes more noticeable as you get above 6000 RPM or so. It gets better as it runs longer (or maybe my ears just become more accustomed to it).

I have a feeling for what you mean. Definitely the noise varies with speed which I think is a resonance and definitely your ears are not a reliable detector because they do habituate.

All you can do is get the tech in to check it out; if the machine is under warranty this is what they should do whenever you ask. Although maybe I have a bit of extra clout with my Haas dealer having bought seventeen machines and asked for a quote on number eighteen :D today.

I mentioned the Super Mini that was noisy; I have a new VF2 that is still under warranty and some mornings it makes a really funny noise during Warm Up. It seems to be temperature dependent and does not happen every day. My plan is to monitor it very closely when the machine is about two months away from the end of the warranty and if it is still doing it get the dealer in to start looking at things.

150 degrees f on the inside of the taper is the cutoff then haas says that spindle is hot. if the machine is under warranty then you should just run it till it dies run it overnight at max rpm if you come in the morning and the spindle is seized then you get a new one. then they will have to verify oil flow and make sure everything is good on the new spindle

150 degrees f on the inside of the taper is the cutoff then haas says that spindle is hot....

This is 65 degrees C and is hot enough that you can touch it for a short period of time but it will not burn you; that is the type of temperature I was meaning in my first post.

I am not sure I agree with serviceman's advise. Yes, you might learn that the spindle can run overnight without problems, or you might learn that it cannot. Coming in next morning to a pile of smoking scrap is not very helpful toward diagnosing the underlying problem.

the spindle should cool down by the morning and break in or it will fail. if the machine is under warranty why not let the hfo handle it. the spindle bearings are rated for something like 220 degrees farenheit and i have been given this advise by numerous factory personnel in the past. if the machine is out of warranty then i would start looking for problems in the oil flow or belt tension etc.

or you can run the run in program and monitor the spindle temp and start the program from the beginning if the temperature rises above 150 and continue to do this until the temperature settles down.

or you can run the run in program and monitor the spindle temp and start the program from the beginning if the temperature rises above 150 and continue to do this until the temperature settles down.

Which is what I advised a few posts up; second or third post; as suggested to me by a Haas engineer.

I agree that you can run it unattended either to success or failure; my point is that you do not learn anything doing this. Any person, factory rep or otherwise, who suggested this type of procedure to me for my machines would never set foot in my shop again.

i've seen a lot of bad spindles come from the factory and if the spindle is going to fail better it fail 2 months in then 16 months in

I have been running 1 hour program for 2 weeks at 5000 -6000 RPM
at first the spindle got a little hot ran the runin program and was stll hot.
Also the tool was stiking at a change. So i added 2 flex coolant hoses
and splash coolat at the spindle at the front and back solved the problem
cool spindle and no sticking at all 2 birds with one stone.
If you look at the ec400 it has 4 coolant nosels around the spindle it
is jacketed in coolant I have 2000 VFOE and a 202 minimill.

Art

I recently installed 8 new machines with 15k spindles, about half of them had trouble staying cool during the intial run-in program. This is not rare. If it reaches 150* F it fails, i let it cool then run the run-in program once again. If it gets hot once more i let it cool and bump the spindle air pressure to 30 and run the spindle run-in program once again. Some machines work great from the factory and some need a little help. It really depends on how much oil has settled in the spindle. You can can see the access oil dripping from the spindle most of the time. You can run into this if you go a while with out running the machine, say over a weekend.

Replacement Spindles are usually going to get hot in the intial run-in. They sit on a box for months horizontally, and are usually filled with too much oil, to prevent rust. This oil causes heat to build up.

Runnning at 10k for 5 hours or so you should expect the spindle to get warm, but if its around 150* F then worry about it.

Make sure you reduce the spindle air pressure when you are done running the spindle in, you won't be getting enough oil.

First thing is get or borrow a temp gun. That way you know what you are talking about. When it comes to a warranty situation with any product you will need good documentation and facts.
You just got it so there is no dispute there but it would be nice to know what temp it is now and 1 month from now and more importantly 364 days, 23 hours, and 59 min from when you got it...:cheers:

Is there a duty cycle for running your spindle at 10k?

Yesterday and today I ran my machine at pretty much 10k for 8 hours each day, with perhaps 10 minutes between cycles. I stopped cutting last night, because the spindle was hot to the point where it became painful to keep my hand on it.

After the cycle ended and the coolant was off, the toolholder was acting as a heatsink, and had probably heated up to ~100*F.

I'm positive this is unrelated to any defects in the spindle--it doesn't get hot until it's been running at high speeds for an extended length of time. I just don't want to run it nonstop at 10k and find out that it's not rated for continuous use and my warranty is voided if it eventually fails.

I remember reading in the Haas CNC Machining magazine the Answer Man responded to this question;'what it the duty cycle at 10000rpm?' with the answer that it was more or less unlimited.

Have you checked the air pressure on the spindle oil feed; the one I mentioned in an earlier post. If this pressure is too low it could possibly allow oil to collect in the bearings.

If you can keep your hand pressed tightly against the spindle for maybe two or three seconds then you are right at the borderline of being too hot I think. If you cannot bear to hold it there at all then I think you may need to get better advice than I can provide.

I remember reading in the Haas CNC Machining magazine the Answer Man responded to this question;'what it the duty cycle at 10000rpm?' with the answer that it was more or less unlimited.

Have you checked the air pressure on the spindle oil feed; the one I mentioned in an earlier post. If this pressure is too low it could possibly allow oil to collect in the bearings.

If you can keep your hand pressed tightly against the spindle for maybe two or three seconds then you are right at the borderline of being too hot I think. If you cannot bear to hold it there at all then I think you may need to get better advice than I can provide.

You can keep it there for a couple seconds, and then it becomes painful.

I checked the pressure on the gauge right above the oil reservoir. It was between 30-40 PSI.

I checked at a later time, and it had dropped down to almost zero, however. Is this normal? I'm at home, so I don't have my owner's manual with me to check.

You can keep it there for a couple seconds, and then it becomes painful.

I checked the pressure on the gauge right above the oil reservoir. It was between 30-40 PSI.

I checked at a later time, and it had dropped down to almost zero, however. Is this normal? I'm at home, so I don't have my owner's manual with me to check.

Wrong gauge :) that is the oil pump gauge.

I have attached three pictures. The first shows the oil pump with its gauge on the right and the regulator and gauge that controls the spindle air feed on the left. This is on my gantry machine where things are easy to see. The second two pictures show the spindle air gauge way down behind all the tubes and wires at the back of the machine on a VF0 and a VF2. This gauge should be showing about 18 psi for normal operation. If you read back a few posts I suggested doing the Run In cycle with this gaug up at 30 psi to expel excess oil that may be causing overheating. If the pressure here is too low the oil that is supplied to the spindle from the pump does not get purged through and out and can build up causing heating.

If you find that the pressure here is low I suggest doing the Run In with it set at around 30 psi, maybe do it twice. Then set it back to the 18 psi and see if you still get the heating. Your temperature is high but not high enough that you are getting close to damaging anything.

Just a data point Cory, but I've run my '07 VF-2ss at 12,000 RPM for 6-8 hours straight several times, and the spindle was actually cool to the touch at all times. Matter of fact, it's never been past luke warm since I've owned it, and I run it a LOT at 12k. Even with heavy loads (120% or so) it doesn't get hot.

Wrong gauge :) that is the oil pump gauge.

I have attached three pictures. The first shows the oil pump with its gauge on the right and the regulator and gauge that controls the spindle air feed on the left. This is on my gantry machine where things are easy to see. The second two pictures show the spindle air gauge way down behind all the tubes and wires at the back of the machine on a VF0 and a VF2. This gauge should be showing about 18 psi for normal operation. If you read back a few posts I suggested doing the Run In cycle with this gaug up at 30 psi to expel excess oil that may be causing overheating. If the pressure here is too low the oil that is supplied to the spindle from the pump does not get purged through and out and can build up causing heating.

If you find that the pressure here is low I suggest doing the Run In with it set at around 30 psi, maybe do it twice. Then set it back to the 18 psi and see if you still get the heating. Your temperature is high but not high enough that you are getting close to damaging anything.

Geof:

Thanks for the help. I had assumed the regulator right next to the oil reservoir would be the one in question. I had to get on my back and contort myself just to get at the spindle regulator.

I will try this before I go home tonight, and again in the morning.

Should the regulator on the oil reservoir be reading zero? Im looking in my manual, and I see no indication of what it should be reading normally. my machine must be getting way oil, as I had to skim about 1/8" of it off the coolant the other day.

...Should the regulator on the oil reservoir be reading zero? Im looking in my manual, and I see no indication of what it should be reading normally. my machine must be getting way oil, as I had to skim about 1/8" of it off the coolant the other day.

I think you mean pressure gauge not regulator. The oil pump cycles every 30 minutes or something like that. There was a thread a while back where this was discussed and I think that is what one of the Haas people said. When the pump cycles, or when you operate it by pulling up the plunger, the pressure shown on the gauge at the top of the tank goes up to around 30 or 40 psi. Then it drops, slowly, but not too slow. If it drops to zero in less than around ten minutes you might have a leak in your oil lines; if it takes longer than 30 minutes some of your oil lines may be blocked.

I do not think your problem is lack of lubrication I think it is too much oil. The main source of heat in ball races is too much lubrication for the speed they are running at. The heat mostly comes from the churning of the oil, or grease, inside the bearing.

Quite honestly I think you need to cross your fingers and hope that when you do find the spindle air purge pressure low and that when you do the Run-In as I suggest it solves your heat problem. Like Matt@RFR points out you should be able to run at 10k all day long without problems.

We have two VF2s that currently are spending most of a ten hour day running at 10k with the spindle load often up near 100 to 120% and they have no heat problems.

Cory
I had almost the same thing happen on a vf7. After months of could be, should be, from the haas tecs the spindle failed in a big way.So long store short all the gages showed the right pressures,BUT the problem was a T fitting after the oiler was loose. The haas use a air/oiler in the same line.The oil was misting before it ran up to the head. Look at the fittings after the oiler. Rap them in paper to see if there is any oil after a few days. The servise tec that solved the problem did it only after burning up a replacement spindle,then traced down there was no oil in the line. As a side note we sent the SS back and replaced it with a xv1020 YCI for less money its 4 times the mill.
good luck

The normal lube cycle runs every 28 minutes, it will initialy go to 30 or 40 psi depending on the machine, hold for a few minutes, then drop to about halfway hold for another few minutes then drop again, the whole procedure last's for about 12 to 16 minutes before it goes back to 0, you can check it out in diognostics(low oil pressure) the switch is inverted so the normal state is 1, Most of the time spindle overheating is in fact caused by oil traped in the spindle, Try what Geof suggest's, but i turn the regulator wide open, run the spindle in both forward and reverse at various rpms, both low and high, i have had it take up to 12 to 16 hours to get the spindle purged, re running the breakin will not really purge enough if there is a lot of oil in the spindle, just remember to set the spindle lube regulator back to 17psi

I ran the run in cycle with the air set to 30 PSI on Tuesday night, and again Wednesday morning.

It seemed like things were better yesterday, but today I've been running my spindle for about an hour at 10k (having run the warm up program this morning) and the spindle is already hot (not to the point where you'd get burned if you held your hand on it, but way too hot for having ran only 1 hour).

I'm going to run the run in at 30 PSI a couple more times, and then call Selway if that doesn't work.

.....I'm going to run the run in at 30 PSI a couple more times, and then call Selway if that doesn't work.

Keep at it. My gantry machine with a 15000 spindle needed, I think, four Run In cycles after I had not been using the machine for several weeks. When I started it up with just a Warm Up it got almost too hot to touch.

Keep at it. My gantry machine with a 15000 spindle needed, I think, four Run In cycles after I had not been using the machine for several weeks. When I started it up with just a Warm Up it got almost too hot to touch.

I'm a little concerned that it's in a seemingly worse state now that I've run the run-in cycle at 30 PSI three times than it was prior to running them in the first place.

It took 8 hours or so for it to be painfully warm. I just finished a third run in cycle (one on tues night, one weds morning), and set the spindle to run at 10K. In under 15 minutes it was significantly hot. Should I run a final run in cycle at 17 PSI to make sure the spindle has enough oil? I'm running another cycle at 30 PSI right now, and I may run a fifth at 30 PSI in the morning, but if that doesn't work I think it's time to start calling Selway. If it comes to that, hopefully it'll be under warranty.

If you do not seem to be moving ahead I think maybe stop there and call your service people. It is not behaving as I would expect based on my experience with my machines.

There is no need to guess whether or not there is an excess of oil in the spindle. Clean up the area, and take the cap off the bottom end for a look. 6 capscrews there, I think.

I have trouble believing that the spindle could retain enough oil to cause a heating problem, after the initial run-in has expelled whatever it was shipped with. I'd be leary of not enough lube. Check those plastic lube lines up behind the motor for leaks. If they leak, they can be stealing the little bit of oil that the spindle is supposed to get. I'm amazed that the bearings survive as well as they do with the little breath of lubrication that they get.

Before I rebuilt my spindle , it was one of the cold ones. The bearing preload was lost in that one, the lower retaining sleeve showed evidence of spinning wear, because the race was precessing around. A proper spindle preload must heat up a little bit. A coolant jacketed head would help a lot to keep the spindle temperature from creeping upward, provided that you let coolant flow through the jacket.

A coolant jacketed head would help a lot to keep the spindle temperature from creeping upward, provided that you let coolant flow through the jacket.

This is true, but I think it would just be masking the base problem--the spindle in no way should be getting this hot during normal operation. I'd rather find out what's wrong now, than run it till the spindle seizes, and then have Selway tell me "tough sh**, you knew it was too hot and ran it anyways"

There is a procedure in the manual on checking the lube pump output to the spindle. It is worth checking out.

I don't recall if you mentioned any indication of some oil flow through the spindle or not? Do you see the occasional drip of oil off the spindle when its left off overnight? I don't mean a pool collecting on the table, but just a single drop would be some indication of normal lube progression.

If the machine is still under warranty absolutley get the Dealer involved, let them know you are down, most of the HFO's keep spindles in stock and this is an item that can ship UPS RED , If your dealer does not have one in stock Haas will ship one overnight without extra charge if it's warranty.It only takes an hour or two to install, the killer is the five hour breakin, If it's out of warranty you'll at least get a 50% exchange, order one in and run the old one till they get a Tech there or it dies.

There is a procedure in the manual on checking the lube pump output to the spindle. It is worth checking out.

I don't recall if you mentioned any indication of some oil flow through the spindle or not? Do you see the occasional drip of oil off the spindle when its left off overnight? I don't mean a pool collecting on the table, but just a single drop would be some indication of normal lube progression.

Yes, it does have oil drip out of it occasionally.

I talked to the tech people at Selway. He mentioned that running the run-in cycle is the correct thing to do, but they open the spindle oiler all the way till the needle is pegged out.

He's sending me another program to try in the meantime. He thinks some oil manifold that regulates the oil flow into the spindle may be releasing too much oil, and is sending us a new one and a tech to install it on Monday.

Well, I think its good that it is getting oil. But I still haven't gleaned from this discussion if you are running coolant, and whether that coolant is circulating through the coolant jacket around the spindle. I don't know how the VF1's are built, but I'd sure hope that there is provision for this feature. My old 96 VF3 also has oil as a heat transfer medium around the spindle cartridge. This oil needs to be present to a certain level so that the coolant, which circulates within passages in the head casting, can grab the heat.

Duty cycle is about heat, pure and simple. Heat will occur in a preloaded spindle, or even in one that is not preloaded but working against high forces or spinning a heavy load, or even transferring heat from the tool.

So, by circulating coolant through the head, the heat has somewhere to go and exchange, and this will increase the duty cycle, because you want the temperature rise to level off at probably no more than 115°F. Now, if in spite of coolant circulation, the temperature continues to ramp up, then a spindle overhaul is necessary. I'm not saying that the average guy wants to muck with that, but if the preload is too high, then the only way to fix it is to disassemble the spindle and change the preload.

I suppose Haas figures in a statistical fashion, that sooner or later somebody is going to get a spindle that is preloaded the wrong way for the manner in which they will use it. For example, continuous high speed operation such as yours will require less preload than a guy who runs larger tools at heavier cuts and slower speeds, or only intermittent top speed operation. But there is no way to specify this to the guy putting together a whole rack of spindles. You'll get 'run of the mill'. If it doesn't cost you time and money, then wait until it packs it in, but do what you can to cool the spindle, that is about the best you can do.

...I talked to the tech people at Selway. He mentioned that running the run-in cycle is the correct thing to do, but they open the spindle oiler all the way till the needle is pegged out.

He's sending me another program to try in the meantime. He thinks some oil manifold that regulates the oil flow into the spindle may be releasing too much oil, and is sending us a new one and a tech to install it on Monday.

I breath a sigh of relief that your tech people give the same prescription I gave. What is the pressure when the needle is full scale? It must be around 100 psi.

Just thought I'd post an update here--

The tech came and replaced the spindle oil meter jet (or something to that effect). Apparently they can be faulty.

It was still getting quite hot after running the run-in cycle again.

It now does not heat up while the coolant is running (coolant jacket around the head is doing it's job, I suppose).

It still heats up after completing a warm-up cycle. the inside of the taper is too hot to touch for more than a second or two.

To top it off, I just walked behind my machine and noticed a coating of oil across the floor, with oil all over the casting directly below the valve that had been replaced--so now it appears the oiler has developed a leak.

I'm kind of hoping when I call my service people on Monday they'll just give me a new spindle, instead of fooling around with minor fixes that clearly aren't getting anywhere.

We got a new spindle last Wednesday. So far it seems to be running well, but we haven't really ran it for an extended length of time.

Guys: why should we do the product development work for Haas. I agree with servicemans advise, sometimes it's better to let it pack it in,and start fresh than trying to resolve a problem that may not be resolvable. If the bores for the spindle bearings were not concentric to each other (just an example), would we pefer to prove it, or just replace it and move on. The unit is under warranty, and if you can sfford to be without it, let the spindle fry itself.

regards

I would advise you to be VERY careful of the 5 hour "break-in" program. On my 30k RPM mills, it only runs the spindle up to 7500 RPM!!!
What the hell good is that??
When my service rep called HAAS and started to question them about it, they admitted that the spindle SHOULD be run up to full speed during break-in!!
( But they still haven't changed the packaged instructions!!)

My humble opinion, break-in anything (car engine, motocross engine, spindle) have to be done carefully but wisely.

In all my motocross, I've done it wide open trottle at full load but not to let the engine get too hot in the first tank. The purpose is to conditioned the motor or anything to what it will be used to. I will always do that for anything thats need break-in as I have made alot of thing that proof me that is the right way to do it.

You have a spindle that will be used to run full speed most of the time (mold making), then break-in just like that, wide open trottle but not for too long period in the first... let say 200 hours of service to avoid overheating. If the machine will be used to run slow but with high load 75%-90% of the time, forget about the break-in at full speed, just break-in the machine with mid loads.

Use your logical. Breaking-in is to conditioned anything to what it will be used to be run in his future!

Your have a Porche and you will racing it, break-in it the pedal to the floor dude! But don't forget the little middle pedal sometimes, cause you will fastly and roughtly learn the driver need break-in too when the car will be smacking the wall lol!(chair)

My humble opinion, break-in anything (car engine, motocross engine, spindle) have to be done carefully but wisely.

In all my motocross, I've done it wide open trottle at full load but not to let the engine get too hot in the first tank. The purpose is to conditioned the motor or anything to what it will be used to. I will always do that for anything thats need break-in as I have made alot of thing that proof me that is the right way to do it.

You have a spindle that will be used to run full speed most of the time (mold making), then break-in just like that, wide open trottle but not for too long period in the first... let say 200 hours of service to avoid overheating. If the machine will be used to run slow but with high load 75%-90% of the time, forget about the break-in at full speed, just break-in the machine with mid loads.

Use your logical. Breaking-in is to conditioned anything to what it will be used to be run in his future!

Your have a Porche and you will racing it, break-in it the pedal to the floor dude! But don't forget the little middle pedal sometimes, cause you will fastly and roughtly learn the driver need break-in too when the car will be smacking the wall lol!(chair)

I will have to politely disagree!! As an engineer and race engine builder, I will say the " run it in like you will ride it" theory is simply blown out the door by real engineering data. I could go on all day with that but is has to do with honing even precision surfaces for high speed apps. Yes, bearings can be put the the max from day one "IF" there are no imperfection that is rarely the case. Temperature kills bearings and engines and nothing else? The reason for run in on anything is to hone precision surfaces so they last as long as possible.

In short, probably can run a 30K spindle at max from day one but probably will fall short at 10K hours of operation. That being said, if you are paying the bucks for it, they should do this for you.

If you want proof, look for microscopic piston pics from a drag race engine and an F1 engine. You can make an engine virtually run in free but honing all surfaces is critical.

"200hrs to prevent overheating" wiow! What if overheating occurs at 2 hrs? We have tested MANY engines and overheating of the critical surfaces is very common in new engines and spindles are no different. Actually, just check the break in procedures for any AC bearing mfgs

I know what honning is. For the 200hrs I was meaning of cycling break-in procedure many time in this 200hrs, not to push things at full speed during 200hr.

Most of the engine experts warned of the danger of breaking in the engine too easily and ending up with an engine that will always run slow whether it is from tight tolerances, inadequate ring seal or carbon buildup.