Hi. Could anyone tell me how effective cnc laser is for engraving glass. I dont know much about laser but was going to buy a manual kit for glass engraving.
I imagine that manual engraving is a delicate skill that will take a long time to become proficient at and would not be conducive to production therefore Im looking for alternatives. The engraving will be on single pane household window glass.

Would the STDK-4028 machine be suitable at the following link?

http://www.chinaoptronics.com/engraver.htm

Thankyou

:) I forgot to mention, I also wish to engrave mirrors....would the laser machine above be suitable for that?

Thanks.

.

Be careful and find out as much as you can about these lasers.
I was looking at buying one (not this manufacturer) then found it had no interlocks, so some major safety issues. There was no second optically safe laser for aligning the machine. You needed to do any alignment with the CO2 laser running. I'm sort of attached to my eyes and fingers and would like to keep things that way. The water cooling was a pond pump sitting in a bucket by the machine.
Get more information and ask specific questions.
Paul

Hey Diarmaid-
got your message from the other thread...

I have one of these little 40w machines from China.
I got mine from here:
http://www.iehk.net/Products/IE300.html
though something similar is sold from here:
http://www.hxlaser.com/en/products/chapter.htm

-
What paulC says is true. There are few safety features.

But, will it work for glass? I just went out to my garage and put a piece of glass in it and tried. Came out pretty good. I did put on 3 pair of saftey glasses (really) because I like my eyes, too. But I am also a bit of a calculated risk taker.

Will it work for mirrors? Hmmm. I certainly would NOT try a front surface mirror, as I wouldn't want to redirect the beam...But I back surface mirror? I dunno. It just might work.

Ask lots of questions and be sure that the company you buy from can answer them in a way you feel comfortable with.

And yeah, the water cooling really is from a pond pump! But it works and is easily replaced...

And as for alignment, you can always start with paper. Once things are cutting where you expect, then just put your glass down on top of the paper. Align. And then engrave on glass. Not elegant, but it works.

Steve

Oh yeah...

What depth are you trying to engrave to? I was able to clearly read my name that I engraved in the glass, but it was shallow. I could feel it, but I would have no way of measuring the depth.

I have felt engraved wine bottles and those were MUCH deeper.

Later, after work, I can try to tell you what the laser was outputting at. Perhaps if I give it more juice, it will go a little deeper...

Steve

Thanks steve. I'll check those two links. Im not sure about depth, Im only trying to cost suitable equipment at the moment. Once it will engrave decorative pictures that can be clearly seen I'll be happy.

Hi Steve,
I visited your link in the other thread for the the InkExpress IE300 engraver you bought.
On their site it says: "Engraving material size: 200 x 100 x 80mm (8" x 4" x 3.2" inches) / 300 x 200 x 5mm (12" x 8" x 0.2" inches)"

Can you confirm that material 300x200 can be engraved ok with it?

Thanks.

Hello Diarmaid,

Sorry for the delay...that pesky job thing...

So, I tried to locate a tape measure, but only found an 8.5"x11" sheet of paper. I laid that down in the machine and it fit with room to spare. However, it doesn't look like that whole area is engraveable area.

I am willing to do 2 things for ya:
if you send me a file (bmp or jpg), I will try to find a sheet of glass and engrave it for you with your image, then I can send you a picture of it.
I will also try to determine the actual engraving area and the maximum size piece that will fit in the bed of the device.

Hi Diarmaid

I´ve already engraved images & text on glass and also in mirror.

On plain glass you have to place a layer of wet newspapper for optimal results and less reflection of the beam.

You can engrave in the back of the mirror, but you have to try on several mirrors because they are not all the same, so you have to find one with the back layer as thin and regular as possible, then try engraving at many settings to find the depth you want to engrave on that layer.
I never tried to engrave on top surface but i dont think it´s advisible due to the risk it may carry.

Sure would like to see some pics of what you all have engraved. Thanks, Paul

Thanks steve,
I dont think theres any need for you to go to the trouble of trying an engraving for me after Pedro's message, but the offer is much appreciated.
If you can determine the max engraving area and size of piece to fit in though, please post it here for us/me to see.

Im going to change the name of this thread to 'Post your Engraving Pictures', might start an interesting show. :)

Hey Diarmaid-
What paulC says is true. There are few safety features.

But, will it work for glass? I just went out to my garage and put a piece of glass in it and tried. Came out pretty good. I did put on 3 pair of saftey glasses (really) because I like my eyes, too. But I am also a bit of a calculated risk taker.
Steve

Steve, regular safety glasses will not protect your eyes. You must have a special pair that filters out the CO2 beam wavelength, even these might not stop a direct exposure to the beam.
Dean

Thanks Dean -

That is a VERY good point and something we all need to remember. These lasers are NOT just another toy in the shop.

Consider these on order!

Thanks again,

Steve

Hi again steve,
Any info yet on the max engraving size? Thanks. :-)

Hi Diarmaid-

The bed dimensions are large enough to allow an 8.5x11 sheet of paper fit in with room to spare. The cutting area, however is a little smaller. 10" x 8.6"

Hopefully you can see the red lines that I have added to the attached photo.

Basically, you get full use of the Y dimension, but X doesn't go all the way to the right.

Steve

I gather that this machine is not capable of doing engraving on round obects?? Does anyone have any pics of what they have been able to engrave??

I'm getting ready to order one of these IE300 laser engravers. The only reason I'm ordering it from Ink Express is the fact that they are located in Hong Kong rather than mainland China. I've been to Hong Kong a few times, and even though the companies there sell mostly products made in China, they are a little more in tune with western business practices, and are sometimes easier to comunicate with. Thats the hope anyway.
A few years ago I owned GCC Mercury 25 watt full sized laser engraver, and I have to say it was a nice machine and I enjoyed working with. But I'm a lousy business person, and I had to give it up for lack of funds. I'm one of these guys who becomes excited about the technology and capability of equipment, but who hasn't a clue about making money with it. My little garage shop has a mini lathe, a drill/mill, grinders, polishing wheels, etc. So it seems if I'm not going to make any money with my equipment, I might as well have a laser to go with my other money making (NOT) machines.
My experience with Chinese tools, is that most of them have the ability to be really pretty good. You just have to take the time to set them up properly. My mini lathe for example is rated at an accuracy of plus or minus .005", but I can get accuracy to plus or minus .001 if I take my time. My point is that if you set these machines up properly, they can often do quite good work.
The reason I relate my experience with Chinese machine tools here, is because I think (at least I hope) that the same rules may apply to their little laser engraver. Now, My GCC unit that I had cost about $25,000. a few years ago. But Ink Express has quoted me a price of $999., plus about $270. for Fed Ex Air shipment, for a total of less than $1300., and up until I found this equipment on the web, the least expensive unit I could find was about $5,000. for a table top model. And that unit wouldn't do vector jobs, only bitmap raster mode.
Ink Express has told me that their unit is a little faster and more versital that the "Rabbit" the other guys are selling for $850. plus shipping form China. I hope thats the case, and I really hope that it does vector paths. But for $1,300. I'll be pleased as punch if it works as well as I think it will, after a little setup and tweaking. And for that price, when my wife asks me how much it cost, I can look her in the eye and tell her that it cost less than 10% of the price I paid for the car I bought her for Christmas.
I know I got a little carried away with my explanations above, so please forgive me. And please, if anyone has had experience with this company and this particular desktop laser unit, please let me hear about your experiences with them. Thanks in advance for your feedback!
SMPARKINSON

Hi all,

Thanks steve. Those measurements should be fine for me initially so I think I'll go with one of these. I won't be buying for a few months so plenty of time to get feedback on its performance. Please keep us updated, especially if you can post pics of engravings. If you could keep us updated aswell smparkinson it would be much appreciated. Sounds like a good excuse to give to my better half aswell! ;)
Does anyone know if this machine can be hooked up to run PhotoVCarve as seen at http://www.vectric.com/ ?
Viper, do you mean 'round' as in 'spherical', or as in flat and 'circular'. It doesnt look like it can carve sphere's/cylinders such as wine glasses. Can someone clarify its capabilities....steve...? Thankyou.
l8rs.

Steve,
Hi again. Is there any chance I can take you up on your earlier offer to send you an image to see if it engraves on pane glass for me? If not its ok, Im just a bit worried about the quality with the engravers 40w power so it'd be good to actually see. I've attached a quick pic I drew up here. If you cant save it ok, I can e-mail it to you, let me know.
Thanks.

Diarmaid - I'd be happy to test out an image on glass for you. I suppose you can send it as an attachment to a reply right here. Or, if you have a place to put it on the web, just send me a link.

SMPARKINSON -
I know what you are saying about the quality vs. cost of tools. I also own a mini-lathe and a small mill. And the fact is that if one is willing to do some work, the tolerances on the machines can be made easonably good and thus make these machines an excelent value.

I've also made a small cnc router/mill thing and enjoy it. Then one day I stumbled across a link for the VersaLaser and thought "COOL!" Then I looked at the price and realized that it was out of my price range.

So, in looking for options, I found Ink Express and their IE300.

Before I purchased, I download the manuals from their website.
http://iehk.net/downlord.html
IE300_MANUAL.pdf
IE300_software_manual.pdf
AQUA_ie300.pdf

Now, please read this part carefully. What really sold me on it was the APPARENT versatility. According to one of the manuals, their software can support raster based images such as bmp and jpg. It also says it supports .PLT files which are a vector format. In addition, according to the hardware manual, the laser engraver should be able to "print" (or perhaps "plot" is a better word) from windows program by installing and configuring a printer driver.

The .PLT support is less than ideal and it is not possible to operate the laser engraver without their software.

The fact is, that the .PLT "support" is really just a vector to pixel conversion. This is problematic in that if you have a properly dimensioned DXF or pick you CAD flavor, the converted bmp will not necessarily have the correct dimensions. In addition, the scaling required to create the desired piece, my increase the size of the pixelation, thus exagerating the problem.

But it wasn't my intention to use their software to control the machine. My intention was to install a printer or plotter driver and "plot" from CAD. First, I followed the instructions in the manual. Then I contacted Ink Express. The condensed version of their responses to my emails:
You can NOT "plot" straight from CAD.
You can't use a printer driver. This option does not work.
You must use the included software to control device.

I have spent many evenings the past several weeks trying to get the engraver to operate without the software. I could go on and on. I have tried so many plotter drivers. I have downloaded parallel port monitors and have tried to figure out the signal that the engraver is getting from the port. I've opened the software in hex editors and tried to trace it.

Bottom line is that the device is controlled directly by the software. There is no driver. This means that the only way that the device is going to get a signal that it understands is through their software.

The story does get brighter. By opening one of the help files, I did find the website of the software developer. It is completely in Chinese. I noticed what appeared to be a link, so I right clicked and it turned out to be an email address. So I sent the developer an email. The response I got was that he could make a driver for it that could interpret HP-GL so that you could plot out .PLT files. But, it would cost. And either me or the factory or somebody has to pay.

I can understand his desire to get paid. That seems fair. But, I feel that I already paid for a device that I thought would do what I needed - which is cut vectors.

I did ask him if he would send me the name of a contact at the factory so I can send an email and find out what it would take for the factory to turn around and request the software guy to develop a driver.

Once I have all 3 email addresses, (Ink Express, Software Dev and Factory) I might even ask you to send an email, explaining that vector cutting is important and that cutting from windows based programs like AutoCAD is an easy way to add value to an inexpensive machine.

To be fair, their software is easy to learn. And, if the goal is to engrave or cut from BMPs and JPGs, then their machine really does work pretty well.

As it is now, it is a fun toy. If I can get it to cut vectors, then it will become a very valuable tool.

For the record, I don't mean to vent or beat a dead horse. But I would not have bought the thing if I had known that I there would be no way to do what I need it to do.

If you have any specific questions about the device or the software, please do not hesitate to ask.

Steve

Hi SIDI STEVE,
Yesterday I emailed Ink Express with a few questions before I place my order. Their sales rep, David Chan, informs me that the actual engraving area is about 8" x 4", if I use material that is thicker than 0.2". I don't understand why the thickness of material should make a difference in the aera which can be engraved, but since you have one of these machines, maybe you can explain it to me.
He also informed me that the machine can operate in vector mode, although he didn't elaborate at all. I'm hoping that they have improved their software to provide this capability. If so, I'm sure they would make upgraded software available to their customers. He also informed me that this is the "3rd generation" mini laser which is faster and more stable than earlier machines.
I'm not a real machine guy, and have no experience with any of the CAD programs. When I had my GCC Mercury engraver, I used Corel Draw and found it to work well. I was already familiar with Corel from using it to produce sublimation and ink jet transfers for coffee mugs and tee shirts, so I was happy that it worked out for me that way.

Anyway, if the IE300 cuts vector for me I'll be a very happy camper. If it doesn't I'll still have fun with it, and who knows, maybe I'll even be able to make some money with it. If so, I will definately be on the road to buying one of their larger format machines in the future.
David also informed me that they would ship within 7 days of receiving payment, so maybe in a couple of weeks I'll have a new tool to play with.

I know you said you really wanted to have the vector capability, and I was just curious. What type of projects do use it for now, and what will you use it for if you can cut vectors with it? I know it's none of my business, but like I said, I am always wondering what other people do with their equipment.

Thanks steve. I've added the image in as an attachment to my above post. (Easier reference for people reading l8r)

SMPARKINSON -
Howdy - I have attached another pic. The red area is the large area that can handle up to about .25" maximum thickness material. The blue lines in the pic show where there is a deeper recess that can hold a MUCH thicker piece of material, up to several inches thick. Make sense?
I like to just play with CAD or 3d programs and then cut them out. Particularly gears..
http://www.geocities.com/sidi_steve/NewPix/picView.html
http://www.crankorgan.com/michelclock1.jpg

Hopefully, I can start making some smaller plastic pieces..less kerf and less movement...maybe

Diarmaid -
Hopefully before work tomorrow I can try engraving your image. I have removed the blue and desaturated what was left. It will be interesting for me to see how their program deals with this. I have little experience with engraving, we'll see how it goes.

Steve

Steve, regular safety glasses will not protect your eyes. You must have a special pair that filters out the CO2 beam wavelength, even these might not stop a direct exposure to the beam.
Dean

Actually normal shop glasses will protect your eyes because acrylic/perspex etc are totally aborbing to 10.6um radiation from a CO2 laser. Most of the goggles sold on ebay as CO2 laser goggles are just a scam.

Graham

Thanks Steve! After I asked about engraving area, I took another look at the pics on the IE site, and kind of figured out about the deeper recess for thicker material. So if I undertand this, I'm guessing about 8" x 11" more or less for materials, and about 4" x 8" for material thicker than .25". If thats the case, that will work fine for me as I will be primarily working with thin material anyway, but the ability to cut thicker material is a definate bonus.
By the way, does your software support a "stepped" feature for making rubber stamps? I never did stamps when I had my GCC Mercury unit, but the guys I bought it from were always pushing me to give it a try. They said that it was a good money maker, so maybe I'll give it a try with the IE300. It really doesn't sound very interesting to me, but if I can get the equipment to provide some income, I have to give it a try. Art rubber stamps are big around here.

SMPARKINSON -
Howdy - I have attached another pic. The red area is the large area that can handle up to about .25" maximum thickness material. The blue lines in the pic show where there is a deeper recess that can hold a MUCH thicker piece of material, up to several inches thick. Make sense?
I like to just play with CAD or 3d programs and then cut them out. Particularly gears..
http://www.geocities.com/sidi_steve/NewPix/picView.html
http://www.crankorgan.com/michelclock1.jpg

Hopefully, I can start making some smaller plastic pieces..less kerf and less movement...maybe

Diarmaid -
Hopefully before work tomorrow I can try engraving your image. I have removed the blue and desaturated what was left. It will be interesting for me to see how their program deals with this. I have little experience with engraving, we'll see how it goes.

Steve

Diarmaid -
Well, I can say that it works. Apparently, the glass gets hot, because it broke. But it could just be the glass that I used. I will try to send pic after work.

SMPARKINSON -
I am not sure what you mean by stepped feature...I'll look around some more. But, there is a choice of either either "convex" or "cave" which seems to toggle whether it will cut where your design is black or cut where your design is white (thus leaving the black) And there is a check box to flip the image. So, I do think one could make rubber stamps with it.

Diarmaid -
You asked in a previous post -
"Does anyone know if this machine can be hooked up to run PhotoVCarve as seen at http://www.vectric.com/ ?"
This is one of the sad things about this machine/software. So, I will reiterate what my challenge has been since I got mine:
Their laser engraver ONLY runs with their software.
-AND-
Their software ONLY supports bmp and jpg.

I will say again, that for quick and easy engraving of BMP and JPG, their software works well and the laser is a hoot.

But if you want to play with vectors (and the precision that vectors allow for) this machine isn't set up to handle that.

I do like the machine and may rip out the motion control components. I have a basic plotter that understands HP-GL and that could easily drive this machine. I also have a CNC board laying around, so I could drive it with gcode. Either option is viable.

Steve

Good Day Steve! You're the Expert!

Does this machine engrave small enough like letters around 1mm-2mm in size? :cheers:

Thanks Steve. I've been looking forward to seeing how it turned out. Sorry about the breakage, hope there were no injuries or damage. Was the glass very cold when you started?

lol...looks like your cnczone's resident IE300 specialist! ;) Ever consider consultancy...I hear they charge €1000 a day!! :)

Hi, Steve, thanks for valuable posts about ie300.

Q: Is it possible to control depth of engraving/cut ? Any possibility to control width of the beam (focusing/defocusing) ? Laser power output - is it controllable ?

And, most impotant thing - how it does with thin metal (kinda thick folie, or PCB plain board - can it cut it ?)

Thanks a lot.
Eugene.

Oh great... Steve left for the 1000euro per day job...

lol.....hmmm, I'm sure he'll post that pic, keep the faith......steve.....steve.....are you still there.....ermm....???..... ;)

Hey Gang!

Sorry about the delay...The gal and I left for a wekeend away at the coast. Gotta keep her happy too!

The pic...hopefully will get snapped today, posted after work.

Depth seems to be controlled by power and or multiple passes. I am still experimenting with materials. I have not yet purchased balsa, but I have played with some woods. I cannot cut thru 1/4" wood in single pass, at any power. But I can get thru it, with a few passes.

Power is controlled with a knob. Turn to the right = more power.

There is no control of focus - The focal length is fixed

More soon - I just got in and now off to work...

!

Hi Sidi Steve,

In my previous posts I was thinking about getting the Ink Express 300 laser engraver, and I am still thinking about it. However, I have since found another desk top machine that is sold by RED SAIL TECHNOLOGY COMPANY, out of China with a rep in Canada.
Their Laser Engraver model RS3040A with Easycut software looks similar to the other company's mini lasers, except that the photo of the unit seems to show what looks like
4 "jog" keys. My GCC Mercury machine had that, as do most other laser and rotory engraving machines that I am familiar with. These were useful for setting relative home positions and other functions as well, and would seem to be worth considering when deciding which machine to choose. I emailed an enquiry to the company and they got back to me with email attatchments that wouldn't open, so I still don't know price and more in depth info not included on their site.
Has anybody heard of these guys, or have any knowledge of their lasers? Please let me know if I should consider this company's products.
Thanks in advance for your help!
smparkinson

PS-My only laser experience was with my GCC Mercury laser engraver about 5 years ago, and that machine had no provision or need for water cooling. I don't remember ever even hearing about water cooled co2 lasers back than. Are all laser engravers water cooled now? Forgive my ignorance, but I guess like everything else, lasers have continued to improve and change since I last had one. Again, thanks in advance for your help and information.

I suppose since I started this thread I have a duty to reply to you....:D

I'll look at that machine for sure, can you post the web address? Thanks.

Im only new to all this so I dont know about the water cooling, sorry. You should ask sidi-steve, he's our resident laser consultant! ;)

Here's the link. They also sell plotters and other laser engravers/cutters.
http://www.hflaser.com/index.html
Thanks for your help!

Hi all, I've come back with some useful information. I contacted hflaser by e-mail and this is what I got back:

Dear Diarmaid,
With pleasure to receive your inquiry about our laser engravers.
We are specialized in this line for more than 9 years, our products
are sold world wide.
The answers are as follows:
1) Q: What is the maximum cutting area?
A: 280mm * 400mm
2) Q: What is the max thickness that will fit into the machine to be cut?
A: RS3040A has Up and down plate which is 65mm Adjustable, so you
can put the stuff which is less than 60 mm inside for engraving.
RS3040A can cut Acrylic Board in 3 mm, and engrave stuff in 60mm.
3) Q: How much is does this machine cost?
A: The FOB price from China is 1990.00 USD
We can dispatch the goods by air or by sea. We can calculate the
shipping cost for you if you make a decision.
Please do not hesitate to contact with us if you have any questions.
I expect to have a great cooperation with you in the future.
Look forward to hearing from you soon
Best regards,
Leo Shi
Redsail Tech Co.,Ltd (Canada)

Im certainly going to look into this more. For a few hundred $ more its a fair bit bigger cutting area and will allow nearly the same thickness

Hope this helps, did you get any reply to your e-mail yet?
Any chance of the pic of that glass engraving when you get a chance steve? Thanks. :)

Im gonna post a new thread to see if anyone has used one of these.

Sorry - my connection was down...

Thats great steve, thanks a million, I've just been looking at them both now for a while. I have whats probably a really basic question if you dont mind, did the laser frost the white part or cut out the black bird and surroundings?
If it frosted the white then I probably should have inverted the pic or drawn in a lighter shade than the background but I suppose I'll learn all this when I have my own.

Thanks again. :D

3) Q: How much is does this machine cost?
A: The FOB price from China is 1990.00 USD


Just a quick question about my own post above!! What does FOB stand for? :withstupi

Arrrg.....I should have stopped and thought before typing but here's my 3rd post in about 30sec (chair) !! Sorry.
1) Steve, how big is that engraving on the pane of glass? If I remember correctly I drew it about 4x4 inches.

2)Steve or anyone who can answer, if you put wet newspaper on or under the glass would it have prevented the breakage?

3) How long did it take to cut?

Hi Diarmaid,

I should have included some explanations with the pics...

I'll start by saying that this was my first foray into the world of glass engraving. Like most things, there are probably a whole host of things that one learns known as "tricks of the trade" that I am still clueless about.

It takes several minutes to engrave something like this. I didn't time it and I shut off the engraver when the glass broke.

There are options when one engraves, to either etch when the pic is black and leave the white or etch when the pic is white and leave the black. In this case, it was the white part that got etched.

You image was resized to fit an already small piece of glass. The square was roughly 1.65"x1.65"

If I were to continue with etching experiments, I would likely try to engrave the next pic. The background is a ramped grayscale. It would be interesting to see where the laser goes on. But, I believe that that a grayscale is not well represented with an engraver. At some point, the laser will be on and below that, the laser is off... With this particular engraver, it really seems to be a binary system. So the experiment with a gray scale would be to see at what value of gray does the laser come on.

For best results, I would likely start with a picture that looks good represented with only black or white pixels.

I am not certain the purpose of the damp paper...

FOB - Free On Board

A trade term requiring the seller to deliver goods on board a vessel designated by the buyer. The seller fulfills his obligations to deliver when the goods have passed over the ship's rail.

When used in trade terms, the word "free" means the seller has an obligation to deliver goods to a named place for transfer to a carrier.

Originally Posted by diarmaid
3) Q: How much is does this machine cost?
A: The FOB price from China is 1990.00 USD


Just a quick question about my own post above!! What does FOB stand for?

FREIGHT ON BILL!!

Hi Diarmaid
On plain glass you have to place a layer of wet newspapper for optimal results and less reflection of the beam.


Hi again Steve, firstly thanks a million again. At least now I know that this laser will definately do what I will want :D , and thats a pretty small piece of glass you engraved so on larger pics the detail should be quite good. I was wondering why it looked kinda 'bubbly' but if Im correct its just because its small and zoomed in. If you dont mind one more question steve, Im sure your head must be melted at this stage!! :tired: ---

1) What software do you use to run the machine and whats the procedure?
2) Is the software included with the machine?
3) Do you run it off a regular Windows based P.C ?

...ok...technically thats 3 questions ;) .... but you are a fantastic help.... Thankyou.

See PedroS post No.10 above. Thats why I mentioned the damp paper. Also thought that wet newspaper might have helped keep the glass cool and prevent the breakage.

jhowelb, thanks for the info, I've received an e-mail from them since with the details, but do you operate and/or own one of these? Please see this thread:
http://www.cnczone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=20872

are there any cost added to the price upon entering the country? Ie. customs? and did they say how much shipping would be (even a guess would be cool)?

.
3) Q: How much is does this machine cost?
A: The FOB price from China is 1990.00 USD
We can dispatch the goods by air or by sea. We can calculate the
shipping cost for you if you make a decision.
Please do not hesitate to contact with us if you have any questions.
I expect to have a great cooperation with you in the future.
Look forward to hearing from you soon
Best regards,
Leo Shi
Redsail Tech Co.,Ltd (Canada)[/I]


Dont know about the USA, but bringing this to Ireland I would have to add 21%VAT and about 5% import duty onto the price if that helps.

See my quote above from my post No.40 with info they e-mailed me. Im not buying yet so I didn't get back onto them about shipping.

You do know that the $1990 is for the other engraver and not the IE300 that most of this thread has talked about, and which did the previous photos on the glass?

In post No. 19 smparkinson says about the IE300: ."Ink Express has quoted me a price of $999., plus about $270. for Fed Ex Air shipment".

The IE300 laser engraver ONLY works with their included software. The software is called MoshiDraw by MoshiSoft. It ONLY runs on a windows PC.

The software will accept bmp and jpeg and a couple other pixel based image formats. It will also accept PLT file and convert that to BMP. So, you bring in your image and size it the way you want. Then you go to the output screen. At that point, the software takes direct control of the engraver. (In that regard, it is very different from a plotter or printer, which use a driver to output data to the device) You can position the drawing on your screen which moves the head around on the engraver. Once things are where you want them, you press an "output" button which launches a dialogue box. Click on some buttons and the software prepares the image for output. Once it is prepared, it will ask if you want to begin output. Click on yes, and the laser is off to the races.

If what you are doing is engraving, then it is rather easy.

For me, it is a bit distressing that one can ONLY operate the engraver via the software. And it would be nice if Ink Express or Moshi would help me cut vectors from DOS or via a driver, since the MANUAL says it works.

So far, I haven't even gotten an apology from them. I feel kinda burned since I am spending time sharing info with their prospective customers - trying to give fair and unbiased info.

For what it's worth, I am nearing the stage where I will have to rip apart my engraver and put in a motion control card that I can control. This will mean no more engraving tests as I will no longer be using their software. I just want to cut vectors.

It would be cool if some people were willing to write emails to:

ink-express@hotmail.com
and
moshi@moshisoft.com

saying that they are interested in the IE300. You can tell them about me. I am not asking for anything that isn't in the manual. I just want to output HP-GL files (.PLT from DOS) the same as I would a plotter.

If you mention me (sidi_steve , aka. laserbeam-steve), you can say that I have been giving fair and (relatively) unbiased info and trying very hard to not slander them in any way.

I like my IE300, I just wish it could do what the MANUAL says it can do. I want them to stand behind their product. I did read the manual BEFORE I bought it and made my decision based on the fact that one could OUTPUT from DOS.

Maybe if they heard from more people than just me, it might inspire them to act responsibly.

I would not want to discourage anyone from buying from them, but it would be nice for all of us to know that they are willing to stand behind their product and make it do what it says.

Thanks

Steve

Steve,
1) Thankyou for all the help and advice.

2) The laser does sound suitable for my intended use and I wouldn't have known that without your unbiased opinions, so regardless of the manufacturers, I very much appreciate your help.

3)I have P.M.'d you.

L8rs.

Hi steve, I looked at VersaLaser and....wow! I want one!....but it'd take half my startup budget to buy it :( I like the fact that its a nice established company with western offices and what looks like an established reputation and probably good customer service and an excellent machine. But can I afford to pay an extra $10k to get that customer service...no I'm afraid not...but definately being filed under 'Laser Upgrade' for two or three years down the line. The more I learn about lasers though the more important it seems to me that I get one, and the cost is being deflected a bit by other tools I wont need to buy because lasers are so versatile. (Wood burning tools, manual glass etching eqpt etc). I think your right about these small inexpensive laser systems though, as an introduction for the person with a small budget they are excellent. I suppose the service quality, and possibly length of life of the machine is what we sacrifice.

The RedSail Laser is based in Canada...so that might be a bit easier to deal with aswell...

(PS: Im kinda in between homes & jobs at the moment so not really located anywhere! ;) Kildare originally. )

I did a quick search on e-bay and all laser engravers are 25W instead of 40W. Im not sure what difference this makes, does it mean they are less powerful and capable because of this?

I ask because they are all around the $10,000 mark....why are they $10k and only 25W when the likes of the IE300 and RS3040A are around $1.5k....is this simply the cost difference we mentioned above or are there extra features that account for 8/10ths of the price?

Sorry for the delay.

The damp paper is recommended by GCC mainly to prevent reflection of the laser beam because it could damage the laser lens and if there's less undesirable reflection the engraved area doesn´t becomes so blurry.

Hope i'll get you some pics of an engraved mirror i've made when i started working on laser engraving.

Not all of laser engravers have water cooling ; I work on a GCC Laser Pro 25 W , and it doesn´t have water cooling , it has air assist on the lens carriage but it has Auto-Focusing Probe :)

hey has anyone used these machines to engrave on chrome or polished aluminum?

If so what steps do you have to do the make it work? ie cover with paper, lamp black or what not.

How many watts would you need to cut tin foil type thickness in metal? (don't answer unless you done this, as I realy don't need speculation)

Also Sid_steve when you engraved the mirror/glass for Dairmaid did you run the laser over the whole surface or just on the features?

if you ran it over the whole features, why? and will it let you just engrave on the image itself?

edit: i looked at the image more thuroughly and I see that it was run as a negative image. Can you run it as a positve image where just the bird and leaves are engraved?

Hey steve, when you have time visit this link and scroll down to the second set of pictures to see one of many things Im planning to do with the laser. http://www.cnczone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=20844

Steve, regular safety glasses will not protect your eyes. You must have a special pair that filters out the CO2 beam wavelength, even these might not stop a direct exposure to the beam.
Dean

Not true!

regular plastic is 95% opaque to the CO2 wavelength. A YAG laser on the other hand needs special glasses.

They do sell glasses specificaly made for the CO2 laser, and if you want to be sure and have some accountability for accidents then buy the one designed for the wavelength in question.

I wish we could combine this thread with the thread at the link below:

http://www.cnczone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=14100

Hi,
I am working for a non-profit organization. We are staring a commemorative brick program as a fundraiser. There are a bunch of companies that privide the laser marked brick as a service. Since this is a fairly large project we are looking into getting our own laser marker and marking our own bricks. The IE3000 is the only reasonable laser marker I have found. The bricks would be 4"X8" - 2 1/2?" deep. We would also like to do 8"X8" bricks.
Can this be used for this purpose? If not can anyone advise what can be used?
Thanks

i think the ability to engrave any material depends on the absorption rate of the material, we engrave on just about anything, however the laser we use is a production 2000w laser, i have heard of etching on mirrors without any special considerations as for beam reflection. actually the only material that has ever reflected a beam, was copper. which is very difficult to cut

Hey, I use a LaserPro ingraver at work from time to time. It has a clear cover that is suposed to filter the laser radiation out. Does anyone know how well this sort of thing works? Should we be taking extra precaution?

Hi,

I own a HX40A from hxlaser. I have read that the engraving area is about 8.5" x 11". But in my case I cannot engrave more tha the half of this area. The head stops at the middle of the X axis. I attach some images in order to be more clear. As you can see at these images the head cannot move more towards left. I have made an image with my engraving area in a red rectangle.
Any ideas?

hi Venton,

Have you try moving the engraving head by hand and see if it can move smoothly on the whole axis - to check if it is jammed.

If the movement by hand is smooth, then check the software limits.

Another thing is that you can try to engave a line on the affected axis, if it works or not. If it works you may have a faulty program.

Make sure you have switch off the machine before moving the head for safety reasons.

The above are suggestions from my machine service point of view.

Any way i just bought a WK40 from wklaser in china for my hobby, it is nice to deal with them - expected to receive it in 2 weeks.

Hi,

Thanx for the reply.
Yes I have tried to move the head while the machine is turned off and the head is moving ok . Then I tried the configuration in the software but in vain. The truth is that when I turn on the machine the head is moving at the upper right corner. The upper right corner is outside the engraving area as you can see at the pictures I have already sent. Maybe the engraving area is not at the correct position !!!
Any ideas?

Vanton;
My guess is one or two of the home sensors are not working...

Here are some possible problem areas to check:

1. Find out were home sensors are and make sure the flag is passing cleanly through the sensor slot. They should be mounted in the direct path of the X & Y rails. You can find them back tracing the electrical wires/cables in the general vicinity.

2. If the flags look good, then take a look at the microcontroller board and see if all the connectors are properly seated. They should be firmly in place. This is a good thing to check, no mater what.

3. If none of those work let me know, and we can do some experiments to figure out what’s going on.

Hi,

I own a HX40A from hxlaser. I have read that the engraving area is about 8.5" x 11". But in my case I cannot engrave more tha the half of this area. The head stops at the middle of the X axis. I attach some images in order to be more clear. As you can see at these images the head cannot move more towards left. I have made an image with my engraving area in a red rectangle.
Any ideas?

I've recently tested same machine you have, and with same problem ...
after you turn on the machine it moves to upper right corner, and with software movement you can pust it to middle and not an mm to left ... which is 0,0 coordinates in software ...

Solution is quite stupid, but it worked and I've get whole working area available ... when you turn on machine, wait a little to position itself in upper right corner, then push it by hand to upper left corner, then in software order it to go to X0,Y0 ... the machine will try to go further but can't .... after that you have available whole working area ...

don't know is there is some fix about this problem, but for cheap machine like this one, you can't expect to everything be smooth and problem free ;)

Yes I have tried this and it is working if you can be accurate enaough moving the head by hand. This is a workaround (thanx turpija) but I dont think this machine is designed to work this way !!? Is there anyone who has achieved to use the full working area with this machine? Do you think that the "solution" described by turpija may damage the machine? I will also try the instructions from ServoGuy.

Yes I have tried this and it is working if you can be accurate enaough moving the head by hand. This is a workaround (thanx turpija) but I dont think this machine is designed to work this way !!? Is there anyone who has achieved to use the full working area with this machine? Do you think that the "solution" described by turpija may damage the machine? I will also try the instructions from ServoGuy.

It probably isn't designed to have issues ... but I didn't search around for some software pathches of firmaware upgrades that might solve this problem ... which technically isnt's a problem at all, it's just limitations of software ... so It shouldn't be too big fix to make ... but considering the price, it's still ok ;)

I also tried the suggestions made by ServoGuy. All cables are connected ok but the problem insists. Maybe there is a firmware update somewhere, I ll take a look and I ll keep you informed.

Hi To all

I just read your posts here and I will try to help, I have RS3040A laser machine from redsail.

vanton , turpija:

I downloaded you machine software and it worked once and never worked any more so I didn't had the chance to take a good look on it, it must have a function to adjust the home position and working area like the attached pict.

If you can't find this function you can modify the setting by another method,
You will find a file on the software folder (NS12Engrave.ini), open it with notepad and search for the following lines

[Jinan HengXing\HX40A]
ID = -641386941, -329260656, 844859719, -575237427
TL = 33,150
WH = 100,150
SP1 = SP0;
SP2 = SP1;

Modify the following line
WH = 100,150

To the new working area
WH = 200,220

Save & close the file, then try to send a big file.

Tell me about the result.

Thank you for the post but it hasn't solved the problem. Whatever configuration I try, the head denies to go to the left side of the table. It seems like the machine needs a calibration or something.

fractaledge3
Are you happy with the engraver from Redsail? Is it stable, and how will it perform making rubber stamps?
I am planning to buy an egraver and are not sure what to buy. I do not see any complains about the RS3040A laser machine from Redsail. It is much cheaper than Epilog, Trotec and Versa.

Hi Diarmaid

I´ve already engraved images & text on glass and also in mirror.

On plain glass you have to place a layer of wet newspapper for optimal results and less reflection of the beam.

You can engrave in the back of the mirror, but you have to try on several mirrors because they are not all the same, so you have to find one with the back layer as thin and regular as possible, then try engraving at many settings to find the depth you want to engrave on that layer.
I never tried to engrave on top surface but i dont think it´s advisible due to the risk it may carry.

PedroS - what power is the laser you use, and what settings (power/speed) do you use for engraving glass? I have just taken delivery of a pinnacle M40 and need all the tips I can get!:drowning:

fractaledge3
Are you happy with the engraver from Redsail? Is it stable, and how will it perform making rubber stamps?
I am planning to buy an egraver and are not sure what to buy. I do not see any complains about the RS3040A laser machine from Redsail. It is much cheaper than Epilog, Trotec and Versa.

Hi reitsmap,

Here is my story
First of all I think that I have enough experience to deal with Chinese machines, my last few years experience on CNC includes:
1- Producing many CNC software as programmer
2- Manufacturing of 3 CNC machines (2 CNC routers, 1 CNC plasma cutter)

http://www.cnczone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=14100&page=39

Now come to the machine:
Sure it is not plug & play machine, I didn't expect that, so when I receive the machine I double check every thing before even plugging any cable and here is what I found:
1- Machine keyboard cable not connected (I reconnected the cable)
2- The Laser power supply was not fixed with any nuts and it was moved from its place inside the machine (I fixed it on its place)
3- I tested every component separately (water pump - Air blower...etc) the water pump had rough operation and was not delivering enough water (I fixed it)

After that part of the story I installed the software and began with testing phase:
-Testing the machine without laser power (ok)
-Testing the machine with min laser power (ok)
-Testing the machine with max laser power (ok)
Now I have a working machine from day (8-28-2006)...Thanks god, I decided:
-not to use the max laser power until I complete my samples on deferent materials
-not to heavy load the machine
-not to modify any thing on the machine until I get profit from it
-take maximum care during machine operation.

At that time I began the sample making phase:
-Wood raster engraving, and Ply Wood vector cutting (3 mm) was very good.
-MDF raster engraving was very good, and vector cutting (4 mm) was hard to cut.
-Glass raster engraving was very good.
-Acrylic raster engraving was very good, and vector cutting (3 mm) was good.
But….! On day (9-19-2006) during normal operation (I am just making a sample on acrylic), I notes that there was no laser beam at the material surface but there was a laser beam inside the laser tube, so I thought that the cause may be from the mirrors , but after short checking I found that the cooling ring at the output coupler was separated from the tube end.
I contacted redsail, they told me just glue that part, I glue it but…. No laser came out from the tube. After long negotiations using web cam to show the problem, they decide to send me a new free laser tube as a warranty, with a set of optics as a gift, but I must pay for shipping by DHL.
On day (10-20-2006) I received the tube & optics, I decided not to install the new tube until I get the full installation instructions from redsail.
On day (11-18-2006) I get the instructions from redsail, and then I complete the installation of the new laser tube. I tested the tube by making some samples, it worked well.
Now because I can't get any income from the machine I decided not to do any more free samples on the machine, except that samples of real working orders.

My conclusion:

Redsail Company:
It Is a trustable company with a good customer support (Special thanks to Amanda for replying so quick and kindly for all my emails), but I think it is better to give your customers a good quality control than to give them excellent customer support.

Redsail RS3040A machine:
From the status of my machine as I received it, I can say:
-The machine by any way it worth the money spend on it especially when it compared to the western machines.
-I think it is not plug & play machine, but it can be plug & play with a little quality control by Redsail.
-The machine has one axis faster than the other (the two axis has deferent resolutions), this will may give a faster raster engraving but it will give a deferent depth on vector cutting or engraving.
-The machine has No Pause, Home, Reset commands, and No limit switches, only has Two home switches for homing the machine when you power it on.
-After making my first samples I was very satisfied with the machine, but now after replacing the defected laser tube I can't tell that I am satisfied until I get income from the machine.

The machine software (Easycut 2.0):
-It is simple software with all basic requirements.
-It has no help file, so I try to understand some options by trail & error.
-By some improvement it can be more productive (for ex.. cut & engrave on same job, use deferent speeds on same job ….) .
-You can do image raster engraving directly from the software, but In my testing I can't grantee the final result with deferent images so I prefers to process the image in Photoshop before using the Easycut.

I am so glad I decided to go with making my own!

It seams that everyone has had some sort of problem with the Chinese lasers. Although I will be using Chinese laser tube/PS The rest will thankfully be my own creation.

good luck to all of you guys on the Chinese stuff.

Hi miljnor,

I think the main problems came from laser tube, power supply and optics not from any other part of the machine, so if you decided to go with making your own machine, I think you will not save big money but the most benefit you can get is a bigger machine.

Well its bigger and badder, (da-da-do-da-dunt, baba bad to the bone! :D)

But the best thing about it, is, it will be my own design so troubleshooting will be a snap. Not a bunch of emails and video conferences to an uncaring bunch of bozo's across the sea.

fractaledge3
Thank you for all the info you give in your reply. It seems that for the money it would be the best machine to buy. Buying an Epilog locally, or from our nabouring country, would cost about USD19000.00.
Thanks again for your info.

Hello,

I´m planning to get one of this IE300. I´d like to know how it works. I´m planning to use it to engrave on leather collar and anodized aluminum dog tags.
I was wondering if it´d work for that.

Thank you

You will be sorry is all I can say.

I am one of chinese laser engraver manufacture and we opened US office since last Dec, if you have any questions, you can go to www.hxlaser.com or our US mirror site www.rabbitlaser.com to get my contact information
also we have demo video available at www.rabbitlaser.com/DemoVideo
thanks

Hi reitsmap,

Here is my story
First of all I think that I have enough experience to deal with Chinese machines, my last few years experience on CNC includes:
1- Producing many CNC software as programmer
2- Manufacturing of 3 CNC machines (2 CNC routers, 1 CNC plasma cutter)

http://www.cnczone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=14100&page=39

Now come to the machine:
Sure it is not plug & play machine, I didn't expect that, so when I receive the machine I double check every thing before even plugging any cable and here is what I found:
1- Machine keyboard cable not connected (I reconnected the cable)
2- The Laser power supply was not fixed with any nuts and it was moved from its place inside the machine (I fixed it on its place)
3- I tested every component separately (water pump - Air blower...etc) the water pump had rough operation and was not delivering enough water (I fixed it)

After that part of the story I installed the software and began with testing phase:
-Testing the machine without laser power (ok)
-Testing the machine with min laser power (ok)
-Testing the machine with max laser power (ok)
Now I have a working machine from day (8-28-2006)...Thanks god, I decided:
-not to use the max laser power until I complete my samples on deferent materials
-not to heavy load the machine
-not to modify any thing on the machine until I get profit from it
-take maximum care during machine operation.

At that time I began the sample making phase:
-Wood raster engraving, and Ply Wood vector cutting (3 mm) was very good.
-MDF raster engraving was very good, and vector cutting (4 mm) was hard to cut.
-Glass raster engraving was very good.
-Acrylic raster engraving was very good, and vector cutting (3 mm) was good.
But….! On day (9-19-2006) during normal operation (I am just making a sample on acrylic), I notes that there was no laser beam at the material surface but there was a laser beam inside the laser tube, so I thought that the cause may be from the mirrors , but after short checking I found that the cooling ring at the output coupler was separated from the tube end.
I contacted redsail, they told me just glue that part, I glue it but…. No laser came out from the tube. After long negotiations using web cam to show the problem, they decide to send me a new free laser tube as a warranty, with a set of optics as a gift, but I must pay for shipping by DHL.
On day (10-20-2006) I received the tube & optics, I decided not to install the new tube until I get the full installation instructions from redsail.
On day (11-18-2006) I get the instructions from redsail, and then I complete the installation of the new laser tube. I tested the tube by making some samples, it worked well.
Now because I can't get any income from the machine I decided not to do any more free samples on the machine, except that samples of real working orders.

My conclusion:

Redsail Company:
It Is a trustable company with a good customer support (Special thanks to Amanda for replying so quick and kindly for all my emails), but I think it is better to give your customers a good quality control than to give them excellent customer support.

Redsail RS3040A machine:
From the status of my machine as I received it, I can say:
-The machine by any way it worth the money spend on it especially when it compared to the western machines.
-I think it is not plug & play machine, but it can be plug & play with a little quality control by Redsail.
-The machine has one axis faster than the other (the two axis has deferent resolutions), this will may give a faster raster engraving but it will give a deferent depth on vector cutting or engraving.
-The machine has No Pause, Home, Reset commands, and No limit switches, only has Two home switches for homing the machine when you power it on.
-After making my first samples I was very satisfied with the machine, but now after replacing the defected laser tube I can't tell that I am satisfied until I get income from the machine.

The machine software (Easycut 2.0):
-It is simple software with all basic requirements.
-It has no help file, so I try to understand some options by trail & error.
-By some improvement it can be more productive (for ex.. cut & engrave on same job, use deferent speeds on same job ….) .
-You can do image raster engraving directly from the software, but In my testing I can't grantee the final result with deferent images so I prefers to process the image in Photoshop before using the Easycut.

I have problem with the Data Cable, can you help me with this:
PC 232 connectors pins to RS3040 pins (in my country this is DB9 male and DB9 female connectors)
Please i need this info to check the machinne.
Thanks! very much for all

Hi Robert,
You can use DB-9 Male-Female Null-Modem cable, also You can see the attached images for the Wiring and Pin outs if You decided to make the cable by yourself.
the machine cable only use that pins

( Male )-------(Female)
(machine)-------(PC)
---------------------
Shield<-------->Shield
( 2 ) <-------->( 3 )
( 3 ) <-------->( 2 )
( 5 ) <-------->( 5 )
( 7 ) <-------->( 8 )
( 8 ) <-------->( 7 )

Good luck.

Hi Robert,
You can use DB-9 Male-Female Null-Modem cable, also You can see the attached images for the Wiring and Pin outs if You decided to make the cable by yourself.
the machine cable only use that pins

( Male )-------(Female)
(machine)-------(PC)
---------------------
Shield<-------->Shield
( 2 ) <-------->( 3 )
( 3 ) <-------->( 2 )
( 5 ) <-------->( 5 )
( 7 ) <-------->( 8 )
( 8 ) <-------->( 7 )

Good luck.


Thanks!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! now my machinne can work with my PC

Sell laser cutting machine:
Hi everyone:
Pls look at our big laser cutting machine LC 1225, working area 1200*2500mm.
You can use this machine for wood industry and fabric industries.
Pls send me email for more information!
wanmeisuccess@hotmail.com
www.wklaser.com

Hi,

Can someone share the experiences of your importing and what documents has to be prepared for passing the US customs services. Very complicated and difficult?

Thanks

Laser123

ITs not a complicated issue for clearing custom, we have over 40 customers imported our machines in US last 6 months. if you live in destination port, no issue at all, just bring the original bill of lading and commercial invoice to custom and pay duty tax, thats it, if destination port is miami, its a little bit complicated and some fees incurred from US shipping company as machine will be cleared in New York and then to Miami, as long as you clear custom by yourself, the fees incurred by US shipping company should be around $100, if they charge more, that mean they want to rob you:)

Thank you very much for the information.

Laser123

ITs not a complicated issue for clearing custom, we have over 40 customers imported our machines in US last 6 months. if you live in destination port, no issue at all, just bring the original bill of lading and commercial invoice to custom and pay duty tax, thats it, if destination port is miami, its a little bit complicated and some fees incurred from US shipping company as machine will be cleared in New York and then to Miami, as long as you clear custom by yourself, the fees incurred by US shipping company should be around $100, if they charge more, that mean they want to rob you:)