Hi guys,
I am completly new at this, and need to start somewhere. (Ok, I did take machine shop way back when the wheel was invented, and remember a little but...)
I am looking into picking up a Busy Bee 10 x 18 B2227L Lathe. I read through most of the posts regarding this lathe, and see that a few own it, and are on the whole pretty happy with it.
My questions are, what are the things I need to buy initially with it ( i.e. cutting tools, holders, etc?, I'm not sure what it comes with) to do simple things like threading rod, and turning down bar stock. Also, any other first hand advice and experiences you want to share about the setup, and things to watch out for?

Thanks
Paul

A link is always helpful, I think that that lathe is the same one that grizzly offers in the 10x22 range. Since they are up in the great white north with you then that should work. I cannot comment on what it comes with, if contact the seller I am sure they can supply that.

At anyrate, take your budget for the machine and in most cases double that, and you will have a machine with tooling suitable to use for average operations. Its always hard to say what someone needs, and this of course is a debate in of itself. I always recomend that someone start with HSS toolbits, learn to run those then move onto carbide bits if the need arises, I would say that most of the operations done buy average home shop machinsts don't need anything more some find that carbide is all they use, but I prefer HSS. A decent drill index, and a set of center drills(the good quality ones) and counter sinks. I would invest in a quick change tool post, I cannot recomend one in particular as the toolpost itself determines what you need so you may want to see if the seller has one avaliable. A standard complement of mics and calipers of course, I find that a smaller surface block is handy for checking and laying out with a height or surface gauge. Vee-blocks, angle plates, and a decent 4-jaw(my assumption is that it does not come with one) chucks are pretty much importortant if you plan to do other then roundstock finishing operations. Milling attachments are handy esp if you don't have a mill, a full range of collets are nice for accurate work, and a decent clamp kit(its hard say what works best as you need determine that) for the odd to hold job. A decent level(machinst or better), a good quality combo square with angle and center finder, a ground finished piece of rod for checking setups, and nice set of files, all this in the last sentence should be of finer qaulity, the more you pay the better it is. Some other important things if you do alot of threading, a center finder, thread gauges, a turret is handy for those runs were you do alot of center drilling, drilling, reaming, tapping. For off center work, a good 4 jaw chuck, bison for instance, a wiggler, and possibly a few extra angle blocks and vee blocks. You can make alot fixtures, like tap holders, depth gauges for indicators, and test indicators. One thing I did buy recently and don't know why I never had it before was a indicator holder that can flex every which way one from Harbor freight the other from a company called flexbar, this makes mounting easy and you can move to any position you desire and lock it. For BTC work, a good live center, you can make dead centers from 12L14 or similiar, and if you can get one for that lathe a taper attachment(my geuess is no). A gallon of wd40, or similiar for degreasing the lathe, a bundle of rags for that job, and another for when you start to use the lathe. A box of cheap brushes, a few peices of flexible plastic for a way cover, a decent oil can, a nice small 6" bench grinder with a 60 and 100 grit wheel, an 8" would be better but not needed, lathes and grinders run hand in hand esp with HSS toolbits.


does this help?

I currently own a 9x20 grizzly and a smaller taig.
besides other machines.
chris

http://busybeetools.ca/cgi-bin/picture10?&NETID=1301420725071507437&NTITEM=B2227L

Thank you! That helps a lot. I have a lot of info to look into.
Are there any online tutorials that you know of, that discuss the leveling and initial setup of a lathe?

Paul

Not sure what part of the country you are in but I buy from the Calgary store. They will help you also and don't be afraid to ask a question. Tell them you are new at it and want to learn. Besides the regular cutting tools(hss) to start I would also have a 4 jaw chuck. I have seen some of the smaller types where it was a problem mounting one and to me it is a necessity as a 3 jaw is only so accurate especially if you have to take the work out and then put it back.
I am going to look at one when I get to the city. I have an Atlas(old) and was thinking of something smaller.
John

The 10x18 is a great deal.
I bought one about 6 months ago and I love it.
I bought mine from the Busy Bee in New Westminster, and had the opportunity to see one beside the 9x20. What a difference the 9x20 is a lot smaller and lighter than the 10x18.
After some basic wiping the grease off I was using it with no modifications
I was parting off 1 1/2" SS. Not 1 or 2 pieces but 100s.
I use the 4 way tool post on my lathes and I bought 5 more for the 10x18
as well as a tailstock turret from the Little Machine Shop.
The best feature for me is the gear box for the spindle, I do a lot of repetetive work drilling, tapping, counter sink, turning and parting,
I could not imagine changing belts for every opperation.
I use carbide insert as well as HSS tooling.
There is a Yahoo group pm1027lathe that has some good info about this lathe.

Mark

Deleted double post

Thanks guys. I appreciate all the info. I'm out east (Toronto Ontario) but have lived in B.C.

Paul

Anybody have the manual, or know where I can find one online?

Paul

Ok guys, I'm taking the plunge. I'm off to buy the Busy Bee Craftex B2227L tomorrow and pick it up on Saturday. I have spent the last 2 weeks searching posts, reading all I can, and trying do digest all the info I have found. All in all it seems like this is a pretty good lathe for it's level.
It's on sale right now, and a lot of the tooling that goes with it as well, so I'm going to pick up the steady rest, follow rest, 4 jaw chuck, and face plate, stand, and a couple of HSS bits, and a bench grinder. One question I do have is about tool posts. For those that own the B2227L what are you using? I hear that the one that comes with it is a bit of a pain. I have read a little about 4 way holders, QC, and the type with separate tool holders, and am a little confused. Who uses what, and where did you buy?

Thanks,
Paul
BTW I almost bought a 3 in 1 Craftex B2229 off Ebay for "real" cheap, but the seller pulled his item saying it blew a motor, and he was going to "fix it up." I said I was willing to buy it "as is," but he didn't respond. (Hmmm...He might have sold it privately) Anyhow, I was willing to take the chance, and do the "treadmill motor" conversion on it. From the pics it didn't look that bad, and I figured for the price I really couldn't lose. I guess the good thing that came out of this, is that I know a lot more about 3 in 1's now. ;) (I did a lot of research and reading on them. )

Paul,

My experience is not with that lathe in particular, but I have worked with all of those types, by far the easiest to use is the QCTP(with seperate holders). 4 way turrets are good on some lathes and others they are a pain, but given the choice i would still go with a QCTP. Lantern style holders(the old style tool post) are nice for some things, but for the most part not needed. My grizzly has a 4 way turret but you can really only use 2 of the 4, and its about as easy to change the bit as it is to use the turret feature. QCTP are rated on the swing of the lathe, I believe that a 10" is into the 200 or B series, I could be mistaken though, they normal specify what size range the holder is. The aloris is pretty much the standard by which all others are judged, I have used a generic no name, phase II, and a aloris, the aloris was the nicest but the phase II would suit just fine. I recomend a wedge type if you are planning on doing some heavy cutting, the pistons work OK, but they are not as firm as the wedge, again the wedges are also almost double the price. If you are using HSS you will find the ablity to easily change height with the thumb wheel makes on center cutting easier, with insert and cemented tools thats not as much of an issue as they normally are on center or really close. Doing that on a turret is a pain and on a lantern style post its slight chore.

One other thing you might want to get is a machinst level, when you set up your machine you will want it as level as possible, a starret #98 is a good example, leveling the bed and the table if possible.

Chris

Thanks for the input Chris, it's all making more sense.
Another question, is 1/2" pretty well the std for tool bits?

Paul

I just bought one of the 10x18 lathes and am just getting it set up. This is not my first lathe and I have used some other rather large industrial types as well. What made me go with this one was it's size and weight compared to the more common 9x20 lathes - obviously physically larger and hence heavier plus I liked the gearhead feature.

As to quick change tool posts, you wouldn't go wrong with the ones already mentioned however, busybee lists one:
http://busybeetools.ca/cgi-bin/picture10?&NETID=1237450810071520363&NTITEM=B1883

that is also a good option. Not as "quick change" as the others but better than the turret post that it comes with - it and additional tool holders are also on sale right now. I like it, works well for me.

cheers, Graham in Embrun near Ottawa Canada

Thanks Graham
I'll take a look at it tomorrow.

Cheers
Paul

Well I picked up the lathe yesterday.
I spent most of the day unpacking and cleaning the lathe. One of the
things I noticed that I want to change, is the tiny nuts and screws
used on the compound slide lockdown. Has anyone changed these? I
couldn't figure out how to get the slide apart to get at the screws. I
had the crosslide apart and the compound off, but couldn't get the
base off. I didn't want to force anything. I did have the handwheel off.

I pulled the gearbox access plate off to check inside and immediately
the rubber gasket came to life, distorting and growing...Yikes! I
killed it with a brick LOL. I guess the rubber isn't oil resistant. I
had a sheet of cork gasket material lying around and replaced it with
a cork gasket.I hope it holds.

I noticed that there is no reverse for the leadscrew, and I want to do some lefthand threading. Has anybody done a reverse leadscrew gear mod? I have found one that has been done to the 3in1 machine, and another to this machine, but not a lot of info about it.


Thanks
Paul

I noticed that there is no reverse for the leadscrew, and I want to do some lefthand threading. Has anybody done a reverse leadscrew gear mod? I have found one that has been done to the 3in1 machine, and another to this machine, but not a lot of info about it.


Thanks
Paul


Morning Paul,

Do tell me more about the reverse leadscrew gear mod the the 3in1 machine and this one that you have found. So far I have only found references to mods like this for the more common 9x12 and and smaller machines.

While the 10x18 has a reverse AC motor which will reverse the leadscrew it also reverses the spindle. I would like to be able to cut left hand threads as well.

I have had mine about 2 weeks and it's still it the garage. I removed what I could so I can get it in the basement; the stairs are steep and narrow and I am waiting on some hired muscle to lend a hand. In the mean time I am cleaning up, degreaseing and oiling those parts I have removed and rearranging and giving a good cleaning to the basement workshop (it needs it - new tools give me a good reason to do just that or does the need to clean it up give me reason to get some new tool ;) )

cheers, Graham in Embrun near Ottawa Canada

Thanks for the input Chris, it's all making more sense.
Another question, is 1/2" pretty well the std for tool bits?

Paul

You can use any size you want, and you may very well need smaller sizes if you do boring. I have in my arsenal 1/8 to 1/2 with a few odd off larger carbide cemented. The only difference is how you adjust the height of the tool bit that is one of the reasons that you need to shim on a standard turret vs a QCTP.

You inquired about a reverese feed for left hand threading, there are several sites that do that particular mod for the 9x20(and just about any lathe), they all work pretty much the same, you take the input for the lead screw and put it through a second gear so it reverses rotation. If I get a chance and find my camera I have my logan apart it uses the same idea stock from the factory. It involves a link arm with a few slots and a couple of gears the same size as the idler gear in my case. Your lathe would depend upon how the lead screw is turned but every lathe I have seen uses the same set up so it just a matter of matching the gear size. The easiest way to do that is just order a spare gear set from the OEM.

Search for 9x20 tumbler reverse, steve bedair and jack fuselier have two good sites.

chris

Thanks for the info Chris. I had a look at some of the different mods, and had a question...Please correct me if I'm wrong. Does the extra reverse gear need to match the drive gear size wise?
I want to do some threading, and to get 18TPI, I changed out (A) from a 35t to a 70T (B) from a 30/60 combo to a single 80 , and (D) from a 125t to a 45t
Do I need to get another 70t gear to make a reverse idler?


Graham
Here is a simple reverse mod I found for the 3 in 1


Thanks
Paul

Thanks for the info Chris. I had a look at some of the different mods, and had a question...Please correct me if I'm wrong. Does the extra reverse gear need to match the drive gear size wise?
I want to do some threading, and to get 18TPI, I changed out (A) from a 35t to a 70T (B) from a 30/60 combo to a single 80 , and (D) from a 125t to a 45t
Do I need to get another 70t gear to make a reverse idler?


Graham
Here is a simple reverse mod I found for the 3 in 1


Thanks
Paul
Yes,
The gears should be of the same size if you do a tumbler reverse yes, if you change size then they will not have the same thread that is a given. Now that does not mean you use the driven gear, you can make 2 idlers setup, wereas one is engaged in one rotation, or two in the other. I am going to a swap meet and tractor show tommorrow I will be digging out my camera I will shoot my logan.

Now I must admit I am not familiar with your lathe in particular, so as for your question its a little oepn ended, pics are worth alot. I have not done the mod to my 9x20, since I have a lathe that can now do that should I ever need to. If you look at atlases and a few others they use a similiar system also. You may need to construct a plate and kick arm like on the 9x20, it may be more like my logan where its just an arm with 3 gears on it.

chris

I should have looked at your picture first, I am not sure how that works or if I am missing somethig but the way I see that is that only works in one direction. Otherwise the swing plate is the same idea, I have seen some lathes do the same with step gears like on the left side in the picture but they also have a similiar gear on the right but(and this is a big but) they match 2 gears to come out with the correct ratio, so in one direction the idler is spinning faster then in the other but the final output is the same, a little harder but doable. With a setup like that if yours is similar, the three gear approach would be very easy as you have alot of room, you just stack the reverse gears on top of each other slightly offset so one is touching the driven the other is touching the drive. When you swing the plate up, the two gears clear, and the third gear comes back into touch both drive and driven. So you would need idler 3 gears of the same size(that means you would need to purchase two). You may want to leave enough room for a neutral also I ahve seen this done and it makes using the lathe quiter, and you get a touch more power when facing, that is of course assuming you don't have a power cross feed driven off the lead screw in which case its pointless.



chris

Sorry Chris, That pic is of a B2229 3 in 1. Here is the B2227L

Paul

I just skimmed through this thread, and i wanted to say that i have had this lathe since feb and i have not had any problems with it. i just moved into a new place, and i found that if you take the gearbox off of the bed, its easily moved my only 2 people.

i just bought more tools and accessories within the last month, and some of the things i cant even imagine living without now are: dial indicator, 4-jaw chuck, QC toolpost and a live centre. i know there is plenty more, but those are the ones that made a huge difference in what i was able to do and how easy it was to do it.

dragons_fire
Thanks for the input.
Question...Where in Canada are you? (I'm in Toronto)
Just wondering where you are buying your accessories.

Paul

im in calgary, so i get it all from the calgary busy bee. i went to house of tools looking for their 7x12 and they had horrible service, so i went to busy bee, and ended up with a much better lathe for a little less money....

You have the project half done already, they provide you with a pivot, I assume that when you change a gear set you have to adjust the pivot around to take up the difference. Do you ever change out the idler gear?

chris

You have the project half done already, they provide you with a pivot, I assume that when you change a gear set you have to adjust the pivot around to take up the difference. Do you ever change out the idler gear?

chris

I havwe been playing around and figured out a simple setup, but I need to find a spare 70T gear that I will use as the idler. I'm going to check and see if BB can get replacement gears.

Paul

One would hope they can, it might take some time, but for pete's sake you just bought it.

chris

Got the parts no problem. Hopefully this weekend I'll get it all put together.

Paul

It's up and running. The pics tell the story. Pretty simple mod so far. I haven't decided how I want to shift it yet, so for now it's just loosen the bracket lock bolt, rotate left or right for forward or reverse and lock it back down. It takes all of 2 min to do it.

Paul

Looks nice, my logan is held in with a bolt takes around a minute to switch.
I have to ask, were did you get the banjo brakcet from? or did you make it?
chris

Thanks.
I just modified the factory bracket by welding on an arm.

Paul

Has anyone figured a better setup for the tailstock (ie:camlock or other?). the square nut on mine has slightly rounded its corners and its difficult to tighten down. GrahamC I'm in Embrun as well!

Hey Nickm23 small world. My home email is planophore@aei.ca

As or the tailstock, I kind of like it as is. I am sure I would like a camlock or similar but I have a small box wrench I just leave on the nut and tighten and loosen when needed. the wrench is not so long that it doesn't extend much past the tailstock ram and so is quite convienient.

I have a a few mods to the tool holder and compound that I will post when I get some time and take some pictures.

So far I do like the lathe and am glad I didn't get the 9x20 size.

cheers, Graham