Hi guys, I got myself an X-1 yesterday, and I've managed to clean the transport grease off it and re-oil all the moving/sliding bits and run-in the motor as per the instructions. Despite reading the instructions carefully, I'm not sure if I need to do anything else to clean or calibrate it. I am currently waiting on a CNC Fusion kit, but I want it to be all set up and read to go when it arrives.

Sorry if this is a repost - I did search but didn't see anything that looked relavant - please point me at the threads if it is a FAQ.

Cheers.

Oh, and one other very newbie question - what's the best way to remove the drill chuck so that I can fit my milling collet holder? I have removed the drawbar, but what's the best thing to bang the drill chuck out with - I'm guessing I don't want to bang the drawbar?

Hi,

The only other thing I can think of now is to reset all the gibs. It will probably take some time to get right if you've never done it, but it's worth getting them nicely set. Not too tight, but at the same time you don't want any play.

To remove collets and chucks from my mill, I loosen the drawbar so that it is unscrewed a few threads. I then give the drawbar a few light taps with a hammer to knock the chuck/collet out. I have been doing this for a year now and there is no obvious sign of wear on the drawbar. As far as I know, drawbars are considered 'expendable' items - they have a finite life (from what I've read anyway). Also, when tightening the drawbar up, make sure you don't over-tighten it. You'll find it requires quite a whack to remove the tools if it was too tight.

Another little bit of advice is to make sure you support the chuck with one hand when you knock it out. The drawbar will catch the morse taper part of the chuck, but I've had the chuck come loose from its own taper and hit the table. Nothing serious, but had I held the chuck, I would've prevented a small ding in the table.

I think you'll find the X1 a nice little machine to use and CNC - I have anyway.

Regards
Warren

Hi,

The only other thing I can think of now is to reset all the gibs. It will probably take some time to get right if you've never done it, but it's worth getting them nicely set. Not too tight, but at the same time you don't want any play.

To remove collets and chucks from my mill, I loosen the drawbar so that it is unscrewed a few threads. I then give the drawbar a few light taps with a hammer to knock the chuck/collet out. I have been doing this for a year now and there is no obvious sign of wear on the drawbar. As far as I know, drawbars are considered 'expendable' items - they have a finite life (from what I've read anyway). Also, when tightening the drawbar up, make sure you don't over-tighten it. You'll find it requires quite a whack to remove the tools if it was too tight.

Another little bit of advice is to make sure you support the chuck with one hand when you knock it out. The drawbar will catch the morse taper part of the chuck, but I've had the chuck come loose from its own taper and hit the table. Nothing serious, but had I held the chuck, I would've prevented a small ding in the table.

I think you'll find the X1 a nice little machine to use and CNC - I have anyway.

Regards
Warren

Thanks for the tips Warren :)

I am looking forward to using this little machine, especially once it's CNC'ed.

Can you think of any good UK milling suppliers I should know of? I got the mill and some cutters etc from Arc Euro Trade and I'm planning an early morning trip to Chronos tomorrow for a few bits and bobs and some metal to practice on.

Incidentally, where do you get your metal from? I am planning on using metalsontheweb.co.uk as that seems fairly hassle free.

Cheers,
Joe.

Hi Joe,

I tend to buy most of my cutters from Arc and the odd one or two from Chronos (I get most lathe tools from Chronos). Mostly Arc for milling, though.

I've battled a bit in the past to find metal, but I think I have finally found a good, reliable source. I used to get 90% of it from Metal Supermarkets (there's one in Leeds), but after having some trouble with them not knowing what they were trying to sell me, I went off them a bit. One fine example was the guy not knowing the difference between cast iron and steel. What hope does that leave when I want different grades of the same material?

Anyway, I now get most of my metal from Mallard Metal Packs (http://www.mallardmetals.co.uk/). You have to order by email or over the phone, but the guy has always been friendly and they haven't messed up anything on any of my orders. I haven't come across metalsontheweb.co.uk before, but they look like they might be worth a try. The online ordering is nice - just a pity they don't stock steel and cast iron (I don't think).

Regards
Warren

You will need to tram the head - A fancy way of saying the head needs to be aligned perpendicular to the table in both the X & Y axis'.
The X&Y backlash needs to be adjusted.
A few minutes of work on the leadscrew/bearing blocks can make your life a lot easier - With mine, if you tightened the handles down to remove the backlash they wouldn't turn. A little deburring on the leadscrew and lapping the bearing block from face cleared most of it up.

Aaron

Hey pastera, exactly how do you "tram" the head on an X1?
There are no rotary axis on my X1.
Any modification to alignment would require metal removal or some kind of tapered shim.

Please explain what (& how) you align the slides to head.

Thanks,
Pres

Hi Joe,

I tend to buy most of my cutters from Arc and the odd one or two from Chronos (I get most lathe tools from Chronos). Mostly Arc for milling, though.

I've battled a bit in the past to find metal, but I think I have finally found a good, reliable source. I used to get 90% of it from Metal Supermarkets (there's one in Leeds), but after having some trouble with them not knowing what they were trying to sell me, I went off them a bit. One fine example was the guy not knowing the difference between cast iron and steel. What hope does that leave when I want different grades of the same material?

Anyway, I now get most of my metal from Mallard Metal Packs (http://www.mallardmetals.co.uk/). You have to order by email or over the phone, but the guy has always been friendly and they haven't messed up anything on any of my orders. I haven't come across metalsontheweb.co.uk before, but they look like they might be worth a try. The online ordering is nice - just a pity they don't stock steel and cast iron (I don't think).

Regards
Warren

Cheers Warren, I had actually spotted Mallard metals - but it is nice to get a personal recommendation. I may actually give Metal Supermarkets a go as there's one fairly near me in North London.

I went to Chronos on Saturday and had a good mosey around their showroom/warehouse and picked up some more bits and bobs and some small bits of metal to practice on.

I still haven't gotten round to adjusting my mill, let alone milling anything though :(

I had quite a battle getting my drill-chuck out - if only I'd tried WD40 first rather than last, it would have saved a lot of hammering and swearing! I also spent ages constructing a solid table to mount the mill on - just gotta bolt the sucker down and add some chip-guards to the back and sides and then I'll be ready to try milling some t-nuts :)

Now, all I need is for the postman to deliver my CNC mounts - hopefully they won't get stuck in customs for too long - though I imagine they look 'interesting' on an X-ray machine!

With shims at the four bolts on the column.
I used plate glass, DTI and torque wrench. The torque wrench keeps things consistent between iterations.

Mount the DTI on a shaft in the spindle such that it swings the largest arc possible while still rotating 360°.
Center the table and lock the gibbs.
Place your glass on the table to give you a nice flat surface.
Lower the head and swing the DTI to get readings at 0°, 90°, 180°, and 270°.
The difference between the 0° and 90° is the column tilt in the Y axis as I am describing it.
place equal shims under either the front two bolts if the 0° reading is higher.
repeat until aggrivated.

I didn't mill any tapered shims but that would be a good idea once you know what the correct shim stack is.

Aaron


Hey pastera, exactly how do you "tram" the head on an X1?
There are no rotary axis on my X1.
Any modification to alignment would require metal removal or some kind of tapered shim.

Please explain what (& how) you align the slides to head.

Thanks,
Pres

On an aside, I just received 2 Arc Euro 3mm endmills today. Within 30 mins both were broken. They are absolutely awful quality. There is a visible difference between the 4 flutes, and they are not at all sharp. I know they are very cheap, but even so I don't consider them to be a worthwhile investment at all. Have you not found this Warren? The cutters I have from Chronos are 10 times better (2 or 3 times the price).

Hi LongRat,

I'd definitely agree that the Arc cutters are not the best quality. I have only ever tried 2 Arc cutters below 6mm and both broke (they were 4mm and also broke within about 20mins)! All my small cutters now are either from Chronos or other known brands.

I recently bought a couple of 6mm cutters and a 9.5mm cutter from Arc. Both the 6mm cutters had small 'nipples' in the centre on the bottom (sorry for the poor description, but it's difficult to describe these extra features that aren't meant to be there) which I had to touch with a Dremel to get rid of. It also looked like someone had slipped with the grinder on the end of one of the flutes on the 9.5mm cutter. I have compared the sharpness of the Arc cutters to Chronos cutters and others and the Arc cutters are definitely blunt in comparison.

I wouldn't say the Arc cutters are not usable, because I have been using them for a while with reasonable success (besides the smaller ones). I am, however, beginning to think that it is worthwhile paying the extra money for better quality cutters (and tooling generally). I'm going to stop being a cheapskate and buy some decent cutters the next time I'm buying them.

Regards
Warren

Hi LongRat,

I'd definitely agree that the Arc cutters are not the best quality. I have only ever tried 2 Arc cutters below 6mm and both broke (they were 4mm and also broke within about 20mins)! All my small cutters now are either from Chronos or other known brands.

I recently bought a couple of 6mm cutters and a 9.5mm cutter from Arc. Both the 6mm cutters had small 'nipples' in the centre on the bottom (sorry for the poor description, but it's difficult to describe these extra features that aren't meant to be there) which I had to touch with a Dremel to get rid of. It also looked like someone had slipped with the grinder on the end of one of the flutes on the 9.5mm cutter. I have compared the sharpness of the Arc cutters to Chronos cutters and others and the Arc cutters are definitely blunt in comparison.

I wouldn't say the Arc cutters are not usable, because I have been using them for a while with reasonable success (besides the smaller ones). I am, however, beginning to think that it is worthwhile paying the extra money for better quality cutters (and tooling generally). I'm going to stop being a cheapskate and buy some decent cutters the next time I'm buying them.

Regards
Warren

I guess I'll find out what they're like soon - I bought a complete 2-flute slot mill set from them and ordered some 4-flutes. To be fair to Arc, they did actually ring me up after I'd ordered to warn me that they were having quality issues with their 4-flutes - some of them might have a 'pip' on them that needed grinding off, and they gave me the option to take them at 25% discount, or cancel. I chose to cancel and buy elsewhere. I guess I'd better try some out before the weekend incase I need to make another trip to Chronos on Saturday.

With shims at the four bolts on the column.
I used plate glass, DTI and torque wrench. The torque wrench keeps things consistent between iterations.

Mount the DTI on a shaft in the spindle such that it swings the largest arc possible while still rotating 360°.
Center the table and lock the gibbs.
Place your glass on the table to give you a nice flat surface.
Lower the head and swing the DTI to get readings at 0°, 90°, 180°, and 270°.
The difference between the 0° and 90° is the column tilt in the Y axis as I am describing it.
place equal shims under either the front two bolts if the 0° reading is higher.
repeat until aggrivated.

I didn't mill any tapered shims but that would be a good idea once you know what the correct shim stack is.

Aaron

Thanks for that :)

I was thinking of slapping a carefully milled 2-3" spacer block between the column and the table to give me more spindle-table distance, I guess I could use your technique to ensure that the column is still true. Or would raising the column that much be a recipie for disaster? I think there's plenty of Z-travel for my needs, but the 1st 75mm are eaten up by collets and the mill, and the last 50-80 by my vice, so I could really do with raising the column a bit.

I haven't tried any of the alignment yet - but my CNC Fusion kit has just arrived at the Post-Office depot - is it worth aligning before taking all the handwheels etc off to fit the CNC, or should I just do it when everything's fitted?

Ta.

Digits, I'm just about to order a cnc fusion kit for my x1 and wouldn't mind knowing how much customs and excise stung you for when you picked up your package, if you don't mind saying of course. How lond did it take to arrive?

thanks.

I would like to find out what performance you get out of the machine

I too am curious what kind of performance you get out of that x1. THey recently opend a HF store in my town, and have really been itching to buy one and learn how to use it.

Simpleton

Digits, I'm just about to order a cnc fusion kit for my x1 and wouldn't mind knowing how much customs and excise stung you for when you picked up your package, if you don't mind saying of course. How lond did it take to arrive?

thanks.

I'm planning to pick it up in person from the depot tomorrow - I've been charged nearly £35 - £8 of which is a UK Post Office handling fee.

I ordered on 21 August and according to the letter I got today, it got to the UK Post Office depot on the 11th of Sept. They seem to be made to order, and mine took a week to make! I emailed them several times inbetween, and they were very helpful, but I was obviously nervous never having dealt with them before. One thing to note, they don't send it to the UK via a trackable service by default - they just use airmail but do insure it - I'm sure if you asked, they could send it via a more expensive service.

I will let you all know what I think of it once I have it and once it's fitted :)

I too am curious what kind of performance you get out of that x1. THey recently opend a HF store in my town, and have really been itching to buy one and learn how to use it.

Simpleton

What sort of thing do you want to know?

I just broke my milling cherry :D

I've just made a mess of a bit of 3/4" aluminium bar - it was pretty quiet and less messy than I had expected. I need loads of practice milling, and my hack-sawing isn't the best either. :)

How far do the chips fly? One of the biggest hangups I have is that I live in an apartment and would have to figure out a way to operate it inside.

Simpleton

How far do the chips fly? One of the biggest hangups I have is that I live in an apartment and would have to figure out a way to operate it inside.

Simpleton

Ha,ha, so it's not just me that's mad enough to mill in a flat :D

So far, the chips have only gone about 12" or so - I still plan to put a perspex back and sides on my DIY milling table - it'll make the cleanup much easier. I have only cut dry so far, I expect wet milling will be really messy!

The main problem I had was carrying the bloody thing up the stairs - I uncrated it, which saved 16kg but the mill is really nasty to pick up without the box.

From my initial milling attempts, it really does look like I need to level the mill - none of my horizontal cuts are horizontal - both X and Y are out, and as it was in the vice, I can't see how it could have been clamped slanted in more than one dimension. It's going to be a busy weekend :)

I often lube my cuts with WD40 or GT85. GT85 is definitely better, you can get it from bike shops or Halfords. If you use this, it tends to bind the chips together in a pile and won't throw them across your room. It also greatly improves the surface finish. Keep a vacuum to hand all the time. It seems there is a growing fraternity of indoor milling enthusiasts!

Well, the best idea I had was to duct-tape a shop vac next to the spindle. At least untill I can cut brackets for it. :-)


Simpleton

After deciding that my test piece was out in 2 dimensions last night, this morning I actually bothered to measure it with a set square ;)

It was only non-square in the X direction, which I presume is because I wasn't careful enough adjusting the column tilt angle - I did it by eye. Is a set square going to be accurate enough to square up the column, or is there some fancy tool I need to use?

Cheers.

Hi there,

A set square is probably not going to be enough if you want to do it properly. Pastera explained what to do in post #8. To be honest, I have never checked my mill like this, but I've never had any problems with misalignment, either. Maybe my mill was reasonably square from the factory??? I really should check it.

Regards
Warren

Hi there,

A set square is probably not going to be enough if you want to do it properly. Pastera explained what to do in post #8. To be honest, I have never checked my mill like this, but I've never had any problems with misalignment, either. Maybe my mill was reasonably square from the factory??? I really should check it.

Regards
Warren

Yes, after posting that, I came to the same conclusion! I will get myself a dial test indicator on Saturday as well as the other bits and bobs I forgot to pick up at Chronos last weekend.

I don't have any parallels, so I guess my slanted milling is due to both the column being slightly off vertical (-0.5 degress at a guess from the scale) and me simply not clamping the workpiece properly. The Y-direction looks and measures perfectly square (without a DTI!) - and that was clamped square by the vice.

I should have my CNC Fusion kit in a couple of hours, so the mill's gotta come apart anyway. I don't think it'll be all wired up tonight though.

When done please post pics. Of you setup as well as what you make. I think everyone would enjoy that.

When done please post pics. Of you setup as well as what you make. I think everyone would enjoy that.

I think I've got a whole load of tidying up to do before I can take any pics that I'd be happy to share ;)

The good news is, I am now 3-axis CNC'ed :D

Just need to get some saftey handles to go on the ends of my motor shafts - the original handles are keyed, and so won't turn the motors.

The CNC Fusion kit is lovely by the way - fits perfectly and simple to put on if you read all the instructions carefully - I forgot some of the thrust bearings and so had to take X and Y off again - D'oh!

That was quick, I'm impressed!!! Can't wait to see the PICs. What are you using for your drivers and steppers?

Good going!!

Tally Ho (or what ever you chaps say)

Ron

That was quick, I'm impressed!!! Can't wait to see the PICs. What are you using for your drivers and steppers?

Good going!!

Tally Ho (or what ever you chaps say)

Ron

Thanks - I went a bit mad and stayed up til 1:30 am fitting and tuning it, but to be honest, the CNC Fusion parts fit like a glove :)

My steppers are FL57STH76B's from Motion Control Products Ltd, and they seem pretty capable of moving all the axes. The only weak link in the chain is the driver board I bought off eBay - from someone called StepMaster NC - the board has no heatsinks and one of the channels seems to go into intermittent thermal shutdown after about 20mins or so. I will have to see if I can find/make some heatsinks to go on the surface-mounted driver IC's - I have also got two 60mm fans to aim at the board.

I will post some pics soon - I'm not trying to be a tease!

Well, I have still not straightened up my column - it didn't seem too far out, but I will have another go with my new DTI later in the week.

I spent a lot of time at the weekend doing carpentry and cutting %$%ing perspex for the sides, so now at least the chips stay on the table and I have small shelf for all my tooling!

I also fitted X and Y limit/home switches which I think need a rework - the X limits are on the side of the table and I think they'll need some protection from metal chips. I also need to sit down and read the Mach 2 manual - I keep sheering my limit switches off as I think I have to enable limit-overriding to be able to home to and then back off the switches, but it only takes a mis-jog to shear my poorly glued switches off the table! D'oh - there must be a sensible way round this!

Has anyone else fitted limit switches to a long X & Y X1 mill - if so, where did you put the X-axis switches, and how did you fix them to the mill?

I had a quick go at cutting some 3D stuff out of wood - it spent 30 mins roughing out and then just as it started doing something interesting, my workpiece came unclamped at one end and the mill jammed :(

Ah, well, it's a learning experience, and as long as I haven't broken any teeth on my spindle-gears, I'll be happy.

The X1 looks like an interesting mill but from the side shots I have seen it looks like the contact area for the sliding surfaces will be minimal long before taken to its limits. For example the following ad claims a 9" x 4" travel thing is how does a table that is only 9-3/8" x 5-3/8" do that???

http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=47158

That said www.littlemachineshop.com sells 2 kits that claim to change the x and y travels to 13" and 5.1"

X-AXIS "KIT" (15-3/4" table)
http://www.littlemachineshop.com/products/product_view.php?ProductID=2642

Y-AXIS "KIT" (also covers the Y screw?)
http://www.littlemachineshop.com/products/product_view.php?ProductID=2297

The X1 mill at SiegIND.com lists the travels for its machine as 7.2" and 3.5"... still not 100% contact for its travel.

http://www.siegind.com/Products/br-x1-lathe.htm

I wonder what pieces would need to be purchased from www.littlemachineship.com to have a complete mill but with the extended travels. The Y-AXIS kit can also be purchased with an attachment that lets the colum tilt just FYI.

Maybe the X kit, Y-Kit (with z-column), spindle and motor? Guess not there would be no handles and very likely other missing parts. Still I bet it can be done for under $500 and the added table width is nice I believe those are a standard t-nut size for clamping kits as well.

OH... here is a link to an X1 from beginning to end with ballscrew conversion. Take a look at that first pic it shows just how much the sux Y-Travel is on the stock X1 (bearings nailed to a board in an attempt to fix the wobbly table I think).

http://www.embeddedtronics.com/micromill.html

The X1 looks like an interesting mill but from the side shots I have seen it looks like the contact area for the sliding surfaces will be minimal long before taken to its limits. For example the following ad claims a 9" x 4" travel thing is how does a table that is only 9-3/8" x 5-3/8" do that???

http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=47158

That said www.littlemachineshop.com sells 2 kits that claim to change the x and y travels to 13" and 5.1"

X-AXIS "KIT" (15-3/4" table)
http://www.littlemachineshop.com/products/product_view.php?ProductID=2642

Y-AXIS "KIT" (also covers the Y screw?)
http://www.littlemachineshop.com/products/product_view.php?ProductID=2297

The X1 mill at SiegIND.com lists the travels for its machine as 7.2" and 3.5"... still not 100% contact for its travel.

http://www.siegind.com/Products/br-x1-lathe.htm

I wonder what pieces would need to be purchased from www.littlemachineship.com to have a complete mill but with the extended travels. The Y-AXIS kit can also be purchased with an attachment that lets the colum tilt just FYI.

Maybe the X kit, Y-Kit (with z-column), spindle and motor? Guess not there would be no handles and very likely other missing parts. Still I bet it can be done for under $500 and the added table width is nice I believe those are a standard t-nut size for clamping kits as well.

OH... here is a link to an X1 from beginning to end with ballscrew conversion. Take a look at that first pic it shows just how much the sux Y-Travel is on the stock X1 (bearings nailed to a board in an attempt to fix the wobbly table I think).

http://www.embeddedtronics.com/micromill.html

The X1 I have came with a 400x145mm mill table which gives about 330x145mm of travel in manual mode. I think I've lost 10-20mm of X via the CNC conversion but there's still plenty of X and Z travel (if not enough Z-clearance for my liking).

Here's what I bought: http://www.arceurotrade.co.uk/en-gb/dept_156.html

Just finished my attempt at tramming it up - left to right is nearly spot on, but there's a slight front-back tilt on the column that I can't fix by adjusting the screws. I tried shimming the column, but my shim plate was too thick. It looks like a tiny error anyway, so I might just try cutting some test parts tomorrow.

Thanks for all the helpful advice :cheers:

My steppers are FL57STH76Bs from Motion Control Products Ltd,

Can't wait to find out how digits gets on with his FL57STH76B steppers!

I have the same type Sieg X1L mill from Arc Eurotrade and am looking to CNC it asap.

Can't wait to find out how digits gets on with his FL57STH76B steppers!

I have the same type Sieg X1L mill from Arc Eurotrade and am looking to CNC it asap.

Hi there - the steppers are fine - I get about 1100mm/min rapids on X & Y and about 650mm/min on Z running at 24v.

My eBay StepmasterNC stepper driver board was a total swizz - it overheated and lost steps at half its rated current and then actually caught fire when one of the axes jammed!

I have been running MSD542 stepper drivers from Motion Control Products since then - they are great!

Hope that helps.

Cheers.

The steppers are fine - I get about 1100mm/min rapids on X & Y and about 650mm/min on Z running at 24v.

My eBay StepmasterNC stepper driver board was a total swizz - it overheated and lost steps at half its rated current and then actually caught fire when one of the axes jammed!

I have been running MSD542 stepper drivers from Motion Control Products since then - they are great!

Thanks digits, a reallly helpful response and fast! I guess I'll take your StepmasterNC stepper driver board comments as a recommendation to treat them like the plague - and leave well alone!

Thanks digits, a reallly helpful response and fast! I guess I'll take your StepmasterNC stepper driver board comments as a recommendation to treat them like the plague - and leave well alone!

I'm not joking - the board actually went up in smoke with a small whisp of flame - good job I was watching it!

I guess the lesson I learnt was that you get what you pay for - nothing in CNC is cheap, but the steppers and drivers from MCP Ltd seem very good value to me.

I hope you enjoy your CNC'ed X-1 - just remember to be patient with it and take small cuts - and if you can afford it, seriously consider an upgrade to ballnuts/screws - the stock screws have some pretty nasty backlash, which makes CNC'ed curves a lot less pretty than they should be.

Cheers and please post some pics of your conversion.