I saw these pics on the zone (I think) but I do not remember the link.

Jason

Good find! That looks pretty good!

I had an idea kind of like that but I was thinking of using plastic rod from USPlastics.
It looks heavy but some monster motors like Jays should be able to throw it around pretty good! :)

Bob

Just wanted to post an update

I purchased the ATC (Industrial Rapid Changer) from http://www.hightechsystemsllc.com/ a couple of weeks go and had a chance to work with it yesterday. First off, the quality of the tool is top notch and I'm very happy with it! If you are using the Hitachi router or any router with the 1/2" collets you can use the Taig 3/4-16 1/2" adapter.

Here's a video of it in use with a 1/8" end mill cutting another dust collector attachment.

http://video.yahoo.com/video/play?vid=386277

You will notice some vibration noise in the video, some of which I've tracked down to the two loose clamps in the background.

I also had ordered a new PC, it's a HP / Compaq I picked up from CDW for around $395. It is a P4 3.06 with 512mb of ram, Windows XP Pro, 80gb hd, integrated sound and video and a cd drive. Nothing fancy.
I could not get a clean test on it and did all of the optimizing as instructed in the file from ArtSoft.

So far my attempts at using it with the Xylotex & Mach3 setup have been miserable failure! I can go into the motor tuning screen and run any one of the X, Y, or Z axis motors all over the place and all was good. I would attempt to run a program and it sounded like it was coming apart! I double checked all of my settings and think they match. I finally just gave up and started using my original machine. I'll get back to it once I get my new power supply / cabinet finished.

I ordered the following for my system:

3 - G203V drives from Gecko
3 - 500 oz/in Model # RS23-500 stepper motors (nema 23) from HomeShopCNC
1 - C11G multifunction board from CNC4PC
3 - 3/8" Bore Lovejoy couplers (motors have 3/8" shafts) from Enco

I've already got the transformer, capacitor, rectifier and other hardware standing by to finish the cabinet. Once it is finished I'll start dialing in everything again.

I've got two different problems to solve, they are:
1 - Machine seems to be cutting everything 1/32 to 1/16" deeper than intended. I did not notice this before as all of my cuts where completely through the material. Once I started cutting the dust collector I notice that the cuts that were not all the way through the material were deeper than intended. I think this is probably a setting issue or something I'm doing wrong.

2 - When carving text, all will be going along fine and then the machine will start cutting 1/8" or so deeper. Other times it will plunge a 1/2" or so deeper. It does not happen in the same place all the time and it's seems random.
I tried to run it down but decided to hold off until I get my new hardware installed so I don't have to do it twice.

Well that's it. Happy Easter everyone!

Great Video Bob :D

Thanks Kent!


Went to the shop to see if I could solve some of my issues.
First thing I did was load the Bull's Head file and cut it. Turned out ok, not perfect but I'll get there at some point :)

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I then watched the VCarvePro videos again and I think I got part of my problem solved. In one of the videos I believe it's Tony that mentioned saving to a different file for each tool used.

I opened up one of my files that I've been having problems with and instead of one file I created four. Loaded the first file in Mach3, with my fingers crossed I watch as it cut the text with no problems. Once completed it goes back to X0 and Y0, Z I can't remember but it's negative .5 or something like that. I load the new file, changed the bit, dropped the bit to touch the surface and zero out the axis. Started the cut and success, each file did it's thing with no problems.

I'm sold on the ATC, it makes changing out the bits so nice! I'm very pleased with it! :)

Bob

Bob,

Great machine and plog. I am in the process of scratching the money toether and ordering my kit from Joe.. I will be refering to posts often.

Enjoy the machine

Gary

One thing i did on the ATC was set all the tools at the same depth into the holders, using a plastic piece from my upspiral bits to ensure the distance from the tool holder to the ver tip of the bits are identical, so when i replace a bit the Z-0 is the same.

Joe

Bob,

Great machine and plog. I am in the process of scratching the money toether and ordering my kit from Joe.. I will be refering to posts often.

Enjoy the machine

Gary

Thanks! Look forward to seeing your build plog! You'll find tons of information and help in all of the logs. Lot of great builds going on!

One thing i did on the ATC was set all the tools at the same depth into the holders, using a plastic piece from my upspiral bits to ensure the distance from the tool holder to the ver tip of the bits are identical, so when i replace a bit the Z-0 is the same.

Joe

Thanks Joe, that was the first thing I did, it makes it so much nicer having all of the tools at the same length! The ATC sure does add a lot of distance between the bottom of the router and the work surface. I can see where we need to come up with a good floating dust collector attachment. I guess that will be another project to work on :)

Bob

With all teh mentions of ATCs and setups are there any links to posts on making/adding one to a system?

With all teh mentions of ATCs and setups are there any links to posts on making/adding one to a system?

Check out JLT's log here:

http://www.cnczone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=28665

The site that sells the ATC has videos of it in action also:

http://www.hightechsystemsllc.com

Bob

I am not using my ATC because of lack of good dust collecting idea. I made one but was not happy with it.

Waiting for the better engineers amongst us to come up with something.

David

Howdy gang,

Did a little shopping at Lowes today, purchased a table top drill press.
I just wanted to let everyone know because I think I got this for a good price.
Here's the details:

Delta®
12" Laser Crosshair Drill Press

Item #: 99686 Model: DP300L

5 spindle speeds
Durable, 11" diameter tray keeps tools within easy reach
Flexible Lamp provides extra light to the work surface
Bright laser crosshairs clearly indicate the drill point
2-year warranty
120 Volts
Extended Protection Plans are available for an additional charge
Chuck Size: 1/2"
No Load Speed (RPM): 1.720
Chuck Capacity: 1/2"
Chuck Type: Jacobs 33
Table Size: 8-1/2" x 9-7/8"
Table Tilt: 0-45° L
Overall Height: 32"

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I was surfing the net and checked out what Lowes had to offer.
The original price for this was $179.00
When I entered my zip code to check if they had it here in town, a different price was shown on the screen as a "Local Price" $152.00
I went to Lowes to check it out. Asked at the customer service counter if $152.00 was the correct price. They checked and sure enough that's what I got it for. Also when you make the purchase before the end of April you get a $25.00 rebate in the form of a Lowes gift card.
That makes the total $127.00

I put it together and I must say it is a very nice unit. Compared to some other models I think I did ok.

Also received my Gecko's, the new motors and couplings. The C11G multi function board should be here tomorrow or Friday. Maybe in time to have it all together this weekend.

Bob

Today I spent some time working on the control / power supply enclosure, made pretty good progress but still have all the wiring to do.

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Here's a shot of the new 500oz motor compared to the 269oz motor

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I am working on an idea to help keep debris off of the x-axis rails. The is extended out to within 1/4" of the gantry sides. It hangs past the rails by about 1" so any debris that falls off the edge should not land on the rails.
The sweep should keep the debris from falling between the 1/4" gap and falling on to the bearings and rails.

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nice job sparky, your machine is looking fine, I'm debating buying a tool changer until I can fix my vibration problem, but I'm so tired of manually changing bits, plus having a set depth on the collets would be spectacular, would mean resetting would be eliminated completely. Even if I didnt have a macro to change it automatically I would still be happy! And that company offers those tool changers at a sweet rate. They come with 3 right?

nice job sparky, your machine is looking fine, I'm debating buying a tool changer until I can fix my vibration problem, but I'm so tired of manually changing bits, plus having a set depth on the collets would be spectacular, would mean resetting would be eliminated completely. Even if I didnt have a macro to change it automatically I would still be happy! And that company offers those tool changers at a sweet rate. They come with 3 right?

Thanks Brian!

Yes it comes with three, I took these pics today for Buzz showing the bits set same height.

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Using the ATC has been great, it does make it real simple changing tools. :)

They look awesome. If I fix the vibration it's going to get ordered in just a few seconds! That and I will finally build a vac. pump. However, this carpet tape and screws has worked out mighty fine. I've yet to have the carpet tape move while cutting. The only reason I used screws on one side of the sign I cut recently was because it wasn't 100% flat and I didn't want the depth of cut to change from the side of the slab to the middle. How about the RPM issue (10,000 I believe max)? Any problems to report with that yet? I would totally ditch a dust collection hood to have the ability to use that as I mainly vaccum stuff by hand anyways to kill time while machining. :D

They look awesome. If I fix the vibration it's going to get ordered in just a few seconds! That and I will finally build a vac. pump. However, this carpet tape and screws has worked out mighty fine. I've yet to have the carpet tape move while cutting. The only reason I used screws on one side of the sign I cut recently was because it wasn't 100% flat and I didn't want the depth of cut to change from the side of the slab to the middle. How about the RPM issue (10,000 I believe max)? Any problems to report with that yet? I would totally ditch a dust collection hood to have the ability to use that as I mainly vaccum stuff by hand anyways to kill time while machining. :D

I've had the setting on my Hitachi router set on 4 because for some reason I thought that was around 10,000, however after going back and checking David's log I see that I was incorrect in my assumption.

Here's what David came up with using a handheld laser tachometer
1 - 7,960 rpm
2 - 11,444 rpm
3 - 14,500 rpm
4 - 17,500 rpm
5 - 20,500 rpm
6 - 24,000 rpm

And here are Joe's calculations

1 - 8,000
2 - 11,200
3 - 14,400
4 - 17,600
5 - 20,800
6 - 24,000

As you can see I was running it around 17,500 rpm. I had no problems and it performs well at that speed, however I won't do that again now that I see I should be running around 2. Will try that speed later to see how it goes.

Bob

What a good idea to keep dust off the rails! I like it and it is so simple. :) I think I might have to steal that idea from you. LOL

Interesting bob. I usually have been cutting solids at around 3 1/2 on the hitachi setting. I'm sure they just say 10k rpms to cover themselves if it ever does fail, meaning that they will only guarantee their tooling if you use it and it breaks at under 10k rpms or something like that.

What a good idea to keep dust off the rails! I like it and it is so simple. :) I think I might have to steal that idea from you. LOL

Thanks Paul!
All ideas are free for the taking. I've done my share of pilfering! :)


Interesting bob. I usually have been cutting solids at around 3 1/2 on the hitachi setting. I'm sure they just say 10k rpms to cover themselves if it ever does fail, meaning that they will only guarantee their tooling if you use it and it breaks at under 10k rpms or something like that.

All the same I think I'll be backing off on my settings, sure don't want any ATC parts flying off the table at 17,500 rmp heading in my direction. That spring looks a little wicked :D

Bob

I thought I read on here that someone had been using theirs are 12-13,000 with no problems. I think the new heavier spring helps.

I thought I read on here that someone had been using theirs are 12-13,000 with no problems. I think the new heavier spring helps.


I believe I read the same thing and you are probably right about the new heavier spring. I ran mine at 17 + and it work fine. I still going to back down to around 2 or maybe 3.

Hey great idea on the rail debri guard and perfect timing that is about where I'm at ( I hope to have movement tonight. I have misplaced my DB25 cable (chair) just had the dang thing in my hands the other day . I must of put it somewhere for safe keeping :rolleyes: I have set the vref and wired it up. even have dust collection set up and running ( O/K guys hurry up and get a good working dust collector design so I can pilfer it too.. :D ) I guess I better get my ATC parts ordered also. Keep up the good work ....never know I may need to aquire more ideas :cool:

Hey great idea on the rail debri guard and perfect timing that is about where I'm at ( I hope to have movement tonight. I have misplaced my DB25 cable (chair) just had the dang thing in my hands the other day . I must of put it somewhere for safe keeping :rolleyes: I have set the vref and wired it up. even have dust collection set up and running ( O/K guys hurry up and get a good working dust collector design so I can pilfer it too.. :D ) I guess I better get my ATC parts ordered also. Keep up the good work ....never know I may need to aquire more ideas :cool:

Thanks Kent!

I'm always putting things in safe places, so safe I can't find them either!:)
Can't wait to see your machine in action!

Bob

Sparky... thanks for the photo. I have one of these with the older attachments that use a set screw (think I have 10 collets). Once I get things going I am hoping to implement the ATC but that is a ways out for me.

At this point though I am having a problem with my TC as the collets keep getting stuck in so hard I have to hit them with a rubber hammer a bunch of times to get them out. I spoke with Derek a few weeks back, gave me an idea... work for a bit on short cuts then I found out when I remove the router it was doing it again... so I will be giving Derek a call again today. Hopefully I can get this fix as the ATC will not work with them jammed in so hard after a lot of cutting.

Sparky... thanks for the photo. I have one of these with the older attachments that use a set screw (think I have 10 collets). Once I get things going I am hoping to implement the ATC but that is a ways out for me.

At this point though I am having a problem with my TC as the collets keep getting stuck in so hard I have to hit them with a rubber hammer a bunch of times to get them out. I spoke with Derek a few weeks back, gave me an idea... work for a bit on short cuts then I found out when I remove the router it was doing it again... so I will be giving Derek a call again today. Hopefully I can get this fix as the ATC will not work with them jammed in so hard after a lot of cutting.

Buzz, your welcome, and thanks for the info! I'll keep and eye out for that. I have not done any prolonged cutting so have not run into that issue, maybe with the new style it won't be. Keep us posted, that's very interesting!

Have not heard of this from anyone else so far but maybe the folks with the ATC can jump in and provide us with the details on how theirs is working out.

Bob

The machine looks good. I did almost the exact same thing on my machine, u used 1/2" mdf ad a base plate, attached the tract clamping, then used 1/4" mdf attached with carpet tape as a cover over the rails.

The ATC works good I use mine up to 3.5 on the Hitachi with no problems (But do not use this as a guide use at own risk).

I cut HDPE at 1.5 and MDF at 3 to 3.5 depending on mdf, every manufacturer uses different glue mixture in their MDF boards.

Joe

How did you attach the table to the machine. I have the 1/4 MDF for now just nailed to the frame and trying to figure out how I attach my leveling surface then my sacrafical surface without clueing them permantley in place.

I used drywal screws, predrilled into the cross suport pieces and countersunk into 1/2" MDF. My Machine i did plane the surface beacuse i adjusted it so close, especially for wood working. And if you have a special need to can plane a pocket out of a 3/4" mdf to use and set ontop of the bead.

Joe

Thanks... I was wondering if people were attaching directly to the ribs. As I am sure you know MDF is not always fond of screws in thinner sections. I will move in this direction.

My plans were to leave the 1/4" MDF torsion box plate in. Then add a 1/2 plate which will be size that the machine is capable of machining with a 1" cutting (so 1/2" bigger than the machinable area) I will then machine the entire area flat giving me a base. This should give me a flat area of about 25" * 49"

Ontop of this I will add a full size plate to what ever size I want suspect I will follows sparky's lead and do it right up to the gantry sides and back far enough to put a tool change on.

Anyone see any problems with this?

My plans were to leave the 1/4" MDF torsion box plate in. Then add a 1/2 plate which will be size that the machine is capable of machining with a 1" cutting (so 1/2" bigger than the machinable area) I will then machine the entire area flat giving me a base. This should give me a flat area of about 25" * 49"


If the torsion box is flat and the MDF skin is flat, wouldn't that make the surface flat with no need to machine it? I guess I'm not seeing the reason to machine it if it is already going to be flat. :)

Well the parts are machined, you still have the Human factor in assembly to take into consideration, but in general the machine will be level with itself, you may need to do fine adjustments on the 5/16" bolts to bring it back to Square and level.

I have explained how to make fine adjustments in several logs, just look around or search and should be able to find them with ease.


Joe

In a perferct world or alignment you are right... which if I find is correctly I will probably not need to machine this surface. In a none perfect world the X and Y axis might be slightly ciltered and thus on its own plane when in referece to the X axis bed. In order to fix this you would machine the entire surface. At least this is how I did it on my last machine (Which was extremely difficult to align itself let alone to the surface :)).

What are you going to use to surface it? I found a surfacing tool on the Vortex site, but wow is it pricey!!


http://www.vortextool.com/standard/productDetail.cfm?groupID=305

Onsrud are about the same price.

you can also use standoffs, say 2"x2" with 1/2" MDF carpet tape to the bed (you will be surprised how well carpet tape holds) in a grid pattern and just do a quick surface on the standoff's using the jog feature.

then place a 3/4" MDF untop of those.

Joe

Wow them some expesive cutters for MDF. I just have a two or three flut 1" router bit that I uses with a 25% overlap pattern and have it weave back and forth across the table. Would take a few more passes than the ones you point me to but for about $25 the extra time is OK.

Joe that is how I did the last machine with 2*2 creating a bed then laying the MDF on top. It worked great and game me nice clamping edge at time.... humm I will think about this idea as well.

Joe: you mention you have documented how to align the axis in other articles, other than finding out what the bolts do I have not found any documentation on the procedures for aligning the machine... I search one night for almost an hour.

To adjust the side X-Azis bearing block screws, to square up the gantry to X-Axis bed slightly loosen or tighten the front two bolts together and the rear two bolt together, this slightly moves the right side forward or backwards. and moving the top two together and the bottom two together will slightly lift and lower that side, its a delicate procedure.

this also applies to the Carriage slide using the 4 bolts ontop.

Joe

Thanks Joe, this is the information I have been able to locate. What I was looking for was a procedure that people are following to square up the machine and what they are checking to make sure the machine is square and parrallel. Something like what I tried to documented on what I did this weekend with my machine and the one suggestion CNCJay gave in his video for alignment (perpendicular) of the Y axis to the X axis.

I agree the procedure is very delicate and you need to work slowly and methodicaly... but the process to do it is very simple and easy to understand. So much easier than the first machine I had. Your design was great in allowing for the simplisty of adjustments.

I am working on an idea to help keep debris off of the x-axis rails. The is extended out to within 1/4" of the gantry sides. It hangs past the rails by about 1" so any debris that falls off the edge should not land on the rails.
The sweep should keep the debris from falling between the 1/4" gap and falling on to the bearings and rails.

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Bob your machine looks great. Great idea I was watching OCC last night and they had a new water jet being setup in there shop and the gantry had a skirt of some sort that would close on one side and open on the other like an accordion. I am going to see if I can come up with something like that. But for now I my barrow your idea.

Rick

The machine looks good. I did almost the exact same thing on my machine, u used 1/2" mdf ad a base plate, attached the tract clamping, then used 1/4" mdf attached with carpet tape as a cover over the rails.

The ATC works good I use mine up to 3.5 on the Hitachi with no problems (But do not use this as a guide use at own risk).

I cut HDPE at 1.5 and MDF at 3 to 3.5 depending on mdf, every manufacturer uses different glue mixture in their MDF boards.

Joe

Thanks Joe!
Also thanks for the info on router speeds to use on different materials!
Bob

Bob your machine looks great. Great idea I was watching OCC last night and they had a new water jet being setup in there shop and the gantry had a skirt of some sort that would close on one side and open on the other like an accordion. I am going to see if I can come up with something like that. But for now I my barrow your idea.

Rick

Thanks! I look forward to seeing what you come up with!
I wish I had a shop full of toys like OCC! Won't mind having one or two of those bikes either :D
Bob

So many great ideas about the top! David cut his t-slots right into his top deck looks like it turned out pretty nice.

Here's a couple of links back to what I did:

http://www.cnczone.com/forums/showpost.php?p=245827&postcount=128

http://www.cnczone.com/forums/showpost.php?p=252593&postcount=182

So far it seems to be holding up pretty good. I am going to change the following two things:

1) Add some through bolts towards the center of the top deck.
2) Through bolt the t-track with flat head machine screws, right now I have them just screwed down with wood screws. I over tightened a clamp and it started to pull the t-track up from the deck. What I have done in the mean time since my clamps don't seem to want to fit in between the sacrificial boards and rest on the t-track is to cut 1/4" thick by 1/2" wide by 3-4" long pieces of oak to place on top of the t-track under the clamp. This causes the clamp to press down on the t-track and not allow it to be pulled up.

Bob

Not good pulling the screws out.... going to have to think that one through, thanks for the heads up... Joe's tape idea might fix that problem quickly. Your idea of going through the table makes sense Only I have one problem. I did not cut the holes in the sides of my gantry so I need to think this out clearly before I put the top plate on.

Not good pulling the screws out.... going to have to think that one through, thanks for the heads up... Joe's tape idea might fix that problem quickly. Your idea of going through the table makes sense Only I have one problem. I did not cut the holes in the sides of my gantry so I need to think this out clearly before I put the top plate on.

Buzz, Joe's idea does sound like a good one!
You might also consider a toggle bolt or other type of anchor.

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More than likely I would not have had a problem with the screws if I would have been paying atention and not trying to gorilla grip the thing to death :)

Bob

Ya we all do stupid things at times often you don't realize that you did it till much later (like the hex nut I strip in my z carrage head).

I am also thinking about opening the top and putting some plastiic liners
inside so I screw into them rather than MDF. Only thing that is stumping me on this idea is how to drill a straight hole through the ribs as the distance between the ribs is to short for a drill.

Ya we all do stupid things at times often you don't realize that you did it till much later (like the hex nut I strip in my z carrage head).

I am also thinking about opening the top and putting some plastiic liners
inside so I screw into them rather than MDF. Only thing that is stumping me on this idea is how to drill a straight hole through the ribs as the distance between the ribs is to short for a drill.

If you know someone with a right angle drill that might do the trick.
Are you going to screw down through the top and into the ribs?
If so here's what I did:
I took a piece of 1" x 3/4" oak centered it in the drill press vise with the 3/4" side up. Drilled straight down through the wood. This I used as a guide to keep my bit straight while drilling with my cordless drill. I clamped some wood across the table to use as a guide for the 1 x 3/4 drill guide. The straight edge was lined up so that the drill guide hole was exactly centered over the rib. This allowed me to drill perfectly centered holes down into the ribs. Worked great. If this is not what you are doing, never mind... ;)

An easy drill guide. Good idea. Basically what I am thinking of, but if I take it one step future and put plastic on the inside edge of the ribs I am sure to have a good material for a long time to attach to (scared of damagingn the MDF ribs from doing something stupid).

Another tought for anchor to my first plate might be to mount T nuts underneath at know locations and attach the sacrafical plate to them. Get the best of both worlds.

An easy drill guide. Good idea. Basically what I am thinking of, but if I take it one step future and put plastic on the inside edge of the ribs I am sure to have a good material for a long time to attach to (scared of damagingn the MDF ribs from doing something stupid).

Another tought for anchor to my first plate might be to mount T nuts underneath at know locations and attach the sacrafical plate to them. Get the best of both worlds.

I don't blame you, it would be the pits to damage the ribs.
Using the plastic and the t-nuts both sound like really good ideas. Keep us posted!

Bob

Buzz, here's the pictures I told you I'd take:

Shot from back. on the side with the bearing adjustment I could have used 3 pieces of 1/2" but if I keep this set up I plan on replacing the bottom deck piece that is now 24" x 3/4" with a piece that will be 29 1/8" x 3/4"

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Side without the bearing adjustment:

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Side with the bearing adjustment:

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I plan on also replacing the 1/2" and 1/4" pieces with one 3/4" pieces. I'll run it through the table saw to take out the 1/4" slice needed to clear the bearing adjustment.

Bob

damn sparky you're getting excellent contact on those bearings, I only wish I was better with metal fabrication. It probably would have made the ease and smoothness to my machine all that better. I just cut the new bottom plate for the dust collector thing joe designed. You going to try it? I also ordered the tool change from HTS. Can't wait to never change a router bit manually again!

damn sparky you're getting excellent contact on those bearings, I only wish I was better with metal fabrication. It probably would have made the ease and smoothness to my machine all that better. I just cut the new bottom plate for the dust collector thing joe designed. You going to try it? I also ordered the tool change from HTS. Can't wait to never change a router bit manually again!

Hi Brian,

Joe's new dust collector looks good, I'll give it a go! It's hard to make these things as fast as everyone thinks them up! :)
I really like my ATC, it does make it nice! One of these days I might have a nice tool rack like JLT :D

Thanks Brian!

Yes it comes with three, I took these pics today for Buzz showing the bits set same height.

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Using the ATC has been great, it does make it real simple changing tools. :)

sparky, I got my tool changer today, this is what I meant before and Derek didn't understand my question, your picture can clarify that a bit. He didn't supply the full collet with the 3 he sent, only the black part or the outer part of the fixture. The inner part that you tighten against the shank of the router bit (silver pictured in your photos surrounding the router bit) is what I meant in what size does he send out. Well question is answered, he doesn't send that. I read now on his website that you can use any size ER16 collet with it, and now I understand. I have a quarter inch and a half inch that came with the hitachi, and without robbing one from one of my other routers, where did you purchase yours? I also plan to buy a few more later on so might as well find a place you know? Thanks!

Sparky thanks for the pics. I have created my table base on our discussions. Mine is two layers. 3 actually if you want to count the 1/4" initial slab. 1" is a 5/8" leveling plate.... once I get everything squared up properly and locked down I will level this plate with the cutter. Then I have a 3/4 sacraficial plate that takes up the entire machine area in my booth, basically what you did only I dadod out the problem areas. Oh ya there is a 4 layer the table limit switch (still in the works).

I posted pictures of all this today. I like the really large table, makes for a nice working surface. Thanks for the great idea.

sparky, I got my tool changer today, this is what I meant before and Derek didn't understand my question, your picture can clarify that a bit. He didn't supply the full collet with the 3 he sent, only the black part or the outer part of the fixture. The inner part that you tighten against the shank of the router bit (silver pictured in your photos surrounding the router bit) is what I meant in what size does he send out. Well question is answered, he doesn't send that. I read now on his website that you can use any size ER16 collet with it, and now I understand. I have a quarter inch and a half inch that came with the hitachi, and without robbing one from one of my other routers, where did you purchase yours? I also plan to buy a few more later on so might as well find a place you know? Thanks!

Brian,

Got them from Enco
I bought 10 1/4" and a few 1/2" ER16 Spring Collets. Enco has a line of their own as well as ETM brand. The Enco line is much cheaper. Most of what I bought was the Enco brand as they were about 1/2 the price of the ETM brand. I did get a few ETM's to compare. After looking at and using both I don't see the need to pay more for the ETM line.
I just tried Enco's site but the search engine does not seem to be working right now.
Have fun! Post some videos of it in action! :)

Bob

Bob will do. Thanks for the info. For now I'm stealing the collets from my pc router haha. Will have to order a few.

Sparky thanks for the pics. I have created my table base on our discussions. Mine is two layers. 3 actually if you want to count the 1/4" initial slab. 1" is a 5/8" leveling plate.... once I get everything squared up properly and locked down I will level this plate with the cutter. Then I have a 3/4 sacraficial plate that takes up the entire machine area in my booth, basically what you did only I dadod out the problem areas. Oh ya there is a 4 layer the table limit switch (still in the works).

I posted pictures of all this today. I like the really large table, makes for a nice working surface. Thanks for the great idea.

I checked out your site, very nice! It is nice have the extra surface to use!
I'm not sure I understand the table limit switch so I'll have to do some more reading! Sounds like a good idea though!

Bob

Bob will do. Thanks for the info. For now I'm stealing the collets from my pc router haha. Will have to order a few.

Enco's up again. The Enco brand spring collet is on sale right now. The 1/4" is $11.99, normal price is $15+. I got mine for around $9.99 but that was last month.

Bob

The table limit switch is something I have come up with on my own. I have limits on the machine all over the place that will ensure if it runs away it will stop if I am not attending to it except if the machine decides to plung into it self and start cutting it self up. So if I hook one side of my limit switch to the router case and the other side to this piece of metal a close circuilt will occur when I hit the sheet of metal.

At present I have discussed this with the guys and Candcnc, I have setup the sheet, now I need to implement.

John

The table limit switch is something I have come up with on my own. I have limits on the machine all over the place that will ensure if it runs away it will stop if I am not attending to it except if the machine decides to plung into it self and start cutting it self up. So if I hook one side of my limit switch to the router case and the other side to this piece of metal a close circuilt will occur when I hit the sheet of metal.

At present I have discussed this with the guys and Candcnc, I have setup the sheet, now I need to implement.

John

Thanks! I understand now, great idea!
Oh and great job on the house and fireplace! Everythings looks very nice!
It's great seeing the family involved in these kinds of projects. I sure enjoyed getting mine envolved every chance I got... then I could sit back, have a beer and watch them work... ya right! :)

Bob

Enco's up again. The Enco brand spring collet is on sale right now. The 1/4" is $11.99, normal price is $15+. I got mine for around $9.99 but that was last month.

Bob

Model #891-6993 is the one right? I need some for half inch shank router bits as well, couldn't find any enco brand there.

Model #891-6993 is the one right? I need some for half inch shank router bits as well, couldn't find any enco brand there.

Whoops, 3/8 not 1/2, sorry about that :o

These are the numbers
891-6993 1/4
891-6996 3/8

Bob

thanks bob, I don't have any 3/8 shank router bits but have 3 1/2" shank ones solely for the cnc router, and probably 8 or so 1/4" shank ones. I've acquired a collection of router bits - v bits, ball noses, spirals. When I started I saw jlts rack of like 12 or so bits and was like damn he's nuts! Now that I've realized you're only limited to your tooling and creativity I feel much differently.

thanks bob, I don't have any 3/8 shank router bits but have 3 1/2" shank ones solely for the cnc router, and probably 8 or so 1/4" shank ones. I've acquired a collection of router bits - v bits, ball noses, spirals. When I started I saw jlts rack of like 12 or so bits and was like damn he's nuts! Now that I've realized you're only limited to your tooling and creativity I feel much differently.

It looks like 3/8" is the biggest ER16 available, or at least that's the biggest I was able to find. I've put together a pretty good collection of bits after reading what everyone else has been using. JLT's tool rack is pretty cool. I've watched the videos of the ATC retrieving bits from it over and over! :)
I'm going to Home Depot tomorrow to pick up some MDF to cut my gear driven dust collector attachment this weekend. We'll see how it goes.
I'm going to use MDF because it's cheap and if it doesn't work out at least I won't be wasting plastic.

Bob

Bob, sounds good. And yeah I wasn't able to find any either. The functionality really decreases if I can't find ones for half inch router shanks. My main bits right now are a 3/4" 90 degree vbit, and a 3/8" upspiral bit both which are half inch shanks.

Sparky if you need them you just have to order the older style ones (just found out), and if you are planning on using half inch shank bits which you probably will and want to use them in the tool changer, I would order a few now before he runs out as he is getting rid of them. Getting the 1/4" ones from enco, thanks for the # you provided.

Sparky if you need them you just have to order the older style ones (just found out), and if you are planning on using half inch shank bits which you probably will and want to use them in the tool changer, I would order a few now before he runs out as he is getting rid of them. Getting the 1/4" ones from enco, thanks for the # you provided.

Brian, thanks for the heads up! I'll go check that out!

Bob

Made pretty good progress yesterday on the gear driven dust collector.
Here's a shot of the new router holder side plates, the side plate with the gear fitted in place, and a couple shots of the x-axis rails after cutting all the plastic. The extra side extentions and door sweep work great in keeping the chips off the rails!

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Used 1/2" MDF because it's cheap to use for a prototype :) Once I am sure of the final design I'll re-cut the MDF parts out of plastic.

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I cut the gear rack channel gear circle about .001 larger. This needed to be larger because the two gears teeth needed more room. So I used a dremel to widen the channels and to take off the tabs. As you can see me and the dremel did not play well together with MDF. The MDF disappears quick!!!

Shots of the unit assembled and in place.
Fully extended:
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Fully retracted:
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Their is 4" of travel between fully extended and fully retracted.

The rod will be cut to size (two pieces) and connected to the stepper that will be mounted at the top where the rod currently crosses from side to side.
I'll add the 1" bruch to the bottom of the dust collector attachment later.

Since I did not have an extra motor and was getting too tired to move one of the other motors I used a cordless drill to move it up and down. It worked pretty good but will need some tweaking. Rather than tweak the parts as built I am going to order some 1/2" cutting board material and re-cut the MDF parts. At that time I will add extra clearance to the slots.

Overall I'm happy with the way it's turned out so far. I am going to replace the plastic gears with metal ones. Not happy with the plastic. I drilled and tapped the gear but could not really get consistent pressure on the rod with the set screw. Once I stripped out one of the tapped holes and had to redo it. The plastic gear racks that I ordered are bowed and that does not make for a smooth operations either. That's it until the next time :)

Bob

Looks very cool, I will be following this with great interest.

David

Looks very cool, I will be following this with great interest.

David

Thanks David! Good to hear from you! :)

I'm going to hold off on this for a few weeks until I get my control / power cabinet wired up and re-cut everything in plastic.
(I was also told no play time today, have to go restaurant shopping for a good place to have a rehearsal dinner. My son is getting married end of June, it didn't wash when I said, "We have plenty of time lets do it the first week of June" :D )

I'll be ordering another Gecko drive to use as the fourth axis to drive the DC. Once I install the new 500oz steppers I'll use one of the spare 269oz motors to run it.

I have to give kudos to Joe, his machine cuts MDF like butter and I've got it dialed in fairly good. The cuts in the MDF are very smooth and I've got it cutting plastic very well also. It's amazing how dead on this thing really is!!!
The more I use it the more impressed I am with it!

Howdy Bob,

That looks pretty cool, I too will keep an eye on this. I have yet to cut anything but air. Still need to fiquire out what I am going to do for dust collector attachment, and still looking for PVC sheet at reasonable price for sacraficial board. Keep up the good work and planning... :devious:'yeah good luck on all the wedding plans also ..:rolleyes:

Nice work, keen interest hear as well.

Very Nice work, I love when someone takes the machine and do some of their own addons, this will eventually be the cats meow of a wood diy machine i hope.

Joe

Awesome Bob that looks great can wait to see it finshed.

Rick

Bob,

got some of the collets today (1/4 from enco that you bought) and the 1/2 ones from hts are coming soon. Anyhow, referring to this photo
http://www.cnczone.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=35568&d=1176680525

How did you tighten that bit so much that there are very few threads left to the top? I tighten mine and they have atleast a 1/4" left of just threads..

Also I have to investigate if there is a way to setup the tooling in mach 3 so I can zero them out individually as some bits obviously cannot be set the same as others, IE: a 1" 1/2 upspiral can never be made the same size in the collet as a 90 degree vbit (1/4 shank). JLT must have done it since he uses an immense array of tooling.

Hi bp092,

Please follow up here about your investigation on setting up the tool with this ATC zero-ing concern with March. I too will be looking for this after I’m over with my design ( Still on the drawing board ! ) and would be grateful to read about your findings on this.
Robert M

Also I have to investigate if there is a way to setup the tooling in mach 3 so I can zero them out individually as some bits obviously cannot be set the same as others, IE: a 1" 1/2 upspiral can never be made the same size in the collet as a 90 degree vbit (1/4 shank). JLT must have done it since he uses an immense array of tooling.

Put the tool lengths in the tool table and use G43 (tool length compensation) when you do tool changes.

Thanks gerry I looked what you said up in the manual and it makes perfect sense now.. I'm sure bob is doing the same thing, and if so bob are you touching them off on the table by sight or with a touch plate? I've seen a few rigged here on the zone but wondered about it. Seems full proof and better than by sight by any means.

calgrdnr, Buzz9075, Joe, rdhharm, thanks!

I received the new steel gears yesterday and have been making changes to the drawing. I was going to work on the power supply this weekend but may work on the DC. Maybe both... ya, that's wishful thinking! :)

Bob

Bob,

got some of the collets today (1/4 from enco that you bought) and the 1/2 ones from hts are coming soon. Anyhow, referring to this photo
http://www.cnczone.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=35568&d=1176680525

How did you tighten that bit so much that there are very few threads left to the top? I tighten mine and they have atleast a 1/4" left of just threads..

Also I have to investigate if there is a way to setup the tooling in mach 3 so I can zero them out individually as some bits obviously cannot be set the same as others, IE: a 1" 1/2 upspiral can never be made the same size in the collet as a 90 degree vbit (1/4 shank). JLT must have done it since he uses an immense array of tooling.

Hello Brian, I ordered two of the older style 1/2" and have not received them yet.
Just used a couple of wrenchs, did not over tighten they snugged up real well.
One thing I did notice when I first inserted the collet into the collet nut is that it has to be lined up and mine snapped into place.

Have not messed with the tool setup in Mach yet. I've got so many things going I'm afraid to start tackling something else right now. :)

Bob

Thanks gerry I looked what you said up in the manual and it makes perfect sense now.. I'm sure bob is doing the same thing, and if so bob are you touching them off on the table by sight or with a touch plate? I've seen a few rigged here on the zone but wondered about it. Seems full proof and better than by sight by any means.

I am doing mine by sight at this time. Have not followed the touch plate, but sounds interesting!
Thanks Gerry, will come in useful when I finally do start working with the tool setup in Mach, and like Robert M it will be nice to see more info and how it works for you Brian!

I've really got to get back to my power supply / control cabinet and am itching to work on the gear driven DC. Also bought some paint mask and want to try it out soon.

Bob

Sounds good sparky. Still not sure how you got that nut so high up in the threading, I have the same bit, same collet exactly, and same hts setup.

HobbyCNC now has their kit with 305oz steppers for the same price as the 200oz kit.
The 3 axis kit is going for $270 + 16 s/h.

http://www.hobbycnc.com/hcncpropkg.php

Bob

HobbyCNC now has their kit with 305oz steppers for the same price as the 200oz kit.
The 3 axis kit is going for $270 + 16 s/h.

http://www.hobbycnc.com/hcncpropkg.php

Bob

if you do the conversion from 305oz uni-polar it will onvert to the 425oz bi-polar motors everyone uses.

I tested them along time ago on my machine with the older hobby cnc board and they work very well.

Don't forget i'm still using his original 200oz kit and have my machine now set to rapids of 200ipm, but cutting at 80 to 120ipm, limited by the router and the ATC, not the machine because i do not want to push the tool changer to hard.

Joe

if you do the conversion from 305oz uni-polar it will onvert to the 425oz bi-polar motors everyone uses.

I tested them along time ago on my machine with the older hobby cnc board and they work very well.

Don't forget i'm still using his original 200oz kit and have my machine now set to rapids of 200ipm, but cutting at 80 to 120ipm, limited by the router and the ATC, not the machine because i do not want to push the tool changer to hard.

Joe

Howdy Joe,

I won't be doing the conversion, just mentioned it because the site indicates it's a limited time offer.
I'm about half way done wiring up my power supply / control cabinet for the Gecko G203V's, CNC4PC multi function board and 500oz steppers.
I've been running with the Xylotex kit at 60ipm with good results and have been to chicken to increase it :)
I've always been impressed at the speeds you run your machine at, but then you are the Original Joe! ;)

Bob

Here's my update for the week. It's been a very busy week with very little time to work on my machine. Got to spend a few hours today on the control enclosure. Thought I'd have plenty of room when this went together but I must have moved things around a dozen times trying to get things to fit.
I replaced the two 10,000uf caps for one 33,000. Went ahead and added terminal strips to the bottom to make it easier to wire the entire thing out side of the box and then when the front panel is done I'll just slip the wires up throught the slots and into the terminals.
Not the neatest job in the world but it'll have to do for now.

37220 37221

Hopefully I'll get the time to finish it this coming week and get the new motors installed. Then finish up the gear driven dust collector.
Haven't ordered the 1/2-8 two start acme rod yet but that will be soon.
I'm having a 1/2-8 two start tap made by e-taps.com, but it will take about 3more weeks before it ships.

Bob

The enclosure looks very nice and tidy. What you should do is make a plexi front door insert so you can see inside it with some nice blue neon lighting inside, and then engrave your machine name in the plexi. I think that would look very cool.

Joe

Very nice looking controller keep up the good work. I can't wait to see your dust collector. I know how you feel so little time and so much to do.

Rick

The enclosure looks very nice and tidy. What you should do is make a plexi front door insert so you can see inside it with some nice blue neon lighting inside, and then engrave your machine name in the plexi. I think that would look very cool.

Joe

I like it! I might just do something like that, thanks! Before I go any further I'm going to stain the exterior and might use 1/4" mdf for the control panel on the lower front. Maybe paint it and add something catchy like Jays panel has!

Bob

Very nice looking controller keep up the good work. I can't wait to see your dust collector. I know how you feel so little time and so much to do.

Rick

Thanks Rick, I'm itching to get back to it, maybe I'll work on it a little before I finish the panel :)

Bob

Looks good sparky. I like how organized it all is. Nice dewalt drill, I have the same and consider it one of the best on the market; the battery life is incredible. Worth every penny!

Looks good sparky. I like how organized it all is. Nice dewalt drill, I have the same and consider it one of the best on the market; the battery life is incredible. Worth every penny!

Thanks Brian!

It's going to be a good day!! Look what I just got for my b-day...

37241

Getting ready to head out the door for Mother's Day breakfast and a fun filled day of Mother's Day events. It's not fair, I want to use my new skill saw... :(

Bob

nice buy! bring it with you its cordless haha

Happy b-day Bob....

nice buy! bring it with you its cordless haha

Good idea! I mentioned that at breakfast... not a good idea :D
I'm going to get busted sneaking in a few more posts before we head back out. shhhhh :)


Happy b-day Bob....

Thanks Buzz, the big 50 today, ah it's just a number anyway!

:eek: Busted!

Happy Birthday Bob, Great job on the controller case.

Happy B-Day, wonder if your older than me now??? lol

Happy B-day Bob you share the same day with my daughter and grand niece that was born today.

Rick

Thanks guys!! The kids made it a real nice day for us older folks! :)

Joe, just to make me feel better how about we say... you're older ;)

I know 5 people that are either close friends or related to me that have the same birthday and I'm always amazed at how many times someone tells me they have or know someone that has the same birthday. Must be something in the water in the month of August :)

Thanks again guys, hope you all had a great day also!

Bob

Hey I know you OLD guys :) are little slow , but its been over 2 months since last post in your thread. Matter of fact it's been since your birthday.

How bout some pictures of what you been making :D

Hey I know you OLD guys :) are little slow , but its been over 2 months since last post in your thread. Matter of fact it's been since your birthday.

How bout some pictures of what you been making :D

I've been busy trying to figure out how to build a walker and wheel chair out of 8020... :)

Actually it's been a rat race around here. My son got married. He's building a house, he and his wife have moved back in and will be here until the house is done in November. My daughter is getting closer to having her baby, due in August. This will be my first grandchild, a little girl. :D

I went into the shop a few weeks ago to play around and had nothing but problems. Seems my Y-Axis is all out of whack as I could not cut anything without it skipping. I did not get a chance to really check why and hope to get back to it soon. I'm thinking it's got to be something simple as it's been cutting very well up until then.

I've also been collecting parts to modify my machine or build another one. I've got 24 v-wheels, four 6' pieces and two 3' pieces of v-track. If I build another one it will be modeled after Joe's only it will use the v wheels and track.

I've also been collecting parts to build a bigger machine something like Yohudi's machine shown here:
http://www.cnczone.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=23149&d=1159066249

So far I have ordered 4 medium duty EG series Hiwin bearing blocks and some track, once I figure out what size I want to end up with I'll ordered the rest of the Hiwin stuff and start getting the 8020. I probably won't start this until late winter or even later than that. I'm thinking of rack and pinion or belt drive, not sure as I've got a lot of researching to do.

And then... Joe goes and shows us his new machine, now I want to built that one too. Very nice as usual!!

My priorities are to get my Joe's machine adjusted, replace the motors and Xylotex controls with the new 500oz steppers, gecko 203's, power supply and breakout board.
I've got some name plaques with seals that I want to cut at work and some different things for the family that I've drawn up.

I've decided to hold off on the gear driven dust collector for now as I'm not sure what direction I'm going in yet and because I'm spending to much time fooling around and not cutting the fun stuff. The one that I have pictures of earlier in my log works by hand very well and should be no problem for a motor to move up and down. It has 4" of travel and pulls up out of the way so that the ATC can change tools.

Any way that's it, I'll try and get back to my machine this coming weekend, we'll see.

Until then, happy cutting everyone.

Bob

I've been busy trying to figure out how to build a walker and wheel chair out of 8020...


Thanks for the laugh. You are one busy man .... I hope when I get your age, I hope Ican handle that kinda load.

Seems my Y-Axis is all out of whack as I could not cut anything without it skipping.
When I was having these problems was driving me crazy... White lithium grease solved my skipping... I now check all the time and take a little solder brush to the the build up on the screws and relocate to the area on screw it is using at the time

Good luck . Hope you can squeeze in some time and utilize your router

Condensation, from the fluctuation in temperature, and days with high humidity will make those nice, shiny looking pipe rails rust quicker than you can blink.

A little BoeShield or top cote would help with that.

A couple other things to consider:

Is the Y axis in alignment - or is it out of alignment and binding?

Do you need more power to your stepper to overcome this?

Is the stepper powerful enough?

Is the leadscrew bent? (If so you may be able to straighten it some, and apply greater pre-load to it to prevent lost steps due to whipping).

Do you have your control software settings optimized for ramp, etc?

Joe,

Are you still cutting kits for the 2006 or are you too wrapped up in the Hybrid to ship another one? Please let me know how to contact you about it.

Thanks, Pete :confused:

My E-mail sould show in my signature here.

Thanks, Joe

Deleted by author

Just sent a request there.

Thanks, Pete in Arizona

Well, it's been a while and I thought I'd post an update.

It has been a busy year!
Daughter got married and moved to Germany with my son-in-law (he's in the army). :(
Had a plate breaking party. :)
Son got married, along with my daughter-in-law, they moved in.
They were building a house, it's done so they just moved out... having another plate breaking party. :)
Garage is still full with a small path from the house door to the roll up door.
Kids, it's time to get your stuff out... or I'll be having a fire sale, just kidding!
Daughter had my first grand child. She's 3 months old now. :D

Haven't done much with my Joe's machine. Did get it back in adjustment and running really well, then... It went under a tarp. Got a lot going on at work and I've run out of room so had to move my machine into a small corner and cover it. Plan to get it moved to my garage after my kids get all their stuff out, hopefully by the first of the year it will be set up enough to have it in place.

Still working on a 8020 machine... well still gathering parts. Have two sizes in mind. 3x6 and 4x8. I've got some 8020 extrusions but still have plenty to purchase. I've got v-wheels and rails for the 3x6 and Hiwin trucks and rails for the 4x8. Once I get started with that, I'll post a log.

To help with the above project and other things, here's a couple of toys I've picked up...

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I just finished cleaning and servicing the lathe, it was full of the red grease stuff. Not to bad cleaned up pretty easy.

I've got the mill cleaned and serviced. Have the gas strut and belt conversion (in the card board boxes) to install.

Will probably CNC the mill later.

Now I've got my eye on the Grizzly X3, they have a special going right now, it's reduced by $100. As I understand it the sale is good until Dec 31, 2007.
I need a bigger garage or a shop... time to start dropping hints! :)

Well that about does it. It's great to see all the Joe's projects going on! Am pretty excited about Joe's new design, can't wait to see all the logs going for it.

Next time I post I am hopeful it will be to show some projects I'm working on.

Until then, have fun and Happy Holidays to everyone!!!

Bob

Good to hear from you bob, nice tools ;)

Nice tools Bob,Looking forward to seeing something done with them. hope you can reclaim your garage/shop soon


Kent