I am investigating buying a second cnc benchtop.

I am set on a X2 or X3 - Machine must be able to be managed into basement. A Bridgeport is out of the question. X2 will handle current work size
X3 gives me growth.

I am looking for the pro and cons into buying turnkey vs building one. I have no electronic experience but I am good mechanically.

What is the total cost of converting a X3?
What are the pros and cons of what I am considering?

Thanks

my total conversion of a round column cost about $2200 to put together. it was a pretty steep learning curve. i would do it again, but this time i bought the IH mill and kit. unfortunately i still have to do all the wiring and that was what gave me fits on the first one. i really built the first one as a template before i build the IH. the tormach cnc is an option but then i don't want to worry about lost steps with steppers.

$2200? did that include the cost of the mill?

do you use this too make money or for hobby

and what do you like better building things or machining things

no that doesn't include the mill.

heres a basic run down of parts that i bought...
motors, x3
gecko drives x3
transformers x2
new PC x1
ball screws x3 (x,y, z all machined from one peice but you pay by the inch
bearings
ball nuts x6 so they can be preloaded with spring washers
spring washers
aluminum plate for all the bracketry
break out board which i didn't end up using
GERC controller board for the geckos
relays
few other odds and ends

if you want a good quality cnc good quality parts cost money. yeah i probably could have scrounged some stuff on ebay but it wasn't worth the time hunting for it.

I will be using the IH mill in my business that why i bought it. the round column mill was an experiment and when i'm done tinkering with it, (its getting a 4th axis conversion on it) i will then strip it, reassemble it with the stock screws and handles and then sell it and buy an X3 to have a smaller CNC mill than my IH. i figure i already have the cnc parts built and running might as well make it useful as well.

do you use this too make money or for hobby

and what do you like better building things or machining things

I have a line of products I am looking to get off the ground. I would say it is a hobby I am looking to make money with.

Build or machine ... machining makes money ... building a machine does not unless there is a huge savings in building it. Thus the reason for my question.

I would say that unless you already have the mill, you would be crazy to try to convert a manual mill on your own, unless that is how you want to spend your time.

A kit is a possibility.

-Jeff

I have a line of products I am looking to get off the ground. I would say it is a hobby I am looking to make money with.

Build or machine ... machining makes money ... building a machine does not unless there is a huge savings in building it. Thus the reason for my question.

then now look at the time you will use to convert ,is that time you could be making money machining your product?

even though i bought the IH mill, in retrospec i would probably buy something ready to run, that way i could start running as opposed to having to assemble everything on my own.

I say buy the Mill and get the CNC conversion from CNCFusion and the drive board and steppers etc from Xylotex.

X3 Mill=$1043.25 shipped
Xylotex 3 axis Drive box w/steppers, cables etc=$500 shipped
CNCFusion conversion kit w/ballscrews for all 3 axis=$549 plus shipping


LAter,
Tim

I say buy the Mill and get the CNC conversion from CNCFusion and the drive board and steppers etc from Xylotex.

X3 Mill=$1043.25 shipped
Xylotex 3 axis Drive box w/steppers, cables etc=$500 shipped
CNCFusion conversion kit w/ballscrews for all 3 axis=$549 plus shipping


LAter,
Tim

I think syil was selling there already converted x2 with ball screws and optical switches for $2300 + shipping(less the puter and software). No wires to mess with for the most part, although I don't think alot the the electrical end to CNC (with steppers) on these small machines is real hard.


chris

Chris,

Well then to compare apples to apples...

X2 Mill=$470 plus shipping if no store local
Xylotex 3 axis Drive Box w/ 269oz steppers, PS, cables etc=$420
CNCFusion Conversion Kit w/ballscrews=$540 plus shipping

Total=$1430

Syil has the X2 complete $2300, X3 for $3900. plus $250 to ship
Compare to X2 plus kit $1430, X3 for $2100.
X2 - appr. $900 Diff.
X3 - appr. $1700 Diff.

Considering Syil does not have a X3 machine in stock there maybe no other choice ... is there someone else to use?

Chris,

Well then to compare apples to apples...

X2 Mill=$470 plus shipping if no store local
Xylotex 3 axis Drive Box w/ 269oz steppers, PS, cables etc=$420
CNCFusion Conversion Kit w/ballscrews=$540 plus shipping

Total=$1430
{edited}
You forgot the prelaoded nuts, which is another $130(optional)
First,
I won't say I don't like xylotex, but I prefer a componet system, if you burn up one drive, I don't want to replace the whole board, and there are some power questions I have with those boards compared to gecko etc. And for an x2 it may be that these are fine, an x3 I would think twice.
Second,
Seems that we are only worrying about money, and I am not discounting that it is a big price difference, but at lets say a liveable wage of $15 an hour which is modest yet easy to figure. Now thats 60 hours(@ $900 straight), if you have no experience with any of the electronics how many hours to convert? and what equipment and supplies did you disqaulify that you might need to do it? Does your own work have a warranty? these are things you need to look at if you want to make money also with the machine(not to mention spend time on getting the product line to market). I only offer the things often forgotten, personally if I was to only worry about using the machine(for production) I would buy it out of the box. Me I would rather build it either way, but money is not always the only factor to take into consideration.

chris

Chris,

The $130 for the reloaded ballnuts with over sized balls is an ungrade to the CNCFusion kit. My kit came with ballscrews and nuts for the listed price.

Later,
Tim

repacking an external return ball nut is very easy

you can buy all the balls for 3 axis for around $25.00 and do it your self

http://stores.ebay.com/ToolSupply_Ball-Screw-Replacemenr-Balls_W0QQfsubZ3502892

Chris,

The $130 for the reloaded ballnuts with over sized balls is an ungrade to the CNCFusion kit. My kit came with ballscrews and nuts for the listed price.

Later,
Tim

Tim,
How much play do you have in your ball screws?
chris

If you have the money and want to get on with the machining of parts get something turnkey or a complete kit at least. If you have time and want to try and save a few bucks retro CNC one yourself with parts you spec. This can be a time consuming thing and if you make a mistake in your purchase you will have wasted money and still need to get the correct item.

Since you already have a CNC and experience with using one that eliminates a big hurdle most folks new to machining and CNC in general have to get past while making the machine and before making any parts. The down side to a homebuilt as someone stated is warranty and tech support are all on you. The plus side is that if you build it yourself you should be able to do all the PM and replacing of parts as needed since you will know the machine intimately. Time is money is your trying to make money. Machining makes money, making machines takes money, the better the machine the more it will cost you to make or to buy ready to machine.

This hobby/craft/skill/trade etc etc has so many variables and things to consider and all must be well thought out as nothing is cheap. Good luck with whatever you decide on doing.


Bo

Sounds like turn key is the way to go for me. Now to find a machine.

Thanks all.

FWIW, my wife and I managed to get a Tormach into the basement of our townhome and set it up there with a head room that is only about an inch higher than the mill. Getting the parts through 3 sets of 30" wide doors was a bit of challenge.

There should be a message in the Tormach forum here with a link to some web pages with pictures and narrative on the process I followed.

Mike

well i would love to do my own conversion, but for now, i need to be up and running, so i'm gonna go turn key, get it producing, and then in time maby pick up a second machine and do that conversion myself to save $$$