Hi there,

Lately I've been getting extremely frustrated with my Sieg X1 and its weeny size. There have been many things that I haven't been able to do, because it won't fit on the machine, or the machine just doesn't have the power or rigidity required.

My latest project requires a fairly large steel surface to be faced. I need a good surface finish and an endmill is not really suitable (although may have to work at a push). I decided to go with a flycutter. Well, all I have done is test it out on a few small pieces, and I'm getting irritated again (I probably sound like a grumpy old man here...). I still need to fiddle around with feeds and speeds, but it is going to take ages. I have a strong feeling that the plastic gears are also in danger of breaking too.

Does anyone have any experience trying to do this type of thing on a small mill like the X1? At the moment, I feel like pushing the mill off the table (which I shouldn't be able to do, because milling machines should be too big and heavy...) :rolleyes: .

Regards
Warren

Warren,
I've found that the shape and sharpness of the cutter seems to affect the end result and effort required quite a lot when flycutting on these small machines. Although I have an X2 not an X1, I can swing a dia 4" flycutter over aluminium and take a 0.5 mm depth of cut in one pass. Never tried steel but I'd bet it would be more like a 0.15 mm pass to feel safe. If the cutter gets a built-up edge form on it, or blunts, I can take almost nothing. It works MUCH better if I spray the surface with WD40 or GT85 prior to the pass.
If you have tried these ideas already, I'm not sure what you can do. Maybe it will just take ages!

Hi there,

Thanks for the reply, LongRat. There are still a few things I need to try (like WD40), but an endmill is looking good at the moment. I am finding that the HSS tool doesn't last at all on steel. This is not the fault of the machine, but rather the tool material (I think). Besides that though, even when the tool is sharp, I can only take very small cuts at very slow feeds. I guess I need to start saving for a bigger machine...

Regards
Warren

Do you have the X and Y axis extension kit?
Get the Y at the very least if not. I did a lot to beef up my X1. Including replacing the plate that flexes on the base of the column, add a 1.5HP motor. You can flycut, but really need to take it easy. Keep a fairly small diameter cutting area going, and keep the tool sharp.
Uncoated HSS endmills are pretty crappy for steel. I don't do much steel, and I got a bunch of them free, so I use them. Next time, I am just going to buy them coated with something colorful.

Hi there,

I have the extended x and y axis kits on my mill along with a slightly over-sized vice. The 'bottom end' is quite sturdy. It's the 'top-end' and column that need work. The motor could do with being replaced and a belt drive would also be a nice upgrade. Instead of breaking those awful plastic gears, maybe the belt would just slip instead.

Most of the endmills that I use are from Arc Euro Trade and have a TiN coating. They look good with the gold finish, but I don't know if it really makes a difference. I'm sure it must do something (besides make them look pretty).

Regards
Warren

well the TiN makes for a very hard coating, makes endmills more suitable for steel. Uncoated HSS endmills don't last very long in steel. I will probably buy a set of carbide endmills, and it will probably be the last I buy for a very long time, as there is more or less no wear on them with the uses I have (primarily aluminum). And I dont feel bad pushing them hard into steel.

Oh, the flex you might be encountering is the joint where the column meets that little adapter plate to secure it onto the base. About 3mm of steel is keeping it there, huge amounts of flex.
I got a piece of 4140 prehard steel, .75" thick, and replaced this adapter plate. Also, I surface ground both sides to parallelism to within +/-.0002", so the mill is very well trammed. This cut flex 250%, I will link you to pictures when I get back from vacation.

i would try some different cutters the ones that i have seen from arceuro are not that good. you get what you pay for. i got some proper coated four flute mill from work with 60 hour cutting time i steel and they ripped up ally like butter. some my surgestion is cutters.

Hi there,

I have shelved the project that required the large steel lumps, as it just wasn't practical on my machine. I have done a fair amount of flycutting with aluminium though, and that is working well.

The cutters from Arc Euro Trade may not be the best cutters in the world, but for the price I don't think you can go far wrong. I haven't had any trouble with them up until now and with the low price, I am able to keep a good backup supply.

Regards
Warren

how would you say the x1 performs, i have just finished a router project which works well but i don't think is redged enough for ally work, I am interested in mainly machining ally and some steel though not a lot. the work is for rc cars and other little projects and looking to use the hobby cnc controller that i am running with my router to run the mill as well. (not at the same time of course.)

The motors are 200oz and the controller is max 3a unipolor. I was wondering if this was a suitable pairing, or would it require further investment?

Thanks matt

Hi Matt,

I have been very pleased with my X1. For some of the projects that I have taken on, it has been a bit small, but for parts for RC cars, I would say that it is more than adequate (although you may have trouble trying to fit a whole chassis on...).

I have worked mainly with alumnium, however I have done some quite big projects in steel and cast iron. You can't take huge cuts, but it will get the job done.

On my machine I am using 254 ozin steppers and a unipolar Xylotex board. This board has now been discontinued, but it uses the same driver chips as the HobbyCNC board (also 3A max). With this combination, along with standard leadscrews, I can get 1500mm/min rapids, which is quite good for this size machine. People have converted X1s using steppers with torque ratings as low as 120 ozin. I doubt these machines have 'eye-watering' performance, however they do work well. I would think that your proposed combination would work just fine.

If you do get an X1, try to get one with the extended X and Y axis kits (like the one that Arc Euro Trade sells). The extra travel is well worth having - very useful and adds some mass to the machine.

If you do plan on ever machining lots of large lumps of steel, then something a bit bigger than the X1 may be a better option, however if your parts are mainly aluminium and not very big then the X1 should be fine along with your 200 ozin motors and HobbyCNC board.

Regards
Warren

well the router was for the chassi plates so have got that covered as that would be carbon fiber.

I am thinking of going for the large table one from arc euro.
The question is what sort of depth of cut and speeds feed and tool sizes are you able to use successfully. Thanks matt

matt
iv'e had my x1 (machine mart) for about 3 yrs now cnc'd 2 yrs and its a good little machine. i would say a 10 mm cutter is the biggest you would want to use on a regular
basis but i have used a 40mm face mill in mine with no worries (just a bit of caution)
the thing with cnc is you can use a small cutter and lots of passes, i find that by running say a 6mm fc3 on a 1mm depth of cut @ 80 mm/min most jobs are a set up and come back later thing. running faster/bigger can create problems and scrap a job
therefore wasting time , you'll find thru experience the best settings for you, start slow/small and build
btw rapids of xxxx/xxx are a bit misleading just means it hits the table/clamps/vice harder
doing the usual mods (counter balance the head/belt drive/bigger table etc) is the way forward but this is a whole new hobby.
you should be able to buy the machine and cnc it for less than 500 quid and as you've
already got a router maybe a lot less.
mike