I recently acquired two Boxford Duet combination Lathe and Mill. They are missing the power supply and control software. I emailed Boxford asking for their assistance but never received a resopnse even though it appears to be a current machine. Does anyone have any ideas about hooking this thing up and what software I might obtain to make it go, or is the software proprietary? I wouldn't mind building the power supply if I could get a schematic but that still leaves the software problem. If worse comes to worse I can always gut the electronics and start over but I always like the easy way out.

Thanks.

Would you be interested in selling one of them?

Actually I bought them both so I could leave one set up in the mill position and the other as a lathe. While it doesn't take long to switch from one position to the other, they only cost $300 each (yes, auctions are sweet) so I figured why not get both and save the three minutes. Thanks for the offer though.

Do you know of anywhere else I can find one? Preferrably used instead of new.

I wouldn't know where to look. I had never heard of Boxford before this auction. Apparently they make small machines for teaching at technical colleges and the sort. You might try some of the schools in your area because it is not a production machine. Emco-Maier also makes small teaching machines and I got one of those off Ebay last year and I still see those from time to time there but they fetch prices upward to $1000. I think I got the Boxfords for so little because no one had ever heard of them. It looks like I am going to have to gut the machines electronics and put in a 4 axis controller from HobbyCNC because I can't get any help from Boxford or their distributors.

Do you know of any of their distributors in the US?

These were the most directly related links I could find. The first two are USA based and the second two are overseas. The boxford site is www.boxford.co.uk

http://mid-atlantictraining.com/Boxford/duete.html
http://www.advancedtechnologies.net/pages/product_lines/boxford.html
http://www.genetron.com.sg/dnt/cncmachines.htm
http://www.technologysupplies.co.uk/acatalog/Duet_Lathe_and_Mill_Machine.html

TXCOWDOG do you have a picture of the main control board or a model #of the step drivers. I am working on a boxford TCL160 and was wondering if the boards are similar. So far I have mapped out the functions and with a new interface board and speed control board from Bob Campbell designs, it looks to be an easy fix. Most of what was in the cabinet is now gone. I will run it on Mach3 Turn. Terry Parker

vmax

Sorry for the delay. I am a manufacturer and the Christmas season keep me slammed to the wall with work. Give me a couple more days and I run that down for you. Thanks for your interest in my project.

Let me know when you are ready. Terry

i have two of these machines as well
both have the controllers but the machines take a werd sereal cable that is custom. i havent been able to get the machine to comunicate with the computer yet but i hope to
i have the version 4 software if anyone wants it
it cost me 25 pownds sterling cince it is no longer supported
im currious about retrofitting these machines cince they work as a mill and a lathe..... any info would be great as well as maby starting a support goup!
there a cool little machine that have allot of potential if i could ever get them running
word!

Hi I have just bought one of these and I will be modifying it with new cabling and I think it needs better software, does anyone have circuit diagrams, cabling information, command structure etc also why does it have a serial and parrallel connection to the duet controller? I suspect it uses the parrallel port for stepping the motors is this true? fairly badly informed at the momment but when I get more info will report back.

Hi
The cable on the Duet is a NULL modem cable the motor control is via parallel and boxford won't tell me the serial commands or the baud rate that the Duet uses, I can't think of how much more unhelpful they could be apart from telling me to p*** *ff, But help or no help I will be putting a RS232 break out box on and will trap all the commands to and from the DUET so there!, their documentation is quite comprehensive in that they do supply a circuit diagram so make sure you get the documentaion with the Lathe/Mill.

i am in the process of getting one of my duets to work. i have made a custom sereal cable ( null modem cable ) thanks controller! and the machine is comunicateing with the computer. due to the fact that i am running in a windows 98 platform boxford gave me a memory fix that will reduce the memory from 32 mb to 64k.
the problem is i dont know where the CONFIG.SYS section of the shortcut \boxford\duetm\main.exe ?
if anyone knows what im talking about please help me out
or if anyone has a coppy of the software v5 or better i would be intersted in a coppy. if anyone needs a coppy of v4 i have it. :)
thanks
mb

ok so after some farting aroud on the internet i got a idea to run the computer in dos mode useing a dos 5.0 boot disk. allong with this i added a small program that allows me to use the mouse in dos mode. i booted up the machine ran the mouse program, accesed the c:\ duet and presto! the dam thing works!!!!!
after almost 5 years i finally got both machines running.
more to come if anyone is intersted. i have the v4 software and manuals if anyone is intersted. i would like a coppy of v5 or v6 if anyone knows where to get one other than boxford.:wee:

I've got two of those old monsters and am very interested in the software and any notes that might help me get mine going. Congrats on your success!

Hi
There is a copy of version 6 on the http://www.boxford.co.uk/boxford/ website I think your key disk should work but its still pretty poor software. I did manage to get Mach 3 running the Duet but at first it wouldn't control the spindle however I did find the codes, I hacked the RS232 cable using a logger and found that if you send one of the files in the boxford library "Duet.dat" to the duet it will recognised it and think that subsequent commands are coming from the ligitimate software ( I just can't remember the parity and speed I think 19.2 even parity I will check). Mach 3 will allow you to send this code to the duet by RS232 under VB so it is possible to run the DUET. however I gave up because I managed to get the Boxford software working, not great but good enough for what I want.

I found a couple of these machines, cheap, keys on there way. Interested in Circuit diagrams or interface details

hay im haveing a very hard time getting the version 6 software to work
i apperently have the original files but the machine will not jog when im at that point of homeing and the sort
anyway just thaught you might know something i dont
thanks again
mb

I have just bought on of theses machines and downloaded the V6.03 software. it is not communicating though. I am probably being a bit silly in that I am using an XP laptop with a USB to serial adaptor. I have also noticed that all the stepper drivers are dead since the little status lights come on in all the wrong order (diagonally opposite lights or all 4 are on at once) so i am running it with the steppers disconnected at the moment.
Does the serial port need to me set up first or will the boxford software do that? Ideally I would like to write some new software to send a stream of nc codes to the machine. there is of course the option of pulling the ROM out of it and writing new firmware since it is only an 8032 in there (although the there is also a PLD in there too doing something i haven't figured out yet)

I have been taking lots of pictures which i will put up on flickr in the next few days should anyone be interested.

P

Hi
If you need the manuals I have copies, I am presently converting the Duet to work with Mach3, The usb to serial should work but they can be fussy, V6 has a setting for the COM port and XP uses emulation to drive the COM port, if you go to Mach3 software you probably don,t need to write any new software the on board software only contols the spindles and safety switches all step motors are controlled through the parallel port if there's a problem with the stepper drive this will probably be hard ware. To initialise the Duet you send Duet.dat which is a program for the 8032 so if you wished to program the 8032 it is just a matter of changing the Duet.dat .The serial cable used is a NULL modem cable, try sending Duet.dat via Terminal 9200 8 bits 1 stop no parity two LED's should flash as it downloads. I haven't much time at the momment but will reply when I can.
PS which version of Duet do you have 1 or 2?

Hi
Log on to the Mach 3 site and you will see more about controlling the Duet by serial
http://www.machsupport.com/forum/index.php

Thanks for the response.

Right, after some fiddling the thing is talking to my computer. one null modem adaptor made up and the boxford software will control spindle, detect the guard and E-stop and spindle speed. However the stepper motor control does not work. The board works (i have tried stepping by unplugging the cable from the processor board and pulsing the input pins to the board and the motors move. so it would appear that the processor board is not sending signals to move the axis. also the 4 little leds do not light up in the same patterns as they do when there is no motor connected. but I'm not sure if that is important) I have also noted that the l293E drivers are a little underrated and get very toasty with no fan so a chunk of ally is now sitting on top of them to stop them frying.

A copy of the manual would be excellent. preferably a scanned copy if possible. I have a Mk1 unit with the big grey box PSU.

Pics at http://www.flickr.com/photos/binraker/sets/72157602815870945/

From the messages on this thread, it soulnds like it would be a whole lot easier to rid the controller and drivers out of these things and use Gecko's and Mach or turboCNC.

had I looked a bit closer (and read a bit more carefully), i would have realised that BOTH serial and parallel communications are required. there was me thinking it was a serial OR parallel thing. right, now to order one usb to parallel thing.

binraker,
I'm thinking Geckos and Mach 3 are the way to go after hearing all you are going through. My limiting factor is that I do not have the control box for my machine. Without that I think I will have to strip it down to the steppers and start from scratch. Good luck with yours.

Binraker
Send your e:mail address to mark.brooke@telent.com and I will forward the manuals, I also have a MK1, the manuals include the circuit diagrams. there is a CPU signal on CZ (Step Z) however all other signals are just buffered from LPT1 when you get the manuals you will see what I mean, unfortunatly this signal comes from the PLD if this is faulty you won't get a replacement, however this is only used by the boxford for screw thread and since you can go to Mach software it wouldn't be needed and could be by passed. Best of luck.

txcowdog, I'm not sure that ripping the guts out is the way to go yet. maybe if it continues to be annoying. You will still need a power supply for the spindle motor if you gut yours and since the PSU box only contained that, some other supplies a PWM controller and it wouldn't be too hard to build what's missing.

I reckon that what might be interesting would be to take out the processor board and make a replacement with something like a PIC18F4550 which has on board USB and serial and then write some firmware to generate tool paths and send signals to steppers from NC sent wither dripfed or as a files sent from the computer. limit switches could also then be retrofitted. However this may be "interesting" but not easy.

USB to parallel was a failure as one might imagine. Interestingly the chip it uses, Prolific PL2035 (http://www.prolific.com.tw/eng/Products.asp?ID=6), supports the full IEEE1284 specification but the drivers supplied only allow it to be used as a USB to printer bridge. This seams to be the standard chip for these adaptors so I am surprised a better driver hasn't been written yet. Does anyone know if there is another USB to Parallel chip out there with better drivers? perhaps made by FTDI chip or a similar company?

So with this lack of success i borrowed an old K6 running win2k and tried using that. the serial bit once again worked fine but still no motor steps. i went along all the pins and tapped them with 5v and sure enough all the motors turn so i think it is a software problem. Are there any special set up requirements for the parallel port? I'm assuming ECP,EPP or BID are not needed since this is a one way deal and that the parallel cable should be wired up pin-for-pin.


The next thing to play with will be installing mach3 on this machine and seeing if that will control it but i will need to work out how to set it all up.

And thanks for the manuals!!

Serial set up

Picked up a TCL160 from a tech school, cheap, with the software, but no License Key !
Don't want to throw the contoller card, but again stuck for the format and set up of the serial link. Have manuals for all the previous boxford/denford machines, but not to the level of detail for the comms connection. Any hard data?

Mach3 just crashes my machine so building a new controller and writing new code looks like the most interesting way to go.

x3UK, do you have any diagrams/pics of the controller board? If it is anything like the Duet Mk1 board, it will use a microcontroller (8032) with external programme memory in 2 parts, bootloder code on a EPROM to allow it to communicate with the computer and SRAM into which the firmware is written. This is the first thing you have to send to it to make it work (Duet.dat for the duet) Since I think the TCL160 is a newer machine it may work differently. Somewhere in this thread is the serial port config for the Duet. If it is the same architecture and you have the software, then writing a bit of software to send the firmware to it and sending subsequent controls shouldn't be too hard.

P

binraker, TCL160 uses same Uproc board as Duet Mk2, 136-00-03. Just the serial link.
Guest the MK1 uses the boards from TCL125?
Reread entire thread, picked up the serial data. Running TurboCNC, but just intended to COPY COM the file to the boxford. But if MACH does the job, guess time to swap.
Software I have is V10,no key, so been playing with Denford VR turn, which told will also drive most of Boxford M/Cs

seen some Boxfords on YOUTUBE MAYBE THESE GUYS CAN HELP

Mach 3 just crashes the win2k machine and now I am getting annoyed.

There for, throwing all concept of sanity to the four winds of the wilderness, I have started writing new software in VB, built a new processor board, started outlining the functions of the firmware, written a new protocol for serial communication with the machine and finally thinking about the creation of a new language to replace the, hideously entropically inefficient, G-code.

Watch this space....

P

New language ? you may get some ideas from Heidenhain

Having whipped out the old controller and replaced it with a board with one PIC and a MAX232, I have managed to get the machine to be controlled by a usb to serial port and some VB software. so far i have implemented XYZ movement, spindle enable, direction and speed. I have written a new control protocol which can be implemented on any communication standard wider than 8 bit and uses no complex maths so can be interpreted with a simple uC. All the tool path and step pattern generation will be implemented on the host computer so it should be interfacable with MACH or any other step generation software. I will hopefully be writing a simple G-code to step expander/translator to control this machine and, if i can figure out how to do it, design it so that each G or M code has a translator file so that new codes can be added quickly and easily by just writing a new translation file.

photos of the mods will be posted in due course. anyone wanting any further info let me know.

It sounds as though you have put an incredible amount of time and thought into this process and I am fascinated with your progress. I have two of these and would be interested to see some pictures when you get an extra minute.

Here is the pic of the new controller board.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/binraker/2091844638/

I see you have the original power supply. Lucky you, I just have the machine itself. Nice job on the new board. It looks like you are almost finished with your upgrade and will soon have a fully functional machine. That is some great work. Congrats.

If you are missing the power supply its not a complex thing to build. There is a 12VDC supply for the electronics, 100VDC for the spindle motor and a 24V supply for the lamp. Then just some relays to control the spindle motor, the PWM board which is not a complex thing to copy or make something to do that job and finally the emergency stop wiring. In fact If you did something similar to me then the PWM board could just be a power MOSFET and some resistors and a diode. Of course i say it would be easy to build but that really all depends if you are comfortable fiddling around with electronics and more importantly mains electronics.

You are way ahead of me there. I am comfortable around 440v 3phase electricity but electronics are not my strength. Just knowing that the spindle is 100vdc puts me ahead of where I was. I have a 12vdc and 24 vdc power supply so that just leaves me with the PWM board. Even a diagram that you may have scribbled on a napkin would be a help.

Thanks for all the time you have put into this project. I actually got mine out this past weekend and put it up on the bench again and started taking the covers off so I could compare it to the pictures you have posted.

Controller sent me the manuals which have the circuit diagrams in. send your address to me at binraker[at]engineeringscotland[dot]com and I will forward them to you. In the mean time i have attached the diagram as seen in the manual. It is a bit convoluted but basically there is an astable 555 (half of a 556 to be pedantic) which triggers a monostable 555 which will stay on for a length of time determined by the voltage at the threshold input which is where you shove the 0-10V signal to set the speed. There is then some current feed back to ensure you don't frazzle anything but I'm not convinced it is required for a machine this small.

Has anyone seen a post-processor made for Bobcad to talk with Boxford equipment?

Does anyone have the G-codes related to the Boxford Machines?

I have working systems (lathe, mill, Duet) to include the computer, software, and cabling.

But I want to use Bobcad/cam software for generating the g-code. Anyone with any information?

James Dunn(nuts)

Hi txcowdog

Sales & service for Boxford in the USA is Andrew Manus Ph 704 855 1970
www.manus.biz

Hi Mactec,

Thanks for the heads up for Manus.biz I will check with them to see about the possibilities of upgrading the machines I have.

Mach 3 just crashes the win2k machine and now I am getting annoyed.

There for, throwing all concept of sanity to the four winds of the wilderness, I have started writing new software in VB, built a new processor board, started outlining the functions of the firmware, written a new protocol for serial communication with the machine and finally thinking about the creation of a new language to replace the, hideously entropically inefficient, G-code.

Watch this space....

P

binraker:
do you have some information regarding Foxford machine 300 vmc?
I really apprecciate any help.

sorry i haven't got any info on other machines.

if anyone is wondering how i am getting on whit the whole new software thing, I kinda got fed up of all the different ways of doing things in VB so the project got shelved and hasn't moved on much. various other projects have gotten in the way but its not totally dead. One day it will be finished.