Where are the guys that have CNCed their IH Mills. I need to know if your kit came with a NEMA Enclosure, and if not where did you get yours? What is the box that i need? If you could please post pictures of your setup. I just got everything except for my plastic covers and my extra y axis spacer. I did all the modifications Aaron has listed on his sight (that i could do). Any help would be appreciated.

hey guys i really need some help. I need to know where to get an enclosure or how i should go about making one. I also need a wiring schematic for the wiring of the geckos and power supply. Please post I need help.

send me an email to jczub and i can email you a wiring schematic. also you can get NEMA enclosures at Mcmaster Carr as well as Grainger. they aren't Cheap but they are certified.

I need a full e-mail addy to send to you. I did send you an e-mail through your cnczone profile

Krymis,

Like you, I would like to see some threads concerning the cnc of these machines. Since you are in the process, you can contribute what you know and have experienced so far, and post some pictures, and this can help others planning to convert this mill and are monitoring this thread.

First off, what gecko's are you using and are you using steppers or servo's? What is the target voltage of your power supply and have you all the components necessary or are you in the process of designing the electronics? Do you need any sources for components?

Plenty of folks ready to lend an opinion, just need to know where you are at in your project. What do you need to know specifically?

I'll post a pdf on power supplies, and that will show everything except the bleed resister that you may want to use across the filtering capacitor. I look around to find the calculation for the value for this resistor. (My power supply had a final voltage of 36 VDC and the resistor was a 2 watt 500 ohm, and the purpose is to safely drain the capacitor fairly quickly in order to remove the voltage from the drivers when you turn off the power to supply).

Post some pics and you will usually get a good bit of input!!

Ron

I already have all the cnc stuff. Aaron has helped out so much already. I feel that the kit Aaron's kit is one of the best things you can buy for the price. I had to purchase a few things as listed: brake cleaner (to clean shipping grease from ballscrews), Locktite Red, Locktite Blue, Ultra Black RTV (high temp, oil resistant), Sodering iron (old one blew) and soder, Mineral spirits (way lapping), Rags, WD40 (rust inhibitor), box for the drives and power supply, extra relays for spindle on/off coolant on/off, 25' male to male DB25 parallel cord, wiring for the drives and powersupply, and a case of Corona (hey my machine likes the good stuff).

:wee:

well here are some specs: the geckos are 320 the power supply is a 65v 20a set and there are 2 24v heatsink fans. and everything is pictured except for the mill and computer and 2 extra cooling fans for the case. I also sent in the z slide for the bushing modification.

send it to

jczub@hotmail.com

well i just stripped the end off of my 25 pin connector. Once i got it off i noticed that i could not just look at the connector to see the wire to pins. I had to use the digital multimeter set to 2 ohms and check each pin and find the corosponding colored wire. I wrote them down on a sheet and now I have the wire colors that would need to go to the geckos. Now, I have to know how all the spindle and coolant stuff comes into play? I only have my power supply(65v/20a), 3 geckos(soon to be four for a rotory table) mounted on heatsinks with 2 fans(24v/0.12A). What do i need for the auto spindle on/off speed control and auto flood coolant on/off? I will not be doing the conversion for the extra stuff right now but want to know how to do it for later. Any other extras i would want to think about doing? Where do i get the power for the geckos(5v regulated) and the fans (4 all together 24v/0.12A) ? how do i do an e-stop set up on the out side of the box?Do i need two more power supplies or how do i do this tapping into the computer power for the geckos? I need this info so i can make my box to put this stuff in.

Power supply is easy. You can follow Ron111's doc (looks like the Campbell Design?). Here are my notes:

http://www.thewarfields.com/MTLatheCNCDrivers.htm

I recommend the Ajax CNC board that goes on top of your electrolytic capacitor:

http://www.thewarfields.com/img/Toys/MachineTools/LatheStuff/CNCConversion/CapTopRectifier2.jpg

They're cheap, have everything but the fuses wired up, and they clean up your install considerably. I got my toroidal transformer from Parts Express, also very cheap.

I have seen a lot of posts say the discharge resistor isn't really necessary--the Geckos themselves will discharge your cap. With that said, the Ajax board has one built in.

I am running 70V in my power supply, which is max for the Geckos. They spec 80V, but you want some leeway according to Mariss. The voltage you get is really a function of what your transformer puts out * 1.414 when rectified. Anyway, for ideal stepper performance, you want a motor rated to 1/20 of what your supply has going (yep, sounds wrong, but it isn't, the Gecko will make sure your motor doesn't burn up). You can deal with less, but it won't accelerate as well.

On servos, you are on your own, but I urge you to read Mariss' recent post about the Kelling tech motors over on the Yahoo Gecko board.

On Geckos, I'm running 202's--they're less prone to blowing up when idiots like me use them and don't do it quite right. (chair)

What else? You want some shielded cable, yada, yada, read a lot of posts here and on the Gecko and Mach Yahoo boards, lotsa people ready to help, yada, yada, and, Oh Yeah! If it helps any, my CNC Dictionary is here:

http://www.thewarfields.com/MTCNCDictionary.htm

Welcome, and as one of the other fellas here says, "May the cutting force be with you."

Best,

BW

bob,
the power end is 65v/20a. It was already built from IH.
how do i get power to my power supply? How do i connect the wiring from the outlet to the supply and where do they get connected? What do i use as a switch to turn it on and off? Where do i get the switch? Do I have to add any more fuses to the power supply going to the geckos?

krymis,

You are asking the right questions, first I would recommend using a breakout board which you plug in your parallel port into and then you have a good arrangement to solder your wires to. I seen them on ebay and on the ebay seller's stores for anywhere from $15 to $150 for the optical isolated variety.

As far as your input power, you need a power switch which you can buy at anywhere from radioshack, or go to the mouser website and wade through the numerous choices.

You will want to fuse the input power( the black wire) from the 3 prong power cord cord, and you will also want to fuse the DC power going to each of your drivers.

The size of your fuse is determined by the power drawn by your power supply.

So, the green wire (Ground) of your 3 wire power input will screwed to your chassis (assuming your box is metal). The black wire through the switch, the fuse and then the to the primary contact on the transformer. The white wire goes to the second contact of the transformer. This is assuming that you are using a single pole single throw switch. If you're using a double pole double through you can also connect the white wire (Neutral).

As far as the five volt and the 24 volt for the fan power there are small power available with these combinations, and you will want to use a relay to control your coolant pump. If you are wanting to turn on and off the larger spindle motor you may need to use a contactor type switch.

But for now I would suggest looking into using the 25 pin break out board, it will keep things a lot neater in your control box.

Press on!!

Ron

Ron is absolutely right. A breakout board is a must and you have less chance to goof up.
Randy

Guys thanks for the info. I am taking consideration to the breakout board but at this time I am concentrating on the powersupply wiring with the switch and plug in. What switch do i get at radioshack? I searched the whole rack and found to have a choice of 54 different ones. Do i just use a household light switch or a pushbutton or a rocker switch? And what ratings should it have? I do not know how to pick the switch. As for wiring if I understand correctly a 3 pronge extension cord can be cut and used for the powersupply plug in. The black cord gets the switch put inline and goes to one side of the powersupply, but is there a certain side? The white goes to the other side and the ground goes to the case that everything is getting put in. Is this correct so far? Where do i get the power for the fans and geckos? Is that what is incooperated in the breakoutboard? And what is a breakoutboard for?

The break out board will have all the signals from the computer, step and dir for each of the up to four axis, and commands to turn on (and off) coolant pumps and spindle. The board also interfaces the input signals such as limit switches and homing switches and also spindle speed.

For more information look at the Mach3 manuel and read through the section about setting up for your machine configuration and you will begin to see how every thing is integrated.

VA for switch selection, I believe that you said that you were using a 65 VDC power supply, and I assume you are using servo's, determine what the current draw is for the servo's and if the total current is say 15 amps (I'm just picking a number) the volt amps would just under 975VAMPS.

So, at 975VAMPS / 120VAC = 8.125 amps So for this example, you would want a switch to could handle 8.125 Amps @ 120VAC. (a 10 Amp - 120 VAC switch)

Some of the guys will tell you that using stepper motors that you will never exceed 2/3 of the total current which would be 10 amps @ 65VDC, but I don't know if this is true with servos.

I'm not sure whether you can pick off the 5vdc from an USB port to use as the 5vdc reference signal, but call gecko and see what they say.



Either of the primary taps you can use for black wire connection, just make sure you are on the primary side.

Hope this helps,


Ron

ron,

you are opening my eyes to so many things. Ok if you look at my pictures of the power supply I would assume the two open tabs are the primary side? I would want to have a wall plug black cord go through a switch to a fuse to the tab correct? Then the white to the opposite tab? The servos have no markings on them to identify their ratings. But the power supply is rated at 20A so could i use this for the switch choice?

If the power supply was wired by Aaron at IH, the the two open taps are the primary side. You are right, the black goes through the switch, through the fuse, and connects to either of the taps. The white can go directly to the other tap or can go through a double pole switch if you buy a DPDT (double throw/double pole).

Seriously start studying the Mach3 setup portion of the mach3 manuel.


I would recommend using a 14 gage Power cord which is rated for 15A of 120VDC.

Press on!!

Ron

ok now what fuse do you use after the switch?

If you think that you will actually use 20 Amps of the DC, use a 10 amp fuse on the AC side, or if you think that you will use 16 AMP DC use a 8 Amp fuse on the ac side, if you think that you will use 12 amps dc use a 6 amp fuse on the ac side.

This should put you in the ball park. Actually determine you VAMP requirements on the dc side and figure what the same VAMP would be on the AC side and then calculate your max current and allow for that.

Ron

ok after a lot of research on being told that the manufaturer (IH) does not use breakout boards i found out how to get the 5v for the geckos using my usb port. Apparently if you take pin one from your usb and daisy chain it to the four geckos they will work. I purchased my new SIIG Cyber parallel card today for the PC. so now i got the power cord, gecko power, and 25 pin connector worked out. Working on the switch and fuse for the power cord. What fuses do i need and where do i get them? Some post are saying fast and others are saying slow blow. What type of holder and where to get them. What gage of wire to use to wire the whole internals? And still looking for a way to power my four cooling fans(2 case fans, and 2 heatsink fans).

Am i to connect all the common wires of the 65v source to the cap on the power supply? That would be one for each gecko.

I used a slow blow for my AC side and fast blows for my driver (DC) side. Let's talk about how to run your power to your drivers. I used a terminal board to distribute a separate power line directly to each driver. (You don't want to daisy chain the power the way you did for the reference power), You want a seperate line with it's own fuse going directly to each driver. The same terminal board (or strip) will have two rows of two screws (20 positions, also buy a package of jumpers) which I have seen at HomeDepot, radio shack and in electronic catalogs. Connect the power to a position on the terminal board and then use a jumper to link to another position. That leaves three positions for lugged wires to be screwed down and ran to a fuse block (which will have 4 fuses one for each driver).

Look at some of the pictures that Bob Warfield put on PhantomCow2's post about needing an enclosure in the Benchtop Machine section and you will probelly see some terminal strips being used.

Hook up wire, 18 gage should be fine, maybe also found at RadioShack (maybe, they are not into the electronics like they were in the ole days, but that's another story)

Go to MPJA Online, this one parts supplier for different things that maybe you can't find locally. You can buy computer cables cheap (USB & DB25 and fuses and buse blocks also). Look at www.pminmo.com they may have small 24 vdc power supplies for your fans.

Tell me about the break out board that you ordered, Is it passive or optical isolated (requiring power)? Either way is fine.

Your making headway!!

Ron

i did not order a breakout board as Aaron at IH said they do not use them. They wire direct to the drives via the db25 cable. I did however order the parallel card the Aaron recommended on his site. It should be here friday.

Ron is there anyway you can get a few good pictures of the control box setups that are not all clutered and explain the whats and whys. Its great being able to get the thing up and running but does me no good to not know what its doing. Thank you for all your help so far.

Am I correct in the fact that you are suppose to connect all the 65v commons from the drivers to the post on the capacitor with the one black wire on the power supply?

Again like the 65VDC distribution, I would connect the commons to the terminal strip jumpered together and then 1 wire to the cap (-) term.

Here is the link to Bob's collection of control boxes, just study them and you will be able to pick out the drives, power supplies, fans, terminal boards, I/O 25 pin break out boards, ect.


http://www.thewarfields.com/MTLatheCNCDrivers.htm

Ron

I laid out the components and think that i have a plan for wiring this box. I will know more once i get the switch and fuses and power cord. Now if I have that conquered, where do i get an estop and how do i put it together? After that how do i wire for the coolant on/off, spindle on/off, and spindle speed to be controled by the pc?

I have found 3 different ways to control the coolant pump and spindle on and off from the pc. I am thinking the Al the Man has the best method. Now, I am really wondering how to control the spindle speed from the pc. I think after I get that squred away the wiring will be done and I will be ready to fab the box. I am going to build a box out of 16gage sheet metal. I am going to apply an Aluminum plate to mount everything to. All wires will be fed through the bottom in stain relievers and then siliconed. The fans will have filter material applied over them to protect the inside from any swarf and dust. The whole thing should be sealed against any incoming contaminates.

can the 5v for tripping a relay come from the same 5 volts used for the gecks? I am referencing "AL the Man"'s schematic. Where should i get the 5v from. Should i just pull it from the ps2 mouse? If i pull it from the mouse would i then affect the way the mouse moved when in use? And if i am pulling the 5v from one usb could i just use another usb or do they share the same 5v? Man the more i think I am getting close to done the further away i feel. Anybody want to wire this thing for me with the needed relays.......where is the fun in that.

why not just add a 5 volt power supply and be done with it. that way you have plenty of power for everything. i find it keeps me sane doing it this way as opposed to trying to steal power from other components.

"I am not sure what circuit of mine you refer to, but if it is using a 2n7000 for a buffer, then if you use this method of buffering the Printer port, instead of a breakout box, then the 2n7000 can drive a SSR or ordinary relay to switch on what ever you want.
If you need a 5v or 12vdc supply for the SSR you can use one of the HD connectors on your PC power supply.
Al."

What is the HD connector he is talking about?

Also where am i going to get a 5v power supply for the items....4 geckos and at least 2 relays? Hell i might as well get another one as i already had to get a 24v one for the fans. Now i know why i used hand tools for so long. This is a pain to figure out.

krymis,
you may want to post the schematic or show the link to it and we will have a better idea of what and how you are building your controller.

I not sure of what card (2n7000?) that you are using, that you had purchased from Aaron so maybe you have a pdf file associated with it that you could post, or some additional info that you could post. Because at this point, there appears to be some known elements in this equation.

As far as planning to control the spindle speed, have you selected the motor and varable speed controller yet?

Ron

"I am not sure what circuit of mine you refer to, but if it is using a 2n7000 for a buffer, then if you use this method of buffering the Printer port, instead of a breakout box, then the 2n7000 can drive a SSR or ordinary relay to switch on what ever you want.
If you need a 5v or 12vdc supply for the SSR you can use one of the HD connectors on your PC power supply.
Al."

What is the HD connector he is talking about?

.
HD = Hard drive connector on the PC power supply.5v & 12v available, although the 5v has the most capacity (Current).
Al.

Thanks Al

Here is the circit Al has posted for auto on/off by m codes. Anybody got any pictures of the circit?

Ron111,

here is a link to the card that i purchased http://www.industrialhobbies.com/howto/tips/cards.htm
It is all there of why to use it...i guess?

I need help with making the circit for the turn ons. What is the measurment of resistor 2? How do i tap into the power supply on the computer for the 5v? And last but surely not least of all where or how do i get the 24v for the fans as they are 24vdc/ 0.12A? Can i just run one cord into the box to power the 65v power supply, coolant pump, spindle, and computer and monitor?

krymis,

Looked at the card you bought, and it is a true 5.0 volt TTL printer port. Not a bad idea to know that the printer port that you are using will interface with the drivers ok.

But, I really think you need to use a $10 break out card. Trustme, you will end up with a bird's nest. And it will be so confusing!!!

Question 1

"I need help with making the circit for the turn ons. What is the measurment of resistor 2? "

I not familure with that component. But I'll give you an option that some of the guys around here use.

Go to http://www.cnc4pc.com and look at their c8 - AC solid state relay board for $14. (I haven't used this myself)


Question 2
"How do i tap into the power supply on the computer for the 5v? ". One of the guys eariler pointed that you could get this from an unused (IDE) hard drive power connector off your computers power supply. Then you will have another cable from your computer carring the 5 VDC power into your control box. (that's one option)

Or you could look at the c2 mini power supply at the above web site for $25, which is 5 vdc and 12 vdc.


Question 3

"And last but surely not least of all where or how do i get the 24v for the fans as they are 24vdc/ 0.12A?"

You could try to find a 24vdc power supply or scrap the two 24 vdc fans and pick up two 12vdc fans for $5 each(guessing) and use the above mentioned power supply from cnc4pc.com.

Or you could pickoff some of the rectified voltage and find a 24vdc regulator to drive the existing fans or try running them off the 32vdc which I think is what is coming of 1 set of your secondary. When build connect your supply, read the voltage avross on of your rectifiers and see if it is around 32 volts give or take, if it is, put a health capacitor across it (to filter it) and you can probelly use that power. I don't know if running a pulsating DC would be Hard on the fans.



"Can i just run one cord into the box to power the 65v power supply, coolant pump, spindle, and computer and monitor?"

I would recommend using a terminal board and run your input AC power to it and distribute your AC from there(Both your black and white). You could mount a clear plexiglass cover over it for safety, just like the real engineers do!!!!

But seriously consider using a break out board (it will keep all of those 25 pins organized in an effective layout that keep you from making expensive mistakes)

My question

"Can i just run one cord into the box to power the 65v power supply, coolant pump, spindle, and computer and monitor?"

Why did you include the computer and monitor? Your not thinking about cramming all this stuff in your computer case, are you?


Hope this helps,

Ron

krymis,

Why did you include the computer and monitor? Your not thinking about cramming all this stuff in your computer case, are you?


Hope this helps,

Ron


Ron I was going to put a regular outlet on the power supply box and then put the computer on top of it. Then have the computer and monitor plug ins run to the outside of the power case. That would allow for a neat and pretty setup at the machine with the custom cover i have made for it.

As for the breakout board...I already cut the db25 and ran all the wires. It is actually very nice as i plan to run the power lines on a peice of aluminum stock that sits 3" from the floor of the case and 2" away from the geckos. The db25 is ran on the floor of the case. All the wires are already zip tied in groups for the specific axis driver. Then all the intelegent wires are ran on the floor and the power wires are ran on the upper level. both top and bottom sets of wires are secured to stable surfaces via loop connectors.

ron thank you for that site. I think that will help me so much. I think on my next box this will be much easier. I think on the next box there will definitally be a breakoutboard.

Little update:

I ordered a 24v/2a power supply from mpjg for the fans, i am ordering a 2 c8 boards or 1 c5 board and 5v powersupply from the cnc4pc site, and by tuesday if everything is here I will wire the box. I will post lot of pictures from the wiring so you can advise me on how the looks and functionality will be percieved. Thank you ron111 for all your help. I don't think i would have done this with out you and the zone. The next hurdle is the wiring and then comes the easy stuff.

Ron,

What board would you use (for controlling the coolant pump and spindle) from the cnc4pc site and why? The C5 or the C8? Can you explain the difference? I assume the at eh C8 needs no power supply to it, but the C5 does. However the C5 can control up to four outputs. Seeing as I am ordering the mini powersupply i could use two of the outputs 5v signals to power the C5 board therefore cutting down the need for two C8 boards. What are your thoughts?

Where are the guys that have CNCed their IH Mills. I need to know if your kit came with a NEMA Enclosure, and if not where did you get yours?

I used 1 nema enclosure for the power supplies (Grainger) and a common 100amp service panel box from Lowes for the gecko's.

thank you for the reply but i am actually making the enclosure for the power supplies and geckos. It may not be the most compact but it will be arranged the way that i want them to be. It is easier for me this way seeing as I have a full metal fab shop. Might even go as far as making it look good....

well guys after much much much debating and confusion, I have decided to go with a CNC4PC multifunction board. I talked with Arturo and he and Aaron converse a lot. So he recommended a multifunction board and plug-in powersupply. I really don't know what I am in for but I am anxious to get this up and running. Do you have any better recommendations for a"multifunction board"? This is the first that I have heard of a multifunction board and I think in some way it may be a breakout board. I think it just has added bells and whistles. here is the link to it http://www.cnc4pc.com/Multifunction_CNC_Board.htm
here is the power supply http://www.cnc4pc.com/Accessories.htm its item A4

If you know of any other multifunction boards or a better option then please post any opinions welcome. I have learned so much from doing this wiring project that I now have a new found respect for the guys that build their own control boxes.

There are a lot of similar boards out there. This multifunction board is a breakout board that adds a few goodies such as safety charge pump circuit, relays, motor speed output, and so on.

There are similar offerings from Campbell Designs, PMDX, CAndCNC, and probably a number of other sources.

Your decision is going to have to be based on which board has all the features you want, and which one you're most confident you can get running. Most of them you can download their documentation. I'd start there and read through all of it to get a sense of what looks easiest for you.

Another thing to do is to make a list of all the functions you're going to need. For example:

- How many axes? 3? Do you need a 4th someday?

- Home/Limits

- Spindle motor: Need on/off, direction, and speed.

- Coolant: On/off. Does it need to be AC or DC relay?

- Control panel inputs: Are you making a control panel, or is it all going to be handled on the PC in Mach?

Some packages are more complete than others. Look over all the stuff provided by each board maker. For example, CAndCNC will sell you a pretty complete box plus a pendant. Others may require you to cobble a lot together.

Best,

BW

well today has gotten a lot accomplished. I spoke with bob campbell and got my circuit breaker, on/off switch, and EPO switch. My 24v power supply for the 4 fans, the remaining 2 fans for the case, the sheet metal to fab the case, the new dell computer for the machine, new SIIG CyberParallel Card, a new DB25 parallel cable, a CNC4PC multifunction card, and 5v/12v power supply. Tomorrow will be the lowes run for the terminal bars, and the connectors for the ends of the wires. Also for tomorrow is getting the materials for the mill stand as outlined on the industrial hobbies website. I will be using the mill stand to hold the quick change tool set, control panel and the computer...i think. It may change as the wind does.

well todays trip to lowes, radio shack, and advanced auto netted 14, 18, and 22 gage wire, a six spot fast blow fuse block with 5A fuses as seen on the mechmate power supply at bob's cnc lathe site. It is from a vehicle application...any problem with that? The 5A fuses are rated at 32V any problem here? I also got heat shrink, sticky holders for zip ties, terminal ends, terminal strips, terminal jumpers, gromets, and a Db25 10' cable. Then i grabbed a book from the local Grizzly store. Its called Machine Tool Technologies Basics. It works ......give some insight on the progress so I know if i am on the right track.

Hey what do i use to make a nice connection into the gecko drives. What connector(like a bullet connector or butt connector just as an example) would i use and where to find them? I searched at lowes but there was only bullet connectors and the y are to big to fit in the gecko wire openings.

I usally just use a stripped wire and tin it so the connecter gets a good grab.
Randy

guys i got my circuit breaker, on/off switch, and epo switch today. My new question is: Do i put the circuit breaker on the black line before it goes to the terminal strip or can it go on the line going to the 65v power supply after leaving the terminal strip?

here is the mess so far. Any help with the circuit breaker please

Go through the circuit breaker before you go to the terminal board, because you will distribute your power from the terminal board and you want all of the current going through the breaker.

thanks ron...hey any ides what the name of this connector is called and where to find it (this is not my pic, it was taken from the mechmate site.). What type of connector to use to connect the encoder wires and limit switches from the outside of box to the inside? And once again where to get them?

As far that that connector, I'm not sure. I would suggest following Randall sugestion
"I usally just use a stripped wire and tin it so the connecter gets a good grab.
Randy" If you don't want to tighten down on the bare copper wire.

I personally like to tighten down on the bare copper wire, just like your house is wired (which does include solid copper wire and stranded copper wires for the Stove, water heater and the outside A/c unit and the electrical furness (I add these because some of the guys may only think of the 12 and 14 gage solid copper wire, but any way the screw down connectors on your drives are simular to the function to the screw down connector in the house's breaker box), If it's safe enough for your house, it's safest enough for you cnc controller. Did not mean to write a book.

Ron

cool sounds like a plan for me but i would like to know what these are called.

That is a "Pin Terminal Vinyl Insulated" connector made by Kobiconn available from mouser. part# 159-2213 for 22-16 awg, part# 159-1617 for 16-14 awg ($.16 each)

found them and i appreciate it. this will help in a lot of other applications i have.

what vfd would be best to use for this machine and cntrol set?

well made some progress with wiring tonight. I got the circuit breaker wired before the terminal strip, got the extension cord cut and wired into the circuit breaker and the terminal strip, got the on/off and estop wired into the power supply, and the nuetral is just hanging out until i get the box built the way i want.

well i started laying everything out in the box. I am using a 24*24" 16g steel sheet for the base. I am using a 12*24" 16g steel sheet to create the front pnael that will be welded to the base. I did the front in two peices so it would be easier to bend a top mounting flange in the brake. I am making the outer shell of a 22g steel sheet with raised 3d tribal patterns. No special reason other than the fact that i take pride in the fact that this control box is a big prject for me and the case will be a show of the pride inside. the whole box will be powdercoated in lollypop blue with the raised pattern being either polised or true flamed in a candy blue purple green. Now the fabbing and coloring is where i can show you i am really not as stupid as this whole thread has made it seem.... :D

krymis,

Be sure to post pic's of your control box. If any of the power coated surfaces are used as a ground tie point be sure to use a small piece of tape or something to prevent it from being coated as a power coated surface is somewhat insulated.

I do admire your drive in this project, and the others which may not have a background in electronics, for tackling a technical project such as cnc'ing a piece of equipment(others with electronics backgrounds on the forum feel the same way and sometimes we may brag or try try to flaunt what little knowledge that we have) but, being able to contribute to someone, who is not afraid to bite of more than they chew, and watch them overcome and produce a quality machine, is what this forum is all about.

Ron

Ron,
thank you, i would not have done this without your help. I was lucky in the fact that i do a lot of custom auto stuff so the wiring was daunting but not something I understand since some of it is house electric and transformer setups. All in all i feel comortable doing my other machines now. I am only doing steppers on them but still some of if not all the same stuff should apply. Pics to follow tonite and more when i get the multi board and 5v and 24v power supplys.

krymis,

Thomas has a good site showing all facets of cnc'ing a RF-45, it would serve as a good guide and may generate a few ideas as you proceed in your project, you may have seen it.

http://imageevent.com/tppjr/rf45dovetailmill/cnc

Good clean installation!! See what you think, and by the way you use the pull down menu to navagate around the site.

Ron

no real progress since i have not received my multi card or power supply yet. But here are the mochup pics and everything is still subject to change on positioning.

after work today i came home to a 24v power supply, a 5and 12v power supply, and a multifunction board. with that i got the geckos all wired the 65v power supply wired, and hopefully tomorrow will be the finishing touch on the control box.

Krymis

Your moving right a long. Have you started the mechanical portions yet?

Any idea as to what your first projects will be? I also enjoy seeing what different folks enjoy making.

Good Work,
:banana: Ron

well i ordered my bobcad/cam v21 and as soon as that gets here i will have all the software. I got my license to mach yesterday. My first part will probablly be an adapter to put 4 coolant hoses on the spindle. After that may be i will start the fixture for my first production run. I am moving on to the mech. side f the retro once i get the control box all done.

I use BobCad My self (V17). I bought an extra seat where I could work from my laptop. I like the bearing cooler/flood coolant mod also. Did you check out that site from 2 or 3 post back? He has good work displayed there!!

You mentioned fixtures for your first production run, what are you thinking of producing? I'm also into minor production my self and trying to market my military/LE product. Google safestshot. I thing I like about the IH is the massive table. I can visualize putting 4 double 4 inch vises and using the Mach 3 fixture tables to repetative cut eight stations on some of my parts. First, I have to develop the market.

Ron

Yea i did. That is actually the one that i was going to make. I make different braketry for auto apps and i figured i can make a set of 14 at a time with the mill and fixture. I will be posting the build of that after the conversion.

i want to make the connections to my machine easily removable. I was thinking of using these on the front panel of the control box (http://www.l-com.com/productfamily.aspx?id=2423) and on the ends of the machine wires (both encoder wiring and motor wiring) and then adding a male to male d-sub adapter? Any thoughts on this? I want ease and versitility. I want the front panel to look nice and somewhat professinal.

Looks interesting, might be the ticket. What is the current capacity of the pins, just verify that they will handle your motor drive capacity.

As for me I used molex type connectors and I've seen where other use the microphone type connectors and then again others use the amphenol Mil spec. type connectors. I tend to stray away from the military styled connectors, reminds me of the days working for the govenment at the rocket ranch, instead of doing fun hobby stuff.

ron,

can you post what connectors you use and a pic or 2 of your control boxes?

Krymis,
I will try to get a couple of pic's, but for now Mouser part numbers 538-03-09-1061 and it's mate 538-03-09-2061, these are six pin connectors. They also have 9 pin and 12 pin connectors. These are the plastic plugs and receptacles. (these are $.52 and $.54 each)

You also order pins which are male 538-02-09-2103 (14-20 awg), and
female 538-02-09-1104 (the pins are $.10 each)

These can be used as panel mount and free hanging

Mouser page number 1133 of cat 627,

Well I'm off to work, I'll try to get pic's later this pm.

Ron

Here are the pic's. I included pictures of the plug and socket and how these connectors also serve as bulkhead connectors. You cut (mill) rectangular holes of the right size and the nylon ears lock them into place. These connectors also serve as the connectors from the chassis to your stepper or servo motors. You can also see the male and female pins. I trimmed the tangs on the pins and soldered my wires. If you look through JL123 thread that is current where he is cnc'ing a X3 he list a place where you can get a crimper for about $20.

This is one option.

Ron

ron do you have any contact info for the guy you linked to a page back? The one that made that coolant setup on the spindle. I want to get all the info on his setup that he has for control box and pendant control.

krymis,

This is his post, you can leave him a message or double click on his name and you can leave him a privite message or an email.

http://www.cnczone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=23648

ron,

the help is always appreciated. I hope i can get the guy to chime in wiht you on my build up. Well i got my bobcad/cam my mach and my turbocad up and running and encountered a total system failure on my computer. At this point i am frustrated and have not had time to move forward on the control box but i am not going to let the project stall. Tonite I am going to go to lowes and pick up the last of the bolts to bolt everything down. Then to radioshack to hopefully get the molex connectors for the front panel.

Anything I can help wiht will be my pleasure. Always good to give back. I could not have done what I have without this and many other groups made up of great people.

Thomas

thomas,

thanks for the post. I was looking at your coolant setup and wanted to know where did you get the system? was it peiced together or bought as a whole and motified? If it was bought as a whole where did you get it from? and if it was peiced together. Can i get all the info you have on your conversion? I want to know all i can.

can i run the servo setups through the molex connector with the encoder wires and everything else?

thomas,

thanks for the post. I was looking at your coolant setup and wanted to know where did you get the system? was it peiced together or bought as a whole and motified? If it was bought as a whole where did you get it from? and if it was peiced together. Can i get all the info you have on your conversion? I want to know all i can.

I was sure I bought the setup through enco, one of their $99 units but can't seem to find it now. But that is what I got. The skimmer I got from Skimpy at: http://www.skimpyoilskimmers.com/4436/23932.html I made the table top and manifold/bearing cooler/downstop/DRO adapter.

Pretty much all the info I have on the conversion is on the photopage. If you need more specifics, give me a buzz.

Thomas

thomas thank you what vfd do i need for a factory ih mill and were to get it?

thomas thank you what vfd do i need for a factory ih mill and were to get it?

Is the factory IH mill motor three phase? I do not think it is even 220 much less three phase which is what you need to run with a VFD. My RF motor is a two speed 220 three phase. I wired it to the VFD to the high speed windings. As stated on my photopages I got the VFD along with almost all of my switches and other goodies from Automation Direct.

Thomas

The stock motor is 220 volt, check the website.
Randy

The stock motor is 220 volt, check the website.
Randy


But not three phase. You need a three phase motor to run a VFD.

Your are correct!
Randy

How can i control the spindle speed from the mach program without a vfd?

Buy a VFD and 3 phase motor to control it. Of course you could use a contractor for on and off from MAch and you just change gears to set speed with your existing setup.
Randy

Of course you could use a contractor for on and off from MAch and you just change gears to set speed with your existing setup.
Randy


i am using a cnc4pc multi board. I can turn it on and off with this but i wanted to control the speeds from the computer. Any certain vfd and motor? And where should i get it?

In this thread or the last couple I posted sources for both of thesehttp://www.electricmotorwarehouse.com/metric_B5_Flange_mount.htm http://web1.automationdirect.com/adc/Shopping/Catalog/AC_Drives_-z-_Motors/GS2_(115_-z-_230_-z-_460_VAC_V-z-Hz_Control)/GS2-23P0
This are the sources to get the motors. This is the link we talked about them.

http://www.cnczone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=22853&page=2&pp=15

Randy

so i got so work done. I mounted the power supply, ran all the wires for it, zip tied them to the box, mounted the 24v powersupply for the fans, mounted the multi board, and mounted the 110v power terminals for the 3 power supplies, and mounted the 5v/12v power supply. the only thin really left to do is to run the wires to the multi board, and to the molex connectors. Can i run my motor power wires through the molex connectors?

krymis,

"Can i run my motor power wires through the molex connectors?"

Refresh my memory, and correct me if I am wrong. I think that you are powering a 2HP IH motor which is about say maybe 15-18 Amps of 120 AC or 8-9 amps of 220 (I guessing) and If you were planning to run those directly through the molex connectors, they would not hold up very long (eventhough I think that you can get a 14 Guage pin in a molex style connector).

If you wanted to control the turn on and off from your chassis, you would maybe want to send a control signal (say 24VAC to turn on a contactor switch (this is what turns on the outside power on the outside A/C unit, for example)). You would need heavyer contacts that the molex connectors. All of this is under the assumption that you are wanting to route the power directly through your chassis, and that you are not simply talking about control signals going to your motor.

I hope I understood your question correctly.

Ron

I think he his talking about axis drive motors(steppers of servos).
Randy

I think he his talking about axis drive motors(steppers of servos).
Randy

that is what i meant. I am sorry i get excitedand type faster than i think. I wanted to run the servo motor wiring through the molex. Any input?

mill is all torn down and way lapping is done....i am moving along at a slower pace than i would have liked.

Krymis
I think your doing great.
On the molex connectors I am not shure . I am running 3 amp stepper motors through them with no problem.
Randy

Krymis,
I was hoping that someone else would chime in. I don't know if you should run the servo feedback (the encoder out puts )through a separate connector to eliminate the possibility of feed back with the servo motor drive power. The encoder should be a differential outputs, which tends to greatly reduce the noise on the lines caused from the inductive coupling of the drive voltage.

So, let's see if you get any input from some of the guys that can let you know if this is a problem.

Ron

i really need to know how i should do this. This is kicking my ass on the connections. I feel i am doing great on the wire routing. I will post pics tonite when i get home.

The systems I have seen usually run the encoders through a different cable.

CAT5 LAN cable is cheap, readily available, and works well for this. Per Mariss, be sure you use the twisted pairs properly for success. Each signal must be paired with a ground for noise to cancel out. If you wire two signals on a pair, instead of a signal and its ground, you lose the noise immunity.

I describe why this works in my CNC Dictionary under "Twisted Pairs":

http://www.thewarfields.com/MTCNCDictTangentoWork.htm

So, if your motor wiring is in shielded cable, and the encoders are twisted pairs, that should provide pretty good isolation. You might also look into some ferrite beads if you discover noise is still a problem one you are up and running. This may be especially true with a VFD. I have a lot less information there, but have seen some threads here and there that you could probably search out.

You're making incredible progress. I am so jealous! :D

Best,

BW

here are the pics so far of the wires

Krymis, that looks good. I like mounting the Geckos on the heat sink material, and had gotten some myself off eBay for just that purpose. It looks like you have plenty of room there, but I have seen some systems save room by mounting that heatsink more vertically, or at a diagonal to vertical so you can access the connections better. You run the connections underneath the Geckos and it makes for a very neat installation:

http://www.thewarfields.com/img/Toys/MachineTools/LatheStuff/CNCConversion/Enclosures/GeckoRack.jpg

Best,

BW

Looks good!!!!!!!

that is a good idea bob. My biggest concern after i saw that on your site was that the connections would not be correct and difficult to get to if i needed to fix it. I have a ton of stuff to do, but it seems to be moving along.

just a simple note on the gecko's, the blue wire connector just slips straight up off of pins and returns just as easy !

Krymis
where ya been. Keep the updates comin.
Randy

randy,

just been swamped with powdercoating, chroming, and anodizing....plus i have a day job as a professor so its hectic. No new updates yet

i have not made many parts now however i have made my enclosure and cnc conversons and a throttle body. As soon as i get a chance i will post pictures.

Can't wait to see the throttle body!

Best,

BW

guys got a problem. I don't think i measured the ballscrews right. I had arron add a 2nd y spacer block to maximize the y travel ( http://www.industrialhobbies.com/howto/tips/maximizing_y_travel.htm ). I then just added new mounting screws and left the y ballscrew uncut. How should i take the measurement because the web instructions are not clear on this ( http://www.industrialhobbies.com/howto/product_instructions/v3_build_instructions/installing_y_axis_v3_pt2.htm ). It does not say where to move the parts to in the second step. I have the spacer blocks(2), the short ballscrew spacer, and the inside mount bracket all are on. Where to move them to do the measurement?

By the way this is my fault for not taking time like arron states in the first web instructions. Now the mill is all apart again. I looked cool and performed like it should have while up and running i just made a careless mistake. Although i did repackage the ballscrews again with none being lost.

I read it as put everything in place, as though you were going to bolt it tight. The ballscrew is going to be too long, and will prevent the assembly going together all the way. Measure the gap from the spacer to the frame of the machine, and subtract 1/8". The remainder is what you want to cut off the end of the ballscrew.

No?

With two spacers, there may not be a gap. I believe all this operation is intended to accomplish is proper clearance, and is not precision critical ('cause he used a tape measure and an abrasive cutoff saw!).

If you were able to bolt everything up and it works without interference, I'd say you are done.

Best,

BW

after conversing with arron for a few i found out that the measurement is for nothing more than to get the ball screw off the casting and for my setup we really would not have to do much to it. I can grind a little off the casting and then maybe take an 1/8 off the ballscrew. Problem solved.