5T Operating Instructions FAQ /Q&A

[John3]

Hello all,

Several of us here on the zone have recently started using recycled CNC Lathes with Fanuc 5T controls on them.

The 5T is quite different than most other controllers being used today. The 5T has many special quirks and oddities about it. The control has a lot of character (but not charm).

Most machines are had with few or no manuals. Even if we got all of the manuals for our old machines, we've all found that the documentation is barely useful because of the odd Japenglish language that they use.

Its my hopes in starting this thread that us poor saps using these ancient relics can share setup and operating instructions and techniques.

-John

[John3]

When starting up the machine, what is the proper method for setting Z axis to the part face. (X needs to be calibrated too, but not worrying about that now)


I'm thinking;

1. Turn on machine.

2. Zero-Return the machine.

3. Use MDI to select tool T0000, so there are no offsets active.

4. Press [ORIGIN] button with X then Z selected. This sets POS readout to machine coordinates.

5. Jog/handwheel the carriage until touch off of the tool post or reference tool tip. (Write down the Z value for next turn-on.)

6. Use MDI G50 Z0 at this position to set Z axis to part face, or press the ORIGIN BUTTON.

7. Select the other tools, and write down their touch off Z cordinates, these will become the Z tool offsets entered.


This method intentionally avoids use of the G50 command for each tool. Will it work, or is there a better way?

At the end of the day, is it customary just leave the machine on if the same job will run the next day. OR, turn it off and start the second day by zero-returning then without moving axis, MDI G50 Z using the recorded touch off number from step #5.

John

[Dragoon2]

In my case I just power up, send the carriage to home (Zero Return X&Z)
Then make sure block skip is off, and simply start running the program. All of the G50 commands are relevant to the Zero Return position, and if used, an initial move to my tool change position that I block skip out in the subsequent running of the program by turning on the block skip feature. You do not have to find or touch off again as these dimensions are all enetered into the part program. Unless you change a tool's physical position on your tool post or in the tool holder they do not change.

Steve

[dougbeast]

Hi guys.New here.Just got a really cool 1979 Mori,with a 5t,and an rs232 by RYM inc.I am not completely lost,but close.I have manuals,but am used to much newer controls...We will be using Mastercam,and the associated cimco editor.This machine has a tailstock and an 8 tool toolchanger.Any info on the machine will be greatly appreciated,as I've never run one.Thanks,Doug

[dougbeast]

Hi.Who makes the most painless control upgrade for this old Mori?(sl3a)?Assuming screws and original motors will not be changed.It is a 5t.Thanks!

[NC Cams]

Dougbeast: In a word, NOBODY.

Proof: do a site search for "CNC lathe retrofit". Essentially, been there done that and didn't find anything worthwhile.

The prior search was an excruciatingly frustrating effort in talking with Ajax and a number of other retrofitters. You'd think that all you had to do was to buy a pC, replace the 5T NC and patch into the servo drives and/or output wiring. Not on your life.

I got as far as finding amps that would drive the Fanuc motors (AMC's). I could not get a support from Mach regarding specific adaptation/interfacing their system to/with the amps. The folks at Ajax wanted to sell me all new everything even though their amps SUPPOSEDLY would/should drive the DC servos in the Fanuc 5T's (supposedly, "they won't work").

Camsoft and others had PC software BUT you or somebody had to write code to interface the damn thing - hardly a painless process as far as I was concerned. Moreover, some other members replied with their versions of the same horror stories.

Although there are some well documented mill retrofits out there, lathe retrofits are NOT that easy to affect - they are not simply mills flopped over onto their sides.....

Fagor and Mitsubishi and other higher end outfits offer better retrofits but, due to cost issues, these were outside of my budget of affordability - I was hoping for $3-4K, most of the ones that came by were in the $10-=$15k range, far out of reach for the DIY or hobbyist = perhaps even some small machine shops.

BTW if you need 5T M/B service, contact Glenn Rowe at Billore Machine in Dallas TX - He's saved my machines from "early" graves several times. They aren't contemporary but they at least still run....

[erd39030]

Just a post to follow this thread.

I have a fanuc 5T also, on a Hitachi Seiki,
just learning how to use it and trying to get some jobs.

Nice regards:

Everardo.

[dougbeast]

Ick!It sounds like I've got a tough row to hoe...Luckily,with help from folks like you,and my two bits worth,we might get some love back from these dinosaurs.I sure do love the robust,high quality of my new/old Mori.It's got a Refresh Your memory rs232 interface,but no software.I'm thinking my MaSTERCAM and it's Cimco editor will speak to it.....Thanks again.Doug

[erd39030]

Refresh Your Memory?

That's the bussiness of Dan Fritz.
He knows a lot of Fanuc and was very nice in helping me. My machine has no RS232,
but I'll buy a BTR software from him as soon as I get some bucks. :-)

[dougbeast]

Howdy!I just hooked up power to the Mori,and everything came on,but the jogging of the Xaxis causes a small popping gurgling(?) sound....Yikes!We checked the power,and it's 250 volts.Too much outa range?Dust from the brushes shook loose during transit?Took 'em out,but have yet to blow them out with computer bottled air.....Hope I didn't let the smoke out of it.Actually,there was no smoke thankfully.What is the process for cleaning brushdust?We are able to barely manually spin the belt with our tough machinist fingertips,but ouch!Thanks,Doug

[Dan Fritz]

Dougbeast: Before you go much further, check the jumpers on the servo and the CNC power transformers. These jumpers are used to adjust for your shop's line voltage, and every time a machine gets moved to a new shop, you're line voltage is likely to be different.

Inside the CNC cabinet (near the power supply) there should be a single-phase transformer with a set of taps for line voltages of 190 to 550vac. This transformer has secondaries (outputs) of 100 and 200vac. Measure the outputs and see how close they are to 100 and 200 volts. If they're more than 5% low or high, you may want to change the taps so they are closer to their intended voltage. In Japan, the "standard" voltages are 100v and 200v, and the transformer is designed to give the CNCs power supply the right stuff.

Also, somewhere near the servo amplifiers, is a larger 3-phase transformer with multiple taps. These jumpers can also be adjusted to give the servos what they need as an input voltage. Chances are, the servo transformer will be jumpered for the same line voltage as the CNC power transformer, so if you have to adjust the small single-phase transformer, you'll probably have to adjust the servo transformer as well.

Making the servos run smoothy on a Fanuc 5 requires a bit of work (with a voltmeter and an oscilloscope), but the results are well worth it. If a servo makes any noises other than a nice "hum" as it moves, then you need to look into things. A lot of machines have ballscrew covers or way covers that make funny noises, but those are not worth worrying about unless they're binding somehow.

One common problem on these old SCR servos was having a blown fuse, which would cause the servo to run on a single phase (sounds rough, and does not have much torque). The 3 "indicator" fuses on the back of each servo amplifier have little "flags" that are suppose to pop up when the fuse blows, but if the flag sticks, the fuse can blow and the control wont' shut it down with an alarm. The result is a servo that runs on a single phase.

As with any used machine, DOUBLE CHECK to be sure the way lube is getting to the right places, and that the ballscrews and nuts are being properly lubed also. Clogged lube lines are a real problem in used machines.

For servo tuning on a 5T/5M, I'll be glad to write up the procedure, but it does take some skill and a few basic tools, including an oscilloscope.

[dougbeast]

Good gravy.What a resource.I was told by the friendly folks at RYM to get ahold of you.I was going to email you and beg for info.Does one simply rearrange the taps?I see red wires going from one terminal to another.I'm to switch these around?To add or subtract voltage?OK.First I'll see what the voltage is,and then I can maybe figure out myself on where to put them...The oscilloscope-I'm not really proficient with one,but I have access to one,and a whiz who knows how to use it.I'll do my homework before I will ask any more questions,but I'm NOT used to these machines-They sure are neat ,though.Thanks Dan,Doug