Well I have started gathering all my parts to build my first CNC machine based loosely on David Steele's belt driven plans. I say loosely as I am using 4 axis an all steel fram solid rails with linear bearings etc etc. Pics all the way and I will beg for and give freely, help.
(group)

Here is the frame which was 4 x 1.5 channel steel a bit rusty til i cleaned it. I have it primered and holes taped in one side and then larger holes on the other to allow for adjusting the rails to square.

I know this is out of the go cheap locally method for David's plans but I choose some linear bearing and rails to handle X and Y and Z axis these are solid 20mm bars with "c" shaped linear bearings they are sold as "cnc" bearings in fact.

http://www.vxb.com/page/bearings/CTGY/20mmLinearMotionSystems

I am using the blocks on each end and to support the middle areas I am useing a piece of angle cut to hieght and screwed to the steel channel. This will give a wider support then a screw/bolt and will be easier to make and mount then drill/tapping the solid round bar.

This rail set will give a better connection to hook to so I dont need to thread through "gas" pipe and I wont have to manufacture the skate bearing solution either.

:withstupi

I'll be watching this closely, can't wait to see how you add in the 4th axis. Do you have any pics of the changes from the Solsylva plans, or perhaps jsut tell us them?

:)

Best of luck with your build.

The end channels are there so I can do a drop plate and mount the 4th axis from end to end stepper on one end and a screw/bearing adjustment thing I havent thought up yet to squish the other end.

So now with the primer on and the holes drilled I mounted the rails with bearings onto the frame. :banana:

I think the angle at 1/3 spacing under the rails will give more than adequate support but I will test deflection at wieght.

I just got all my flatbar and angle aluminum. NOW to start on the Y axis mounting sizeing etc etc....

Little frustrated with not having all the right drill bits... I am looking for a solution that will drill 7/8 and 1" holes into aluminum?? anyone..?? anyone..?? Bueller?? anyone?????

I'd suggest buying the right bits! :D hehe.

Looking good already. :)

IMHO any TiN or TiTN bits (Gold coloured coating) will give you long and dutiful service in your aluminium. Thats what Im using, and Im off to buy some more bits tomorrow. I dont have an 8mm wood bit so had to stop working om my router until tomorrow. :(

I am not using "gas" pipe for my rails as I went with solid steel and linear bearing from vxb see previous post. I needed a way to secure proper hieght across the length of X and Y and hated the thought of drilling and taping round stock so I came up with this concept.

The aluminum is 1/8th or 1/4th and the part touching the rail will be slightly concave to mate to the 20mm rail. The part on the frame is bolted down but sloted for adjustment. Hieght adjustment is in the form of shims if need be but I plan to cut these to the exact hieght of the pillow blocks on the ends. The blue arrow in the last pic points to the open end of the linear bearing and how it clears the support bracket.

What ya think? will work wont work?

oh BTW I borrowed a set of 1" and 7/8 drill bits for the 4 stupid holes I need to cut. WOOT!!!

Good job Coogrr! I'm going with the same thing from vxb, keep us posted about how the support for the roundbar works out!
Have you taken any notice of the amount of play in the bearings?

well if I grab one I can say that there is at least a little .002ish play but I am using 2 on each and every axis/rail so 4 for each 2 left and 2 right.

With a angle strung between then my gantry plate comming down to that it should be very square and tight.

In fact the more square they are the less they drag so the object is to get them aligned very well.

I will let you know more when I get that done and pics will follow.

Coog

I am not using "gas" pipe for my rails as I went with solid steel and linear bearing from vxb see previous post. I needed a way to secure proper hieght across the length of X and Y and hated the thought of drilling and taping round stock so I came up with this concept.

The aluminum is 1/8th or 1/4th and the part touching the rail will be slightly concave to mate to the 20mm rail. The part on the frame is bolted down but sloted for adjustment. Hieght adjustment is in the form of shims if need be but I plan to cut these to the exact hieght of the pillow blocks on the ends. The blue arrow in the last pic points to the open end of the linear bearing and how it clears the support bracket.

What ya think? will work wont work?



IN ADDITION!!!!!

The support will be cut and made exactly same in dimension for hieght x 3 per rail so that the ends and the middle are set to same height regardless of support (pillow) blockat the end or anything that might make it hill or valley during the length. I may stick to one with the Y, and there wont be any on the Z so its only 3 of them to get to within .0005 or so... :confused:

Thanks for the reply Coogrr, it's great to have someone with the same ambition and ideas at the 'zone, looking forward to seeing more of your plans and work.
I will start ordering next week, and then we can exchange plans and ideas along the way!
Have you given any thoughts about the gentry?
cdsgraphics posted this earlier, I was thinking of going with something like this, since I'm planning a long z-axis, and need maximum stiffness i the gentry...
http://www.cnczone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=30167

I saw that one and another like it that is the cutty shark unit. I am wondering whether or not I may try that or another type of setup I will start drawing something and or think of what I am going to do as I am most certainly about to go there.

I think it would be great to share info and help each other as many do here! If I can answer anything I will!

Sorry for the time delay the cold weather of the last 2 weeks has made it very hard to go out into the shop. I am now back on track. I also had alot of time to work on the electronics so these are nearly set already. PICS inbound soon!

Coog

I've started doing some calculations on how much a gentry would bend, but it takes some time to do it in between studies..
Hopefully you come up with a good design Coog :)
My Keling steppers are on the way btw !

I've started doing some calculations on how much a gentry would bend, but it takes some time to do it in between studies..
Hopefully you come up with a good design Coog :)
My Keling steppers are on the way btw !


Awesome and to add to your steppers what motor setup you doing? I have a xylotex and a SureStep setup the heavy duty SureStep is going on this unit the Xylotex is for the second unit that will be built smaller and all aluminum but VERY strong and precise as it will be for milling aluminum directly.

I would suggest the Xylotex setup unless your steppers are bigger than 2.8phase amps then I would seggest a different solution (upon request).

I would also recommend this regardless of anything you do.
http://www.cnc4pc.com/Multifunction_CNC_Board.htm

has the opto isolation has allllll the input output additional hoockups for estop etc etc..

I am working on building a remote Jog/E-Stop/Pause/Spindle etc controller for use around the machine. This little board makes that hookup simple.

just my .0002 worth

Thanks for the tip Coog, I'm currently looking at drivers, found some similar or better than gecko for a better price, think I will go with that...
Will make a thread when the project is coming along.. :)

Well I finally got em mounted and only have a few more wires to go. The parallel card is where the multifunctio board will go and I will have to redo some of the wires but at least I can get this going.

Tomorrow the Gantry should be done and mounted with only the Z axis and steppers left!

Heres some pics again.

Coog

Coog, that is one nice controller setup you have there. Well done. :)

Coog, that is one nice controller setup you have there. Well done. :)


Doing Plexi box around it with ports for fans the middle supply is spare for +35 and +5 volts DC.

Side note I am making a 3D scanner for doing some imaging and going to make a lathe attach 4th axis for this machine too.

Gots a ways to go yet but gantry is going to be mounted tonight hopefully so I will upload pics if I can finish it today.

How are you planning your lathe attachment. I mentioned in the thread about additions/modifications on how simple it could be to put a 'lathe' axis lengthwise on the x axis. I also don't think it would be too difficult to add another stepper and use it to turn work pieces along the x axis. Does this make sense?

Coogrr,
I saw your description in the other thread of your lathe set up. That's almost exactly the kind of thing I was thinking about. It could be use as a lathe or just to turn your piece and it looks like it would be really simple for the you guys on here that already know what you're doing with these things. We also must be having the same ideas on using steel c channel, that's what I planned for my frame.

I have my Y axis mounted and the electronics board finished! Sorry I have been asleep for weeks with the cold weather and now I have the flu to boot! I will upload some pics later today (pacific time here).

Can wait to review how things have been going on the boards here and check in with a few of you.

coogr,

gee all I had to do was look at your thread for some good info. Looks like your nearing the home stretch, congrats.

JMP

How are you planning your lathe attachment. I mentioned in the thread about additions/modifications on how simple it could be to put a 'lathe' axis lengthwise on the x axis. I also don't think it would be too difficult to add another stepper and use it to turn work pieces along the x axis. Does this make sense?

Coogrr,
I saw your description in the other thread of your lathe set up. That's almost exactly the kind of thing I was thinking about. It could be use as a lathe or just to turn your piece and it looks like it would be really simple for the you guys on here that already know what you're doing with these things. We also must be having the same ideas on using steel c channel, that's what I planned for my frame.


I do plan a stepper mounted along X axis on the bed as an attachment or hook it to the end rails to swing it down into the bed area. I had some simple drawing around here but I think I iwll have to find it again or maybe draw it for real.

As for the "C" channel, I found it strong cheap and rigid so it was a no brainer and aluminum for wieght considerations for the rest. If the price is right everyone should try to get there IMO the resulting cuts will be higher quality at higher speeds.

just my .0002 worth

Thanks for the vote of confidence I look forward to chatting and sharing info!

coogr,

gee all I had to do was look at your thread for some good info. Looks like your nearing the home stretch, congrats.

JMP


I need to mount the y belt system and make my Z cart then I might feel the same but when the latest pics go online tonight you will see what I mean.


SORRRY to all ya that expected them lastnight I will get them tonight I swear or I will buy each of ya a beer!

Finally here they are new pics and a video to boot!

I quickly clamped a belt to the table to show how it works so take a look.

Let me know what you think... :cheers:


http://www.sandjlee.com/coogrrr_cnc.avi


just my .0002 worth

I have a 35vdc supply and want to power a 12vdc from that, amperage is same same so what parts do i need to solder???

Belt setup looks great coog. :)

Belt setup looks great coog. :)


your sig with how complete you are is awesome so I am going to steal the idea as a form of flattery of course :cheers:

Belt setup looks great coog. :)


I need your shameless plug for where your thread is or some pics or something so I can ohh and ahh about yours....


Coog

Nice work Coogrr! Have you taken any notice about the play in the bearing blocks yet? I've just ordered 12 pcs and PMDX board for my project :)

How is that beam working out? Aluminium H-bar? Dimensions?

Nice work Coogrr! Have you taken any notice about the play in the bearing blocks yet? I've just ordered 12 pcs and PMDX board for my project :)

How is that beam working out? Aluminium H-bar? Dimensions?


I havent felt much play but thats relative as I dont know if I can feel .002 play or not. Anywho the bearings stiffen up a ton with gantry and some torqe on them. The beam ia just 4" aluminum "c" channel with 3.5" legs i think and is light weight so I like it alot and it was cheap enough. If I could weld it I would build the next machine out of nothing but AL.

As for total bed size or cut size I think I should hit around 36" x 48" which is where I wanted this to land as the next machineS will be both a small one and a full sheet one. This one and the full sheet will be setup dual wood and plasma tables.

too many thoughts not enough time to work on all of it!

Coog

No problem about the signature, I took it from someone else who said he had taken it too, and that was nearly a year ago, so its doing the rounds! :)

Afraid there's not too much admiring with my machine, I had great plans for it, but I ended up having a few days off work and I just banged it together while I had the chance. :o
But hey! She cuts, and served my needs thus far for learning the basics about cnc, before starting on more Industrial type machines. Im hoping to iron out a few small problems tomorrow and get V-Carve Pro this month so I can do the few jobs that have been waiting on her.
I committed to doing another two carved signs today for my new employer. I offered them free, but hopefully I might get a paying job from them later, either from the same folks, or the other companies on the campus. Need to get my name out there! :) Anyway, I had a name for my first cnc router originally, but have since changed the name to 'The Ugly Ducking'....that about says it all! :D
http://www.cnczone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=29618

For what its worth, although I dont know enough about your intended purposes, but your intended setup sounds similar to my own....

....If possible I wouldn't go with a twin plasma/router setup if at all possible. I considered it originally but after being on cnczone now for the best part of a year I think its not such a great idea. Its discussed in a lot of threads.
I've decided on:
1 x small wood router, which will be the successor to my current build and much better built, maybe all metal. I can weld so that aint a problem.
1 x large wood router with 8' x 8' working area. Obviously that size will be metal.
1 x large plasma cutter. Likely 8' x 8' working area but this will be my last build so I haven't started considering details yet. Might be able to go with a smaller working area and index large pieces.

If you have the space I'd do seperate machines.
Anyway, m2c.
L8rs.

If I could weld it I would build the next machine out of nothing but AL.

Coog
Don't know what kind of welder you are using, but you can get serviceable welds on Aluminum with a stick welder.

Thanks for the inputs guys knowing is half the battle and getting the know from others is wise business.

I might forego the plasma until it gets its own machine. My next machine will be made from the parts being cut by this machine and be much more tight this machine will be for wood but the next machine will be over built to do 24"x24" max all aluminum including an actual spindle for it.

As for what welder I am using now Schootie - well nothing but I want to purchase one and I want to make sure I purchase a good wire feed unit unless the AL is not going to be doable.

Thanks for the feedback guys keep it rolling.

I'm pretty sure you can weld Al with MIG using the right gas. It won't take much internet surfing to find out what you need.

You can absolutly weld with MIG, but it's a lot more difficult than with steel...It takes a lot of time to learn and get it right... I prefer TIG for aluminium...Luckily, if you have a MIG/MAG welding machine, chances are that you can use the same gas for both...I don't remember the exact composition, but it should contain mostly Argon gas, if I'm not mistaken...(it's been a while...)
I believe you can get a decent TIG for about 8-900 $. That was the pricetag on mine at least...
But the cost of gases and different sizes of electrodes add up...You may be better off getting some friends at a machine shop ;)

Also I forgot to mention, you will need to use an Aluminium/Magnesium wire with the Mig and no spool gun because the pure aluminium wire is too soft. But the Al/Magnesium makes a dirtier weld.

Well I got some time in finally and have nearly finished the Z-car today. I should have it running through wood inside 2 weeks if I get as much time in the days to come.

Well here are a couple of pics and a new AVI file that shows the movement of the Z-car and gantry.


http://www.sandjlee.com/coogrrr_cnc2.avi


Coog

I did manage to mount the Y belt and 2 of the 4 holders for the 2 X belts, this is a bear as I am drilling steel with a portable 18v drill....

The whole setup slides VERY smoothly but I think I am getting some flex in my rails now that there is some good weight on them. I do have a plan that seems to be working out for the X axis as this is direct downward force and is simple to over come. BUT... my Y axis is flexing horizontally and the bracing can only be between the main strut and the rails in a vertical setup like the X axis..

So my question is anyone have an idead to brevent horizontal flex in the Y rails but using only a straigt up down from the strut to stabalize this? I have added a pic that shows the yellow arrows for the flex and the red arrows show where I have to support the rail.

Help needed.... :withstupi

Couldn't you extend your rail support the entire length of the rail? This still may not help with the lateral flex. As far as drilling, I believe the bit makes all the difference. I have some cheap bits that I was using, but not doing to well. I just happened to have a bit in my tool box from unknown origins that went right through the channel I am using.

Couldn't you extend your rail support the entire length of the rail? This still may not help with the lateral flex. As far as drilling, I believe the bit makes all the difference. I have some cheap bits that I was using, but not doing to well. I just happened to have a bit in my tool box from unknown origins that went right through the channel I am using.


I figured I could bolt up through the channel (its aluminum) and into the rail the tough part here is that the rail is all hardened steel so drilling and tapping this item or just drilling it is going to suck royal. I may have to take it to a shop to be put on a mill.

Anyone here have a mill and live in or around Portland, OR?

Coog

Coogrrr,

Very nice job, I watched the video and it makes everything more clear in my mind.

If you don't mind answering this;

Just how much are you into your version of Davids table?

Coogrrr,

Very nice job, I watched the video and it makes everything more clear in my mind.

If you don't mind answering this;

Just how much are you into your version of Davids table?


50 in steel 150 aluminum 450 in electronics/motors 200 in rails/bearings so in all end to end around 1k rounding up not including the PC. I am sure I can build another one like this for less as I bought an extra axis and extra aluminum etc and the first shot through is always a learning(costly) process.

My next one will be done with copier motors and mdf/hdpe so it will cost around 200 to build a 24x24x4 inch table and go more quickly with the first CNC building the parts for the second.

First cuts today if I can get mach3 setup all the way..

ok so I had extra magnectic contact switches left over from my security system installation and had an epiphony(spell check). I setup 2 of these contacts per axis wire back to my electronics and they work like a champ!


http://www.smarthome.com/7113.html

love em!


Coog

Coogerr,

Did you ever get the Horizontal flexing out of the Y Axis?

Bill

I am now dialing in the machine and havent as of yet dealt with any flex issues. The problem I am trying to solve is this...

I have setup the machine in Mach3 and watched all the videos I can ref all home and jog the machine no problem with either. BUT! when I type in g0x10 it goes 10 inches perfectly however if I type in g0x0.5 it gets to the limit switch at around 4 inches left to go.

How is it it will run positive X axis perfectly then over run back the other direction??

Help anyone everyone?

Coog

P.S. I will start searching through the threads for more info.

I have an issue in mach3. I issue G0X4 and it travels 4" just fine. When I issue G0X0 or G0X-4 either of those send it back 7or so inches. I have talked to Art of Mach3 and he had me check MaxCL which is off he had me try sherline setting he had me try G90 but nothing thus far works so here i am ready to set a router on this and make my first cuts except my X and Y axis is running 1.6 to 1.9 times farther on the negative move than it does on the positive move PLEASE HELP!!!!


~Coog (crying out of frustration!)


Thanks in advance and I am here all night Pacific time to try things to make it work so send me the PM's and or the posted replies!

on the settings page i did the calibration using -2 as the distance then told it that it moved 4" as it did. it set my steps to 1248 and now the negative movement is right on so G0X-4 sends it back 4" perfectly but it moves only 2" forward on a G0X4 move....


its like x in the negative moves farther then the positive??? I dont know how this is possible but sure enough it does it.

still need help please.

Does it sound different when moving in the different directions?

Does it sound different when moving in the different directions?


it sounds different running in the negative like its moving faster. and when i jog it it moves faster in the negative than it does in the positive.

Do you get good results from the driver test?

Do you get good results from the driver test?


I watched the video and ran the driver test program and had a better signal than he did in the video.

If you change your pin settings in Mach3 so the Z axis drive is set up as X, does the Z then do the same thing? I'm assuming the Z is working correctly and only the X and Y are messed up?

Also, is your direction pulse set to at least 2? And are you sure you're outputting 5V?

First of all let me say thank you sooo much for all the help time and effort you have all given and I want to say Art F. of Mach3 is an example of great customer service. Secondly let me say it got it! It was not the Mach3 software, noise, or sherline, or g90 or maxCL! It was this board http://www.cnc4pc.com/Multifunction_CNC_Board.htm (http://www.cnc4pc.com/Multifunction_CNC_Board.htm) which op-isolates all the pins. I wired directly to my drivers and *poof* no more problem circa 12:32 am! So today I am setting up a simple breakout board directly to all my drivers. They are each op-isolated so I still retain some safety but not on my home/limit switches. I will be trying to work with that company to resolve the issue but all I can do is hope they are as good as Art at customer service.

Thank you again for everyones help and I cant say enough about this family!

Coog

Hello Coogrr,

I was looking at that board, does it look like a good board?
Is there a reason you have chosen that one over Xylotex or HobbyCNC or Gecko?

I need to buy 3 boards for;
Foam cutter
Router
X2 Mill

I really would like to have one board and have a A-B-C selector box type setup, but I have heard that it is more trouble than it's worth.

Thanks and GOOD LUCK!
Bill

Hello Coogrr,

I was looking at that board, does it look like a good board?
Is there a reason you have chosen that one over Xylotex or HobbyCNC or Gecko?

I need to buy 3 boards for;
Foam cutter
Router
X2 Mill

I really would like to have one board and have a A-B-C selector box type setup, but I have heard that it is more trouble than it's worth.

Thanks and GOOD LUCK!
Bill


Bill,
do you mean the board in my previous post? I like/liked the board but with my automation direct there seems to be an incompatibility. I think with Xylotex setup it would work fine. I will test it on the next unit to make sure this is true. As for that board I like that is has a Digital and an Analog relay all the inputes and outputs are opto-isolated every pin is easy to get to it is really a well thought out board.

So with a Xylotex 400+oz/in setup 3axis solution, yes I think (will verify) that this is the best solution.

If you mean a different board let me know.

If you mean a different board let me know.
Nope, Thats the one!

Thanks
Bill

I moved the 2 videos to you tube and tomorrow I will upload the new one that shows first cuts also.

First Video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SBC8rxM-_xA[/URL]

Second Video: [URL]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZiPQPodKJf4 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SBC8rxM-_xA)


Coog

I am building the base for my machine out of solid teak 4x4. 4 legs 30" 2 long axis cross members then 4 crossmembers along y to hold MDF table.

1" thick MDF table that I will level to the machine but when its installed I am going to mill the entire top to get it perfectly level to the router. I will put 1" MDF T-slot table design on that and use sacrificial boards under my work that has to cut all the way through.

The steel frame will be bolted to the top of the 4 legs with anchor screws that have machine threads 1/2 13 on the top half and wood thread on the bottom. This will allow me to screw down into the post securely and then level the machine to the table top by using nuts on the upper halves and jam nuts to hold it in place.

I plan to use leveling feet under each leg that are around 3" diameter to help soak some vibrations out too but this teak is soooo heavy that the base with table will wiegh in around 250+lbs. add to that the 150lbs router itself and well if ti walks then its because its pissed at me and needs to go somewhere I guess.
:confused:

Anyway I will get some pics online tonight if I can and will get some after table is built also.

Coog

P.S. Video - may not be my best one but it shows I have movement!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2wNiQbK4JrY

Electronics - on
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yDRIcYuU-IE

I posted this file on a different thread but for those watching my attempt at a CNC here are my belt driven calcs!


Coog

I am wondering if milling a 1" thick MDF board with the mounted router is wise. I want the table to be flat to .0001 and can run my planning bit over the entire surface of the MDF board should I seal the wood after this ???

Anyone have some knowledge on this thought?

Coog

I've seen on this forum where others have done it. I think one concern is that outside of the cutting area, the MDF will be higher than what you mill off. It could cause problems if your workpiece has to extend past your cutting area. I guess you could manually rout the MDF down on the edges to avoid that if necessary.

I am milling the table everywhere the router can reach and then on that I will be placing the 1" thick MDF t-slot pieces. This wont be any bigger than where the mill can reach and will sit on a nice leveled table. The top of the t-slots will then be milled to perfect smooth level also with the router once more.

I will use a sacrifical board under my stock that has been mill likely some hardwood or something for the thru cuts. and if no thru cuts just use the t-slots to directly clamp.

Later when I can afford it I will change to a steel version of this.

Thanks for the thought Schootie! Long time no see brother!

Coog

I've been on here following your build. I kind of wish I had decided to build the belt drive table, but I'll stick with the dual lead screw and see how it goes. I've started mine and I am using 3" channel with acme screws. Not sure how I'm going to build the gantry, considered channel like you have or maybe building it out of 1.5" steel tube built to the original dimensions. I'm cutting my steel with a chopsaw and I'm having trouble getting square cuts. This is causing me to end up with different lengths than the plans called for by the time I get it as square as I can. I'll have to atone for this while building the gantry.

Ok lets look over some thought about perfect cuts and square-ness....

If you take 2 un even lengths of stock that would run the length of the Y axis and hold your rails instead of welding them into place on the face of the gantry legs I would cut holes in the gantry legs and place these 2 lengths through those holes on each end.

With this I can exactly measure the distance between the 2 legs at top and bottom, and then bolt a piece of angle to the leg and the rails that are slot fitted(oval hole) for adjusting the distance between legs. see pic1

This allows me to have unequal lengths yet adjust for square and precise distance between the 2 legs or even between the 2 rails them selves.

my CNC has many of these "slotted - bolt" style setups so I can adjust it in every axis in every direction to the .0001 inch so when its set I simply locktite (breakable locktite) each bolt and its good to go yet I can readjust later if need be.

I try to build into each step a method to over come my bad cuts or missed accidental angles or something so I can go back and take it out. I think this comes from a long time of car building where everything is precise but can be adjusted for wear and tear or better handling etc etc.

Hold this helps.

Coog

OH and as for screw driven. My CNC is screw driven on the Z axis and my next cnc(s) being smaller will all be screw driven it is VERY easy to setup compared to belt and faster also and the resolution is still very good infact.

I like the lead screw method until 36" then its belts or rack and pinion (ohhh fun !)

Coog

I have not been able to get to the CNC build for nearly 2 weeks now but starting Thursday its full steam ahead until Monday night. I am going to try to have her doing some nice final cuts by then!

Stay tuned for some good diagrams/pics/videos as I am going to try to document the whole damn machine once and for all.

Coog

Waiting patiently. It is a shame a fellow has to work before enjoying his toys.

:mad: !!! stupid work!


I like this advice!
There is a dangerous virus being passed around electronically, orally,
and by hand. This virus is called Worm-Overload-Recreational-Killer
(WORK). If you receive WORK from any of your colleagues, your boss, or
anyone else via any means DO NOT TOUCH IT! This virus will wipe out your private life completely.

If you should come into contact with WORK, put your jacket on and take
two good friends to the nearest grocery store. Purchase the antidote
known as Work-Isolating-Neutralizer-Extract (WINE) or
Bothersome-Employer-Elimination-Rebooter (BEER). Take the antidote
repeatedly until WORK has been completely eliminated from your system.
You should forward this warning to 5 friends. If you do not have 5
friends, you have already been infected and WORK is controlling your life.

:cheers:

Coog

Hi Coogrrr,
very impressed by how you are progressing so fast and well. I tried the advice about wine and beer but am now so relaxed I don't do anything at all!
Did you make any progress to resolve issues with the C11 board with CNC4PC? I note they say the C11 board curently offered is a new revision 3.
I read this thread today ;( after ordering their C1 board on Tuesday. I will let you know if I find a problem.
Looking forward to seeing you machine completed
Graham

I am in the process if aquiring parts for my cnc. I just ordered the vbx 20mm rails......Are you happy with your design? and how are they working out for you. I know this is out of the go cheap locally method for David's plans but I choose some linear bearing and rails to handle X and Y and Z axis these are solid 20mm bars with "c" shaped linear bearings they are sold as "cnc" bearings in fact.

http://www.vxb.com/page/bearings/CTGY/20mmLinearMotionSystems

I am using the blocks on each end and to support the middle areas I am useing a piece of angle cut to hieght and screwed to the steel channel. This will give a wider support then a screw/bolt and will be easier to make and mount then drill/tapping the solid round bar.

This rail set will give a better connection to hook to so I dont need to thread through "gas" pipe and I wont have to manufacture the skate bearing solution either.

:withstupi

I am very happy with my rails the only exception to that is that I need to make good support for the length of them. They are hardened steel all the way through and the bearings are steallar! There is some flex in them mid way on a 60" run and with 150lbs on it. so I am going to support it with 3 5/16 bolts up from my steel box into them hopefully threaded.

another soulution is to set them on a piece of angle and to grind a striaght line the lenght so that it is in the middle. I use the open bearings that are "c" shaped not the fully closed ones.

I do suggest a support if the length is more than a couple feet and there is good wieght on them. but they will never wear out as far as I can see.

hope this helps if not shoot me some more questions.

Coog

I have not received mine yet, but I was thinking the same thing. I don't know how hard it is to drill into this material. From what I am hearing it's tuff. Also can't imagine it being too easy tapping either......But thanks for your input....Well get it done.....

here is the cnc without a router but testing table stability.
60ipm:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=33hdAhAiGQA

and much much faster 200ipm:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PK-kpC4IGyc

need to mount router and perm mount the limit/home switches and make my cable chains and t-slot hold downs. After all that i can put all the pretty skirting etc around it.

Coog

P.S. I set the ipm to 300 and then overdrove it to 555ipm and it didnt take itself apart!

Yeah Beer/Wine love it but my CNC hates me for drinking it as she gets no attention! :) I have not made progress with the C11 REv 3 board I ahve but the support person is readily available to work on this with me so I give him AAAAA+ on support. I still hold that the board and my drivers are maybe incompatible but he isnt done with me yet.

As for the machine look to the previous post for a 200ipm YES 200 ipm video. I messed around and drove it at 300ipm then over rode that to 555ipm last night to see if it would blow a belt or something and it screamed through 4400 lines of the roadrunner sample from Mach 3 in less than 2 mins.

Now remember I need to mount a router on this and get it into wood but I seriously doubt that 80+ ipm is possible as the push on the bit would break it off.

Coog

Hi Coogrrr,
very impressed by how you are progressing so fast and well. I tried the advice about wine and beer but am now so relaxed I don't do anything at all!
Did you make any progress to resolve issues with the C11 board with CNC4PC? I note they say the C11 board curently offered is a new revision 3.
I read this thread today ;( after ordering their C1 board on Tuesday. I will let you know if I find a problem.
Looking forward to seeing you machine completed
Graham

I get my Hitachi router this Thursday and I will finally be able to mount a real router to the table and give it a try. I know I am already going to have to more securely mount my rails as they are wanting to give a little and I am just avoiding the issue of trying to deal with hardened steel...

I am trying to wrap my mind around the drilling or milling of this stuff...


Coog

I am looking to build my t-slot hold down table this weekend if all goes as planned....!!!! I am planning to buy and use these http://www.rockler.com/product.cfm?page=5209 kits as my t-slot track but I was wondering if there was a "best" configuration...

I am including the sketchup file and 3 pics of the obvious 2 and the Great NorthWest "do it wierd" 3rd option! Let me know any thoughts on this I was looking at the 3rd as it might provide more configurations for clamping???

Thanks for the input guys!

Coog

Hey! Thats a great idea Coog. :) I'll look at it for my next machine also, thanks. :cheers:. I'd say go with idea 1 or 2, no point making it more complicated for no reason.

TOTB been awhile where you been? Thanks for the feed back the t-clot product is something I saw on another post here but cant remember where only that it is placed into my cnc favorites web links kudos to mr. x on that link for us!

As for the vertical or horizontal or angular track setup the least costly is the one that runs with the X then it cost a minor amount more as you add more slots. The angular one would cost more but that is all as for the build its still the same width boards only a little longer so that I can cut 45 degree angles at the ends to make it all slideways... But if we discount that is there an advantage to the angular attack?

If not then I think I am going to run mine against the x axis or in the same direction as the Y so that I can put up a fence or attach a 4th axis and or provide some push against the x itself. I think that this attack if stay with perp or parr configurations would be best in the long run. Plus I can buy the 36" tracks for slightly less then buy the knob kit seperately.

Coog

I've been around Coog, just busy busy. No time for posting. You know how it is. Thanks for the T-Slot idea. Im getting the bug again designing my next baby! :) L8rs.

Last week my son got into a headon car wreck as a passenger. Everyone is now ok. The results can bee seen here (http://www.localnewsdaily.com/news/story.php?story_id=117503344636904100) the car is the one my son was in. After all the stress of the accident I was unable to focus on my machine or having any good input here at the zone. BUT I think I am getting the urge to continue now and I will try to make myself more available!

Thanks for the support you guys!

Coog

Wow, I can see why the stress factor would come in. Glad to hear everyone is now OK.

Wow Coog, glad he's ok. That's why I like big cars, somehow I don't think a Nissan Micra would have fared so well (Using the term 'well' loosely!).

Last week my son got into a headon car wreck as a passenger. Everyone is now ok. The results can bee seen here (http://www.localnewsdaily.com/news/story.php?story_id=117503344636904100) the car is the one my son was in. After all the stress of the accident I was unable to focus on my machine or having any good input here at the zone. BUT I think I am getting the urge to continue now and I will try to make myself more available!

Thanks for the support you guys!

Coog


Coorrr, Glad your son is ok I know all to well of the situation, I had to go through that 2 1/2 years ago when my son died in a car accident, it was very rough, and very glad you do not have to go through that. it is very painful.

Enjoy every time you have with him and be very thankful for having him with you now.

Joe

I did not mean to dredge up any hard memories and yes your words strike home as do all of your guy's replies. I am sorry for your loss Joe and will hug my son a couple more times just for you! Thank you for the support everyone.

Coog

Coorrr, Glad your son is ok I know all to well of the situation, I had to go through that 2 1/2 years ago when my son died in a car accident, it was very rough, and very glad you do not have to go through that. it is very painful.

Enjoy every time you have with him and be very thankful for having him with you now.

Joe

HI,

I am new and I apologize for my poor english, Its not my language.

If Somebody know?
From the motor company I don't received any answer.

I have four beautiful and new stepper motors from
"Swiss made" SONCEBOZ 6500 R.489
3.9 Amper ∆/PH 9610
8 wires
with Ωmeter I find the four coils
white & red/white; orange & green; red & black; green/white & black/white.
How can I know the A A' and B B' coils? connections to make 4 wires connection.
What should be the tention to use? What driver to buy for a 3 axis CNC machine I build.

Thank you very much
Yosi

I know that the gecko drives will be a very good choice. I know that I have seen things about wirring 4 or 6 or 8 lead wire steppers also. As for which are which on yours I cannot help currently but I will try to find some more info or a thread or two to help you. I would suggest posting to the main forum for DIY here and asking there.

Welcome to a great hobby and dont get discouraged all the little problems can be worked through with a little time and patience.

~Coog

Coorrr, Glad your son is ok I know all to well of the situation, I had to go through that 2 1/2 years ago when my son died in a car accident, it was very rough, and very glad you do not have to go through that. it is very painful.

Enjoy every time you have with him and be very thankful for having him with you now.

Joe

I am very sorry too Joe, loosing a child is very rough.
I have two daughters and as a parent i can see that this is the worst can happen....

Coorr, i am glad your son is OK.

HI,

I am new and I apologize for my poor english, Its not my language.

If Somebody know?
From the motor company I don't received any answer.

I have four beautiful and new stepper motors from
"Swiss made" SONCEBOZ 6500 R.489
3.9 Amper ∆/PH 9610
8 wires
with Ωmeter I find the four coils
white & red/white; orange & green; red & black; green/white & black/white.
How can I know the A A' and B B' coils? connections to make 4 wires connection.
What should be the tention to use? What driver to buy for a 3 axis CNC machine I build.

Thank you very much
Yosi

Hello Yosi, :)

I hope this will help you, is from Astrosin Step motors, maybe will work with yours too.

Hello Yosi, :)

I hope this will help you, is from Astrosin Step motors, maybe will work with yours too.

Thank you very much
It could help
I am going to try.

Yosi

He is in physical therapy now and doing much better he will recover fine. Oh and thanks for helping Yosi out also!

One of the reasons I actually spend time on this board is the helpfulness!

Coog

Yosi,

I found this attached page which seems to show the same colours as you list in your post. I have not tried to upload attachments before so, just in case it fails the address for the page is:
http://www.sonceboz.com/html/en/pdf/motoren/6500/6530-24.pdf

hope it is of use.

Graham

Yosi,

I found this attached page which seems to show the same colours as you list in your post. I have not tried to upload attachments before so, just in case it fails the address for the page is:
http://www.sonceboz.com/html/en/pdf/motoren/6500/6530-24.pdf

hope it is of use.

Graham
Graham

Thank you very much its very helpfull.
Thanks to all in this forum

Yosi

After thinking about these rail flex issues. I figure that a simple machined hole tapped and threaded into the rails midpoint then mounted down through the steel frame and bolted will solve any posibilty of sag, the other thing it does it solves any lateral movement, have you tried anything?

This looks very nice, but for supports for under the rails, start a hole under the rails and drill and tap holes on your main frame directly under the holes in the rails and run a long bolt up though and use a lock nut for adjustments? Also there could be multiple holes and adjustments on each side. This is just my 2 cents.....

Gurvy/Porschet,

Yes that is my thought too. The tough part is being the DIY guy I am I dont have the tools to handle this case hardened steel. It is hardened all the way through so it is VERY tough to get a drill into it and straight also.

I know I can grind a little straight line into it with a jig and then use the "L" shaped bracket to fit into that and lock the bracket down. But I really really want to go with what you guys said which is the bolt method.

Any thought on how to drill/tap this hardened stuff?

Coog

Hi again Coogrr,
With our similar design, we are planning to get the drilling and tapping done at a pro shop, it is something that you _could_ do for yourself, but I don't think it's worth putting down that many hours on something...Let alone, the cost of the equipment needed.
Getting every hole lined up perfectly and then get the tapping done well is difficult at best, at least if you are unsure how to go about it.
(I know WE were, that's why somebody else does it for us.;) )

My Rails came from VXB as well, I did take everything apart and took it into the local machine shop to have them drill and tap them for me, they did a perfect job, 1/4 inch standard threads, I used ready rod cut and threaded tight into the rails, and locknuts down through the frame top and bottom , now I can adjust the height levels, worked out perfectly, I think the 80 bucks was worth the time and precision, I wouldn't have been able to reproduce with my tools. 3 holes in the X axis and 1 in the center of the Y. The shop guys did say the outside was pretty hard, but once into the rails they were okay to work with for threading.
Question, where did you end up sourcing your timing belts and pulleys?
Thanks

Hi

Just read the last few posts in this thread and wanted to give a little advise.
For drilling hardened steel use a masonery bit reground to the proper tip. These work very well, I've used them for years for case hardened steel as well as through hardened steel.

Hope it helps someone.

steve

I like the fact that I could DIY my holes with a masonry bit and that is nows card filed info!

I am however taking mine to a shop as I am not confident that my prescision is on par yet...

Good deal either way guys!!!

My Rails came from VXB as well, I did take everything apart and took it into the local machine shop to have them drill and tap them for me, they did a perfect job, 1/4 inch standard threads, I used ready rod cut and threaded tight into the rails, and locknuts down through the frame top and bottom , now I can adjust the height levels, worked out perfectly, I think the 80 bucks was worth the time and precision, I wouldn't have been able to reproduce with my tools. 3 holes in the X axis and 1 in the center of the Y. The shop guys did say the outside was pretty hard, but once into the rails they were okay to work with for threading.
Question, where did you end up sourcing your timing belts and pulleys?
Thanks


McMasterCarr has some but I found that www.sdp-si.com (http://www.sdp-si.com) is best and make sure that everything you order is matching in pitch and widths. I like .200 stuff myself. And if you can kevlar reinforced but not a must.

Coog
P.S. I am going to use 5 holes on my X's and 3 on my y's

Holes done and now that it is all apart i am putting paint to it tonight and I am assembling for first cuts this weekend!

Crossing my fingures that I dont break something or forget something on the rebuilding part! Also stay tuned for the video of its first cuts!

Coog

Coogrr - looking forward to the video and some more pictures. I'm really interested in hearing the results of any accuracy tests (e.g. cutting a 1" circle or square and reporting the error) you might be doing.

its going slower than I had hoped but the weekend draws closer so maybe with a good push I will be up and running.

Coog

Coogrrr,

Just wanted to say thanks for all the work you put into your project and posting the info on this site. I'm in the process of building my first CNC router so I have gained many good ideas from your postings as well as others. I'm looking forward to seeing your video when all is finished. BTW, what do you plan on using your machine for when it's finished? Wood cutting, metalwork?

Great build. Thanks again.

Den

Coogrrr,

I'm also making a similar machine based on the belt drive plans - I noticed you skipped David's method of creating the pulleys on the end plates. I split several pvc couplers before deciding to just order more timing belt pulleys.

What size pulleys did you use (how many teeth) - and did you drill them out for the bearings - or how did you mount them?

And I'll second dmparrott's comments, thanks for taking the time to document your build, it's a great help for the rest of us!

Coogrrr,

Just wanted to say thanks for all the work you put into your project and posting the info on this site. I'm in the process of building my first CNC router so I have gained many good ideas from your postings as well as others. I'm looking forward to seeing your video when all is finished. BTW, what do you plan on using your machine for when it's finished? Wood cutting, metalwork?

Great build. Thanks again.

Den

Well I do intend on primarily using it on wood/hdpe but I will try some metal work. I intend I building a smaller unit for metal work though this one being all leadscrew and super tough in build and super fine resolution.

Videos inbound soon!

Coog

Coogrrr,

I'm also making a similar machine based on the belt drive plans - I noticed you skipped David's method of creating the pulleys on the end plates. I split several pvc couplers before deciding to just order more timing belt pulleys.

What size pulleys did you use (how many teeth) - and did you drill them out for the bearings - or how did you mount them?

And I'll second dmparrott's comments, thanks for taking the time to document your build, it's a great help for the rest of us!


Ok if you were lucky like me you got 100 of those bearings for 27.00 US (which is what i did for future projects or replacing worn ones) so I made some of those PVC pulleys and absolutely busted all of them from simple temp changes. The next test and it ends up being the final result is I stacked 4 of them onto a 5/16" x 2" bolt (you pick your size) and I bolted that to the plate between the stepper pulley (14 tooth) and the main pulley (56 tooth) and it is in a slot cut into the aluminum. see attached drawing for an example.

so make a slot 5/16" wide to go cross-way to the belt then insert a 5/16" bolt with 4 bearings jammed with one nut to the top, through the plate and then another nut below to hold it in place and make for adjustments.


I will try to get you a real pic tonight or some video.

Coog

Coogrrr,

I'm also making a similar machine based on the belt drive plans - I noticed you skipped David's method of creating the pulleys on the end plates. I split several pvc couplers before deciding to just order more timing belt pulleys.

What size pulleys did you use (how many teeth) - and did you drill them out for the bearings - or how did you mount them?

And I'll second dmparrott's comments, thanks for taking the time to document your build, it's a great help for the rest of us!


Thank you guys again for the support I will get under way with more info as I can but!!!! I reread what you asked Ron and I wanted to make sure I covered the other pulley. I used the same 14thooth pulley from the stepper shaft and it is a 5/16" bolt also. I used no bearings this time around but will buy pulleys with bearings if this wears badly. I think it will be ok with a drop of oil occasionally as the speed (rpm) that these pulleys move is very small. If I rapid at 300ipm they are not getting to 300rpm as my drive pulley is a 1" diameter. So I figure for the drive pulley on the X axis to walk 50" one end to the other ir will have to rotate < 60 times. If this could be done in 10 seconds flat which is about 300ipm the pulleys would be moving at around 300 rpm for only that period of time not sustained.

I think that the bearing issue will take much time to show its face but when it does here is the solution!!!!


take 2 of those beloved skate bearings and 2 washers and make a pulley! might want to get a small 5/16" by nearly nothing washer to put between the big washer and the skate bearing. I will try to mock that up tonight and upload the video tonight too.

Coog

No pun intended but I warbled my brain around making pulleys for the Solsylva plans and on my router here is my replacement soulution in pics...

I would use 3 bearings in a triangle top one is a drive pulley that the belts teeth get into.

I would then use a 5/16" bolt or what ever size is right for you and put that through a bearing in the plate to hold a pulley 2 more times.

Now the top one is set screwed into its shaft that runs back to the stepper drive. The other 2 free wheel so the belt can move nicely.

I would then bolt the a plate over the tos of those 3 with another set of bearings to hold it straight.

This is much the same as David shows only I am using the bearings to support the bolt that the pulleys are on.

I will likely do this setup right away so I can ensure a nice long life to this system.

As for making sure its tight I would just check the belt tension and tighten it at the ends rather than build a tension system in this setup.

Coog

Ok if you were lucky like me you got 100 of those bearings for 27.00 US

Yeah that's the first mistake I made - I already had some bearings, and figured, aw I won't need that many extra, but after 2 trips to home depot to buy pvc couplers and bearings getting soaked in pvc cement I had to buy more bearings.

As it turns out we hit upon similar solutions - yours is perhaps a little easier than mine. I bought 4 more 14 tooth pulleys, but then drilled out each side so I could fit in a set of bearings - no easy feat since I have a mini-mill but no lathe.

I also like your solution re: using the stack of bearing as a pulley - thanks for that.

Were there any other areas that you ran into problems (other than those due to switching to a different rail system)?

I've gotten through the first 12 pages (installation of the Y-Stepper mount for those of you who don't have the plans) and so far the largest difficulty was those darn pulleys. It's great to not have to be the first to try to come up with a solution - thanks a lot of taking the time to make and post those pictures!

Yeah that's the first mistake I made - I already had some bearings, and figured, aw I won't need that many extra, but after 2 trips to home depot to buy pvc couplers and bearings getting soaked in pvc cement I had to buy more bearings.

As it turns out we hit upon similar solutions - yours is perhaps a little easier than mine. I bought 4 more 14 tooth pulleys, but then drilled out each side so I could fit in a set of bearings - no easy feat since I have a mini-mill but no lathe.

I also like your solution re: using the stack of bearing as a pulley - thanks for that.

Were there any other areas that you ran into problems (other than those due to switching to a different rail system)?

I've gotten through the first 12 pages (installation of the Y-Stepper mount for those of you who don't have the plans) and so far the largest difficulty was those darn pulleys. It's great to not have to be the first to try to come up with a solution - thanks a lot of taking the time to make and post those pictures!

I ran into a small issue mounting pulleys and rails of course the pulleys on my steppers had to be drilled out to .5" to fit. I also ran into an issue with my opto isolation board which I am hoping will be worked out shortly, its not bad just the electronics I am using are in conflict I will have to let you know more about that another time.

As for my pulleys I did take a couple videos showing my setup in much greater details and I also show some of the limit switches I am using. Well any way I dont think I will get a nod from the Emmys but here they are!

Coog

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SM2y_gk5zNg
AND
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iw1Aq3MTm8k

Coogrrr - That was fantastic! Way beyond the feedback I thought I'd get. This post should be flagged for anyone else making the SolSylva belt drive cnc ( plans sol sylva solslyva large table pulley pulleys pvc ) <--- hopefully this list of keywords will help the next poor soul find your great post. [Note if you just found this message due to the keywords, look at the above post and videos by Coogrrr, they'll save you a lot of time.]

Well when you have it back up and running I'd be very interested in seeing the results.

Thanks again.

STOP IT!!!! you make me blush! lol


Thank you for the words o encouragement. I do plan on makeing some more videos and going over all that I can for anyone making this type and!!! ...wait for it... wait.... A 24x24 aluminum capable router! yes uber stout and not expensive!!! Then to wrap that all the how to's on the lathe axis for this and hopefully any machine then as my final wrap a CNC Lathe from scratch not a rebuilt 99 dollar jobby

SO STAY TUNED its going to be an exciting winter!

Coog

I'm wondering why you felt these modifications are necessary.

Ed_R - It looks like you're asking about the pulleys - so I'll respond to that.

The plans call for press fitting bearings into two different sized couplers, then into bushings, I managed to make one set without splitting the PVC (I even tried heating the pvc up in boiling water first which marginally helped).

You may have better luck than coogrrr or I did, but for a few dollars for a pulley it's not worth the headache and split pvc. I wasted several nights (and time returning to HomeDepot to get more PVC) before deciding to order more pulleys.

That's why I was encouraged when I noticed on coogrrr's video that he'd done a similar solution, and since I'd seen his run in the video I figured I wasn't wasting more of my time.

I'll try the PVC way first, it's hot and things ought to slide together easily . But if they don't I'll have to take some measurements and do the pulley thing like you guys do. My current plan includes only two deviations from the design- I'm going to make the X axis a bit shorter, and I'm not running the xylotec or Hobbycnc controllers, I'm running a Camtronics controller with the 425-ounce steppers and a 48 volt power supply. Just means the math's a teeny bit different is all.

I'll try the PVC way first, it's hot and things ought to slide together easily . But if they don't I'll have to take some measurements and do the pulley thing like you guys do. My current plan includes only two deviations from the design- I'm going to make the X axis a bit shorter, and I'm not running the xylotec or Hobbycnc controllers, I'm running a Camtronics controller with the 425-ounce steppers and a 48 volt power supply. Just means the math's a teeny bit different is all.


Boy I hope I caught you in time... Yes your right when its hot outside or rather the PVC is nice and warm they go together rather nicely. (use a vise to press them smooth) However this is not the pitfall I had. The issue is that they get hot from use and or you build them when warm just to return and find that they split badly when they cooled. Now the other gotcha is it gets real cold in winter and unless you bake your shop all winter long to match that nice summer day where the pvc is soft you will get a split.

It is a way to go and yes David has obviously done it a few times. I would wager that 1. my alternative is faster to assemble 2. wont crack in time. 3. serviceable when a bearing dies. 4. stronger all around.

Do not mistake me I love David's plans and will be building the super strong smaller metal CNC for myself off his plans of course Coogrrr'fied a bit too.


Just my .002" worth

Coog

I live in Texas; it's rarely under 60 degrees here for very long. David's from South Carolina, it's warm there all winter too. I'll probably find myself replacing the idlers but since I've already spent the money on the parts I may as well try it this way.
the idea of two washers and a stack of bearings is a good one, I'l'l probably do that if this pvc stuff cracks.

I bought one of the famous Hitachi routers that we all talk about on this web site. Example here http://www.hitachi-koki.com/powertools/products/cutter/km12vc/km12vc.html

It has a speed controller on the top of it but I want to control the speed like a spindle with a VFD. I would simply turn the router all the way up and then slow it down with the VFD device or whatever is suggested.

Anyone know of a thread here that has information and/or could you reply with some suggestions?

Thanks in advance
Coog

I finally have this thing finished with pain! Does it look ok? The new Z mount is finished also, nothing a couple aluminum plates cant fix in life! As long as there is sufficient duct tape and chewing gum and paper clips!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wKJTOetYbWg

Electronics today and a new brain (computer) for it and maybe just maybe it will cut today! I am going to use the T-nut solution all over the bed on something like a 2" spread. and have some long bolts with aluminum plates drilled and slightly bent. I will also use the miniature guitar shaped holders I have seen and use them to lock down the sides of work pieces. I will use the router to cut those out when I know its working.

Wish me luck on the electronics!

Coog

Wow this looks great, especially with the new paint job! It just makes me want the patience and money to build one of these!

all I can do is think how nice it looks now. I am hooking up the shop vac tonight and the electronics are all done so tonight I should have a new video and maybe even my first cut!

Thanks for the compliment and you have to be VERY careful the bug will bite hard and infect you deeply. It did me so much that I am planning number 2 already!

Coog

It looks great! Can't wait to see the cut video.

So after all this, what are you planning on making? (Aside from cnc router #2.)

One question - what's the difference in the Z-carriage aside from the mounts for the full sized router?

One question - what's the difference in the Z-carriage aside from the mounts for the full sized router?

the Z car changed in that there is a 3/8 plate holding the four bearings precisely and the Z leadscrew/nut all together on which the 3/8" router mount plate is then bolted. This will allow for a different mount plate to go onto it quickly in case I want to use a different tool or whatever. The whole thing got a massive strength upgrade in the 2 plates now used.

And what to build next well first for this machine it is the 4th axis (rotary) so I can lathe with it. Then the next CNC and I am going for a cnc saw after that a x and y machine that holds a nice saw blade on it but can be used in manual mode also and it will mount upright on the wall.

Coog

Well here it is the long awaited first cut. I need to setup my table and hold downs and mount the vacuum tube. But she is up and running and here is a video to prove it!

I have the wires on it and I added an arm to carry the Z car wires as well as hid some other wires. I dialed in a new comp to run the Vectric software (only software to use IMO).

Well enough with my ramblings and on with the show!

Coog

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yJpwq8e1Tgs

It's looking good - (Great titles on the video).

With all the other machines you're planning on building will you even have time to use this one? ;-)

That's a great idea for the Z car, I'll have to think about doing that on my current build - I'm currently building the Z car now...

By the way did you have problems with the old design of the Z car?

It's looking good - (Great titles on the video).

With all the other machines you're planning on building will you even have time to use this one? ;-)

That's a great idea for the Z car, I'll have to think about doing that on my current build - I'm currently building the Z car now...

By the way did you have problems with the old design of the Z car?

You trying to buy my router??? Everything has a price! But yes while I own it and its fully running I will use it to build my other tools. Wood projects, gifts for others, custom wood items for the home that SWMBO wants and some friends have some aluminum they want cut for their hot-rod dashes...

The Z car previously was not able to hold this router and go all the way down. My current Z depth is 5.25 inches and if I wanted to push the Z by readjusting it I could get as much as 8 but I dont think i need it with the Vectric software. The designs are basically the same but this one is much more sturdy and I am going to add some stabalizing bearings to it later today and that damnable vacuum tube!

So have you started yours Ron? send some pics!

Coog

Well right now mine is still a collection of pieces, so it's not that exciting to look at - which is why I have to live vicariously through yours (until you grow tired of it and I manage to get my hands on it, or mine is built whichever comes first).

I'll start a build thread when I have something more exciting to look at for those who are also looking into doing the belt drive table. [Hopefully it won't take too long, but as the father of an 18 month old these projects don't get quite as much time devoted to them as they once did.]

I'm still blown away by the time you put into documenting the machine - you can tell by the thread views that it's helping a lot of people.

I am going to get some bits for my router today and want to know what are the basic few I should start with?

end mills???

60V
90V
1/8"ball


???

Thanks for the info!!!

Coogrrr

Well right now mine is still a collection of pieces, so it's not that exciting to look at - which is why I have to live vicariously through yours (until you grow tired of it and I manage to get my hands on it, or mine is built whichever comes first).

I'll start a build thread when I have something more exciting to look at for those who are also looking into doing the belt drive table. [Hopefully it won't take too long, but as the father of an 18 month old these projects don't get quite as much time devoted to them as they once did.]

I'm still blown away by the time you put into documenting the machine - you can tell by the thread views that it's helping a lot of people.

Well just one piece/part at a time to get you to done. It may take some months but if you work out one portion each week/weekend it will come together fairly easily. Dont give up on it ever! These things are a blast to build and use!

Coog

I am going to get some bits for my router today and want to know what are the basic few I should start with?

end mills???

60V
90V
1/8"ball


???

Thanks for the info!!!

Coogrrr

Also do I need small bits like .02 or .002

If you're going to be doing lithopqahnes and other vectric stuff, V-bits are the way to go and they have lots of advice on what bits to buy on their forum.
Precisebits.com is where I got small bits strong enough for cutting plastic and pearl for inlay work.
\

I have a distributor here of onsrud so I got one of these super "O" units https://www.onsrud.com/oc/pdf/Super_O.pdf

And I got a 60 and 90 degree V as well as a 1/4" round from CMT at same distributor along with my 1/2 round i think i got a good start for noob cuts.

I will post some cut pics this weekend.

Coog

Thanks for the very informative info in this thread.

HarryN whatever I can do to help I am willing to do as so many have done so for me! Just ask away and I will help get the answer if I dont have it myself.

Coog

As Ger21 and or Greybeard and many others have talked about. Until I get my t-slot solution done I am going to go with the t-nut solution. I have used my CNC to drill a hole every 3" on the Y by every 4" on the X this gave me about 90 holes I think. Each hole is a tight fit to a 1/4 20 t-nut. A t-nut you ask? A t-nut looks like a top hat but the brim has been cut and folded upward (up the stove-pipe of the top hat). These 3 or 4 spikes sink into the wood as the brim comes up to meet the wood. The "stove-pipe" part slips up into the hole that was drilled by the CNC, 19/32's dia. I thnk.

Now with holes every so many inches I will use a flat 2" square of alluminum with a hole bigger in dia than the 1/4 20 bolt but only enough to allow the threads to slip by. I will use a hand drill or an air wrench or manually with a socket wrench to pull the t-nut up to the bottom of the bed of the machine allowing the t-nut shaft to go upward into the drilled hole allowing the spikes to secure it.

I can now use a 1" by 4-6" strap of alluminum with a hole in it tha the 1/4 20 bolt slides thru down into the t-nut to secure my wood by holding it down. I am also cutting with the cnc some small 1" and .5" thick dense plywood into little paddel or banjo shapes. These will have a hole for the bolt to they can secure projects from the sides to preven slippage latterally.

I will upload another video as soon as the setup is all finished.

Thanks for the DIY ideas guys!

Coog

Something like this.

Something like this.

although I had a few more that is it exactly. I am still installing those damn nutz!

I am making some good ally holdowns and some wood side holders too. I think the system will work fine and its a lot cheaper than a vacuum table.

Coog

I have had some trial cuts here and there but these are the first official parts I cut for a real purpose.

CMT .25 ball nose bit on the infamous Hitachi router. 60ipm and pine stock planned to 1 and 3/16ths thick.

"Air Block" pantent pending, trademark, copyright, I spit on it so dont even think of touching my plans!!!"


Sketchup for plans export to dfx
Vectric Cut3D for dxf to gcode paths
Mach3 to run GCode
1hr 10min total cutting time.


watch the 4min video to see the results!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bLD9F0JSUIs



Coog
P.S. I was kidding I attached the plans of course.... ;)

I need to route MDF .75" thick and it will be all through cuts .75" deep. I need to use an 1/8" bit but own a 1/4" end mill now. What bit, or a link to it rather, could I use to keep 80+IPM cut at .25" per pass and have it last.

I do have a machine that can do the 80ipm I need some information on how many flutes and such so that the MDF doesnt clog it.

Thanks in advance for your knowledge and time.

Coog

coogr,
My CNC isn't finished, so I have not used this on a CNC, but I have cut several speaker cabinets with a plunge router and a circle jig using this bit. Should work well.

http://www.hartvilletool.com/product/11052

I am making the vacuum shroud around my router so I can slurp up all the MDF dust. I have a design that is goint to work with this Hitachi and I will be uploading pics and such but I had a question...

Bristles or Plastic skirt? The bristles would of course be softer and collect more dust but I see many plastic skirts simply cut at the bottom into strips and I think I like seeing through the skirt to the cut area...

Thoughts?? Help me out guys!

Coog

I have made several collection versions, i have come to the conclusion that a fixed height or manual height adjusted shroud would be best for me, one that does not move with the Z-Axis, you just adjust the height manually depending on your stock thickness.

That way you have a constant conection with the skirting and the stock material for best exstraction of dust and cut material.

I am partial to the clear plastic skirting, just so i am able to see inside and see whats going on.

Joe

Well I took a stab at a dust collector and I think I got it done. I have new brackets made for my Hitachi router and I am adding the dist skirt tonight. I will upload some pics and how I did it tonight also.

Coog

coogr,
My CNC isn't finished, so I have not used this on a CNC, but I have cut several speaker cabinets with a plunge router and a circle jig using this bit. Should work well.

http://www.hartvilletool.com/product/11052

I have not used them on a cnc driven router, but I have had very good luck with those Whiteside bits as well. Mostly used them on 2 in thick red wood and cedar. Rough cuts with a blade, and finished the cut at full depth with the router using a home made guide.

I have not used them on a cnc driven router, but I have had very good luck with those Whiteside bits as well. Mostly used them on 2 in thick red wood and cedar. Rough cuts with a blade, and finished the cut at full depth with the router using a home made guide.


The tough thing is I need a 1/8th bit that has a 1" cut depth maybe as litle as 0.8" but that is an odd length.

Anyone know where to find that?

Coog

Yet again my brain is going going gone somewhere into the next build! I am starting with the bearings.

I am going to use the skate bearing and build a hybrid jgro/joe2006/buildyouridea.com solution.

The machine will be first built in 3/4" MDF with steel angle iron for the bearings to ride on and the bearing block will be built like the attached photo.

I have a forge and foam cutting solution all setup now so I should be able to whip these bearings out 4 at a pour or roughly 8 an hour. I am working on this CNC using 16 bearing blocks 8 - on X axis, 4 on Y and Z axis.

This will give it some good strength and should be smooth as silk. I am placing many 5/16" mounting holes so that there are many configurations too.

Coog

P.S. I need not say copyright - right? Well copyright anyway and trademark too! ;)

The tough thing is I need a 1/8th bit that has a 1" cut depth maybe as litle as 0.8" but that is an odd length.

Anyone know where to find that?

Coog

I am not sure if these rotozip bits fit your need or not.

http://www.rotozip.com/Shop/CategorySubBrowse.htm?IID=66586&HID=188064&BID=18

It gets real tricky using 1/8ths bits. I designed an Al part which required some milling in 1/8ths inch down at the bottom of a pocket. I ended up redsigning it around the bit, as only a small part of the cutting area stuck out of a 1/4 in support shank.

At least on Al, the rotation rates had to be really high and movement rates very low. Also, the end likes to wander.

Yet again my brain is going going gone somewhere into the next build! I am starting with the bearings.

I am going to use the skate bearing and build a hybrid jgro/joe2006/buildyouridea.com solution.

The machine will be first built in 3/4" MDF with steel angle iron for the bearings to ride on and the bearing block will be built like the attached photo.

I have a forge and foam cutting solution all setup now so I should be able to whip these bearings out 4 at a pour or roughly 8 an hour. I am working on this CNC using 16 bearing blocks 8 - on X axis, 4 on Y and Z axis.

This will give it some good strength and should be smooth as silk. I am placing many 5/16" mounting holes so that there are many configurations too.

Coog

P.S. I need not say copyright - right? Well copyright anyway and trademark too! ;)


On the mounting holes, I would make the 5/16" holes smaller, the size of the tap bit, that way you can tap threads into it for easy bolt up.

"P.S. I need not say copyright - right? Well copyright anyway and trademark too!"..... LOL@Coog.


Joe

On the mounting holes, I would make the 5/16" holes smaller, the size of the tap bit, that way you can tap threads into it for easy bolt up.

"P.S. I need not say copyright - right? Well copyright anyway and trademark too!"..... LOL@Coog.


Joe


Yes I meant that those are finish tapped 5/16" holes I will make the holes 1/64th smaller and tap out to 5/16". If someone is interested in where this goes...

I might be persuaded to make more for sale.... I will of course proof them out first and show videos of the items in operation well before offering any for sale.

Coog

P.S. Joe I have been looking at your build for a straight day! I am going to work something like your build as these bearings are similar to how you mount yours. I think they can be fit to some nice steel tube or drill rod to match your build. Not stuck to steel angle makes them open to other applications.

What if you were to knock off the corners at a 45 degree angle? Then you could put connect two of them with a
plate and make something equivalent to ger21's bearing assembly in the alternative to round pipe thread http://www.cnczone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=34044

What if you were to knock off the corners at a 45 degree angle? Then you could put connect two of them with a
plate and make something equivalent to ger21's bearing assembly in the alternative to round pipe thread http://www.cnczone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=34044


At first I did have the corners knocked off but then placed it back to square blocks so there are more mounting methods. I think that if you run one facing downward onto angle bar and one upward onto angle bar connect the sides with a plate or MDF if your into that you will have a place to slide the rail into...

I will be trying 2 on top one on bottom to make a triangle setup on the rail to hold it tight to the rail and provide good support. Past that 2 top and 2 bottom for the most stable I suppose. The pinching effect allow us to set how tight it will grip the rail itself.

I was thinking of other methods too like 4 side mounted to rails like in the Joe2006 setup only angle bar instead of round stock. 4 on each side gives us some good stability but adjustments would be harder to do.

I will get some of these online with pictures in the weeks to come. Getting the forge fuel tank worked on right now and a new crucible inbound.

See you back here soon!


Coog

As you all know I started off with Davids plans and they are great. I modified them a bit so I came up with a hybrid. It is a great router and I am working on the polishing points now.

1. Finish vacuum skirt
2. Install cable chains (great ebay deal)
3. Install new home/limit switches (magnetics work but I prefer the real
thing another good ebay deal)
4. Make new control pad (got the joystick and the buttons)
5. Make/find a good encoder set for each axis
6. Enclosure......

I am running some jobs now I am making some plaques thanks to the help I have gotten from the Vectric team. I need to say if you do not have this software you must get it. This is as important to me as Mach3 is to the machine. I can do amazing things with these products and while it is an investment in money it is sooooo worth it I cannot say enough. This is the only software in its class I will ever use or recommend at this point.

Most oftern I will create in SketchUP pro then use vectric Cut3D or create it in VCarve and output my GCode from both. I run the code without any thoughts about it in Mach3 every time. I can take drawings from many CAD apps and make GCode and run parts in mere minutes. Trust me this is the stuff to use.

Chat you later guys and as always thanks for the brain share the support and possibly one of the best communities on this planet!

Coog

Coog - Hey I finally have some motion on my cnc - thanks in large part to some ideas from you (I don't ever want to look at PVC couplers again). I started a log so folks can see the first few moves:
http://cnczone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=45667

Keep the posts coming this is definately the most helpful thread I found.

Coog - Hey I finally have some motion on my cnc - thanks in large part to some ideas from you (I don't ever want to look at PVC couplers again). I started a log so folks can see the first few moves:
http://cnczone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=45667

Keep the posts coming this is definately the most helpful thread I found.

Sorry I have not posted more but I am on the upswing again. I am developing a new bearing for a hybrid jgro/joe2006 build more to come... I have all the parts for a demel based 12"x12"x2" machine that is all aluminuma nd steel for sub 200 not counting electronics.

I am working on a diy vacuum solution as this job i picked up needs it for the part cutout needs.

I am working on some new forgings too so stay tuned more to come!!

P.S. no plastic bearings!!

what if i take the air drive out of a small air grinder attach a pulley at top and an electric motor?? good cheap spindle?? its rated for 22k rpm and goood lateral forces....

Thoughts???

Coog

I see you got this drilling done, how much did it cost you? And where did you get it done or who did it.
PS Great job, your machine looks really cool. I am at the parts gathering stage, building the same machine for myself.

FINALLY!!!!!

I am able to get things calmed down. I have not had much time on the machine but I now own all the parts to make a fine control setup (joystick and buttons) and I will start into this soon.

Also, I have a small machine of all Ally and brass and such that I am going to build the machine looks to cost me around 200 in parts not counting electronics. I am thinking I may produce a bunch and sell them as I can. Cut area 12x12x2 is the goal with an eye toward super accurate extremely high SPI count.

Coog

and design on pendant?

David,

GREAT thread! I learned oodles and am now considering a build in metal like yours. One concern of mine was getting everything lined up and accurate to a few thousandths of an inch. You mentioned how you did this is an earlier post, but try as I might, I am at a loss to understand what it is you actually did to line everything up?

I can weld together a frame, but I doubt it will have thousands of an inch tolerance. If I bolt rails down directly to this structure, everything will be out of whack from the get-go. Can you elaborate a bit on your alignment process - the mechanical items you put into your build to allow for adjustment, and the actual procedure ou used to line it all up? Thanks again for this awesome thread!

David,

GREAT thread! I learned oodles and am now considering a build in metal like yours. One concern of mine was getting everything lined up and accurate to a few thousandths of an inch. You mentioned how you did this is an earlier post, but try as I might, I am at a loss to understand what it is you actually did to line everything up?

I can weld together a frame, but I doubt it will have thousands of an inch tolerance. If I bolt rails down directly to this structure, everything will be out of whack from the get-go. Can you elaborate a bit on your alignment process - the mechanical items you put into your build to allow for adjustment, and the actual procedure ou used to line it all up? Thanks again for this awesome thread!

For each machine there will be a different way to align the machine. On mine I was not worried whether or not the steel frame was totally true to the thousandths as the rails we bolted into a nearly square bolt pattern with respect to each corner. This way I could adjust them when it was time to square up this part. So just for the X rails what I did was to place a measuring device that went from one corner to the opposite corner. that was short by 4 inches. I mounted a caliper to the end of this so that it could open up the rest of the distance to finish the measurement. I open the caliper to get a reading of (for example. 2.534") and recorded this. Then I switched corners and made it match. This took a few tries due to pulling in or pushing out the opposing corners changed the original measurement. I just kept moving from corner to opposite corners until they we equal or within a thousands over the course of the entire length of the X rail set. This was acceptable for me as I work mostly with wood and being off .001 for every 48" was as accurate as I would need and I am betting MUCH more accurate than most expensive "custom hand crafted" wood shops could do. PLUS wood expands and contracts much more than that .001 of the distance of 48" from the nature of its makeup.

Hope this helps?

Coog

For each machine there will be a different way to align the machine. On mine I was not worried whether or not the steel frame was totally true to the thousandths as the rails we bolted into a nearly square bolt pattern with respect to each corner. This way I could adjust them when it was time to square up this part. So just for the X rails what I did was to place a measuring device that went from one corner to the opposite corner. that was short by 4 inches. I mounted a caliper to the end of this so that it could open up the rest of the distance to finish the measurement. I open the caliper to get a reading of (for example. 2.534") and recorded this. Then I switched corners and made it match. This took a few tries due to pulling in or pushing out the opposing corners changed the original measurement. I just kept moving from corner to opposite corners until they we equal or within a thousands over the course of the entire length of the X rail set. This was acceptable for me as I work mostly with wood and being off .001 for every 48" was as accurate as I would need and I am betting MUCH more accurate than most expensive "custom hand crafted" wood shops could do. PLUS wood expands and contracts much more than that .001 of the distance of 48" from the nature of its makeup.

Hope this helps?

Coog


As an after thought you could make a threaded rod frame that was an X in a square. [x] kinda. each length could be adjustable so that when you set this onto your rails you could screw or unscrew the device and measure the distances this would hold your rails perfect then you bolt them down to the frame once square (take readins during bolting as the bolts will pull it around a little) The added benefit is that this could be adapted to square up anything it could fit on. and you would have an easier way to measure and adjust.

Coog

Garage is clean I am ready and I will post post post!

Coog

So as I get started again. I am open to helping others while I take on a few projects. :banana:

The first project is to finish my pendant which is going to be a little large but I think It will server my needs. I am going to mount a joystick and several buttons into a piece of HDPE or Acrylic and wire the buttons and joy to the keys of a keyboard that will slide out from under this box. I think this will allow me to use the one input (keyboard) and have several intervaces to use i.e. keyboard or joystick and buttons or a small x/y/z pendant over cat5 to the main setup this allows for a small handheld pendant tethered to a large one that is mounted on a overhead adjustable monitor arm hangin from shop roof and rotateable. :)

The Second project is a mini Joe cnc made of ally but useing the basic build he has designed. This will be built to do the finest of etchings or circuit boards and be super tight with extremely small movement and tolerances in the .000001 area as a goal. (wishful thinking) but can get close I think. My controller allows for 10k steps if I elect. :rainfro:

3. CNC 2 axis circular saw. I dont know if I should use a circular saw or a SERIOUS bit in a router. I want to be able to take a full sheet up to 1" thick and cut the pieces out that I want. The unit will be mounted to a wall and have a lock down system for the raw piece. I am building it without Z and going to work on an enclosure so that I can capture all the sawdust. :withstupi

I will start a new thread on each of these so we can all watch my new fire burn!!! I want to say DAMN you and Thank you to all you zoners for getting me hooked on this !!! I love it, I hate it, I love it, I.. I... Well ok I love it!!!!
:cheers:

Coog

Coogrr,
What an enjoyable thread to read through. Love your machine. I have been lurking here since 2006 not saying anything because I haven't had the time or location to build something. Having just returned from South America and finally being back home I am excited to get started. I was spending a lot of time looking at Joe's 4x4 hybrid and the RoGr over at Lumenlabs. I must say however, that I am looking more and more into possibly making my own design. It goes back to the simple (but very hard to answer) question of do I want to go through the process of making a cheaper CNC mill to learn more to make the next one, or do I stand on the shoulders of others and hope that they hold my weight. Both Joe's design and Brainchild's design are intriguing but I really like the idea of pillowblocks on supported rails. Very similar to what you ended up with except that I will start with supported rails similar to this. 20mm Linear 55" Rail Guideway System w/2 Slide Units (http://www.vxb.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=bearings&Product_Code=Kit7429&Category_Code=20mmLinearMotionSystems)
Does this cost more money? Sure but I don't have to do the drilling myself or send it off to a machine shop. Over at Lumenlabs they are building a 2X4 machine that seems ridig and overbuilt, but and to me this might be a big but. He isn't supporting his rails over a 4 foot area. True I think that he is using 35mm rails which are pretty huge but I am still not convinced that there won't be some possible sagging. Anyway, only one question for tonight. What do you think you have investe into your build as is? I have about 2k I can throw at this project including mechanicals and eletronics, but excluding any software and computer. I already have Mach 3, Rhino, and AutoCad and will purchase anything else I need. However, I don't want this to rise over about 2,500 and 2k if I can help it. It's a tough question trying to decide to bite the bullet and drop 2k, but it's also just as tough to make my own trial machine for 500-1000. and then have to turn around and spend another 1700-2200 (I could hopefully buy the steppers and electronics to go with the finished machine the first time around) to get where I originally wanted to go.

Your thoughts are greatly appreciated.

Hello Yosi, :)

I hope this will help you, is from Astrosin Step motors, maybe will work with yours too.

please
sonceboz 6530 R.274 data sheet

I am announcing the unfortunate RETURN OF THE COOG!!!!! I am back on the zone and starting some more projects. I will upload some pics/info of the things I have done over the last year that I have been mostly away from the zone.

Look forward to speak to you all again!

Coog

Great job. I just read through all the post and think its an excellent machine. Im planning on building a machine thats similar but completely different. Instead of rails for the x axis I'm planning on rollers somewhat of a plotter printer configuration only alot more beefy.:D